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    Oct 9, 2004 11:12:46 PM

    Carlos from SpainM
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    Carlos from Spain
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    Reply to: Ron (Houston)M

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    on first impressions, more than a match for the car it was designed to beat - Lamborghini's Gallardo.



    Well didn't take long for the Gallardo to be hitting back, Lambo plans debut of the Gallardo SV for the end of this year (as MY 2006) with 550HP to 600HP Then after that, in 2006, the 997TT beast will be coming out, not to mention the posible 997GT2. Bad timing, bad timing for the F430

    Crazy huh, but all three are different cars anyways so really just depends what you are looking for and value most for yourself. The F430 has its appeal and particular fearures, the 997TT will have a different ones for a different type of driver, and the Gallardo sort of in between. But I'd be placing my money on the Gallardo for straight-line perf part, and on the 997TT for the track performance part

    Oct 10, 2004 2:01:20 AM

    Ferdie
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    Ferdie
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    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    BluCamSS said:
    ...I OWNED a 01 S4....hated it, no driver involvement or feel....very numb, vague steering....had it a whole 4 months.

    To each there own, if you like AWD, that's fine....
    I totally prefer RWD....



    You might be right on the numb steering feel but this is not due to the AWD but on Audi's general suspension setup.

    If you consider the quattro GmbH's specific sport suspension on the Audi RS4 (yes, on top of the std. susp. in that car) you will figure out that even Audi's setup can be improved to the dynamic side.
    Still this has nothing to do with the AWD - the quattro system has great traction and a very neutral handling on most models (admittedly the S4s are not great representatives of this)!

    By the way, you don't have to quote the whole discussion in your comment...

    Oct 10, 2004 2:42:43 AM

    SSNISTR
    Senior
    SSNISTR
    Loc: Florida
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    Reply to: Carlos from SpainM

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    on first impressions, more than a match for the car it was designed to beat - Lamborghini's Gallardo.



    Well didn't take long for the Gallardo to be hitting back, Lambo plans debut of the Gallardo SV for the end of this year (as MY 2006) with 550HP to 600HP Then after that, in 2006, the 997TT beast will be coming out, not to mention the posible 997GT2. Bad timing, bad timing for the F430

    Crazy huh, but all three are different cars anyways so really just depends what you are looking for and value most for yourself. The F430 has its appeal and particular fearures, the 997TT will have a different ones for a different type of driver, and the Gallardo sort of in between. But I'd be placing my money on the Gallardo for straight-line perf part, and on the 997TT for the track performance part



    Well the 997 TT is AWD, so that takes that out of the hardcore track car equation...
    And why would Lambo make a Gallardo that is quicker then the Muricelago???? Sounds VERY fishy to me, there are no plans for a upgraded M, I doubt a G will have that much of a power boost.....Regardless the G still won't sell in the States, they are marked way down and actually SITTING on lots here.

    Oct 10, 2004 7:24:09 AM

    brunner
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    brunner
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    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    Well the 997 TT is AWD, so that takes that out of the hardcore track car equation...


    Do you consider the F430 a 'hardcore track car'?

    Oct 10, 2004 7:58:54 AM

    Carlos from SpainM
    Rennteam Moderator
    Carlos from Spain
    Loc: Spain. , Spain
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    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    BluCamSS said:
    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    on first impressions, more than a match for the car it was designed to beat - Lamborghini's Gallardo.



    Well didn't take long for the Gallardo to be hitting back, Lambo plans debut of the Gallardo SV for the end of this year (as MY 2006) with 550HP to 600HP Then after that, in 2006, the 997TT beast will be coming out, not to mention the posible 997GT2. Bad timing, bad timing for the F430

    Crazy huh, but all three are different cars anyways so really just depends what you are looking for and value most for yourself. The F430 has its appeal and particular fearures, the 997TT will have a different ones for a different type of driver, and the Gallardo sort of in between. But I'd be placing my money on the Gallardo for straight-line perf part, and on the 997TT for the track performance part



    Well the 997 TT is AWD, so that takes that out of the hardcore track car equation...
    And why would Lambo make a Gallardo that is quicker then the Muricelago???? Sounds VERY fishy to me, there are no plans for a upgraded M, I doubt a G will have that much of a power boost.....Regardless the G still won't sell in the States, they are marked way down and actually SITTING on lots here.



    There will be an upgrade for the Murcielago as well, called Murc GT or SV with the 6.5l engine from the limited production street version of the Murc R-GT.

    Second, the viscous-coupling AWD of the 997TT (nothing to do with your S4's 50-50 permanent split Torsen AWD) will take out the hardcore track FOR YOU but don't categorically speak for everybody else, some hardcore like more bite than bark, and some more bark than bite...
    We can pretty much bet it may not have the best straight-line perfromance (at least compared to theat Gallardo SV) but will be the best handling one of the bunch and the most effective at the track, and even more so in the streets. And then there is still the 997GT2 on top of it to chose form if you can handle it.

    Oct 10, 2004 10:23:26 AM

    iyori
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    iyori
    Loc: Tokyo, Japan
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    Reply to: Carlos from SpainM

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Bad timing for F430? Not at all!I think it will be great if Lambo comes up with an SV and Porsche comes up with a TT, a GT2, and a GT3. Competition is great and will complement sales of all parties.

