Crown

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Crash said:
This guy would have survived had he worn a seatbelt. Most crashes nowadays are survivable unless coming to a very sudden stop or rolling for a long distance.

When will people learn?

Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

Excessive speed will kill you no matter what.

Actually your statement is more the erroneous one. I've been working in emergency services for over 25 years and based on what I see in these pictures this appears to be a very survivable crash, if your wearing a seatbelt. The picture that is most significant is the final one that shows the side view of the drivers area. The drivers area is for the most part intact. The A and B pillars show minimal damage. The roof also maintained its integrity. The drivers seat remained attached to the vehicle and the steering wheel is intact. What can't be seen is the footwell. Based on the front pictures I would presume there might be some intrusion into that area. Damage in that area typically results in fractures to the long bones of the lower extremities. While serious, generally not fatal.

The drivers door of the vehicle is missing. That could be from the accident or from the rescue itself. With that in mind the most probable scenario is that the driver either "pinballed" within the vehicle or was ejected, either of which could be prevented by a seatbelt.

Bottom line is this, seatbelts are your absolute best defense in a vehicle accident. Airbags are a good supplement. But they are just that, a supplement. These statements do not come from speculation, but from direct observation having responded to thousands of accidents over the past 25 years. And yes I'm still a total gearhead who loves to jump in my 987S, buckle up, and go have some fun in the twisties or at the track.

Take a look at the second picture. The hood has buckled and the bumper is completely missing. Now, tell me at no point in this accident was there a frontal collision.

The most likely scenario is the guy died upon impact due to excessive speed.

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Crash said:
This guy would have survived had he worn a seatbelt. Most crashes nowadays are survivable unless coming to a very sudden stop or rolling for a long distance.

When will people learn?

Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

Excessive speed will kill you no matter what.

Actually your statement is more the erroneous one. I've been working in emergency services for over 25 years and based on what I see in these pictures this appears to be a very survivable crash, if your wearing a seatbelt. The picture that is most significant is the final one that shows the side view of the drivers area. The drivers area is for the most part intact. The A and B pillars show minimal damage. The roof also maintained its integrity. The drivers seat remained attached to the vehicle and the steering wheel is intact. What can't be seen is the footwell. Based on the front pictures I would presume there might be some intrusion into that area. Damage in that area typically results in fractures to the long bones of the lower extremities. While serious, generally not fatal.

The drivers door of the vehicle is missing. That could be from the accident or from the rescue itself. With that in mind the most probable scenario is that the driver either "pinballed" within the vehicle or was ejected, either of which could be prevented by a seatbelt.

Bottom line is this, seatbelts are your absolute best defense in a vehicle accident. Airbags are a good supplement. But they are just that, a supplement. These statements do not come from speculation, but from direct observation having responded to thousands of accidents over the past 25 years. And yes I'm still a total gearhead who loves to jump in my 987S, buckle up, and go have some fun in the twisties or at the track.

Take a look at the second picture. The hood has buckled and the bumper is completely missing. Now, tell me at no point in this accident was there a frontal collision.

The most likely scenario is the guy died upon impact due to excessive speed.

I did see the second picture. What that picture shows is that the car did exactly what it was supposed to do. Cars are designed to crumple and deform in a preset manner to dissipate energy to protect the occupants. This vehicle did just that. The hood is bent in the standard engineering manner and pieces of the vehicle are designed to come off to help dissipate the energy and forces of the accident. Again the key picture is the drivers cell. The drivers cell is almost completely intact. The fact that there is so much damage to the front indicates the car was dissipating the energy so that it would not transfer to the human occupants. This is the science of modern automotive safety engineering. However none of this works without the occupant(s) wearing their seat belts. Again I say this is not from speculation, but from direct observation.

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svtrader1 said:
[...] upon impact due to excessive speed.

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Crash said:
This guy would have survived had he worn a seatbelt. Most crashes nowadays are survivable unless coming to a very sudden stop or rolling for a long distance.

When will people learn?

Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

Excessive speed will kill you no matter what.

Actually your statement is more the erroneous one. I've been working in emergency services for over 25 years and based on what I see in these pictures this appears to be a very survivable crash, if your wearing a seatbelt. The picture that is most significant is the final one that shows the side view of the drivers area. The drivers area is for the most part intact. The A and B pillars show minimal damage. The roof also maintained its integrity. The drivers seat remained attached to the vehicle and the steering wheel is intact. What can't be seen is the footwell. Based on the front pictures I would presume there might be some intrusion into that area. Damage in that area typically results in fractures to the long bones of the lower extremities. While serious, generally not fatal.

