Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur - Page2

Jun 29, 2008 3:40:43 AM

thuggy: Veteran; Loc: PA & CA , United States; Posts: 834, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 22, 2006; Reply to: nberry

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

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nberry said:
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Grant said:
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ADias said:
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Grant said:
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SoCal Alan said:Tadge J. Juechter, Corvette's chief engineer, announced this morning that Jim Mero, GM's development engineer, drove the ZR1 around the Nurburgring in 7:26.4.

If an engineer can lap the Ring in 7:26, imagine what the car would do in the hands of HVS!

GM always says crazy things like that. When the laptime for the Z06 was set, they claimed it was set by David Hill, project Director. He certainly wasn't the driver back then...

I think that David Hill's lap was run this year as an individual not as a GM employee. I imagine that his time can easily be challenged by a professional driver.

I thought the time attributed to Dave Hill WAS set by a pro driver (Jan Magnussen or someone), even though the press release said Dave set it...

It was Magnussen. FWIW, the GT-R times was 7.29 so the Z1 beats it.

Alan, I doubt HvS can even come close to this time. It just is not in his DNA.

Turbo Al, the consternation is that an America car has beaten the Supercars of Europe. That cannot be.

I can believe the time given what a ZO6 can do and this car has well over 600hp and lighter weight.

Unlike you Nick, most of us are not blinded by badges harping against HvS and Porsche. We are dealing with the realities of stated numbers and performance. The ZR1 Numbers are believable given the numbers, the GTRs are just harder the believe especially in comparison. Remember the ZR1 is lighter and with almost 200 bhp more than the GTR. This is always been the basis of our skepticism.

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Jun 29, 2008 8:05:26 AM

U Boat Commander: Veteran; Loc: Los Angeles, CA; Posts: 1250, Gallery; Registered on: May 8, 2004; Reply to: thuggy

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

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Jun 29, 2008 10:29:25 AM

Marwan Arakji: Senior; Loc: Lebanon , Lebanon; Posts: 572, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 11, 2006; Reply to: U Boat Commander

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

the problem is the CHEAP interior... all else is well... it's the feel you get as soon as you slip into one... I would be ready to pay an extra $25k for chevy to grant me a porsche/ferrari/aston-like interior... and THEN I'd buy one

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Jun 29, 2008 10:49:14 AM

Porsche-Jeck: Rennteam Master; Loc: Rheinland , Germany; Posts: 4856, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 27, 2005; Reply to: Marwan Arakji

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Marwan - this is not a real issue. I've seen a C6 with a very nice interior (Recaro seats & full leather á la Porsche) made to order (if I recall correctly the made to order parts were done by Callway). Salesguy told me the extra price for the customization was about 10-12k Euro

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Jun 29, 2008 10:56:17 AM

Walter: Pilot; Loc:; Posts: 453, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 20, 2006; Reply to: U Boat Commander

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

This article is stupid.Don't take those clowns seriously.

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Jun 29, 2008 2:04:53 PM

550 Spyder: Junior; Loc: MD, USA; Posts: 90, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 25, 2004; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

you must be kidding if you believe this interior is acceptable for a car that costs that much. Adding leather and other gadgets won't do the job either for this poorly designed interior. It needs a complete make-over.

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Jun 29, 2008 5:34:28 PM

JimFlat6: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Cave , United States; Posts: 8633, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 25, 2004; Reply to: Porsche-Jeck

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

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Porsche-Jeck said:
Marwan - this is not a real issue. I've seen a C6 with a very nice interior (Recaro seats & full leather á la Porsche) made to order (if I recall correctly the made to order parts were done by Callway). Salesguy told me the extra price for the customization was about 10-12k Euro

At least in the US, you can own a Corvette almost or free.

How? The first year depreciation for a 997 Cabriolet with a few options is almost the same as the sales price for a std 405hp Corvette convertible with sport suspension and 6spd manual.

You have plenty of money left over to install Porsche like leather interior trim and Recaro seats.

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Jun 29, 2008 5:47:22 PM

Marwan Arakji: Senior; Loc: Lebanon , Lebanon; Posts: 572, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 11, 2006; Reply to: JimFlat6

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

it ain't just the leather and seats... it's EVERYTHING... the interior shapes, every bit of material, button, and switch... the 50s and 60s corvettes were far more competitive with same era ferraris and maseratis... today, they have simply been surpassed... I love the simplicity of the corvette's engineering (chevy V8, rock-crushing gearbox, etc.), but I just can't take that interior... the pic. posted by 550 spyder says it ALL...

