Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ?? - Page1

Jan 23, 2005 3:24:25 PM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004

Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Which would you guys (and gals) prefer as a long-term purchase at this point- a very lightly used loaded 2004 986 S (perhaps anniv edition) w/2-3K miles vs a new 2005 987 NON-S? Cost is the major concern as this is not a primary vehicle. Both would be about $45K US; I could not justify spending another $10K for a new 987S. Thanks!

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Jan 23, 2005 3:39:21 PM

Ron (Houston): Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Houston, TX , United States; Posts: 8812, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 10, 2002; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Not to add any more factors to this equation but how about clean 911 Cab. for the same price.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayIS...688004&rd=1

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Jan 23, 2005 5:33:18 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: Ron (Houston)

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Isnt the 987 pretty close to the 986 S in terms of performance..even tho it lacks 20 hp? What equipment does the 987 have? PASM etc?

It's tough choice.
For everyday fun, I'd probably pick the 2004 986 S if it has so much more equipment than the 987.

Having resale in mind, I'd probably go for the 987.
People would often rather have a new model with less equipement than an older one with more, which might make it easier to sell, but not necessarily worth more when you sell it.

Please list the exrtas on both cars and I for one will give you my input

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Jan 23, 2005 6:00:48 PM

dedam: Pilot; Loc: Holland , United States; Posts: 464, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 27, 2002; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

No competition
Base 987 hands down!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Jan 23, 2005 10:31:08 PM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

The 2004 986 "S" would probably be an anniversary edition (GT silver/natural) w/18"s, PASM, BOSE, Xenons, sport seats, heated seats, cruise, pretty loaded

VS.

2005 987 "base" - maybe 18"s, but not much else = $45-47K

What do you think?

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Jan 23, 2005 11:11:23 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Ok. First, let me be honest and say that I haven't tried the new 987 yet, so I dunno how much better than the 986 it is.
Having said that, I'd advice you to do one of two:
a) Either pick the car that appeals the most to your driving needs or need for gadgets.
b) or pick the one that makes more sense economically, and by that I mean, pick the car that will resell with least loss for you.

I think the extras on the 986 appeal to you, or you wouldnt have to choose between the two...and I believe your torn between brain and heart.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you'd like to get the loaded 986 but something tells you the 987 is the "clever" choice, right?

Ok, my opinion:
I'd pick the 986. No doubt.
The 987 may be newer and a slighty better ride, but the extras you'll be missing on the 987 and the smaller engine is going to annoy you IMO.
No PASM, no xenon, no Bose etc etc...and a smaller engine.
Nah, I dont think it's a tough choice the more I think about it.

If this were a choice between the 986 and a loaded 987 or 987S, the 987 would probably get my vote.

I'd say go with your gut feeling on this.
These are both great cars, and I wouldnt worry too much about the depreciation on the 986. The two models look very alike for the same reason.

Hope this helps you

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Jan 23, 2005 11:19:51 PM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Yes, that is very helpful. I'm not as concerned about resale because I intend on keeping it > 5 years, and will probably only drive it about 3-4K miles a year, if that. The 987 might look a little better to me inside and out, but the difference is pretty small IMHO. I've driven an 03 986S and it's simply awesome, so unless the 987 is that much better dynamically, which is hard to fathom, I wouldn't mind going with the 986S at all, since it's faster, looks great, and is loaded vs the base 987. However, it's a little difficult from a psychological standpoint buying an outgoing model, if that makes any sense. And its hard for me to justify (and explain to the spouse) spending >40-45K on a non-essential vehicle-

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Jan 23, 2005 11:37:51 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Quote:
lemansbluem5 said:
Yes, that is very helpful.
I'm not as concerned about resale because I intend on keeping it > 5 years, and will probably only drive it about 3-4K miles a year, if that. The 987 might look a little better to me inside and out, but the difference is pretty small IMHO.

That's a matter of taste. I drive an 03 986S, but like the 987 interior a lot better.