The drivers door of the vehicle is missing. That could be from the accident or from the rescue itself. With that in mind the most probable scenario is that the driver either "pinballed" within the vehicle or was ejected, either of which could be prevented by a seatbelt.

Bottom line is this, seatbelts are your absolute best defense in a vehicle accident. Airbags are a good supplement. But they are just that, a supplement. These statements do not come from speculation, but from direct observation having responded to thousands of accidents over the past 25 years. And yes I'm still a total gearhead who loves to jump in my 987S, buckle up, and go have some fun in the twisties or at the track.

Take a look at the second picture. The hood has buckled and the bumper is completely missing. Now, tell me at no point in this accident was there a frontal collision.

The most likely scenario is the guy died upon impact due to excessive speed.

I did see the second picture. What that picture shows is that the car did exactly what it was supposed to do. Cars are designed to crumple and deform in a preset manner to dissipate energy to protect the occupants. This vehicle did just that. The hood is bent in the standard engineering manner and pieces of the vehicle are designed to come off to help dissipate the energy and forces of the accident. Again the key picture is the drivers cell. The drivers cell is almost completely intact. The fact that there is so much damage to the front indicates the car was dissipating the energy so that it would not transfer to the human occupants. This is the science of modern automotive safety engineering. However none of this works without the occupant(s) wearing their seat belts. Again I say this is not from speculation, but from direct observation.

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Crash said:
This guy would have survived had he worn a seatbelt. Most crashes nowadays are survivable unless coming to a very sudden stop or rolling for a long distance.

When will people learn?

Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

Excessive speed will kill you no matter what.

Actually your statement is more the erroneous one. I've been working in emergency services for over 25 years and based on what I see in these pictures this appears to be a very survivable crash, if your wearing a seatbelt. The picture that is most significant is the final one that shows the side view of the drivers area. The drivers area is for the most part intact. The A and B pillars show minimal damage. The roof also maintained its integrity. The drivers seat remained attached to the vehicle and the steering wheel is intact. What can't be seen is the footwell. Based on the front pictures I would presume there might be some intrusion into that area. Damage in that area typically results in fractures to the long bones of the lower extremities. While serious, generally not fatal.

The drivers door of the vehicle is missing. That could be from the accident or from the rescue itself. With that in mind the most probable scenario is that the driver either "pinballed" within the vehicle or was ejected, either of which could be prevented by a seatbelt.

Bottom line is this, seatbelts are your absolute best defense in a vehicle accident. Airbags are a good supplement. But they are just that, a supplement. These statements do not come from speculation, but from direct observation having responded to thousands of accidents over the past 25 years. And yes I'm still a total gearhead who loves to jump in my 987S, buckle up, and go have some fun in the twisties or at the track.

Take a look at the second picture. The hood has buckled and the bumper is completely missing. Now, tell me at no point in this accident was there a frontal collision.

The most likely scenario is the guy died upon impact due to excessive speed.

I did see the second picture. What that picture shows is that the car did exactly what it was supposed to do. Cars are designed to crumple and deform in a preset manner to dissipate energy to protect the occupants. This vehicle did just that. The hood is bent in the standard engineering manner and pieces of the vehicle are designed to come off to help dissipate the energy and forces of the accident. Again the key picture is the drivers cell. The drivers cell is almost completely intact. The fact that there is so much damage to the front indicates the car was dissipating the energy so that it would not transfer to the human occupants. This is the science of modern automotive safety engineering. However none of this works without the occupant(s) wearing their seat belts. Again I say this is not from speculation, but from direct observation.

We must not be looking at the same last picture.
What I see is major damage to the side frame of the car. This would imply that it was the initial contact of this crash. And why I say the the driver died upon impact.

The driver was driving excessively (triple digit) fast, lost control and hit something from the side...a tree, a lamppost, a telephonepole, etc.and died. Again, take a close look at the last picture. Imagine how damaged the door was after it was removed. You can also imagine the damage it would do to the side of the driver's head and body.

Which is why I say a fastened seatbelt would not have saved him. Nor, would a seatbelt in conjuntion with side curtain airbags. The guy was going too fast. Period!