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Jun 29, 2008 6:49:39 PM

U Boat Commander: Veteran; Loc: Los Angeles, CA; Posts: 1250, Gallery; Registered on: May 8, 2004; Reply to: Walter

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
Walter said:
Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

This article is stupid.Don't take those clowns seriously.

Any actual reasons why you come to that conclusion or just usual messageboard, flying by the seat of your pants unsubstantiated commentary?

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Jun 29, 2008 8:22:07 PM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: U Boat Commander

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Quote:
Walter said:
Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

This article is stupid.Don't take those clowns seriously.

Any actual reasons why you come to that conclusion or just usual messageboard, flying by the seat of your pants unsubstantiated commentary?

Actually, Walter is right. There are a enough factual errors in that article to stop me taking it seriously.

Can't be bothered to go into detail. Spain is just beating Germany at soccer right now.

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Jun 30, 2008 1:14:09 AM

U Boat Commander: Veteran; Loc: Los Angeles, CA; Posts: 1250, Gallery; Registered on: May 8, 2004; Reply to: fritz

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

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fritz said:
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U Boat Commander said:
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Walter said:
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U Boat Commander said:
Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

This article is stupid.Don't take those clowns seriously.

Any actual reasons why you come to that conclusion or just usual messageboard, flying by the seat of your pants unsubstantiated commentary?

Actually, Walter is right. There are a enough factual errors in that article to stop me taking it seriously.

Can't be bothered to go into detail. Spain is just beating Germany at soccer right now.

I'm not really going to get into another GTR debate but the following are well established facts:

1. the GTR used a modified suspension and semi-cut slicks around the Ring;

2. The GTR Ring time is based on a flying start; and

3. The GTR Ring time is based on different starting and stopping points.

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Jun 30, 2008 3:38:09 AM

01Box06Z06: Pilot; Loc: Pennsylvania, USA; Posts: 300, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2006; Reply to: 550 Spyder

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
550 Spyder said:
you must be kidding if you believe this interior is acceptable for a car that costs that much. Adding leather and other gadgets won't do the job either for this poorly designed interior. It needs a complete make-over.

And you think this is worth $60K?

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Jun 30, 2008 8:48:33 AM

fritz: Rennteam VIP; Loc: BaWü , Germany; Posts: 10248, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 23, 2003; Reply to: U Boat Commander

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Quote:
fritz said:
Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Quote:
Walter said:
Quote:
U Boat Commander said:
Isn't it old news that the GTR Ring time is bougs?

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/the-truth-about-the-nissan-gt-r-and-the-nurburgring-lap-record/

This article is stupid.Don't take those clowns seriously.

Any actual reasons why you come to that conclusion or just usual messageboard, flying by the seat of your pants unsubstantiated commentary?

Actually, Walter is right. There are a enough factual errors in that article to stop me taking it seriously.

Can't be bothered to go into detail. Spain is just beating Germany at soccer right now.

I'm not really going to get into another GTR debate but the following are well established facts:

1. the GTR used a modified suspension and semi-cut slicks around the Ring;

2. The GTR Ring time is based on a flying start; and

3. The GTR Ring time is based on different starting and stopping points.

Re your points 2 and 3:

- All Ring times are generally based on a flying start, as the starting gate is at the end of a short section of speed-restricted track. (Compare it to driving through a speed-restricted pit lane). Cars accelerate at the end of the restricted zone to pass the starting point at as high a speed as possible.

- Due to the speed-restricted section which has to be driven through on every lap of the Nordschleife, the end of the lap is a few hundred meters away from from the start (i.e., before the starting point). This is the same for everyone going for a timed lap, not just Nissan.
Unless of course you are saying that Nissan shortened the lap even further by not using the same two positions for their start/end lap-triggers as everyone else uses?

Don't get me wrong. I also think that Nissan must have taken a cavalier attitude to preparing the car and/or timing the lap, otherwise they could not have achieved the claimed time in a stock car with stock weight and power figures. I just don't think that the web site you linked to got the facts right to help support this same view.

