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    2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Well, It finally got warm and dry enough to get the Yellow Beast out of the garage over the past two days. Here's the story so far:

    First, ... I just noticed that the tachometer background is a lighter gray than the flanking gauge faces. And, ... the yellow markings are pleasantly close enough to Signal Yellow to make it look as if they match.

    Lookey here (Please ignore the temp reading. The front radiator apparently has an effect on the reading when the car sits after running):

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    It was actually about 80F today, so off came the top:

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    I must say that the car is a wonder to experience. It is what I imagine a 4-wheeled motorcycle to be like.

    The car has such low engine inertia that a tap on the accelerator when changing down a gear lets off a "whooop" that is really exciting to my ears. Even observing a break-in rev limit, the car makes really great sounds while going up through however many gears one can manage on the street before visions of jail start to impinge on my consciousness. I'm not sure a V1 will even help at this level. Felony speeding?

    The ride of the CGT is amazingly comfortable for a car with zero body roll. In fact, I think the CGT's ride is a notch more comfy than that of my 2004 996TT Cabriolet. The Cab is a bit harsher while simultaneously having more "wallow" to the body motions.

    The car is amazingly easier to get in and out of with the tops off. Since I'm tall (6'4"), I end up leaning down into the cockpit, putting my right hand on the tunnel and my left hand on the carbon fiber sill. I support myself via my arms, tuck my legs up and slip my feet under the steering wheel. Then, I let my butt down into the seat shell, lowering myself as if I'm doing a tricep dip at the gym. It all happens way faster than the description above, and works out much better than with the tops in place.

    Here it is without the tops:

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    WOW!

    Very cool.

    Thanks Mike.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    If I ever end up in Cincinnati, we can be really good friends. Ok?

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    After driving it around a number of hot bends, I find that the "sporty" oversteer set-up as delivered by the factory might be a little aggressive for my taste. I decided to have the dealer back off the rear sway bar stiffness one notch to the middle hole. I observed some amount of skittishness traversing bumpy corners that had also been reported by some early test drivers. Ben LJ advised me that his CGT was delivered set to the middle hole whereas mine was set conventionally to the stiffest hole. We will see how it changes when the adjustment is made.

    Now for the bad part of new cars ... I was unable to avoid a piece of metallic junk in the middle of my street lane that made a slight interference fit with the underside of the car

    It looked like the remains of a universal joint, complete with one of the yokes, that had fallen off of, or out of, a passing vehicle.

    The CGT has much poorer blind-spot visibility than other cars I've driven and one must do much more neck swiveling than that to which I'm accustomed. By the time I figured out that I couldn't swerve to change lanes and avoid the "thing", all I had time to do was line it up to approximately center it for a "pass over". I briefly considered slamming on the brakes, but there was someone close enough behind that I thought they might hit me from behind.

    So, ... I just took my lumps.

    Well, ... we put it up on the lift at the dealer to have a "look/see". The ferrous "thing" clipped the front spoiler strip and put a barely visible gouge in the lower lip. I can live with it easily as-is.

    Further back, however, the "thing" must have flipped from contact with the spoiler lip and made hard contact with the fore-most bottom CF panel. It punched a small variegated hole that won't quite admit my little finger all the way through the carbon fiber panel. It also scraped its way back along most of the under-tray, leaving surface scrape marks all along the way.

    If I were to replace all the damaged panels for cosmetic reasons, the dealer parts guy got a quick bill together equaling the better part of a new Boxster. The mid and rear under-tray panels were $17K each, while the front panel with the molded in brake ducts, etc., was about $10K.

    I was briefly tempted to buy a new front under panel when I imagined it might be only $5K, but in light of the nature of the damage, I've opted to cover the little hole with some black duct tape to prevent any road-liquid ingress or snagging of the free fiber ends. I won't replace the panel until it's been banged up some more (to which I've resigned myself is certain at some point).

    Here's the little puncture:

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    On another front, the car is much easier to drive when wearing shoes like these:

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    So glad to hear you got to get it out, and sorry to hear of the skirmish with the road debris. I'd think you will suffer no aero and water difficulties with a home made patch of some sort.

    BTW, Les came in today and pick his 05 CGT up. It is the 2nd CGT (including mine) I've ever seen with the sway bar set in the middle!

