Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Try taking up sailing instead - Page1

Sep 2, 2004 4:31:12 AM

gseries89: Newbie; Loc: San Francisco, CA; Posts: 14, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 26, 2004

Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

I have been debating whether I should ship my TT to Hong Kong next year, as I will be relocating there. I understand that HK is left hand drive and my U.S. spec TT is probably useless over there, but how about China. China is right hand drive!! Is there a route for me to sell my car to someone in China and get a good price for it? Thanks in advance.

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Sep 2, 2004 6:08:14 PM

JasonC: Co-Pilot; Loc: UK; Posts: 155, Gallery; Registered on: May 26, 2004; Reply to: gseries89

Re: Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

HK is right hand drive. The US and China are LHD. If you live in HK as a foreigner, you are very unlikely to want to drive into China for a whole lot of reasons insurance being one. LHD is probably OK in HK but keep in mind you won't get out of second gear other than driving to the airport.

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Sep 2, 2004 7:15:23 PM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: gseries89

Re: Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

If I am not mistaken, you would in fact not be allowed to license a LHD (US spec) car in Hong Kong. I would suspect that those people who can afford a Porsche at all in mainland China would also want to buy a new one, so you shouldn't count on being able to make a killing on an used car.

And then there is the hassle involved in a personal import.

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Sep 2, 2004 9:07:36 PM

JasonC: Co-Pilot; Loc: UK; Posts: 155, Gallery; Registered on: May 26, 2004; Reply to: fritz

Re: Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

You could probably licence it. But it will be a pain. To be honest, you could pick up a second hand one pretty cheap as it is common there to change cars very regularly and to buy completely inappropriate cars for the driving conditions...

No shortage or Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc.

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Sep 3, 2004 1:22:43 AM

gseries89: Newbie; Loc: San Francisco, CA; Posts: 14, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 26, 2004; Reply to: JasonC

Re: Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

Thanks for your help. Sounds like if I sell my TT in U.S., I can buy a Boxster over there. Nothing wrong with that.

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Sep 3, 2004 5:05:22 AM

Moogle: Rennteam Master; Loc: Bay Area , United States; Posts: 5019, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 9, 2003; Reply to: gseries89

Re: Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

keep the TT, but a beater or don't drive at all in HK.

driving in HK is even more insane than in NYC

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Sep 3, 2004 7:11:51 AM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: gseries89

Try taking up sailing instead

Quote:
gseries89 said:
I have been debating whether I should ship my TT to Hong Kong next year...

You need to do a lot more research.

As others said, Hongkong is RHD. LHD cars are BANNED in Hongkong. It is impossible to register a LHD car. There are a very few there but they are all being driven on dealer plates. The reason is to block Chinese cars from coming across the border into Hongkong. In fact, I have never seen a car being driven on the streets of Hongkong with a foreign plate.

First registration fees are VERY high in Hongkong. Not as bad as Singapore but not so far off either. Look at paying close to the value of your car in taxes.

The mainland is not a signatory to the various driving conventions. This means your foreign license and registration will not be honoured there. Getting Chinese plates for a Hongkong registered car requires business dealings and serious connections and even then, will only allow you to drive without an escort in Guangdong.

Some people do buy cars and keep them across the border from Macau where there is a race track. Then they go visit them. Import duties into China are also high but not as high as Hongkong.

Similarly, many car enthusiasts will actually keep their cars garaged in Europe and then visit them there occasionally where they can take full advantage of them.

People will buy and sell parking spaces in Hongkong in the same way people buy and sell houses here. Figure on paying about the same amount for a parking space in Hongkong as you paid for your house in San Francisco.

Traffic laws are enforced mercilessly. Your will always see at least one speed trap on the road to the airport and that road is only a few kilometres long. Dropping a passenger on a double-yellow line will guarantee you a fine. You must know exactly where you are going and be in the correct lane. Crossing a solid white line is never done. Photo radar is everywhere. I know of no other place with higher fuel prices. Most parking garages fill quickly and the fees are quite high. Parking is only allowed where specifically signposted (unlike most of this world where you can park unless there is a sign saying otherwise). Insurance isn't that cheap and there is no assigned risk pool so if you cannot get insurance for your particular car then tough.

Public transport in Hongkong is some of the best in the world. You have an unbelievable selection of conveyances. Taxis are also cheap.

I never even considered buying a car there. Where my house is the mode of transport for the well off is the golf cart. Last I knew, golf carts were trading in excess of US$100,000 - i.e. a golf car is worth more than your Porsche.

Having said that, if I were to live in a remote part of Lantau or somewhere up in the rural New Territories - not that anywhere in Hongkong is really rural - then I might consider a small econobox. I quite like the Audi S3.

And if you think the situation for motoring is tough, then take a look at the general aviation situation there.

Enough said?

