Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!) - Page1

Apr 6, 2005 7:03:14 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59590, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002

F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

This is TEST data obtained by AUTO Zeitung, a german car magazine which has friendly connections to Porsche:

Test track handling test
F430: 1:36,9 min.
Turbo S: 1:38,5 min.

The F430 wins.

Slalom 18m
F430: 68,0 kph
Turbo S: 66,1 kph

The F430 wins.

Performance figures
0-100 kph: F430 (3,8 sec.) - Turbo S (4,1 sec.)
0-160 kph: F430 (8,3 sec.) - Turbo S (8,5 sec.)
0-200 kph: F430 (12,2 sec.) - Turbo S (13,1 sec.)
Top Speed: F430 (316 kph) - Turbo S (307 kph)

The F430 wins.

Overall, I'm impressed.

Kudos to Ferrari for their nice setup. I just hope Porsche knows that the level set by the F430 is pretty high, at par with current 996 GT2 level.

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Apr 6, 2005 7:07:58 PM

svtrader1: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 821, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2003; Reply to: RC

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Stunning performance by F430.

Porsche has their hands full with the 997. Thanks RC.

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Apr 6, 2005 7:22:38 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: svtrader1

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Very nice numbers indeed! I guess more power and less weight makes for a faster car, not to mention the frictional drag of AWD on the TTS...

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Apr 6, 2005 7:33:01 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59590, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Grant

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
Grant said:
Very nice numbers indeed! I guess more power and less weight makes for a faster car, not to mention the frictional drag of AWD on the TTS...

AUTO Zeitung put both cars on a scale.
There is only a 80 kg weight difference between the tested F430 F1 and the tested 996 Turbo S.
The F430 was 70(!) kg heavier than factory claim, despite the fact that the tested F430 had the optional ceramic brake! Both cars had street tires, no Corsas or semi-slicks.

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Apr 6, 2005 7:54:58 PM

ben, lj: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1373, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 6, 2003; Reply to: RC

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
RC said:
Quote:
Grant said:
Very nice numbers indeed! I guess more power and less weight makes for a faster car, not to mention the frictional drag of AWD on the TTS...

AUTO Zeitung put both cars on a scale.
There is only a 80 kg weight difference between the tested F430 F1 and the tested 996 Turbo S.
The F430 was 70(!) kg heavier than factory claim, despite the fact that the tested F430 had the optional ceramic brake! Both cars had street tires, no Corsas or semi-slicks.

what was the curb weight on the 430 in the test?

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Apr 6, 2005 8:00:05 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

How heavy was the TTS compared to the factory spec?

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Apr 6, 2005 8:28:12 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Bear in mind that the CGT was initially power at 550 hp (later increased to 610 for marketing and jacking up the price stradegy) but Porsche made it midengine apparently aware of the rear engine limitations.

An interesting fact which I recently became aware of is Porsche purchased a couple of 360's and installed the present CGT engine in it to test. Boy would I love to get my hands on one of those cars. It would be the beauty AND the beast.

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Apr 6, 2005 9:10:20 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
nberry said:
I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Bear in mind that the CGT was initially power at 550 hp (later increased to 610 for marketing and jacking up the price stradegy) but Porsche made it midengine apparently aware of the rear engine limitations.

An interesting fact which I recently became aware of is Porsche purchased a couple of 360's and installed the present CGT engine in it to test. Boy would I love to get my hands on one of those cars. It would be the beauty AND the beast.

I think Nick is right on the hp/motor placement

The 901 was conceived 40 years ago. It has to be an engineering nightmare to make it competitive with a
modern two seat dedicated sports car like the F430.
Maybe the Turbo can no longer be all things to all
people and customer performance expectations have
pushed its design capabilties to the wall. Maybe the
997TT will be the last one of its type.

So either accept the TT as a ultra fast 2+2 or await Porsches first attempt at a modern sports car, whenever that will be!