    As you know, Les has more cars than General Motors - including an 04 GT2 and an 05 on the way. While you've already gotten to drive your car partially (can't wait for your break in to be over so you can drive the other 2/3rd!!! of it), you might like to know that Les seemed more moved by the ride in my car than in any other in his life. You really are in for a treat when that break in is over.

    PS. the bill was nearly $75k for a local car here that needed all three underpanels replaced. Your $44k + labor seems a steal.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    The main difference is that the shoes above (Oakley 1320) do not have any welts that stick out on the lateral edges. Driving shoes are smooth-sided and tend not to get hooked under the back of adjacent pedals like the shoes at the bottom of this post.

    When I drove the Carrera GT home from the dealer on its maiden voyage, I was wearing standard Mephisto dress shoes with the wide welts where the uppers and soles are stitched together. This caused some frustrating moments when the welts interfered with the smooth operation of the pedals. Driving shoes completely solved this for me.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    The last thing I noticed was a "gnashing" sound that happens mostly under light engine loads around 1800 +/-200 RPM. It won't do it much at all if it is just sitting still without any gear engaged, except slightly at exactly 2000 RPM. There needs to be a slight (but not heavy) load on the engine for it to really sound off.

    When I tried to demonstrate it to the dealer service guys in the entry drive-thru, I could barely make it happen. Of course, they then gave me that look reserved for the truly insane. Then, I offered to take the service manager for a ride to listen to it and he countered that a better solution would be for the tech who would have to fix it to take the ride. The tech barely concealed his wide grin.

    Sure enough, we had only travelled about 100 yards out of the dealer's driveway when the tech was assaulted by this trashy, gnashing noise that sounds really cheap, tinny and too loud to be a charming quirk. The tech suggested that it might be a loose heat shield and I agree that it sounds like a partially unfastened sheet metal part of some sort. The service manager wanted to make sure it wasn't a throw-out bearing rattle, and the tech said it didn't sound anything like that to him.

    They're going to keep it for a few days and see what they can find. That's OK with me because the weather is supposed to suck out loud for the next few days, anyway.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    W8MM said:
    The last thing I noticed was a "gnashing" sound that happens mostly under light engine loads around 1800 +/-200 RPM. It won't do it much at all if it is just sitting still without any gear engaged, except slightly at exactly 2000 RPM. There needs to be a slight (but not heavy) load on the engine for it to really sound off.

    When I tried to demonstrate it to the dealer service guys in the entry drive-thru, I could barely make it happen. Of course, they then gave me that look reserved for the truly insane. Then, I offered to take the service manager for a ride to listen to it and he countered that a better solution would be for the tech who would have to fix it to take the ride. The tech barely concealed his wide grin.

    Sure enough, we had only travelled about 100 yards out of the dealer's driveway when the tech was assaulted by this trashy, gnashing noise that sounds really cheap, tinny and too loud to be a charming quirk. The tech suggested that it might be a loose heat shield and I agree that it sounds like a partially unfastened sheet metal part of some sort. The service manager wanted to make sure it wasn't a throw-out bearing rattle, and the tech said it didn't sound anything like that to him.

    They're going to keep it for a few days and see what they can find. That's OK with me because the weather is supposed to suck out loud for the next few days, anyway.



    mine (and every other one i've driven or ridden in) makes that noise too. this was one of larry's complaints (reasons for selling) too.

    btw, i'm not sure if you saw my post a couple back on this thread, but you might have em do the sway bar adjustment while it's there.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:

    mine (and every other one i've driven or ridden in) makes that noise too. this was one of larry's complaints (reasons for selling) too.

    btw, i'm not sure if you saw my post a couple back on this thread, but you might have em do the sway bar adjustment while it's there.



    Thanks for the info on the noise, Ben.

    If the "gnashing" noise is a "normal" quirk of the car, I guess the only thing to be done about it is to keep the RPMs above 3000 at all times

    Yes, I'm having them make the rear bar adjustment while it's in for the other stuff.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Sorry that your CGT was damaged by road debris

    I am not an expert on CF, but in military aerospace
    applications they frequently patch damaged CF with
    adhesive and a CF patching compound. Im unaware as
    to the vendor, but for 40K, it might be worth it to
    research it a bit.

    Better drives are ahead we know!

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    JimFlat6 said:I am not an expert on CF, but in military aerospace applications they frequently patch damaged CF with adhesive and a CF patching compound. Im unaware as to the vendor, but for 40K, it might be worth it to research it a bit.



