Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Re: Pagani Huayra - Page2

Oct 27, 2017 1:49:33 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: noone1

Re: Pagani Huayra

noone1:
I think the P15 should come in very, very light. I mean, it has to have more power and lightweight than an already powerful and lightweight 720S. It's a P1 replacement minus hybrid, so I'm expecting something extremely light.

This is what I am worried about: Have we seen any crash test results from McLaren or similar cars in the hypercar category? I don't say they aren't safe but do potential buyers actually care about actual crash test results? I doubt it.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Oct 27, 2017 2:06:25 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: RC

Re: Pagani Huayra

Well, we've seen plenty of crashed with 12Cs etc and those cabins tend to come out looking very "good".

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Oct 27, 2017 4:38:42 PM

absent: Pilot; Loc: Illinois , United States; Posts: 365, Gallery; Registered on: May 6, 2012; Reply to: noone1

Re: Pagani Huayra

That's the beauty of CF, lighter and stronger in a crash.

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Oct 27, 2017 8:04:57 PM

crayphile: Rennteam Pro; Loc: England , United Kingdom; Posts: 2861, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 16, 2004; Reply to: noone1

Re: Pagani Huayra

noone1:
It's a P1 replacement minus hybrid, so I'm expecting something extremely light.

McLaren are most definitely not positioning it as a P1 replacement. it another Ultimate Series car and sits below P1.

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Oct 27, 2017 11:08:39 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: crayphile

Re: Pagani Huayra

Similar price, limited production, higher performance, and in the same series name. Why wouldn't it be a replacement?

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Oct 30, 2017 8:47:40 AM

Joost: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands; Posts: 8059, Gallery; Registered on: May 3, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: Pagani Huayra

RC:
noone1:
I think the P15 should come in very, very light. I mean, it has to have more power and lightweight than an already powerful and lightweight 720S. It's a P1 replacement minus hybrid, so I'm expecting something extremely light.

This is what I am worried about: Have we seen any crash test results from McLaren or similar cars in the hypercar category? I don't say they aren't safe but do potential buyers actually care about actual crash test results? I doubt it.

Are crash tests not mandatory for cars in Europe to be allowed on the road?

--

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

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Oct 30, 2017 2:30:21 PM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: RC

Re: Pagani Huayra

RC:
noone1:
I think the P15 should come in very, very light. I mean, it has to have more power and lightweight than an already powerful and lightweight 720S. It's a P1 replacement minus hybrid, so I'm expecting something extremely light.

This is what I am worried about: Have we seen any crash test results from McLaren or similar cars in the hypercar category? I don't say they aren't safe but do potential buyers actually care about actual crash test results? I doubt it.

You will be surprised at how strong the carbon tub is.

This happened earlier in the month.

They were guests of the McLaren dealership and on their way to our track for a corporate day, but they were idiots on the road and It left the road at a very high rate of speed and rolled a few times.

Both driver and passenger survived with minimal injuries.

The tub is so strong event the doors worked and the windshield is not even cracked.

--

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Oct 30, 2017 3:48:53 PM

bridggar: Veteran; Loc: UK , United Kingdom; Posts: 1223, Gallery; Registered on: May 25, 2007; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Pagani Huayra

Why so filthy inside? Looks like they sank somehow??

--

991 Carrera Black Edition, XC90 Black\Black - 2 kids, 1 dog

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Oct 30, 2017 9:25:05 PM

DaveGordon: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Zürich , Switzerland; Posts: 2774, Gallery; Registered on: Aug 20, 2007; Reply to: bridggar

Re: Pagani Huayra

bridggar:
Why so filthy inside? Looks like they sank somehow??

Windows open while it was rolling..?

I wouldn’t doubt McLaren’s ability to build an immensely strong car. Their history is very good; in the F1 they built the first car ever to be driven away from a British MIRA crash test.

--

2015 911 GT3, 1964 Type 1

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Oct 30, 2017 10:30:05 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: DaveGordon

Re: Pagani Huayra

They most likely have to do crash tests, but keep in mind how good simulations are.

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Oct 30, 2017 10:35:56 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: noone1

Nov 2, 2017 10:25:27 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: noone1

Re: Pagani Huayra

I wa dubious about the strength of the carbo tub. But after Ben's crash in the CGT I am now a believer. The tub is almost bullet proof. I was present when the car was going to be disassembled. That's me speaking with an insurance representative. They were interested in pursuing Subrogation possibilities. This picture was taken in July 2005.

--

"A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

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Nov 3, 2017 11:08:11 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: nberry

Re: Pagani Huayra

Unfortunately the human body isn't as "tough" as a carbon tub and even if the tub isn't damaged, the human body is. angry You can't beat physics...yet.

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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Nov 3, 2017 12:00:57 PM

Joost: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Dordrecht , Netherlands; Posts: 8059, Gallery; Registered on: May 3, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: Pagani Huayra

Those are some horrific pictures Nick! I remember the impact it had on these forums as well. If I recall correctly was quite a fresh member here when it happened.
The structural integrity of these carbon monocoques is unsurpassed (if done right). It would be very interesting to see some inspection reports of such a crashed structure.

Like Christian says, these kind of cars have reached a level of security where they protect the driver/passengers from being crushed or hurt by broken off parts that enter the space occupied by the passengers, but the next step is to further reduce the G-forces on the body when crashes occur. In the end, at a certain point accidents will always have serious consequences.