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Apr 6, 2005 9:50:18 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21152, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
nberry said:
I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Nick, sorry but I don't see any logic to that, just how do you arrive at that conclusion?
Is it the rear weight bias of the rear engine? Mid-engined cars have the same rear-weight bias, it helps put all that power down on the road. Is it the higher polar moment of inertia than mid-engined cars? Front engined cars have the same higher polar moment of inertia and have excess of 500HP these days. As a matter of fact, due to this lower polar moment of inertia, the mid-engined cars are easier to spin and more nervous at the limit due to their greater turn in ease, though not everybody knows this. Its a slight advantage for racing but not easier to control at the limit on the streets.
Then you have to sdd to this that the 911 Turbo offers AWD (rumored to be active differentials even) that other mid-engined sportcars don't have, making the power delivery much safer and balanced than a RWD car. And lastly you have the PSM electronic stability system which is among the best in the industry, it reduces accidents between 33% and 50% alone according to different studies, yet some of its comeptitors just offer a primitive traction control. Add all this up and you will get one of the most effective and safe sportcars in its class to drive on the streets.

Thats why modified 996TT's have no problem managing 600HP and lapping the ring in the 7:30's, or very powerful 911 rear engined platforms were so succesful in racing history, from the smooth tracks to the Paris Dakar desert. Or why a 996TT is so fast in the wet compared to its rivals. Or why a 996GT2 can lap the ring within 2 seconds of the Pagani Zonda.

Trust me, it will be very fast at the track, and best of all safe and effective at the street, thats the beauty of the 911

unless you have some engineering arguments to contradict what I said that I'm not aware of. But if you don't believe me, wait till you see the magazine comparison tests of the DDK/PDK AWD/997TT

BTW, the CGT is mid-engined because the V10 was designed initially for prototype racing which are mid-engined race cars, when the project was cancelled, they saved the engine and built a street supercar around the engine and it logically needed to be mid-engined too. Try and fit the CGT's V10 in the back of a 911. The previuos Porsche supercar, the 959, was rear engined

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Apr 6, 2005 10:23:34 PM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

What about the 935? 800hp+ with rear engine. Seems that it performed pretty well...

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Apr 6, 2005 11:56:02 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Following your and Grant logic all high performing race cars should be rear engine just like the Porsche TT.

Also, Porsche in developing the Le Mans race car (CGT) opted for a mid engine configuration because of the LOWER polar moment of inertia. The are better balance, can take more power and react quicker to turns and other driving inputs. I do not deny there are rear engine cars with a lot of hp but are they really safe to drive by the general public?

BTW, where did you get the idea that front engine car have the same polar inertia as the midengine. That does not make sense.

Take this to the bank. The rear engine concept was good while it lasted. Porsche is going to dump it despite howls from some of its enthusiast who are stuck in a time warp.

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Apr 7, 2005 1:25:01 AM

Ryan in SD: Senior; Loc: San Diego; Posts: 604, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 14, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Porsche doubters, track times say more than theories. GT2 is supremely fast around the track. I have a video from best motoring which have many exotics do 3 laps around a track. I seriously doubt the F430 is faster than the GT2Mk2.

RESULTS overall time:

F50 5:02:029
GT2 5:03:880
Murcialago 5:08:307
NSX-R 5:08:577
Gemballa GT500 5:10:087
911 C2S 5:23:166

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Apr 7, 2005 2:48:55 AM

Grant: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Denver, CO , United States; Posts: 12586, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 21, 2002; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
nberry said:
Following your and Grant logic all high performing race cars should be rear engine just like the Porsche TT. Also, Porsche in developing the Le Mans race car (CGT) opted for a mid engine configuration because of the LOWER polar moment of inertia. The are better balance, can take more power and react quicker to turns and other driving inputs. I do not deny there are rear engine cars with a lot of hp but are they really safe to drive by the general public?

BTW, where did you get the idea that front engine car have the same polar inertia as the midengine. That does not make sense.

Take this to the bank. The rear engine concept was good while it lasted. Porsche is going to dump it despite howls from some of its enthusiast who are stuck in a time warp.