Okay, here why the driver didn't "pinball" around in the cabin:

1. The roof of the car is undamaged, which means the driver was not tossed around like a rag doll.

2. There is only major damage to the side and front of this car. It would have to hit numerous objects to force the driver to pinball around.

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Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

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svtrader1 said:

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Carlos from Spain said:

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svtrader1 said:

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JimFlat6 said:
Very sad. Yes, he should have had his seatbelt on.

However, the crash may not have been his fault. And the seatbelts and airbags may not have been enough to mitigate the kinetic energy from the impact.

Yes, somebody actually understands the big picture!
Remember Ben had his seatbelt on, airbags deployed and he was wearing a helmet in his CGT, yet ended ep dead.

Excessive speed kills no matter what.

No, absolutely everybody agrees on that part, who wouldn't?

But you said to Crash: "Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts". Thats a different story altogether and what was obviously rebuted by other members, and not that seatblets and airbags can save you from ALL posible accidents.

Go back and read his statement. He stated wearing a seat belt would've save the driver's life as if it were a scientific fact.

That is pure speculation and utter nonsense.

You have a knack for sidetracking yourself.

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Paralizer said:

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svtrader1 said:

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Crash said:
This guy would have survived had he worn a seatbelt. Most crashes nowadays are survivable unless coming to a very sudden stop or rolling for a long distance.

When will people learn?

Nonsense and pure speculation on your part. Airbags do a much better job of protecting you from a frontal crash than seatbelts.

Excessive speed will kill you no matter what.

Actually your statement is more the erroneous one. I've been working in emergency services for over 25 years and based on what I see in these pictures this appears to be a very survivable crash, if your wearing a seatbelt. The picture that is most significant is the final one that shows the side view of the drivers area. The drivers area is for the most part intact. The A and B pillars show minimal damage. The roof also maintained its integrity. The drivers seat remained attached to the vehicle and the steering wheel is intact. What can't be seen is the footwell. Based on the front pictures I would presume there might be some intrusion into that area. Damage in that area typically results in fractures to the long bones of the lower extremities. While serious, generally not fatal.

The drivers door of the vehicle is missing. That could be from the accident or from the rescue itself. With that in mind the most probable scenario is that the driver either "pinballed" within the vehicle or was ejected, either of which could be prevented by a seatbelt.

Bottom line is this, seatbelts are your absolute best defense in a vehicle accident. Airbags are a good supplement. But they are just that, a supplement. These statements do not come from speculation, but from direct observation having responded to thousands of accidents over the past 25 years. And yes I'm still a total gearhead who loves to jump in my 987S, buckle up, and go have some fun in the twisties or at the track.

Take a look at the second picture. The hood has buckled and the bumper is completely missing. Now, tell me at no point in this accident was there a frontal collision.

The most likely scenario is the guy died upon impact due to excessive speed.

I did see the second picture. What that picture shows is that the car did exactly what it was supposed to do. Cars are designed to crumple and deform in a preset manner to dissipate energy to protect the occupants. This vehicle did just that. The hood is bent in the standard engineering manner and pieces of the vehicle are designed to come off to help dissipate the energy and forces of the accident. Again the key picture is the drivers cell. The drivers cell is almost completely intact. The fact that there is so much damage to the front indicates the car was dissipating the energy so that it would not transfer to the human occupants. This is the science of modern automotive safety engineering. However none of this works without the occupant(s) wearing their seat belts. Again I say this is not from speculation, but from direct observation.

We must not be looking at the same last picture.
What I see is major damage to the side frame of the car. This would imply that it was the initial contact of this crash. And why I say the the driver died upon impact.

The driver was driving excessively (triple digit) fast, lost control and hit something from the side...a tree, a lamppost, a telephonepole, etc.and died. Again, take a close look at the last picture. Imagine how damaged the door was after it was removed. You can also imagine the damage it would do to the side of the driver's head and body.

Which is why I say a fastened seatbelt would not have saved him. Nor, would a seatbelt in conjuntion with side curtain airbags. The guy was going too fast. Period!

Okay, here why the driver didn't "pinball" around in the cabin:

1. The roof of the car is undamaged, which means the driver was not tossed around like a rag doll.

2. There is only major damage to the side and front of this car. It would have to hit numerous objects to force the driver to pinball around.