Oct 8, 2008 7:36:35 AM

skazzy
Senior
skazzy
Loc: Swaziland
Posts: 556, Gallery
Registered on: Oct 31, 2005

Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Nissan is gathering evidence in Tokyo before unleashing a rebuttal of Porsche's claims that its GT-R could not have achieved a claimed 7 minute 25 second lap at the Nurburgring as a stock-standard road car.
It has deliberately avoided commenting until it has everything ready to prove its point.
But Nissan was angered by Porsche's attack on its GT-R, which came after the German company ran a back-to-back comparison with its 911 GT2 and Turbo and could not get within 25 seconds of the Japanese lap record for a production car.
There were talks late last week at the Paris Motor Show as Nissan executives tried to negotiate a back-room compromise with Porsche, but these failed with the German company standing by its claims.
This forced Nissan to mount a major case with everything from independent video footage to the disputed Dunlop tyres used by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki during his 7:25 run.

Oct 8, 2008 8:02:13 AM

BiTurbo
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BiTurbo
Loc: X , United States
Posts: 830, Gallery
Registered on: Jan 27, 2006
Reply to: skazzy

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
skazzy said:
Quote:
Nissan executives tried to negotiate a back-room compromise with Porsche, but these failed with the German company standing by its claims.
This forced Nissan to mount a major case with everything from independent video footage to the disputed Dunlop tyres used by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki during his 7:25 run.





Hahahahaha

Oct 8, 2008 8:31:05 AM

boytronic
Senior
boytronic
Loc: London, England.
Posts: 552, Gallery
Registered on: Jan 5, 2005
Reply to: BiTurbo

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

This is war!

Oct 8, 2008 8:55:46 AM

Carlos from Spain M
Rennteam Moderator
Carlos from Spain
Loc: Spain. , Spain
Posts: 8465, Gallery
Registered on: Feb 9, 2003
Reply to: BiTurbo

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
BiTurbo said:
Quote:
skazzy said:
Quote:
Nissan executives tried to negotiate a back-room compromise with Porsche, but these failed with the German company standing by its claims.
This forced Nissan to mount a major case with everything from independent video footage to the disputed Dunlop tyres used by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki during his 7:25 run.





Hahahahaha



indeed, "backroom compromise"??? that sounds like a plea bargain...

Nissan: "we'll scratch your back if you scratch ours on this and let our NRing claim slip by"....
Porsche: "nein, it is nicht pozzible, zou are inexact in vour meazurmentz!!"

Oct 8, 2008 9:31:51 AM

Wrubel
Co-Pilot
Wrubel
Loc: EU
Posts: 176, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 23, 2008
Reply to: Carlos from Spain M

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Here we go again

Oct 8, 2008 9:32:02 AM

Joost
Rennteam Master
Joost
Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands
Posts: 4099, Gallery
Registered on: May 3, 2004
Reply to: Carlos from Spain M

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

LOL, now we're talking!
Good news that this is taken seriously. That means that both companies are really putting effort in it. Porsche will have to proof their accusations. Reminds me of that commercials battle between audi and bmw...
-Joost-

Oct 8, 2008 10:16:23 AM

PinKchampagnE
Pilot
PinKchampagnE
Loc: Fr , France
Posts: 308, Gallery
Registered on: Mar 10, 2007
Reply to: Wrubel

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Wrubel said:
Here we go again

Oct 8, 2008 10:53:08 AM

Gauss M
Rennteam Moderator
Gauss
Loc: Luxembourg , Luxembourg
Posts: 2307, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 3, 2003
Reply to: Wrubel

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Wrubel said:
Here we go again


I love it !

Oct 8, 2008 11:13:30 AM

WAY
Rennteam Pro
WAY
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2142, Gallery
Registered on: May 11, 2004
Reply to: PinKchampagnE

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

This is great! You know who is the guy sweating at the moment? Poor old Walter! Afterall it is he who tanked the time of the Nissan on pupose when he drove it! :P

Oct 8, 2008 12:55:26 PM

eclou Offline
Veteran
eclou
Loc: Texas , United States
Posts: 1177, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 4, 2006
Reply to: WAY

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

except Walter was not driving.

Oct 8, 2008 2:08:10 PM

dhayek
Rennteam Master
dhayek
Loc: Beirut , Lebanon
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Reply to: eclou

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

I'm happy this is being taken seriously. at least we will know the truth. the gtr bashing will either stop for good by die hard porsche fans or we will all agree that the nissan is crap

Oct 8, 2008 2:16:32 PM

Ferdie
Rennteam Master
Ferdie
Loc: Europe , Germany
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Reply to: dhayek

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

So what does this end up with? Porsche and Nissan each providing a particular car with a factory driver at the wheel battling for the best laptime?

Oct 8, 2008 2:20:39 PM

JoeRockhead
Rennteam Master
JoeRockhead
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Registered on: Sep 17, 2007
Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Ferdie said:
So what does this end up with? Porsche and Nissan each providing a particular car with a factory driver at the wheel battling for the best laptime?



