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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
I found the video a vaguely unsettling ‘vision” of the near future. A little too neat, too electronic, too planned. ICEs are flawed but human, the electric vehicle always comes across as sterile and devoid of the human element. Guess I’m just old.
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"Don't worry about avoiding temptation, as you grow older it will avoid you" Churchill
Exactly as in formula e, thin ones with a loooot of rubber (16-17’’?). Not where sporty imoRe: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
DaveC:I found the video a vaguely unsettling ‘vision” of the near future. A little too neat, too electronic, too planned. ICEs are flawed but human, the electric vehicle always comes across as sterile and devoid of the human element. Guess I’m just old.
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"Don't worry about avoiding temptation, as you grow older it will avoid you" Churchill
I'm a geek, a nerd, a gadget lover, whatever involves technology, especially new one, I'm in but when I think about autonomous driving systems, aka autonomous driving cars, I get the chills. 
Hate this stuff. 
I don't even order the usually available driving assistants stuff, my Mercedes dealer was quite surprised ("all our E class customers order that...").
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Speaking of autonomous driving cars...this is worth reading:
http://saferoads.org/2018/03/05/letter-to-senate-leaders-on-driverless-car-bill/
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
This concept has potential but this particular example is horrible, all the way down to the colors chosen.
Why bother to compare vs a Tesla, one is a not final concept, the other is already on the roads. It is like comparing a four year old $60k Cayenne TTS with a brand new $170k one...
The performance announced is VERY disappointing for a Porsche. The CURRENT Tesla S blows it out the water. Would I buy this (or the equivalent Macan ELV) vs a future Model X for $100k? For sure. But there is no way this car will be $100k with the necessary options. But then again this concept should be compared to the future Model Y. Would you buy this for $100k it a Model Y for $60k is the real question...
Range?
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
we all are waiting for its options list to be leaked...there's already internet buzz about its optional electrically heated floor mats and the sport option ones that interface with the sport chrono package.
or AMG detection that warns drivers of a AMG Benz about to pass them. Porsche HQ must have bad water in their pipes, first the 718 motor and now this can't run at high speed much mini wagon because the batteries will drain fast.
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Josef:Finally some really negative comments
I hate this concept, one of the most idiotic cars / concepts that ever came out of Porsche. They must be joking
It is not a Porsche it is an Audi All-Road
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Guys, you don't have to buy it. 
Porsche is responsible for the sportscars in the VW Group, so the stuff you usually buy (GT cars, etc.) will still be available. Just look at it from this perspective: Porsche can only survive if they offer ELVs, hybrids, SUVs, crossovers, etc. too.
We are the 3%...remember? The customers Porsche thinks are not representative for the typical Porsche customer?! 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Mar 7, 2018 1:12:10 PM
- alexalex88
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Is not that the concept is bad. The thing is we are in front one of the ugliest cars ever (about to be) made - absolute lack of proportion. Also there is not groundbreaking technology nor any special feature that would make you wanna instantly buy it.
RC you don't have to buy a Tesla either, so why all the hate towards Tesla? And this sectarian comprehension to Porsche? Where are the products from the big companies that will make Musk's company run out of business?
Not to mention how Porsche screwed original Mission E concept, already dated and far from its challenging but beautiful concept lines.
Mar 7, 2018 2:15:23 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Talk about sectarianism 
... as far as I seen the Jaguar EV had a great acceptance in the forum and its not Porsche. The Jag is just the start.
If you think the Mission E Cross Turismo is ugly, and I don't think its a looker at all BTW, just put it side by side to a Tesla X or 3 and the P-frog will magically turn into a prince.
As to new groundbreaking technology vs a Tesla, it doesn't need it, there is plenty on the handling and driving character department to draw upon, the build quality and reliability, the interior, autobahn performance, etc...
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⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
RC:Guys, you don't have to buy it.
Porsche is responsible for the sportscars in the VW Group, so the stuff you usually buy (GT cars, etc.) will still be available. Just look at it from this perspective: Porsche can only survive if the offer ELVs, hybrids, SUVs, crossovers, etc. too.
We are the 3%...remember? The customers Porsche thinks are not representative for the typical Porsche customer?!
The Porsche Dealers will tell you the Cayenne and Macan are what generates the sales and services revenue for them. ELVs will add another stream for them. Sports car sales/service are a very small piece. Without these revenue streams, my dealer certainly wouldn't sponsorship and funding for club racing.
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Mar 7, 2018 5:12:44 PM
- bobr
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
In the video the car looks attractive IMO. Porsche styling elements are nicely integrated.
Static pictures might not do it justice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oa5F1cWLnRg
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Mar 8, 2018 11:16:21 AM
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RC
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
alexalex88:Is not that the concept is bad. The thing is we are in front one of the ugliest cars ever (about to be) made - absolute lack of proportion. Also there is not groundbreaking technology nor any special feature that would make you wanna instantly buy it.
