Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud? - Page1

Feb 16, 2008 3:02:55 AM

whiteturbolover: Newbie; Loc: USA; Posts: 8, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 27, 2008

Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

As my 997tt is on her way, I started thinking about mods I'm going to do once i get her. First of all, I want to start with a good exhaust system and need experiences&opinions. I want her to sound same way as stock on idle, but want a really "perfect" sound when I do the full throttle. I have been doing some research for a while, and I finally have 2 choices left, tubi or cargraphic loud. I guess the cargraphic is louder than tubi. I listened only videoclips so far, because I don't have a chance to listen them in person where I live now. Of course better fit and car's health are important facts too.

So, which of them and why?

Thanks in advance

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Feb 16, 2008 2:28:42 PM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: whiteturbolover

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

I can't help you too much, but have listened to both (inside and outside the car) and have just ordered, but not yet installed the Tubi. I prefer the slightly higher pitch of the Tubi, and if there is any resonance induced by the aftermarket exhaust it should be easier to attenuate withe the Tubi. Both are excellent systems, you can't go wrong with either system.

I think it's a blonde or brunette kind of decision.

Good luck,

Dick

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Feb 16, 2008 2:48:03 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

If you want a really good sound get the Tubi, if you want sound and power get the Cargraphic.

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Feb 16, 2008 6:35:21 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Dick, so which one "sounds" like the blonde?

Quote:
dkreidel said:
I can't help you too much, but have listened to both (inside and outside the car) and have just ordered, but not yet installed the Tubi. I prefer the slightly higher pitch of the Tubi, and if there is any resonance induced by the aftermarket exhaust it should be easier to attenuate withe the Tubi. Both are excellent systems, you can't go wrong with either system.

I think it's a blonde or brunette kind of decision.

Good luck,

Dick

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Feb 17, 2008 2:29:13 AM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: cannga

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
cannga said:
Dick, so which one "sounds" like the blonde?

Hi Can!
The Tubi of course! The Tubi exhaust won't arrive until Monday, so it will be next week before I get it installed. I put the TT up on a lift today to see how involved the installation looks - I think it should go fairly easy providing I don't shear any studs in the turbos. If so, I'm prepared with a right angle aircraft pneumatic drill and the proper easy-outs - but that kind of problem always adds a few hours, a few beers and a lot of blue language.

I'm going to get a dyno run on Wednesday with the car bone stock, and then do another pull after the Tubi installation to see what the real story is on HP and torque. After the Tubi comes the chip, and another dyno run. I'm hoping for about 550 HP with the exhaust and chip.

Dick

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Feb 17, 2008 8:04:58 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Alex, probably doesn't make much difference anyway, but does Cargraphic quote higher horsepower/torque gain than Tubi? I don't see any numbers quoted on Champion Motorsports site for Tubi. Thanks.

Quote:
Alex_ said:
If you want a really good sound get the Tubi, if you want sound and power get the Cargraphic.

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Feb 17, 2008 8:13:42 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Ah, of course, the one with the higher pitch.

And wow, didn't know you planned to mod the ecu! We are all sinking deeper and deeper into "this," aren't we?

Sound like you have access to some racing group's shop! Have fun with the exhaust installation. Do you plan to take the bumper off?

Re. dyno, I am sure you've read Ed's recent thread in which issues re. dyno in awd cars were discussed?

Quote:
dkreidel said:
Quote:
cannga said:
Dick, so which one "sounds" like the blonde?

Hi Can!
The Tubi of course! The Tubi exhaust won't arrive until Monday, so it will be next week before I get it installed. I put the TT up on a lift today to see how involved the installation looks - I think it should go fairly easy providing I don't shear any studs in the turbos. If so, I'm prepared with a right angle aircraft pneumatic drill and the proper easy-outs - but that kind of problem always adds a few hours, a few beers and a lot of blue language.

I'm going to get a dyno run on Wednesday with the car bone stock, and then do another pull after the Tubi installation to see what the real story is on HP and torque. After the Tubi comes the chip, and another dyno run. I'm hoping for about 550 HP with the exhaust and chip.