Nick - I may be stuck in a time warp, but I have nothing against mid-engined cars (and I love some Ferraris). I truly hope Porsche builds a more affordable CGT-type car or a super-Cayman. I think that sounds just dandy to me. I really wouldn't mind if Porsche stopped building rear-engined cars - there are many thousands of great 911's still running around. I like progress, but I'll always have at least one old 911, if I can

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Apr 7, 2005 2:53:13 AM

STRADALE: Rennteam VIP; Loc: NY , United States; Posts: 11075, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2005; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:
Quote:
nberry said:
I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Nick, sorry but I don't see any logic to that, just how do you arrive at that conclusion?
Is it the rear weight bias of the rear engine? Mid-engined cars have the same rear-weight bias, it helps put all that power down on the road. Is it the higher polar moment of inertia than mid-engined cars? Front engined cars have the same higher polar moment of inertia and have excess of 500HP these days. As a matter of fact, due to this lower polar moment of inertia, the mid-engined cars are easier to spin and more nervous at the limit due to their greater turn in ease, though not everybody knows this. Its a slight advantage for racing but not easier to control at the limit on the streets.
Then you have to sdd to this that the 911 Turbo offers AWD (rumored to be active differentials even) that other mid-engined sportcars don't have, making the power delivery much safer and balanced than a RWD car. And lastly you have the PSM electronic stability system which is among the best in the industry, it reduces accidents between 33% and 50% alone according to different studies, yet some of its comeptitors just offer a primitive traction control. Add all this up and you will get one of the most effective and safe sportcars in its class to drive on the streets.

Thats why modified 996TT's have no problem managing 600HP and lapping the ring in the 7:30's, or very powerful 911 rear engined platforms were so succesful in racing history, from the smooth tracks to the Paris Dakar desert. Or why a 996TT is so fast in the wet compared to its rivals. Or why a 996GT2 can lap the ring within 2 seconds of the Pagani Zonda.

Trust me, it will be very fast at the track, and best of all safe and effective at the street, thats the beauty of the 911 unless you have some engineering arguments to contradict what I said that I'm not aware of. But if you don't believe me, wait till you see the magazine comparison tests of the DDK/PDK AWD/997TT

BTW, the CGT is mid-engined because the V10 was designed initially for prototype racing which are mid-engined race cars, when the project was cancelled, they saved the engine and built a street supercar around the engine and it logically needed to be mid-engined too. Try and fit the CGT's V10 in the back of a 911. The previuos Porsche supercar, the 959, was rear engined

Well said.

Comparing a 430 to a 996 isn't very interesting. When the 997 Turbo comes out then comparing both manufactures newer models make a whole lot more sense. The AWD is going to give the Turbo a big advantage over the 430. Too big I think.

imo - The 997 Turbo will outperform the 430.....The possible 430 Challenge Stradale when/if it comes out will be a better car to compare the 997 Turbo. .

I've been told that my Ferrari salesman wants to buy my Stradale. I can get into a 430 or 430 spider within a few months if I wanted to but I'm going to wait for the 430 CS. I would be dissapointed if I bought a 430 and they announce the 430 CS while I was waiting for a 430. The 430 CS will probably be one of if not the best sports car ever made.

Ferrari - Please make a 430 CS - Build it and they will come.

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Apr 7, 2005 2:54:50 AM

Justin: Veteran; Loc: San Diego, CA, USA; Posts: 979, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 12, 2003; Reply to: Ryan in SD

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

While I don't care to speculate on which is faster around a track, I do know that Best Motoring results are similar to Top Gear in that it's for entertainment purposes only. It's hard to compare all of these lap times with different drivers in a race situation, where there is traffic, etc. If lap times are like night and day, then it's a different story.

Might be good show to watch before making an educated guess, but it falls very short of a scientific test.

In any case, with cars as fast as that pair, it makes more sense to pick the car which you enjoy driving more.

- J

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Apr 7, 2005 6:23:50 AM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21152, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
nberry said:
Following your and Grant logic all high performing race cars should be rear engine just like the Porsche TT. Also, Porsche in developing the Le Mans race car (CGT) opted for a mid engine configuration because of the LOWER polar moment of inertia. The are better balance, can take more power and react quicker to turns and other driving inputs. I do not deny there are rear engine cars with a lot of hp but are they really safe to drive by the general public?