    Oct 10, 2004 10:59:13 AM

    Ferdie
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    Ferdie
    Loc: Europe , Germany
    Posts: 8234, Gallery
    Registered on: Jul 2, 2004
    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    BluCamSS said:
    ...Well the 997 TT is AWD, so that takes that out of the hardcore track car equation...
    And why would Lambo make a Gallardo that is quicker then the Muricelago???? ...



    Funny that most people excuse 360's and maybe even 430's inferior performance compared to the Gallardo and TT(-S) with the subjective experience - so what's the point in claiming the TT is not a hard-core trackcar. Has it ever been? And who arouse that criteria anyway?

    Like Carlos said, Murcie and Gallardo will be upgraded.
    Actually, the 430 is superior to all other Ferraris sans the Enzo in handling and acceleration - so what's the point?

    Oct 10, 2004 11:15:27 AM

    Rossi
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    Reply to: brunner

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    brunner said:
    Quote:
    Well the 997 TT is AWD, so that takes that out of the hardcore track car equation...


    Do you consider the F430 a 'hardcore track car'?



    Not at all IMO...

    Oct 10, 2004 12:22:40 PM

    RCA
    Rennteam Administrator
    RC
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    Reply to: iyori

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    iyori said:
    Bad timing for F430? Not at all!I think it will be great if Lambo comes up with an SV and Porsche comes up with a TT, a GT2, and a GT3. Competition is great and will complement sales of all parties.



    Very well, said. Competition is great, especially for us freaks who have a variety of cars to choose from.

    Yes, it will be tough competition for the F430 but Ferrari plans a F430 Challenge Stradale and despite that, there is a saying I learned in budo sports: there always will be somebody better and stronger...

    We have interesting sportscars years ahead of us, I just hope that much higher oil prices won't force car makers to cut back on interesting future models.

    Oct 10, 2004 2:33:26 PM

    Carlos from SpainM
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    Carlos from Spain
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: Coming up next week....

    F430 Challenge Stardale... now that should be quite a site!

    Oct 10, 2004 8:38:49 PM

    SSNISTR
    Senior
    SSNISTR
    Loc: Florida
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    Registered on: Apr 15, 2004
    Reply to: Ferdie

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    Ferdie said:
    Quote:


    430's inferior performance compared to the Gallardo and TT(-S)




    I don't know what tests your reading but in the two that I have read the F430 is rated so much higher then the Gallardo it's not even an issue...........

    Oct 10, 2004 9:23:58 PM

    Rossi
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    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    BluCamSS said:
    Quote:
    Ferdie said:
    430's inferior performance compared to the Gallardo and TT(-S)


    I don't know what tests your reading but in the two that I have read the F430 is rated so much higher then the Gallardo it's not even an issue...........



    Fact is, that there is no real test of a F430 at the moment, because there are no test cars. What you are talking about are the first drive impressions of some journalists. So it's nonsense to say one is better or the other is inferior.
    When the first real tests are out, I'm sure it will be a close race between Gallardo and F430, not to mention the forthcoming 997 TT. All will be great cars with similar performance and different characters for different people.

    Oct 10, 2004 9:31:24 PM

    Carlos from SpainM
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    Carlos from Spain
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    Reply to: Rossi

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    rossi said:I'm sure it will be a close race between Gallardo and F430, not to mention the forthcoming 997 TT. All will be great cars with similar performance and different characters for different people.



    Well said!

    Oct 11, 2004 8:17:36 AM

    Ferdie
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    Ferdie
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    Reply to: SSNISTR

    Re: Coming up next week....

    Quote:
    BluCamSS said:
    Quote:
    Ferdie said:
    Quote:


    430's inferior performance compared to the Gallardo and TT(-S)




    I don't know what tests your reading but in the two that I have read the F430 is rated so much higher then the Gallardo it's not even an issue...........



    Oh, there are new Graemlins out... maybe I should use some?

    Honey, can't you even read the whole sentence?

    I said "Funny that most people excuse 360's and maybe even 430's inferior performance compared to the Gallardo and TT(-S) with the subjective experience"
    Check TT-S's and Gallardo's acc. times and compare them to 430's factory claims.
    There are quite a few people who justify this with the sensual greatness this car transpires - what do they need an F430 for then....?

    Oct 11, 2004 8:45:11 AM

    dhayek Offline
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    dhayek
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    Reply to: Carlos from SpainM

    Re: Coming up next week....

    we dont need to wait for the 997tt,the real competitor of the 430 today is the 996 gt2,they have both same hp(490 vs 483) ,they are both rear wheel drive ,they are both in the same price range,and both are still in production.so lets forget a comparison between a tt and a 430. what do you think will be the result of such a comparison??
    my personal opinion ,not based on facts since we dont have accurate numbers for 430,is that gt2 is still superior in performance

    Oct 14, 2004 1:39:20 PM

    watt
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    watt
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    Reply to: RCA

    Re: Coming up next week....

    [quoteYes, it will be tough competition for the F430 but Ferrari plans a F430 Challenge Stradale .



    RC- is this a fact, my dealer still will not take an order
     
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