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Jun 30, 2008 12:13:45 PM

racerx: Rennteam VIP; Loc: 1985 porsche dealership , Bouvet Island; Posts: 8751, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 27, 2004; Reply to: fritz

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Comparison shots are interesting. Anyone got the same view of aston, ferrari, or lambo?

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Jun 30, 2008 12:25:07 PM

Ferdie: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Europe , Germany; Posts: 8234, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 2, 2004; Reply to: fritz

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

I won't comment on the Corvette itself anymore. There simply are two extreme opinions out there that won't go together.

The time sounds much more plausible considering track focus, spec sheet and personal experience. Anyways please note that the low thread on the Z06 and ZR1's tires are not any further away from everyday usability than Cup tires.

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Jun 30, 2008 2:05:29 PM

95jersey: Senior; Loc: US; Posts: 578, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 20, 2006; Reply to: Marwan Arakji

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
Marwan Arakji said:
the problem is the CHEAP interior... all else is well... it's the feel you get as soon as you slip into one... I would be ready to pay an extra $25k for chevy to grant me a porsche/ferrari/aston-like interior... and THEN I'd buy one

Jewlery is located in isle 4, next to cosmetics and ladies underwear. This thread is about gut wrenching performance cars. The information you seek is in the leather conditioning/polishing forum.

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Jun 30, 2008 2:20:14 PM

Marwan Arakji: Senior; Loc: Lebanon , Lebanon; Posts: 572, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 11, 2006; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
95jersey said:
Quote:
Marwan Arakji said:
the problem is the CHEAP interior... all else is well... it's the feel you get as soon as you slip into one... I would be ready to pay an extra $25k for chevy to grant me a porsche/ferrari/aston-like interior... and THEN I'd buy one

Jewlery is located in isle 4, next to cosmetics and ladies underwear. This thread is about gut wrenching performance cars. The information you seek is in the leather conditioning/polishing forum.

last i heard it was ok to want luxury AND performance in a single package... otherwise you might as well go straight to an Ariel Atom!

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Jun 30, 2008 2:32:32 PM

JoeRockhead: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Topside , Monaco; Posts: 8033, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 17, 2007; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
95jersey said:
Quote:
Marwan Arakji said:
the problem is the CHEAP interior... all else is well... it's the feel you get as soon as you slip into one... I would be ready to pay an extra $25k for chevy to grant me a porsche/ferrari/aston-like interior... and THEN I'd buy one

Jewlery is located in isle 4, next to cosmetics and ladies underwear. This thread is about gut wrenching performance cars. The information you seek is in the leather conditioning/polishing forum.

Maybe Chev can throw in some triple bacon-cheeseburger coupons and a football helmet to go along with the manly-man spartan interior?

I think it is a great looking car and the claimed 'ring time is quite believable. Definitely looking forward to the comparisons with the GT-R.

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Jun 30, 2008 4:36:17 PM

ADias: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Southwest USA , United States; Posts: 2495, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 9, 2004; Reply to: 01Box06Z06

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
01Box06Z06 said:
Quote:
550 Spyder said:
you must be kidding if you believe this interior is acceptable for a car that costs that much. Adding leather and other gadgets won't do the job either for this poorly designed interior. It needs a complete make-over.

And you think this is worth $60K?

Yeah, right... I did not reply to the original post because it was silly. The interior Vette picture perspective is terrible and all interiors shot from that perspective will look gaudy. It's silly to say that the interior of the current Vette is ugly, especially the top leather wrap. It is quite ergonomic and comfortable. And... these are the guys who would be paying a premium for a stripped bare metal interior should one be available from a premium brand. Prejudice and peer pressure are funny things.

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Jun 30, 2008 6:07:46 PM

95jersey: Senior; Loc: US; Posts: 578, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 20, 2006; Reply to: ADias

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

I enjoy participating on this forum primarily for it's diversity, but ONLY here would I continue to hear comments about a car's interior which runs a 7:26 at the ring!?!?! Instead of talking about spring ratio's, engine specs, gearing, gearbox, or suspension technology that makes such an increadible feat possible for a production car, we talk about "the dashboard"!?!? This is not a euro luxo 5000lb sedan, nor is it a bare metal open cockpit Ariel Atom. It is perhaps in a category of it's own (possibly created by American's), that blends the two methodologies together at s reasonable price. It takes raw perfomance only available in hardcore track biased machines, and happens to add a nice interior with airbags, air condition, and radio, with a package that is 100% streetable (probably more so than a GT3). It's focus is on perfomance with interior/luxury being secondary. The goal is to put the money into designing a machine that will conquer the world while providing at least a B+ comfort.