Dick

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Feb 17, 2008 9:31:08 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: cannga

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
cannga said:
Alex, probably doesn't make much difference anyway, but does Cargraphic quote higher horsepower/torque gain than Tubi? I don't see any numbers quoted on Champion Motorsports site for Tubi. Thanks.

Quote:
Alex_ said:
If you want a really good sound get the Tubi, if you want sound and power get the Cargraphic.

Been told by Tubi to expect between 8-28bhp gains. Been told by Cargraphic to expect at least 25bhp and 30Nm torque. The CG power jump is much more consistent.

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Feb 17, 2008 11:18:28 PM

whiteturbolover: Newbie; Loc: USA; Posts: 8, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 27, 2008; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

thanks to you all

Alex, I guess you have listened both systems in person and you say Tubi sounds little better doesn't it? I'm also going to do ECU soon, so I think sound should be the 1st factor on my decision.

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Feb 18, 2008 9:34:16 AM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: whiteturbolover

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Tubi is higher pitched, Cargraphic lower. Tubi sounds like a race car, CG more Porsche-like.

I haven't heard the CG loud version, only the middle one - which I am supposed to be having fitted this week.

Tubi does sound good though - so either way I think you would be happy. I would say that the CG Loud is probably louder than the Tubi. When I went out in a 997TT with the Tubi it sounded nice but I was expecting more noise - especially in the cabin. Suppose that's a good thing though.

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Feb 18, 2008 9:41:37 AM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: whiteturbolover

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
whiteturbolover said:
thanks to you all Alex, I guess you have listened both systems in person and you say Tubi sounds little better doesn't it? I'm also going to do ECU soon, so I think sound should be the 1st factor on my decision.

If you are going to do ECU also, then I strongly suggest you consider the CG powerkit which is Air-filter + Exhaust + ECU.

Cargraphic (RS-Tuning) powerkit is TUV approved and RS-Tuning is one of THE top dogs in the world of Porsche tuning. Lot of threads here recently about me talking about the powerkit.

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Feb 18, 2008 8:36:58 PM

STRADALE: Rennteam VIP; Loc: NY , United States; Posts: 11075, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 9, 2005; Reply to: cannga

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
cannga said:
Alex, probably doesn't make much difference anyway, but does Cargraphic quote higher horsepower/torque gain than Tubi? I don't see any numbers quoted on Champion Motorsports site for Tubi. Thanks.

Quote:
Alex_ said:
If you want a really good sound get the Tubi, if you want sound and power get the Cargraphic.

They both provide the same HP.

btw: just got back from Champion Motorports & Champion Porsche - Awesome! Tubi is defintely the way to go.

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Feb 18, 2008 9:53:17 PM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: STRADALE

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

My Tubi has arrived, but I need to find a day when I can do the dyno pull; install the Tubi and then get another dyno pull the same day. It may be next week but I'll have some real data - not claims - to share with you. My car is bone stock right now, and the Tubi will be the first performance upgrade.

Dick

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Feb 18, 2008 11:04:00 PM

AK997TT: Junior; Loc: SoCal; Posts: 76, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 22, 2006; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

dkreidel, looking forward to your report. Hope to see you at C&C again real soon!

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Feb 21, 2008 12:49:47 AM

silverrules: Senior; Loc: N. Calif , United States; Posts: 784, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 5, 2005; Reply to: AK997TT

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

My delaer is quoting me 5 hrs to install the Tubi exhust. Does it sound reasonable? Wonder how many hr your dealer charged you guys?

Thanks

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Feb 21, 2008 2:54:58 AM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: silverrules

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

I'm going to do it myself as soon as I return from Taipei next week. I'll let you know how long a "TT Exhaust Virgin", but competent wrench takes to complete the install.

I think I can do it in 3 - 3.5 hours

Dick

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Feb 21, 2008 4:56:14 AM

atomic80: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Bellevue, WA USA , United States; Posts: 2596, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2006; Reply to: silverrules

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
silverrules said:
My delaer is quoting me 5 hrs to install the Tubi exhust. Does it sound reasonable? Wonder how many hr your dealer charged you guys?

Thanks

That's how long it took my dealership to do the install. 5 hours. But really, for these kinds of jobs if you're going to do it yourself, why rush it? Take your time and do it right.