Nick, you are contradicting yourself, I don't know were you got these notions but let me explain. Lower polar of inertia offers quicker turn in/steering which is good for racecars (its not a definitive feature since rear-engined racecars can beat mid-engined ones, take the 911 in racing for example) but that quicker turn in/ steering which helps racecar drivers also makes it more nervous at the limit and easier to spin it which is not in the best interest of the street driver. Just like a front engined car is generally safer than either a rear or mid engiend car at the limit.
Then if you add that to the fact that the 911 Turbo has AWD on top of this, which makes that power delivery much safer and controlled, then you see what you get? which street car can take more power?
And lastly, like I said above, the fact that a car is mid-engined doesn't make it necesarily handle better or quicker at the track, its not that simple, that depends on a combinations of many many other factors, thats why the GT2 can lap the ring in 7:44 or the GT3 racecar dominate it class.
Bottom line, let me put an example, since the 997TT is not here yet, lets compare the 996TT and the F360M, which is safer and more forgiving to drive at the limit? and which is faster around the track? And the story 997TT will likely reat itself with the 997TT by the looks of it.

Quote:

BTW, where did you get the idea that front engine car have the same polar inertia as the midengine. That does not make sense.

I said that the front engined has higher polar moment of inertia than mid-enghined like the rear engined has. The rear-engine has a higher polar moment of inertia because the engine is more towards the end of the car, wereas in the midengine, the engine is rearward but "more" to the center, try to spin a dumbell with the weight at the center and another with the weight at the extremes. The front engined car has the engine on the opposite "end" of the car yileding higher polar moemnto of inertia but on top of the engine is on top of the turning wheels.

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Apr 7, 2005 6:57:52 AM

svtrader1: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 821, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2003; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:

And the 997TT will likely outperform the F430 and Gallardo, like the previous generation did before.

Bear in mind, the previous generations had higher hp than their Ferrari counterpart. The 997tt will need a lot more than the purported 490hp to beat the F430.

By the time the 997tt rolls out, Lamborghini will probably have their nearly 600hp Gallardo. So, I highly doubt the 997tt worry Ferrari or Lamborghini a whole lot.

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Apr 7, 2005 8:44:36 AM

Yargk: Pilot; Loc: SF Bay Area, CA, USA; Posts: 486, Gallery; Registered on: May 18, 2003; Reply to: Grant

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
Grant said:
Very nice numbers indeed! I guess more power and less weight makes for a faster car, not to mention the frictional drag of AWD on the TTS...

Shocking revelations!

Sorry I couldn't help myself.

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Apr 7, 2005 9:07:31 AM

Yargk: Pilot; Loc: SF Bay Area, CA, USA; Posts: 486, Gallery; Registered on: May 18, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Nick, there is nothing about rear engine placement that limits the car. Show me any mid engine car and someone can engineer a rear engine car to perform better. The point is that given exactly the same power/weight/suspension development a mid engine car will perform better, but if you go the extra yard with a rear engine car, the extra bit of work is worth much more than the engine placement. Of course Porsches would perform better if they were midengined. I'd rather have a cayman GT3 than a 911 GT3. But, as long as Porsche goes that extra mile to make their cars perform better than everything else, it doesn't matter to me if they stay with the rear engined design.

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Apr 7, 2005 10:48:20 AM

boytronic: Veteran; Loc: London , United Kingdom; Posts: 961, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 5, 2005; Reply to: Yargk

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

The fact that a previous generation 911 model can almost keep up with the latest generation Ferrari is a marvel in itself - testament to Porsches excellent engineering skills!

Porsche always make their next generation 911 significantly better than the last, and I am sure that the 997 Turbo will be no exception... It will be absolutely amazing!!

And that's coming from a Ferrari fan!

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Apr 7, 2005 11:16:09 AM

Rossi: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Home , Germany; Posts: 12681, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: boytronic

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
boytronic said:
The fact that a previous generation 911 model can almost keep up with the latest generation Ferrari is a marvel in itself - testament to Porsches excellent engineering skills!

Porsche always make their next generation 911 significantly better than the last, and I am sure that the 997 Turbo will be no exception... It will be absolutely amazing!!