I personally see WAY to much emphasis on useless appointments in today's euro cars that are better suited to "football wives" than for a true sports car enthusiast.

I STILL say, Jewlery in isle #4!

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Jun 30, 2008 9:04:09 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: 4trac

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

My hope is that the more factory claims for NBR lap times of new cars will appear the more sports car lovers will agree that claimed OEM times are not reliable and thus not a basis for serious discussions. SportAuto Supertest rules (until another test of similar quality will appear)

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Jul 1, 2008 12:48:27 AM

Turbo Al: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Rochester, New York , United States; Posts: 2531, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 3, 2005; Reply to: 95jersey

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
95jersey said:
I enjoy participating on this forum primarily for it's diversity, but ONLY here would I continue to hear comments about a car's interior which runs a 7:26 at the ring!?!?! Instead of talking about spring ratio's, engine specs, gearing, gearbox, or suspension technology that makes such an increadible feat possible for a production car, we talk about "the dashboard"!?!? This is not a euro luxo 5000lb sedan, nor is it a bare metal open cockpit Ariel Atom. It is perhaps in a category of it's own (possibly created by American's), that blends the two methodologies together at s reasonable price. It takes raw perfomance only available in hardcore track biased machines, and happens to add a nice interior with airbags, air condition, and radio, with a package that is 100% streetable (probably more so than a GT3). It's focus is on perfomance with interior/luxury being secondary. The goal is to put the money into designing a machine that will conquer the world while providing at least a B+ comfort.

I personally see WAY to much emphasis on useless appointments in today's euro cars that are better suited to "football wives" than for a true sports car enthusiast.

I STILL say, Jewlery in isle #4!

Very well stated. This renaissance ability used to be the 911 Turbo's forte, combining supercar performance with everyday usability with just enough leather and bespoke trim to satisfy the Euro-effete and the pampered American. The model still can be modded to easily keep it on top, but with talk of making the next generation engine block just able to handle the tuning that comes from the factory and not much more, it will be the end of an era.

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Jul 1, 2008 8:31:24 AM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: Turbo Al

Re: Here we go again: ZR1 - 7:26.4 at Nur

Quote:
Turbo Al said:
Quote:
95jersey said:
I enjoy participating on this forum primarily for it's diversity, but ONLY here would I continue to hear comments about a car's interior which runs a 7:26 at the ring!?!?! Instead of talking about spring ratio's, engine specs, gearing, gearbox, or suspension technology that makes such an increadible feat possible for a production car, we talk about "the dashboard"!?!? This is not a euro luxo 5000lb sedan, nor is it a bare metal open cockpit Ariel Atom. It is perhaps in a category of it's own (possibly created by American's), that blends the two methodologies together at s reasonable price. It takes raw perfomance only available in hardcore track biased machines, and happens to add a nice interior with airbags, air condition, and radio, with a package that is 100% streetable (probably more so than a GT3). It's focus is on perfomance with interior/luxury being secondary. The goal is to put the money into designing a machine that will conquer the world while providing at least a B+ comfort.

I personally see WAY to much emphasis on useless appointments in today's euro cars that are better suited to "football wives" than for a true sports car enthusiast.

I STILL say, Jewlery in isle #4!

Very well stated. This renaissance ability used to be the 911 Turbo's forte, combining supercar performance with everyday usability with just enough leather and bespoke trim to satisfy the Euro-effete and the pampered American. The model still can be modded to easily keep it on top, but with talk of making the next generation engine block just able to handle the tuning that comes from the factory and not much more, it will be the end of an era.

Once the Turbo can no more be reliably tuned, the Audi R8 V10 (saw a white R8 with black rims yesterday - stunning; the silver 997 Turbo around the corner looked pedestrian) and the LP560 will become much more appealing for this demographic. After all, the LP560 is about as fast as a CG544/Ruf550 out of the box

.

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