Yes! Isn't it exciting?

Oct 8, 2008 2:45:32 PM

Porsche-Jeck
Rennteam Master
Porsche-Jeck
Loc: Rheinland , Germany
Posts: 3964, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 27, 2005
Reply to: JoeRockhead

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
JoeRockhead said:
Quote:
Ferdie said:
So what does this end up with? Porsche and Nissan each providing a particular car with a factory driver at the wheel battling for the best laptime?



Yes! Isn't it exciting?



Hahaha - would love to watch the High Noon encounter at the 'Ring

Oct 8, 2008 2:51:13 PM

reginos
Rennteam Master
reginos
Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus
Posts: 4575, Gallery
Registered on: Mar 20, 2005
Reply to: dhayek

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
dhayek said:
I'm happy this is being taken seriously. at least we will know the truth. the gtr bashing will either stop for good by die hard porsche fans or we will all agree that the nissan is crap



The answer is in the middle!
Definitely not crap but not the car from God many make it to be.

A very competent performance car at a very low price with certain development/reliability issues.

This is how it will be remembered in 2-3 years time.

Oct 8, 2008 3:18:26 PM

TT Surgeon
Senior
TT Surgeon
Loc: Long Island, NY , United States
Posts: 768, Gallery
Registered on: Dec 28, 2004
Reply to: reginos

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

How about an episode of pinks?

Oct 8, 2008 3:42:51 PM

boytronic
Senior
boytronic
Loc: London, England.
Posts: 552, Gallery
Registered on: Jan 5, 2005
Reply to: TT Surgeon

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Surely the ultimate test is to give the GTR to Clarkson and the 911 to Hammond, and let them battle it out on a track?!

You couldn't get a more independant test!

Oct 8, 2008 4:23:05 PM

Greg81
Newbie
Greg81
Loc: UK
Posts: 23, Gallery
Registered on: Jan 2, 2005
Reply to: boytronic

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

What 7.25 run? Are the two published runs not 7.38 and then 7.29 (different suspension set-up and dunlops)?

Oct 8, 2008 4:30:18 PM

intouch1
Rennteam Pro
intouch1
Loc: Red Sea , Egypt
Posts: 2771, Gallery
Registered on: May 22, 2004
Reply to: Greg81

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

cool....brint it on

Oct 8, 2008 5:02:05 PM

Heist
Rennteam Pro
Heist
Loc: Washington, DC , United States
Posts: 2482, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 15, 2007
Reply to: intouch1

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

I think the backroom compromise went more like:

"Frantz, print a retraction"

"Nein, Hiroto-san"

"Frantz, we'll be forced to make you look stupid because we have the evidence and then we'll start coming directly after you customer base"

"Nein, nein, nein ... "

WWW III Germany vs Japan - get your popcorn folks.

Oct 8, 2008 5:35:15 PM

MKSGR M
Rennteam Moderator
MKSGR
Loc: Germany , Germany
Posts: 4588, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 17, 2002
Reply to: skazzy

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
skazzy said:
Quote:
Nissan is gathering evidence in Tokyo before unleashing a rebuttal of Porsche's claims that its GT-R could not have achieved a claimed 7 minute 25 second lap at the Nurburgring as a stock-standard road car.
It has deliberately avoided commenting until it has everything ready to prove its point.
But Nissan was angered by Porsche's attack on its GT-R, which came after the German company ran a back-to-back comparison with its 911 GT2 and Turbo and could not get within 25 seconds of the Japanese lap record for a production car.
There were talks late last week at the Paris Motor Show as Nissan executives tried to negotiate a back-room compromise with Porsche, but these failed with the German company standing by its claims.
This forced Nissan to mount a major case with everything from independent video footage to the disputed Dunlop tyres used by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki during his 7:25 run.





Oct 8, 2008 5:49:45 PM

Crash
Rennteam VIP
Crash
Loc: Never been to , Antarctica
Posts: 8284, Gallery
Registered on: Oct 17, 2002
Reply to: MKSGR M

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
MKSGR said:
Quote:
skazzy said:
Quote:
Nissan is gathering evidence in Tokyo before unleashing a rebuttal of Porsche's claims that its GT-R could not have achieved a claimed 7 minute 25 second lap at the Nurburgring as a stock-standard road car.
It has deliberately avoided commenting until it has everything ready to prove its point.
But Nissan was angered by Porsche's attack on its GT-R, which came after the German company ran a back-to-back comparison with its 911 GT2 and Turbo and could not get within 25 seconds of the Japanese lap record for a production car.
There were talks late last week at the Paris Motor Show as Nissan executives tried to negotiate a back-room compromise with Porsche, but these failed with the German company standing by its claims.
This forced Nissan to mount a major case with everything from independent video footage to the disputed Dunlop tyres used by former F1 driver Toshio Suzuki during his 7:25 run.









This is going to get really interesting really soon.

