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Sep 6, 2008 1:36:27 PM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
A quote from one of the more knowledgeable sources for sportcar news: "The premier Porsche prototype program will also wrap up."
So It looks like Porsche will be out of prototype racing (in any official capacity)for 2009.
Also Rumored is that Pat Long will go to the Farnbacher GT2 RSR in order to team up with Dirk Werner. There will also be a second car for this team.
Further rumor says that as Porsche ramps up its GT2 participation, Ferrari will decrease theirs.
So It looks like Porsche will be out of prototype racing (in any official capacity)for 2009.
Also Rumored is that Pat Long will go to the Farnbacher GT2 RSR in order to team up with Dirk Werner. There will also be a second car for this team.
Further rumor says that as Porsche ramps up its GT2 participation, Ferrari will decrease theirs.
Sep 6, 2008 4:06:37 PM
- Jim_in_Iowa
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
Interesting. I hope the 9R6 doesn't disappear.
Has anyone else noticed the difference in setup in the RSR between the Flying Lizards and F-L #87? At Road America, the Lizard RSRs seem to have a lot of pitch issues, where #87 just cruises along. It's not as obvious on TV, but in person, they sure handle bumps and ripples differently.
Has anyone else noticed the difference in setup in the RSR between the Flying Lizards and F-L #87? At Road America, the Lizard RSRs seem to have a lot of pitch issues, where #87 just cruises along. It's not as obvious on TV, but in person, they sure handle bumps and ripples differently.
Sep 6, 2008 5:20:03 PM
- Spyderidol
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Sep 6, 2008 8:03:14 PM
- arakis
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Sep 7, 2008 1:48:10 PM
- arakis
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Sep 8, 2008 3:41:00 PM
- Spyderidol
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Sep 8, 2008 7:36:21 PM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
It is now almost a given that Porsche will not be participating in any official capacity in the prototype classes in 2009.This is not to say that there wont be any RS Spyders competing; there will, but they will all be in a private capacity.
I suppose that the question that now arises is exactly what was/is the purpose of the RS Spyder program?
Initially it was touted as possible entry step (and learning curve) for Porsche long awaited return to the top class of sportscar motor racing : LMP1.
This made sense as Porsche had been out of prototype racing for almost seven years (if you count the GT1 as a prototype) and seven years is an eternity in motor racing.
Now it seems the dream has come to an end. (not official yet, but highly likely)
What is the cost of this?
Financially speaking it is of course the right thing to do (in the short term). The economy is weak, and Porsche sales are suffering (at least in the US).
What about the other costs involved?
Did Porsche not spend a small fortune constructing a new Motorsport building? I'm sure it will now be filled with cars for the lesser classes, but is that really maximization of their investment and infrastructure?
Also - What about the bevy of drivers? (some considered amongst the best in Sportscar racing)
Will a Dumas and Bernhart settle for a GT2 seat in the ALMS? I don't think so.
So it seems, Porsche will most probably loose some of its valuable human capital.
With that, goes a lot of know-how. And it usually goes directly to a competitor.
Then there is the loss of "face".
What does the average Joe think and say?
Most probably the following: As soon as Porsche was challenged by Acura, they decided to quit before they were beaten.(in the championship)
In fact , as an active member of various sportscar forums, I have already seen this being written.
So, in the end, the question remains: What was it all in aid of? Was it just to sell a couple of cars?
I'm sure they did not even come close to break-even on this project, so on the surface, it all seems a little futile,
On the other hand, there is still a small chance that Porsche announces that they will not be participating in the top prototype class next year, but will be developing a LMP1 car for 2010 in time for the new rules to take hold.
Unfortunately, this is not how Porsche usually announces their intentions, so I'm getting for another seven year dry spell.
I hope I'm wrong.
I suppose that the question that now arises is exactly what was/is the purpose of the RS Spyder program?
Initially it was touted as possible entry step (and learning curve) for Porsche long awaited return to the top class of sportscar motor racing : LMP1.
This made sense as Porsche had been out of prototype racing for almost seven years (if you count the GT1 as a prototype) and seven years is an eternity in motor racing.