And that's coming from a Ferrari fan!

And then there will be the 430 CS and an upgraded Gallardo and so on...

It just never stops.

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Apr 7, 2005 12:17:52 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59590, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: boytronic

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
boytronic said:
Porsche always make their next generation 911 significantly better than the last, and I am sure that the 997 Turbo will be no exception... It will be absolutely amazing!!

I just hope the engineers won't be too limited by the marketing department. The last HP figure I heard was 490 HP for the 997 Turbo at around the same weight like the 996 Turbo. BUT: I also heard from another source that the 997 Turbo gets 460 HP and if this is true, it would be very sad. Right, this isn't only about HP figures but I'm pretty sure that ANY 997 Turbo driver would feel very bad if he can't outrun a F430 on the Autobahn.

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Apr 7, 2005 1:42:25 PM

arakis: Pilot; Loc: Belgrade,Serbia , Serbia and Montenegro; Posts: 302, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 30, 2004; Reply to: Grant

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

what was the regular turbo time

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Apr 7, 2005 1:59:05 PM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8234, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
nberry said:
I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Bear in mind that the CGT was initially power at 550 hp (later increased to 610 for marketing and jacking up the price stradegy) but Porsche made it midengine apparently aware of the rear engine limitations.
...

Sorry Nick, kudos for still trying to persuade us from your thoughts but I'd say this is pretty hopeless!

Let's say it again, all engine layouts have advantages and disadvantages BUT for a street car, especially with the engineering level as on a 911, I don't have any problem at all!

That's all I have to say reg. that issue. The fact that the 430 weights nearly as much as the Turbo DESPITE the aluminum chassis and only RWD and being the newer car is a slap in the face of Ferrari.

Let's see what Porsche will come up. In fact I believe that the PDK could help acceleration in the upper speed range even if the car would have less hp than the 430.

Best solution for Porsche would be to advertise two power stages just like exercised on the Carrera!

Wait, this is a Ferrari forum, isn't it?

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Apr 7, 2005 2:42:22 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: Ferdie

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
Ferdie said:
Quote:
nberry said:
I honestly believe there is a safe practical physical limit to what a car can do with close to a 500 hp engine hanging behind it rear axle. The 997 TT is going to have that and find that troubling.

Bear in mind that the CGT was initially power at 550 hp (later increased to 610 for marketing and jacking up the price stradegy) but Porsche made it midengine apparently aware of the rear engine limitations.
...

Sorry Nick, kudos for still trying to persuade us from your thoughts but I'd say this is pretty hopeless!

Let's say it again, all engine layouts have advantages and disadvantages BUT for a street car, especially with the engineering level as on a 911, I don't have any problem at all!

That's all I have to say reg. that issue. The fact that the 430 weights nearly as much as the Turbo DESPITE the aluminum chassis and only RWD and being the newer car is a slap in the face of Ferrari.

Let's see what Porsche will come up. In fact I believe that the PDK could help acceleration in the upper speed range even if the car would have less hp than the 430.

Best solution for Porsche would be to advertise two power stages just like exercised on the Carrera!

Wait, this is a Ferrari forum, isn't it?

I have no doubt the 997 TT will perform at least on par with the 430. But with AWD and an engine hanging over its rear axle it will be a boring car to drive just as the 996 TT was.

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Apr 7, 2005 3:28:42 PM

STRADALE: Rennteam VIP; Loc: NY , United States; Posts: 11075, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2005; Reply to: nberry

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
I have no doubt the 997 TT will perform at least on par with the 430. But with AWD and an engine hanging over its rear axle it will be a boring car to drive just as the 996 TT was.

LOL ! Yeah, okay.

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Apr 7, 2005 3:28:51 PM

ben, lj: Expert; Loc:; Posts: 1373, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 6, 2003; Reply to: boytronic

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
boytronic said:Porsche always make their next generation 911 significantly better than the last, and I am sure that the 997 Turbo will be no exception... It will be absolutely amazing!!

did you notice the base 997 is only 2 sec faster on the 'ring than the 996 it replaced? 0 to whatever numbers are quite similar as well.