    Jim,

    Thanks for the aero-CF tip

    I agree that some research seems appropriate for sure

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    If you want to try it yourself, these are the two companies I use:

    http://www.acp-composites.com/
    http://www.cstsales.com/

    I build composite RC gliders and it is easy to work with carbon fiber.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    If you want to try it yourself, these are the two companies I use:

    http://www.acp-composites.com/
    http://www.cstsales.com/

    I build composite RC gliders and it is easy to work with carbon fiber.



    Vtrader - I used to do alot of RC slope soaring when I lived in LA as a kid (Malibu, Temescal Canyon, and Torrey Pines). Where do you fly?

    Now that I live in Denver, I'm been flying electric planes occasionally...

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    mmmm, nice carrera GT! Sucks to have it damaged a bit, atleast it is well concealed.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Its just a break in scratch maybe those little scratches will alleviate any future worrying. Nice photo BTW I think that car looks great in yellow.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    W8MM said:
    Quote:
    ben, lj said:

    mine (and every other one i've driven or ridden in) makes that noise too. this was one of larry's complaints (reasons for selling) too.

    btw, i'm not sure if you saw my post a couple back on this thread, but you might have em do the sway bar adjustment while it's there.



    If the "gnashing" noise is a "normal" quirk of the car, I guess the only thing to be done about it is to keep the RPMs above 3000 at all times



    lol, that's how i'm choosing to deal with it :-) that said, when larry first said it drove him nuts to about 2100, i asked him what the heck it was doing under 2100. truth is though, it spends a lot of time there in normal driving. fwiw, it seems to go completely away around 2100. is that about where yours does? my 996 made that same noise when i put in the lightweight flywheel but only while idling. like the 996, it stops in the CGT immediately upon depressing the clutch.

    one thing i have noticed that i don't think was present when i first got it was that 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 1st is a bit tough (with the attendant grinding noise) like the syncros are bad or something. i brought it up with the dealer initially thinking it was only when it was cold, and porsche told em it was normal when cold and that if there was anything wrong with syncros it would be when it was warm too. made sense to me, but now it is doing it warm. maybe i'll have em check it out when it's there in early may for the PCA tech session.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    W8MM said:
    Of course, they then gave me that look reserved for the truly insane.



    LOL!

    W8MM,
    Have you decided on the best solution for clear paint protection?

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Mike,

    I would also recommend to repair the CF panels instead of exchanging it. In fact there will probably be some more scratches if you intend to drive the thing - which you obviously do. The front end should get some more ground contact due to its rather low ground clearance.

    I am pretty confident that you should find someone who can cover the CF holes, maybe while getting it taken off at the dealership.

    Good luck!

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    40 - 75 K for a couple of panels to a car???????????????????????????
    You have got to be kidding me.
    This isn't even a matter of being affluent or not and nor a question of priority.
    I dont care if you're the Sultan of Brunai,- if you spend that kind of money on a piece of woven fiber to put underneath your car you need a serious head exam...you know, the one where they check to see if they can find... your BRAIN!!??

    My god. You guys are really better than any entertainment channel I could think of. Man...40-75 K on a piece of carbon fiber...LOL!
    They must be laughing all the way to the bank at Porsche...
    No wonder they are making a lot of $$$.

    Hey, by the way:
    I happen to have some pieces of lovely plastic to jam into the wheel arches.
    You can have them for just 25,000$ a piece. It's a bargain.
    Let me know how many you want.


    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Dr Phil you need to meet Dr. Profit

    Consider that Porsche is building 1500 CGT's, few of wich
    will get driven much, yet they still have to manufacture and then inventory spares for decades to come.

    Soooooo.....those CF bits have to be sourced, autoclaved,
    finished, inspected and rejected as needed. Then they are stacked up in their Porsche poly bags and may wait for a lonnng time to be picked, shipped and installed.

    Sooooo......exotic car parts inventories are expensive to
    stock and maintain, the demand just isnt there, yet, they gotta be there,like Danish taxes!

    Then, you need Profit on top of it all....Darn!!!!

    So please dont cry over it too much, a minor F1 Carbon Fiber piece can cost the same or more.

    Want exotic, Pay exotic!