I've driven an 03 986S and it's simply awesome, so unless the 987 is that much better dynamically, which is hard to fathom,

They say it is even better, and I'm sure it is.
Question is: Would you rather have a 240 bhp no-equipment car, that handles a bit better than a loaded 260bhp similar car that already is recognized as one of the most well-handling cars in the world?

I wouldn't mind going with the 986S at all, since it's faster, looks great, and is loaded vs the base 987. However, it's a little difficult from a psychological standpoint buying an outgoing model, if that makes any sense.

That makes a lot of sense.
And thats why I said before, that I would have picked the new model any day, had it not been for the lack of equipment, and the 987 being the "small" version. A standard 987s versus a standard 986s and the answer is clear.
I would absolutely advice you to test BOTH cars if you have the chance.

And its hard for me to justify (and explain to the spouse) spending >40-45K on a non-essential vehicle-

Well, THAT is a totally different debate...hehe
From a "sanity" point of view, I think you can pretty much forget it.
But if your wife (I assume you're a guy?) accepts you having a Boxster in the first place, I dont think any of the two you're looking at right now would make more or less sense to her.
I dunno how the market is in the US, but over here in Scandinvia the price stays pretty much up there.
Older 986'es from 1999 are still sold (or at least put up for sale) at around 60-75% of the new vehicle price.

How is the patient?

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Jan 23, 2005 11:39:58 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Quote:
lemansbluem5 said:
I'm not as concerned about resale because I intend on keeping it > 5 years, and will probably only drive it about 3-4K miles a year, if that.

Didnt notice that comment before.
If the extra equipment and power on the 986 is essential to you, I'd pick the 986 without a doubt!
Try both cars, though, to avoid sleepless nights after having picked one

Make it happen!

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Jan 23, 2005 11:50:02 PM

Moogle: Rennteam Master; Loc: Bay Area , United States; Posts: 5019, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 9, 2003; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

get the S

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Jan 23, 2005 11:57:11 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Remember that Porsche makes such subtle changes to their cars from model year to model year, which very much helps the brand to keep the resell value up there for a long time, but also helps making each Porsche a classic.
Look at the very first Boxster. And then look at the lastest.
Hard to see that there is in fact 7 years between them. (Even tho I'd pick the 987 any day

Go for the 986 S!
After 2 weeks, you're gonna want to sell your M5...give the 986 to the Mrs and get a brand new 987S for yourself.

WROOM!

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Jan 24, 2005 3:47:13 AM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Dr. Phil, now you're talking! Don't have the M5 anymore- traded it in on a used GS400 last year in preparation for getting a convertible. That was a tough decision too, but even though the M5 is a great ride and daily driver, it still cannot match the 986S experience; it straddles the luxury/practicality/sport lines extremely well, but it isn't as "visceral" as the 986S. But I miss the M5 every day. Here in the midwest (US), 2 door convt's don't sell that well, so a mint 2003 986S with <5K miles can be had for under $40K, and a 2004 for just over $40K, and maybe even a bit lower now during winter. We just got about 12-14 inches of snow during the last 2 days-

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Jan 24, 2005 3:56:27 AM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

What are you doing writing posts!=!=!?!?!?!?!?!?
Get out there and GET THAT 986S!!!

U in Chicago? I LOVE that city.
Used to work there, and was there on vacation 2 yrs ago. Went to Harbor Springs, MI for Christmas. Long haul compared tm what Im used to...but nice.

I was thinking: Boxster + Illinois winter =

?
If you dont already have a second car, perhaps you should think about getting a cheap...I dunno...Chevy Blazer or something.

And go for the 986S. You'll be thrilled!!!
Let me know if you want input, details etc.
I havent had mine for long, but Id be happy to help.

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Jan 24, 2005 4:46:59 AM

DavidSF: Senior; Loc:; Posts: 525, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 7, 2003; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

I would get the 987 non-S. I believe the HP difference is only 18 HP. Does this even make a difference in real world driving? Besides that the 987 is improved in every way over the 986S, including better suspension and chassis. If you can live without the "S" label (some can't) get the 987.