Now it seems the dream has come to an end. (not official yet, but highly likely)
What is the cost of this?
Financially speaking it is of course the right thing to do (in the short term). The economy is weak, and Porsche sales are suffering (at least in the US).
What about the other costs involved?
Did Porsche not spend a small fortune constructing a new Motorsport building? I'm sure it will now be filled with cars for the lesser classes, but is that really maximization of their investment and infrastructure?
Also - What about the bevy of drivers? (some considered amongst the best in Sportscar racing)
Will a Dumas and Bernhart settle for a GT2 seat in the ALMS? I don't think so.
So it seems, Porsche will most probably loose some of its valuable human capital.
With that, goes a lot of know-how. And it usually goes directly to a competitor.
Then there is the loss of "face".
What does the average Joe think and say?
Most probably the following: As soon as Porsche was challenged by Acura, they decided to quit before they were beaten.(in the championship)
In fact , as an active member of various sportscar forums, I have already seen this being written.
So, in the end, the question remains: What was it all in aid of? Was it just to sell a couple of cars?
I'm sure they did not even come close to break-even on this project, so on the surface, it all seems a little futile,
On the other hand, there is still a small chance that Porsche announces that they will not be participating in the top prototype class next year, but will be developing a LMP1 car for 2010 in time for the new rules to take hold.
Unfortunately, this is not how Porsche usually announces their intentions, so I'm getting for another seven year dry spell.
I hope I'm wrong.
Sep 9, 2008 4:34:00 PM
- bobr
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
Spyderidol,
I hope you are wrong..Penske has invested a significant amount in the current LMP2 cars so I am hoping they will be working with Porsche to develop an LMP1 car. With respect to factory drivers, Dyson Racing has asked Porsche for drivers so perhaps they will get them next year or Dumas/Bernhart move over to Audi. Regardess, the last two ALMS races will be certainly interesting as Porsche/Penske drive toward toward the LMP2 championship.
I hope you are wrong..Penske has invested a significant amount in the current LMP2 cars so I am hoping they will be working with Porsche to develop an LMP1 car. With respect to factory drivers, Dyson Racing has asked Porsche for drivers so perhaps they will get them next year or Dumas/Bernhart move over to Audi. Regardess, the last two ALMS races will be certainly interesting as Porsche/Penske drive toward toward the LMP2 championship.
Sep 10, 2008 3:04:05 PM
- Modrocket_stereo
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Sep 10, 2008 7:03:32 PM
- Spyderidol
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Sep 11, 2008 9:32:58 PM
- 996cal
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
Spyderidol, you think its possible Porsche has a surprise for everyone about there plans for an LMP-1 program. I figured they are making eeveryone wait for a reason. Also my post in the begining was just me going crazy at the situation with Porsche not announcing anything yet and with all the rumors going around with them leaving Prototype racing made me go nuts, so I posted something that I hope will come true sometime in the near future. I called Paul Ritchie at PMNA and he said no comment at this time, about the plans for 2009 ALMS.
Sep 13, 2008 1:40:52 PM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
ACO Press conference:
2010&2011 OBJECTIVES
*Postpone to 2011 the 'new rules' planned in 2010, because of the time required to analyze and to adjust the cars to the new rules
*Ongoing study on the Prototypes aerodynamics, in collaboration with the FIA and manufacturers
*For the future rules to be enforced in 2011, we wanted to add two very important aspects for the ACO and the automobile industry: 1) New technologies 2) Reduce CO2 emissions and fuel consumption
*The broad technical lines of the 2011 rules will be communicated around 15th November 2008
*Slight changes concerning the current LM P1 and LM P2 chassis
*Free choice between open and closed cars in Prototype
*'Important' reduction of LM P1 engine capacity on the current basis of LM P2 engines
*LM P2 only in 'production' engines
*2010 FIA GT in agreement with the ACO
*New reduction of noise level
2010&2011 OBJECTIVES
*Postpone to 2011 the 'new rules' planned in 2010, because of the time required to analyze and to adjust the cars to the new rules
*Ongoing study on the Prototypes aerodynamics, in collaboration with the FIA and manufacturers
*For the future rules to be enforced in 2011, we wanted to add two very important aspects for the ACO and the automobile industry: 1) New technologies 2) Reduce CO2 emissions and fuel consumption
*The broad technical lines of the 2011 rules will be communicated around 15th November 2008
*Slight changes concerning the current LM P1 and LM P2 chassis
*Free choice between open and closed cars in Prototype
*'Important' reduction of LM P1 engine capacity on the current basis of LM P2 engines
*LM P2 only in 'production' engines
*2010 FIA GT in agreement with the ACO
*New reduction of noise level
Sep 13, 2008 3:22:26 PM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
Also - I want to report more RUMORS: There is a RUMOR going around that Penske will leave ALMS and enter two Porsche Dallara's in Grand Am. There is also another similar rumor that says that the chassis is not year decided. There is still a further similar rumor that says that they will be Porsche Riellys.