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    I hear you Jim, but it still is totally laughable that it costs Porsche the same to delevop some underplates as it does to build a Boxster S.
    Come on.
    There's gotta be limits to how exotic and exclusive a car part can be.
    Or let me rephrase that: Apparently there isn't, which I find insulting to people who work hard to be able to afford one of the most expensive and exotic production cars ever made.
    I assume people who can afford a CGT didnt get rich by wasting their money - why would they start paying monster overprice for a molded piece of carbon fiber now? Doesnt make sense.

    Having said that, it's a brilliant business idea on Porsche's part. I wish I had thought of it myself.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Mike,

    Are you sure the questionable sound your car is making isn't the flywheel? The CGT flywheel is very small and light so the noise it makes is similarly high pitched and scratchy between those RPMs. There is even a notice about it in the owner's manual...

    Also, glad the shoes worked out

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    syf0n said:
    Mike,

    Are you sure the questionable sound your car is making isn't the flywheel? The CGT flywheel is very small and light so the noise it makes is similarly high pitched and scratchy between those RPMs. There is even a notice about it in the owner's manual...



    Well, ... it could be. I guess I missed the section of the manual that describes it.

    Additionally, Ben LJ tells me that his does it and so has every other with which he has had contact. One poster here told Ben that one of the reasons he sold his CGT was the noises it made below 2100 rpm.

    I guess it could be a "charming quirk" of the audio tapestry of Carrera GTs

    But, it does detract somewhat from the overall sensation of greatness otherwise bestowed by the CGT experience.

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Mike - How would you compare the CGT to some of the other interesting road and/or track cars that you've owned. I assume that it is the fastest and most capable of the road cars, but do you find it as satisfying, entertaining and involving to drive as some of the others? Maybe it's too early to tell yet, based on its newness??

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Mike, I truly hope that you enjoy your GT, as much as I enjoy my Valentine 1 ! Really though; I know that you can
    truly appreciate that Porsche machine ! The noise that you are referring to is totally normal in every way. Every single GT that I have been in, or driven makes that nasty
    gear rattle, just off idle, under light load. It is no loose heat shield. Just learn to ignore it; and listen to
    the most beautiful sounding combustion engine on the planet ! Take Care,
    Revvv

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    Grant said:
    Mike - How would you compare the CGT to some of the other interesting road and/or track cars that you've owned. I assume that it is the fastest and most capable of the road cars, but do you find it as satisfying, entertaining and involving to drive as some of the others? Maybe it's too early to tell yet, based on its newness??



    Grant,

    I think the Carrera GT is long on its way to convincing me that giving up the 962, McLaren-BMW 320 GTU, 911 RS/IROC, and 996TT coupe for it was the right thing to have done

    It will never have the 2200#/800HP that the 962 had, but it's really hard to notice that below 100 MPH any way. The CGT isn't as low as the 962, though it is still low enough to cause some amout of focus on route and maneuver planning.

    The clutch is easier to modulate than was the IROC 911's, but the CGT engine inertia is much lower than the 1973 era, 3.0 race motor. This equates to a similar difficulty on hilly starts, but it is by no means a big problem. I've only driven the car for about 70 miles now, so I expect operating the engine/clutch to be second nature after a few hundred more.

    It's difficult to make any final judgements with so few miles under my belt in the CGT as of yet. It sure grows on me with every passing mile behind the wheel. And, I'm sure that figuring out where it ranks on my all-time list will be lots of fun and keep me as busy as I want to be

    Re: 2nd Carrera GT Driving Report - Great & Oops!

    Quote:
    Revvv said:
    The noise that you are referring to is totally normal in every way. Every single GT that I have been in, or driven makes that nasty gear rattle, just off idle, under light load. It is no loose heat shield. Just learn to ignore it; and listen to the most beautiful sounding combustion engine on the planet ! Take Care,
    Revvv



    Hi Revvv,

    Well, ... that's exactly what the guys at Beechmont told me today after a discussion with the tech folks in Atlanta.

    It is, actually (according to the dealer), a heat shield mechanical resonance. The mechanics could press on the shield and stop the noise. They recon fixing the noise might have messed up the cosmetics or the mechanical reliability of something on the engine and, therefore, Porsche left it alone.

    It's my guess that the CGT engineering development team either ran out of "want-to", or fell short of time=funding, when they got to this little item.

    This is, of course, not to take away from the monumental achievement that the finished Carrera GT represents for Porsche and for CGT owners to enjoy.

    I guess it's going to be "charming quirk" all the way

     
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