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Apr 7, 2005 4:19:09 PM

zzboba: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Germany; Posts: 3115, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

ah, awesome

probably this was a rocket test car (but the turbo S probably wasn't the worst performing model PAG could find either

)... nevertheless -- very impressive.

even if 997 TT, gallardo update etc will match or excel the F430's performance, this car is so awesome. can't wait for... erm... april... hmrpff, where's my car?

thanks for posting RC!

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Apr 7, 2005 5:39:30 PM

svtrader1: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 821, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2003; Reply to: boytronic

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Quote:
boytronic said:

Porsche always make their next generation 911 significantly better than the last,

Um, No. The Porsche philosophy is to produce a car that is attractive enough to make any enthusiast's mouth water, and yet, at the same time not making their previous model obsolete.

The new model has a slightly more powerful engine and has cleaner emissions, but, the power is never so great that it make the older one seem boring.

IMO, that's how Porsche retain its customer loyalty.

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Apr 7, 2005 5:59:17 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: svtrader1

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

According to Road and Track, The 987 Boxster S is already quicker in a slalom test than a Ferrari Enzo.

If they decide to offer a 400hp gt3 engined Cayman,wich they will for 07,the notion of comparing porsches to ferrari performance is pretty much settled in Porsches favor.

As the two companies have completely different driver
dynamics philiosphies and vehicle personalities, I dont really see any point in feature matching them.

Why not just buy one of each and get it over with?

or if you are simply bored with Porsches and view the Ferrari as not really being useable as a everyday car,
try something different like a C6 Corvette with Bilstein coilovers.

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Porsche	OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022	3/12/24 8:28 AM DJM48	260780	323
Porsche	The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche	1/30/24 9:18 AM RC	85070	45
Porsche	OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift	3/15/24 1:23 PM CGX car nut	5494	50
Porsche	The moment I've been waiting for...	2/1/24 7:01 PM Pilot	880443	1364
Porsche	992 GT3	7/23/23 7:01 PM Grant	815535	3868
Porsche	Welcome to the new Taycan Forum!	2/10/24 4:43 PM nberry	390769	1526
Porsche	GT4RS	4/21/24 11:50 AM mcdelaug	389758	1454
Others	Tesla 2 the new thread	12/13/23 2:48 PM CGX car nut	372007	2401
Porsche	Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design	7/3/23 12:30 PM Porker	368779	797
Porsche	Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour	4/11/24 12:32 PM Ferdie	289005	668
Porsche	Collected my 997 GTS today	10/19/23 7:06 PM CGX car nut	261158	812
Lambo	Huracán EVO STO	7/30/23 6:59 PM mcdelaug	240007	346
Lotus	Lotus Emira	6/25/23 2:53 PM Enmanuel	230132	101
Others	Corvette C8	10/16/23 3:24 PM Enmanuel	221095	488
Others	Gordon Murray - T.50	11/22/23 10:27 AM mcdelaug	169059	387
Porsche	Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS	6/11/23 5:13 PM CGX car nut	140893	144
BMW M	2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now	12/29/23 9:04 AM RC	117357	303
Motor Sp.	2023 Formula One	12/19/23 5:38 AM Whoopsy	108501	685
Others	Valkyrie final design?	4/28/23 2:45 AM Rossi	99623	219
Porsche	2022 992 Safari Model	3/7/24 4:22 PM Whoopsy	84077	239
AMG	Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758	2/23/24 10:03 PM blueflame	75020	297
Porsche	992 GT3 RS	3/3/24 7:22 PM Whoopsy	53556	314
Motor Sp.	Porsche 963	3/16/24 9:27 PM Whoopsy	24948	237
Ferrari	Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6)	1/21/24 4:29 PM GT-Boy	21162	103
BMW M	2022 BMW M5 CS	4/8/24 1:43 PM Ferdie	19479	140
AMG	G63 sold out	9/15/23 7:38 PM Nico997	16578	120
AMG	[2022] Mercedes-AMG SL	4/23/24 1:24 PM RC	13657	225

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F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

Re: F430 performance compared to 996 Turbo S (tested!!!)

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