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Feb 21, 2008 4:40:18 PM

silverrules: Senior; Loc: N. Calif , United States; Posts: 784, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 5, 2005; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

I think I can do it in 3 - 3.5 hours

Dick

Dick, You'r the man !!!!Please Post pictures showing the step by step procedure. It probably be a popular thread

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Feb 21, 2008 5:50:22 PM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: silverrules

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

I will indeed take good pix and document the installation. This isn't rocket science, it's removing and replacing a bolt-on muffler system. I've ordered a couple of specialized tools (like an O2 socket and flare nut crowfoot) that may make this easier. I'm also inclined to leave the four O2 sensors on the stock exhaust and simply unplug the 4 electrical connectors...and then drop the whole mess down. This should make the O2 sensor R&R much easier than doing it in situ.

Dick

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Feb 21, 2008 6:23:35 PM

cannga: Expert; Loc: Los Angeles's "twisties" :-) , United States; Posts: 1940, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 6, 2005; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Dick,

I *can't* wait to hear the "elusive" Tubi!!

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Feb 21, 2008 7:47:38 PM

isurg: Newbie; Loc: KY, USA; Posts: 16, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 3, 2008; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Quote:
dkreidel said:
I will indeed take good pix and document the installation. This isn't rocket science, it's removing and replacing a bolt-on muffler system. I've ordered a couple of specialized tools (like an O2 socket and flare nut crowfoot) that may make this easier. I'm also inclined to leave the four O2 sensors on the stock exhaust and simply unplug the 4 electrical connectors...and then drop the whole mess down. This should make the O2 sensor R&R much easier than doing it in situ.

Dick

I will be doing my exhaust and plenum myself next month. What is special about the 02 socket?

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Feb 21, 2008 7:50:16 PM

TT Gasman: Co-Pilot; Loc: Texas , United States; Posts: 241, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 18, 2002; Reply to: isurg

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Yes leave the O2 sensors & wires on when you drop it down, then you can use a regular 22mm wrench, no special tool needed. It's a 3-4 hour job maybe slightly longer if you need more exposure ( removing bumper, intercoolers etc.).

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Feb 21, 2008 8:41:12 PM

dkreidel: Co-Pilot; Loc: SoCal USA , United States; Posts: 167, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 10, 2006; Reply to: TT Gasman

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Doug - thanks for the confirmation leaving the sensors on the exhaust is the right way to approach the job

Dick

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Feb 22, 2008 3:59:26 AM

TT Gasman: Co-Pilot; Loc: Texas , United States; Posts: 241, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 18, 2002; Reply to: dkreidel

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

Dick, one more thing. Make sure you secure all the wires in the factory mounting points when you run the wires back up. Enjoy the Tubis!

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Feb 23, 2008 12:38:19 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: TT Gasman

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

The CG Kit 1 is just an exhaust and air-filter.

> CG Powerkits <

Although if I was more interested in sound and price over power, I would actually go with a Tubi exhaust and a BMC air filter (Tubi is about Pounds2500 fitted, whereas the CG exhaust is about Pounds3300 here in the UK).

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Feb 23, 2008 3:31:04 PM

salihbjk: Junior; Loc: Turkey; Posts: 111, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 16, 2007; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

how much hp difference is there with tubi and cg loud exhaust system?

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Feb 23, 2008 3:34:39 PM

atomic80: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Bellevue, WA USA , United States; Posts: 2596, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2006; Reply to: salihbjk

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

No, not much but look at how much smoother the powerband seems to be.

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Feb 23, 2008 3:56:40 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: atomic80

Re: Tubi vs Cargraphic Loud?

What I am trying to work out is if in the exhaust graph both lines are using non-Sport mode (620Nm torque standard). Because then in the Powerkit graph which has 620Nm going to 800Nm - whether if I then put it in Sport will it give 860Nm?!! I know the re-map sits on top of the OEM mapping so Sport should still give a +60Nm overboost.

Or do you think they got 620Nm in Sport mode ie. less than it should be? Perhaps these are power measurements taken at the wheel and not on an engine dyno?!

They say the OEM clutch is designed to work with the 800Nm (544bhp) powerkit but surely 860Nm is going to over stress it.

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