Stephen

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Sep 3, 2004 10:16:42 AM

JasonC: Co-Pilot; Loc: UK; Posts: 155, Gallery; Registered on: May 26, 2004; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

I had a car there living on the island, I don't think it is quite as draconian as you suggest. Perhaps you are influenced by the Discovery Bay anti-vehicle lobby :-). I certainly wouldn't have a high performance car there though. An Audi A4 was fine. But you are right, taxis/MTR is cheaper and easy.

I am also a private pilot and that is a joke in HK as you suggest....

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Sep 3, 2004 12:34:04 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: JasonC

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

Quote:
JasonC said:
I don't think it is quite as draconian as you suggest. Perhaps you are influenced by the Discovery Bay anti-vehicle lobby :-).

Hmmm ... maybe I do have it in for Hongkong lately. But then again, I defy you to point to one thing that I said which was factually wrong.

And as for that DB crowd running around in their ostentatious golf carts .. what a bunch of loonies!!!

Stephen

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Sep 11, 2004 3:02:52 AM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

You can drive a LHD car only with "T" plate in HK. It's for test drive only, some people use it on 360CS and GT3RS to escape the tax and also you can drive the LHD car legally. Another way is to regist your car in China and get a China-HK license, but this is much more difficult and complicated. No doubt that you won't have any speed over 50kph in city area legally, but on the way to airport you can drive it at 110kph. 110kph is the highest legal speed in HK.

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Sep 11, 2004 3:07:23 AM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

The price of used car in HK is quite fair. eg.
00' 360 is HKD1.38m to 1.45m
01' 360 is HKD1.46m to 1.56m
01' 996TT is HKD1.1m to 1.18m
02' 996TT is HKD1.18m to 1.26m

Depends on milage and condition.

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Sep 11, 2004 5:55:16 AM

gseries89: Newbie; Loc: San Francisco, CA; Posts: 14, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 26, 2004; Reply to: Chris Lo

Thanks Chris

You are such an expert. So a used TT is still considerabe less expensive than a 997 S which I heard is around 1.5m. Is it difficult to find a 993TT in Hong Kong? Approx. how much? Does Jebsen carry used Porsche's? Thanks in advance.

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Sep 11, 2004 6:20:35 AM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: gseries89

Re: Thanks Chris

The 997 Carrera S standard price is HKD1.48m (included tax), with 200K less you can get the 997 Carrera. I talked to the salesman in the launch party, he said I can get it delivered in Nov,04 if I order now. There is only around 40+ orders queuing up now.
I think 01' 996TT is really good price and worth. However, 993TT is pretty rare in the market and not easy to find one. Jebsen does sell used Porsche, sometimes there are some nice deal. There was a 00' 996 GT3 and asking for less than HKD1m.

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Sep 11, 2004 10:34:23 AM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: gseries89

Porsche in Hongkong

I think my choice would be the 996 GT3 Mk2. At least with the GT3 you could have a bit of fun on a few corners up in the New Territories. And it isn't like you are going to grow stiff driving the GT3 around. What is the longest you can be stuck in a car in Hongkong? Not like you can ever really use the Turbo there. The GT3 is definately faster on slower corners.

The depreciation rate amazes me though. The price of the Turbo is not a lot above what it would be in the U.K. for a similar car and yet taxes have been paid in Hongkong.

Stephen

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Sep 11, 2004 5:25:17 PM

gseries89: Newbie; Loc: San Francisco, CA; Posts: 14, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 26, 2004; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Thanks everybody. I guess I will just bring the kids and leave the Porsche's.

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Sep 11, 2004 8:46:06 PM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

Quote:
Chris Lo said:
110kph is the highest legal speed in HK.

When I read the above, followed by the list of autos in your "car pool", I wanted to cry.

Then I remembered, 110 km/h = 69 mph is not too different to what is allowed in most parts of Europe / USA / Rest of World!

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Sep 11, 2004 9:06:48 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: fritz

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

Quote:
fritz said:
Then I remembered, 110 km/h = 69 mph is not too different to what is allowed in most parts of Europe / USA / Rest of World!

The difference is that on that road there is zero tolerance and your chances of getting caught are about 100%.

Stephen

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Sep 11, 2004 9:23:14 PM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Try taking up sailing instead

Quote:
FixedWing said:
Quote:
fritz said:
Then I remembered, 110 km/h = 69 mph is not too different to what is allowed in most parts of Europe / USA / Rest of World!

The difference is that on that road there is zero tolerance and your chances of getting caught are about 100%.

Stephen

I've been to Hong Kong a few times, so can imagine how easy it would be for the traffic police to keep such a relatively small, congested place completely sewed up.

At least the border is "open" now so sports car fans have access to the nearby track in China (Shuhai?). In the "old days" you had to get your thrills from landing at and taking off from Kai Tak Airport!