Finally there is still another rumor (this one in the ALMS paddock) that says that the continuation of the Penske Porsche Program was on the Porsche Management Agenda this past week.
Finally there is still another rumor (this one in the ALMS paddock) that says that the continuation of the Penske Porsche Program was on the Porsche Management Agenda this past week.
Sep 13, 2008 4:30:35 PM
- 996cal
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
SpyderIdol, where did you hear this rumor? If its true it gives us hope for an LMP-1 I hope! So when will be the date where Porsche will announce there plans for 2009. I sure hope they have a new 911 RSR ready for 2010' to take on the GT2 Corvettes, they will be strong.
Sep 14, 2008 4:26:42 AM
- Spyderidol
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Sep 20, 2008 3:52:10 AM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
A good sign is that Porsche approves of the new ACO rules for Prototypes : "You have to prove that racing is doing something relevant to road cars," says Porsche's motorsport strategy and planning chief Jurgen Klauke. "Therefore we are very much in favor of this new thinking (by the ACO)... Everyone has the same pressure, all the manufacturers have to do something relevant but the advantage in motorsport is that you can do something relevant, quickly. Le Mans is the perfect proving ground for new technologies and if you look at its history, it was always about new technology and proving reliability."
Sep 21, 2008 3:37:48 AM
- Spyderidol
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Sep 21, 2008 5:26:58 AM
- 996cal
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Sep 21, 2008 9:48:29 AM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
The 2011 rules allow for current LMP2 engines to be used in LMP1
* 3.4 ltr atmo petrol racing engine with 8 cylinders max
* 2.0 ltr turbo racing engine with 6 cylinders max
* 4.0 ltr atmo production based petrol engine homologated in LM GT2 - 1,000 units per year minimum production
* 4.4 ltr turbo production diesel engine 10,000 units per year minimum production
As you can see Porsche already have a 3.4L 8 cylinder engine that they can develop further.
As the current rules will change for 2011, there is really very little point (and certainly no commercial value) in building a car just for these two "interim" years before the rules change again.
* 3.4 ltr atmo petrol racing engine with 8 cylinders max
* 2.0 ltr turbo racing engine with 6 cylinders max
* 4.0 ltr atmo production based petrol engine homologated in LM GT2 - 1,000 units per year minimum production
* 4.4 ltr turbo production diesel engine 10,000 units per year minimum production
As you can see Porsche already have a 3.4L 8 cylinder engine that they can develop further.
As the current rules will change for 2011, there is really very little point (and certainly no commercial value) in building a car just for these two "interim" years before the rules change again.
Sep 26, 2008 3:53:11 PM
- Spyderidol
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Re: 2009 Porsche Motorsport
According to a poster on another Forum, the Italian magazine Autosprint is reporting news about the return of Porsche to the LMP1 class with a new prototype based (this is just a supposition) on the RS Spyder. According to the article, this news is for sure, and that Weissach are working on the future engine: petrol V8 DFI. The car would be launched in 2011, to compete in 24 Hours of Le Mans, ALMS and LMS. The car will be an open top car, the same as the RS Spyder.
N.B. I have NOT read the article, so if anyone can get their hands on a copy, I would much appreciate the confirmation of this news.
N.B. I have NOT read the article, so if anyone can get their hands on a copy, I would much appreciate the confirmation of this news.
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