RC you don't have to buy a Tesla either, so why all the hate towards Tesla? And this sectarian comprehension to Porsche? Where are the products from the big companies that will make Musk's company run out of business?
Not to mention how Porsche screwed original Mission E concept, already dated and far from its challenging but beautiful concept lines.
Hate? I guess you don't know me to understand what I'd do if I hate something. 
I am a very critical person, maybe you haven't read my other comments regarding other cars (incl. Porsche) in detail.
No hate towards Tesla, actually lots of admiration (especially for Elon Musk and his achievements) but I don't see a future in Tesla's current ELV strategy, unless they move away from personal cars. Even in the truck or bus business, there is a lot going on, so not sure if their future will be there.
Or let me put it this way: I saw the future at VW Group and it is impressive. Even if I think they are rushing things (with ELVs).
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Mar 8, 2018 11:33:03 AM
- alexalex88
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
For now the products they (VAG) are hinting are not disrupting at all.
Basically the Audi e-tron, Porsche Mission E variants, etc. are already dated cars and they are not even on the market. The numbers are the same than a 2012 Tesla.
Then: impressive future? Let's take it with a grain of salt.
Mar 8, 2018 11:42:16 AM
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RC
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Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
alexalex88:For now the products they (VAG) are hinting are not disrupting at all.
Basically the Audi e-tron, Porsche Mission E variants, etc. are already dated cars and they are not even on the market. The numbers are the same than a 2012 Tesla.
Then: impressive future? Let's take it with a grain of salt.
This is the future the public sees... VW Group has diverted resources, the future will be seen in a couple of years and I wonder how companies like Tesla will keep up with it. I still think it is too early though but maybe I am an old dinosaur. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Marek Reichmann has arguably made an even bolder/worse design on a pure electric car - depending upon your point of view - with the Lagonda Vision Concept.
It seems that designers want to try and force through a change in perception of how a car should look. They should pay heed to what happened to Renault every time Patrick Le Quément adopted a similar approach - Avantime, Vel Satis etc. The Japanese manufacturers have also tried to give their hybrid models quirky styling but it just does not have wide enough appeal. How many more Leafs or Prius models could/would have been sold if the styling was more contemporary. Ellon Musk shrewdly realised this and kept the Model S styling far closer to that of a conventional ICE car.
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
Why can't ELVs look like ordinary cars and go through the regular/usual design evolution?
Best example are the Prius and the i3: Ugly as hell, just because the manufacturers wanted to make a (design) point. The future? Seriously? If the future looks that ugly... 
I think this trend to futuristically (over)designed ELVs will die down at some point.
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
I think one cannot compare the Lagonda with the Porsche, it is has a completely different purpose.
With ELVs, desinger have far more flexibility on the car's design, as the E-motors are much smaller than the ICE. Therefore, designer go much further with the design of ELVs, especially with concepts such as the Lagonda. This does not mean that I like to new direction. We know and are used to the current design "language" for the last 100 years...it is difficult to just accept something completely new.
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
It's like with smartphones. When the first designed smartphones lacking buttons appeared they seemed to be strange and impossible to use. How would I survive without keyboard/buttons and how can I talk in that thing when it doesn't have a clamshell? 
Saying all that I still prefer the rather traditional design lines and many of the EV prototypes, concepts and "Design studies" are a bit over the top. Still like the minimalism and also focus on new materials. Leather in a car to me something that belongs to the past. Hot in the summer and cold in the winter and doesn't wear very well over time. Luxury fabric materials is much nicer and we'll probably see much more of that the coming years.
What the VW-group have in store with the *ZZ* cars I'm not sure. Think it's not very appealing so far... Porsche seem to get it much more "right", but it's getting a bit bland at the same time. The specs on the Mission-E versions are a bit of a disappointment also. Apart from the 800v charging, there is not a single thing that is ground braking. And the 350kW charging speed will be the norm in 2020 anyway. Maybe Tesla will upgrade their Superchargers in 2020 to double that effect. Who knows. The knowledge is for sure there with the Megachargers for the Semi....
And oh. Why is everybody in here using the abbreviation ELV that doesn't even exist? It is EV or BEV
Re: Porsche Mission E Cross Turismo
I'm not sure it's actually safe to have cars with front seats that don't face airbags, but yeah, in the distant future we will just be riding in glass pods playing on your phones or computers or reading or whatever. The perfect car of the future is just a greenhouse to relax or do other stuff.
And I agree, leather sucks. I would rarely even buy leather furniture. It's always too hot, too cold, too sweaty, too sticky, doesn't wear well. There is really nothing that great about leather aside from being easy to wipe off spills.
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