David

Quote:
lemansbluem5 said:
Which would you guys (and gals) prefer as a long-term purchase at this point- a very lightly used loaded 2004 986 S (perhaps anniv edition) w/2-3K miles vs a new 2005 987 NON-S? Cost is the major concern as this is not a primary vehicle. Both would be about $45K US; I could not justify spending another $10K for a new 987S. Thanks!

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Jan 24, 2005 5:01:07 AM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: DavidSF

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Youre partly right, but I believe the problem is not the few HPs, but also torque and equipment.
Perhaps it's not so much fun for LemansBlueM5 to drive a skeleton 987?

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Jan 24, 2005 9:03:37 AM

AS4s: Pilot; Loc: New York , United States; Posts: 328, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 10, 2004; Reply to: Moogle

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

I have a 986 S 03 and have tried both 987 and 987 S. I think 987 is a huge improvement over 986 non-S. I had a blast testing the 987 but if I had to choose in between a fully loaded 986 S and a naked 987, I would no doubt choose the 986 S.

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Jan 24, 2005 10:18:33 AM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: AS4s

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Quote:
senra said:
I have a 986 S 03 and have tried both 987 and 987 S. I think 987 is a huge improvement over 986 non-S. I had a blast testing the 987 but if I had to choose in between a fully loaded 986 S and a naked 987, I would no doubt choose the 986 S.

Senra, how big is the diff between the 987S and the 986S? Huge?
And if so, in what way, exactly?

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Jan 24, 2005 11:49:29 AM

AS4s: Pilot; Loc: New York , United States; Posts: 328, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 10, 2004; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

I tested both 987 and 987 S. I think the 987 (non-S) is a huge improvement over 986, of course the 987 S is better than 986 S but compared to the 986 S 03, the differnece when driving is not big enough to make me want to change right at this time.
I felt the biggest difference was in the feel of the steering, I felt it was much better, more direct if that makes sense. The manual transmission I testd had the short shifter option, this was great although very hard with car cold, if I were to get a new car I would defenetly get this option, vrey precise, fast amd fun.
The car I tested had sport chrono, I think it made a big difference in the 987 tiptronic I tested but not that much in the 987 S manual transmission. I am sure its a great option but in a track not so much for daily driving conditions. By the way, I don't think the Chrono in the dash looks that bad, I actually think it looks nice in the 987 compared to 997 because together with the sport rounded wheel and the air vents, it gives the interior a nice balance.
The engine sound is something that I am sure different people will have very different opinions, I think it is very nice, 987 much nicer and huge improvement over 986, 987 S nicer but not huge over 987 S 03.
Power, a bit dissapointed on the 987 S, very impressed with 987. If all you want is power and already have 986 S 03, I would not make the change.
The seats are a big improvement over 986, I tried both the normal seats and the sport seats, both much more comfortable, especially because of the lumbar support. PASM is great I would think this is a must, the 987 S had 19" wheels. The interior although IMO not necesseraly better looking, it has a nicer finish, the leather feels better, the dash cleaner and better finish, the central consol with the PCM aso has a much nicer finnish and once inside it does not look crowded, it all makes sense.
What about the looks? well, I like the back of my 986 S 03 better, the sides have more muscle and are curvier, I prefer also the look of my exaust compared to 987 S. The side air intakes, again you heard this before from me, are ugly, at least should be color coded, which I am sure Porsche will do during face-lift just like with 986, I hope they don't wait 5 years to do. The front I have mixed feelings, more aggressive, love the main headlights but do not like the look of the spoiler, IMO it would have lookd better 1st with a different finish in the fog lights and also with a black grid covering the huge air intakes, something similar to Ferrari F430 and other cars.

All and all, 987 S a great car but if you have 986 S 03 or 04, I think you are better off waiting a bit.

By the way, do you think 986 S will go a lot in value after a year or 2 once you start having second hand 987 S in the market or do you think most of the price drop has already been accounted for with the intro. of the new model?