Oct 8, 2008 8:16:34 PM

Dr. Phil Offline
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Dr. Phil
Loc: Denmark , Denmark
Posts: 4925, Gallery
Registered on: Nov 30, 2004
Reply to: Crash

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

This is a PR disaster waiting to happen for Nissan.
It is a classic lose-lose situation, because unless Nissan does the impossible under extreme scrutiny at NBR, they will forever be referred to as untrustworthy and "remember that GTR-NBR claim they had? HAhaha...".
I believe Porsche will never ever go out on a limb unless they are absolutely 100% sure of their claim. Why would they?
Hence for Nissan this is an uphill battle.
If I were them I would simply let this go, and let fans decide what they believe.
If they actually decide on a showdown, I would really, really hate being the driver destined to drive that GTR. Talk about pressure. A lot of Nissan's believability hinges on his performance. Brrrrr...

Oct 8, 2008 11:50:40 PM

Enmanuel
Rennteam Pro
Enmanuel
Loc: Santo Domingo , Dominican Republic
Posts: 2420, Gallery
Registered on: Mar 7, 2008
Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Dr. Phil said:
This is a PR disaster waiting to happen for Nissan.
It is a classic lose-lose situation, because unless Nissan does the impossible under extreme scrutiny at NBR, they will forever be referred to as untrustworthy and "remember that GTR-NBR claim they had? HAhaha...".
I believe Porsche will never ever go out on a limb unless they are absolutely 100% sure of their claim. Why would they?
Hence for Nissan this is an uphill battle.
If I were them I would simply let this go, and let fans decide what they believe.
If they actually decide on a showdown, I would really, really hate being the driver destined to drive that GTR. Talk about pressure. A lot of Nissan's believability hinges on his performance. Brrrrr...



they should find an impartial driver then, maybe The Stig

Oct 9, 2008 5:55:11 AM

ozr
Junior
ozr
Loc: NYC , United States
Posts: 83, Gallery
Registered on: Dec 13, 2004
Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Dr. Phil said:
This is a PR disaster waiting to happen for Nissan.
It is a classic lose-lose situation, because unless Nissan does the impossible under extreme scrutiny at NBR, they will forever be referred to as untrustworthy...



...Nissan CLEARLY lied,...

...as Japanese ALWAYS cheat, when introducing a hiperformance car. Japanese lied in the past, lie today for GTR and WILL lie again...

The truth is simple. When introducing the new sports car they get the numbers for the car in NONSTOCK configuration (more powerfull engine, unrestricted NONstock engine programming and etc...). Then they claim these NONstock numbers for their LESS powerfull/restricted STOCK cars in their PR campaign to make more money of the suckers on the market, buying their lies/cars...

...Nissan may show record time video on the Nring, BUT this video will NEVER disclose car engine hp stock/nonstock car configuration and other internal details...

I'm pretty sure Nissan's 7 minute 25 second lap time at the Nurburgring was true, but for a NONstock much more powerfull GTR (more hp and specifically tuned...)


OZRacing

Oct 9, 2008 10:03:09 AM

Woolfe
Co-Pilot
Woolfe
Loc: Western Australia
Posts: 219, Gallery
Registered on: May 21, 2006
Reply to: ozr

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Carsguide Article

Oct 9, 2008 10:12:07 AM

Dr. Phil Offline
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Dr. Phil
Loc: Denmark , Denmark
Posts: 4925, Gallery
Registered on: Nov 30, 2004
Reply to: Woolfe

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Mizuno: "The GT-R was designed from the start to be a supercar that could be driven anywhere, anytime and by anyone."
So why would drivers from Porsche need special training to get the most out of this car? This makes no sense.

IMO the Japs are full of BS.
Let's see how this ends

Oct 9, 2008 10:18:59 AM

Porsche-Jeck
Rennteam Master
Porsche-Jeck
Loc: Rheinland , Germany
Posts: 3964, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 27, 2005
Reply to: Dr. Phil

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

"It is also offering video footage shot by the Japanese magazine 'Best Motoring" during the high-speed runs."

"Best Motoring" videos are the best

Oct 9, 2008 10:39:04 AM

Ferdie
Rennteam Master
Ferdie
Loc: Europe , Germany
Posts: 5072, Gallery
Registered on: Jul 2, 2004
Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

Quote:
Porsche-Jeck said:
"Best Motoring" videos are the best



It's in the name...

Oct 9, 2008 12:16:59 PM

DaveC
Pilot
DaveC
Loc: FL, USA , United States
Posts: 453, Gallery
Registered on: Jun 16, 2005
Reply to: Ferdie

Re: Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

I'm also inclined to believe that "corporate culture" is at work here. Using non-production vehicles for magazine tests and other "promotional" purposes wasn't invented yesterday. Nissan's executives and advertising people probably saw this as another means of enhancing "market share" no different than dumping product below cost to crush the competition. Since their is no honor in modern corporate culture (need I give examples??) Nissan was probably taken aback by Porsche's white glove slap, and hence the need to "negotiate" rather than resort to pistols at dawn.
 
 
 
 
 
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