--

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

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Nov 3, 2017 11:05:19 PM

blueflame: Expert; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 1702, Gallery; Registered on: Jan 28, 2005; Reply to: Joost

Re: Pagani Huayra

Wow, after all these years we can see these pictures of Ben‘s accident.

I always wondered why both passengers died in this accident, because the few pics after the accident of the car did not look that bad.

I always thought they hit each other with their heads during the impact with fatal results...

Nberry, do you know the details?

Blueflame

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Nov 4, 2017 1:59:26 AM

absent: Pilot; Loc: Illinois , United States; Posts: 365, Gallery; Registered on: May 6, 2012; Reply to: blueflame

Re: Pagani Huayra

We are just a bag of soft tissue, loosely connected bones and all of it suspended in a lot of liquid.

Not a very strong structure, with all our delicate organs sloshing around.

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Nov 4, 2017 11:24:23 AM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: absent

Re: Pagani Huayra

They both died because of the sudden impact when the side of the car hit a concrete barrier. It was estimated that at the time of the impact the car traveling at 90 miles an hour. I have many more pictures of the car after the accident and I posted this to show how strong a carbon tub is.

Christian is correct. No matter how well the car is constructed our human bodies cannot withstand high speed impacts against immovable objects.

FWIW, the insurance company decided not to pursue a case against Porsche after deconstructing the car. Their experts could not find a defect in the car which would have contributed to the cause of the accident.

--

"A man wrapped up in himself makes for a very small bundle."

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Nov 4, 2017 3:14:45 PM

noone1: Rennteam Master; Loc: Los Angeles , United States; Posts: 5587, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2009; Reply to: nberry

Re: Pagani Huayra

A lot of safety has to do with things like airbag deployment as well. Modern car crashes often look like giant balloons inside when all those airbags deploy. Tubs will hopefully prevent intrusion and absorb as much every as possible, but that won't help so much if your body collides with some part of the car.

Enthusiasts often blame safety standards for adding so much weight to cars and making them so big, but modern cars can let you walk away a bit sore from a crash that might have killed you 15 years ago.

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Nov 5, 2017 4:42:57 AM

Whoopsy: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Vancouver,BC , Canada; Posts: 16151, Gallery; Registered on: Sep 19, 2006; Reply to: noone1

Re: Pagani Huayra

After running at my track for over a year, I would never feel safe with just a 3 point harness on track.

6 point with HANS is much much safer.

I ran all of my cars with 3 point only but I never push them past perhaps 60-70%. I simply moved too much within the seat with only he 3 point.

Only cars I have 6 point is my ClubSport and the 918. Night and day difference in the 918 with and without 6 point.

--

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Apr 21, 2018 10:45:40 PM

Topspeed: Rennteam Pro; Loc: Portugal , Portugal; Posts: 2992, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 14, 2014; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Pagani Huayra

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1tEV4ITdHI

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Apr 22, 2018 9:15:53 AM

tso: Senior; Loc: Denmark , United Arab Emirates; Posts: 748, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2004; Reply to: Whoopsy

Re: Pagani Huayra

Whoopsy:
After running at my track for over a year, I would never feel safe with just a 3 point harness on track.

6 point with HANS is much much safer.

I ran all of my cars with 3 point only but I never push them past perhaps 60-70%. I simply moved too much within the seat with only he 3 point.

Only cars I have 6 point is my ClubSport and the 918. Night and day difference in the 918 with and without 6 point.

Have a look at these 2 videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSaiZuzNMSY - Impact without HANS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFOprqPmgqQ - Impact with HANS.

The 6 point belts and the HANS will keep you and your head in a position which will avoid some of the potential damage.

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Apr 22, 2018 12:32:10 PM

DJM48: Expert; Loc: Australia , Australia; Posts: 1727, Gallery; Registered on: Dec 16, 2015; Reply to: tso

Re: Pagani Huayra

Impressive videos tso

Time for a new helmet/HANs combination..

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Apr 23, 2018 7:34:22 AM

BjoernB: Rennteam Master; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 4100, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 19, 2004; Reply to: tso

Re: Pagani Huayra

tso:
Whoopsy:
After running at my track for over a year, I would never feel safe with just a 3 point harness on track.

6 point with HANS is much much safer.

I ran all of my cars with 3 point only but I never push them past perhaps 60-70%. I simply moved too much within the seat with only he 3 point.

Only cars I have 6 point is my ClubSport and the 918. Night and day difference in the 918 with and without 6 point.

Have a look at these 2 videos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSaiZuzNMSY - Impact without HANS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFOprqPmgqQ - Impact with HANS.

The 6 point belts and the HANS will keep you and your head in a position which will avoid some of the potential damage.

loads of people driving around on streets with 6 points not realized this !!! very good example !

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Apr 23, 2018 7:53:42 AM

BjoernB: Rennteam Master; Loc: Switzerland , Switzerland; Posts: 4100, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 19, 2004; Reply to: BjoernB

Re: Pagani Huayra

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g40YatgE_CE

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Apr 23, 2018 9:56:40 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: BjoernB

Re: Pagani Huayra

BjoernB:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g40YatgE_CE

Very "nice" video indeed. Smiley

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

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