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Jan 24, 2005 12:04:50 PM

993Targa: Rennteam Pro; Loc: ZH , Switzerland; Posts: 2522, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 16, 2004; Reply to: AS4s

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

I would go for the 986S, you can get a good deal on the 986S now. The car is more powerful and fun to drive compared to a 987 base.
Zürich
Proud owner of a 2003 986S and tested the 2005 987S and was not that impressed..

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Jan 24, 2005 5:45:50 PM

Dr. Phil: Rennteam Master; Loc: Denmark , Denmark; Posts: 5884, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 30, 2004; Reply to: AS4s

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Quote:
senra said:
By the way, do you think 986 S will go a lot in value after a year or 2 once you start having second hand 987 S in the market or do you think most of the price drop has already been accounted for with the intro. of the new model?

I believe the depreciation has already taken place. IMO it's a very good thing for the market value of the 986 that the 987 is visually just a conservative makeover. It's good thinking from Porsche.

Thanks for the nice report, btw

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Jan 24, 2005 6:12:48 PM

dedam: Pilot; Loc: Holland , United States; Posts: 464, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 27, 2002; Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Quote:
DrPhil said:
Quote:
senra said:
By the way, do you think 986 S will go a lot in value after a year or 2 once you start having second hand 987 S in the market or do you think most of the price drop has already been accounted for with the intro. of the new model?

I believe the depreciation has already taken place. IMO it's a very good thing for the market value of the 986 that the 987 is visually just a conservative makeover. It's good thinking from Porsche.

Thanks for the nice report, btw

The first time you see a 987 on the street you will see that the 987 is more differend then the People on the forums and in the magazines tell you!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Jan 24, 2005 7:35:28 PM

Mellow Yellow: Co-Pilot; Loc: Atlanta, GA , United States; Posts: 171, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 29, 2003; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

This is a no brainer for me. Get the 986S at an incredible discount. You are buying a car, no matter what you buy, you'll be stuck with a depreciating asset. So don't worry about the resale 986S vs. 987.

Go drive both and you'll know the answer.

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Jan 25, 2005 2:23:38 AM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004; Reply to: Mellow Yellow

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

You guys (gals) are awesome and thanks for all the opinions, especially from the 986 owners. I currently have a 04 Z4 3.0 (in storage) that was a great deal back in November '04, but it just doesn't drive anythink like the 986S. When we test drove the Z4 and 986S, it was really no comparison, with the BoxsterS having far superior steering feel, chassis dynamics, etc, although the car is not as "stiff" as the Z (more cowl shake in the 986S). However, a used 986S was still $8K more than a new Z4 3.0, so I went with my brain rather than my heart and got the Z. Even my wife told me I would regret it. And of course, she's always right.

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Jan 28, 2005 6:49:23 PM

skyline: Newbie; Loc: CA USA; Posts: 31, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 13, 2005; Reply to: lemansbluem5

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

I think you should figure out exactly how much you want to spend, then go in the dealer ready to buy. Make an offer on the 987 with options that will satisfy you (allow for a few grand over what your max is-- add a package that appeals to you the most). Give him an offer slightly under your max. If it's too far from what they want to do, they will suggest you to look at the 986... then you probably have more bargaining power with the 986S that you would be happy with also.

Keep at the negotiations. If progress is being made, most likely they will sell close to what you want to pay...

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Jan 29, 2005 3:58:45 AM

lemansbluem5: Newbie; Loc: Ilinois; Posts: 23, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 18, 2004; Reply to: skyline

Re: Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

Drove the 987 Non-S today - what a fantastic car! The exhaust note, steering, suspension, interior, etc all significantly improved over the 986, and it feels almost as quick as the 986S. Unfortunately, there's not much room for negotiation, and almost all in-stock units are pretty loaded >$50K US (base price 44K). For me, I would be happy with nothing but 18" rims. You can take out the stereo for all I care. Spent the entire 15 minute test drive listening to the engine. Intoxicating! The ride was supple too considering the test car had 19"'s. It was so good that I cannot get the 986S- it's either suck it up and get a pretty stripped 987 non-S, or stick w/my Z4-

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Advice: 2004 986S vs 2005 987 "base" ??

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