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Sep 12, 2004 9:27:45 AM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8234, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: gseries89

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Quote:
gseries89 said:
Thanks everybody. I guess I will just bring the kids and leave the Porsche's.

Better than other way round!

I would also say that public transport is quite good in HK, though it takes quite a while to get into the inner city by bus due to heavy traffic.

Do you already know in which area of HK you live? There are quite nice areas and from what I've heard places you are happy to stay at. The further from the city, the cheaper the accomodation, of course!

Chris, may I ask what area (or island) you live at? Do you have ALL your cars located in HK? Just answer if it doesn't become to personal for you, okay?

Fritz, since Kai Tak is gone, where do they get their thrills from?

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Sep 12, 2004 11:49:51 PM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Ferdie, yes I do keep all the cars in HK. To be honest, driving in HK is not really necessary since the public transport is very convenient and not expensive. However, getting a sports car is just for weekend fun. Traffic jam is all around in city area. Speeding in driving those super cars in HK is almost unavoidable. BTW, a tipronic is alright in HK but the e-gear is a bit of nightmare since there is not much chance you can shift to 3rd gear and very difficult to drive it smoothly due to the low speed. The only place you can drive faster is on the way to airport and some highway in NT area. If you want to go to track, you need to take a 2 hours drive to China at Zhuihai, actually is a bit far but quite fun since no one will cares if you speeding China. It means you can drive as fast as you can.

On the other hand, HK may build a FIA F1 qualify track, may be within 5 years time.

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Sep 13, 2004 1:29:37 AM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8234, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Chris,

amazing to have all of these cars in HK. Where is the projected F1 circuit planned to be located?

Been in HK a couple of years ago but where located in a hotel about 30 min. by bus north of Kowloon.

Landed on Kai Tak... and departured from the new one - on the very first day!

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Sep 13, 2004 1:43:53 AM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

The new track may build near Disneyland but it's not yet confirmed. Hope they can finish this project soon and can enjoy track time more often.

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Sep 13, 2004 2:22:24 AM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Quote:
Chris Lo said:
The new track may build near Disneyland ...

Disneyland for grownups.

Where exactly Chris? More reclaimed land?? Or up in the hills? If in the Lantau hills then I could imagine a very interesting course. But would the government ever allow parkland to be used that way?

Stephen

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Sep 13, 2004 3:17:29 AM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Disneyland is building at Lantau Island and confirmed to be grand open in 2005.
The track is proposed to be built at Lantau Island or at Kai Tak airport. However, there is a roumor that this project can be completed around 2006.
The HK government is trying to build more attraction to attract more tourist to HK.
However, Disneyland and track are 2 good ideas.

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Sep 13, 2004 3:37:28 AM

lev: Pilot; Loc: Canada, Toronto; Posts: 397, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 15, 2004; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Chris,

Where do you keep all of those cars that appear in your signature? Some underground garage

?

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Sep 13, 2004 12:18:38 PM

FixedWing: Veteran; Loc:; Posts: 870, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2002; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Quote:
Chris Lo said:
However, Disneyland and track are 2 good ideas.

Do you think so? These are hardly the normal sorts of roads & bridges projects that one might expect from a government. Some might argue that the government is straying into the area of private enterprise. Exactly what can private enterprise not undertake a project like this? Disney, and now possibly this, seems to be a break with historic Hongkong which use to be very good at creating the environment for enterprise without actually getting directly involved in it.

Can you tell that I'm a libertarian?

Stephen

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Sep 13, 2004 6:54:10 PM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8234, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: Chris Lo

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Chris, I thought that on the former Kai Tak airport other houses were already built.

It seems that HK tries to attract tourists just like Dubai does right now, investing considerable amounts of money.

There was a radio report yesterday about the upcoming election and what's going on with a certain, ahem... mothership.

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Sep 13, 2004 11:38:25 PM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: lev

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

I park some inside the garage and some on the driveway, parking is always a problem in HK. It is really hard to park all cars inside a garage.

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Sep 13, 2004 11:48:20 PM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

Kai Tak is just a waste at this moment cause' the government have no actual plan on it so far. I was always think if we can use it for playing the 0-400m

.
HK politican always is...stupid

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Sep 13, 2004 11:54:21 PM

Chris Lo: Senior; Loc: HK , Hong Kong; Posts: 505, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 10, 2002; Reply to: FixedWing

Re: Porsche in Hongkong

For the Disney project, the government have put a lot of resource on it like selling the land to it below market price and building roads and bridge for it. Also giving lot of special offer to Disney. I can say almost anything Disney request, the government agree to offer. Sometimes I feel the government beg Disney to come to HK

, I don't really feel happy about its attutide like this.

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Shall I ship my TT overseas? HKG?

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Try taking up sailing instead

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Thanks Chris

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