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    993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Yesterday I had a dinner at my house with a bunch of friends. I show them the new 997. Can you belive that every woman there, and they were five, told me that the 996 looked much better from the front. All of them never liked the 993, they said it was kind of "pimp car" due to the big rear wing and large wheel arches on the 993Turbo go figure and said the new lights on the 997 were poor. When I show them pictures where we could see the back of the 997, they liked it very very much.

    As to the guys, they liked the 997 very much, and didn't made any comment 997 vs 996.

    Women, can't live with them, can't live without them
    J.Seven

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Well, most women can't tell the difference between a 996 and a Boxtser either. (I don't mean to offend anyone).

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Mine will tell you if its a 993, 996, 997... a C2, C4, TT... and most of their specs... hates auto's trannys and diesel engines... after all, if you have a Porsche nut in the house, its bound to rub off

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    (no offense to women )

    It seems to me that women don't care what type it is...996,997,993,ect...they equate Porsche = $$$$

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    I mentioned and not once that women actually like Porsche form/exterior design

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    My brother-in-law got a comment from a lady couple weeks ago on his 996TT that he had a very nice Boxster .

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion



    My wife is the same way; if she sees a Porsche out in the streets she can analyze it to even what kind of Exclusive options, wheels,..... it has . She can even tell you which colors cost extra.

    I'm very proud of her but she always tells me that my crazyness about Porsche has entered into her brain too, and as a woman she is not supposed to know this much about cars .

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    J.Seven said:
    Yesterday I had a dinner at my house with a bunch of friends. I show them the new 997. Can you belive that every woman there, and they were five, told me that the 996 looked much better from the front. All of them never liked the 993, they said it was kind of "pimp car" due to the big rear wing and large wheel arches on the 993Turbo go figure and said the new lights on the 997 were poor. When I show them pictures where we could see the back of the 997, they liked it very very much.

    As to the guys, they liked the 997 very much, and didn't made any comment 997 vs 996.

    Women, can't live with them, can't live without them
    J.Seven



    Let us hope that the 997 is short lived and the 998 is introduced early. Do you realize that all the higher end cars are evolving toward space age headlights which are flatter and set back except Porsche?

    The CGT is the best looking Porsche ever made and when you compare the styling to the 997 it becomes evident the 997 is destined to the dust bin as soon as the totally redesigned 998 can be introduced.

    FWIW, a German magazine ran a survey and found the men that own Porsche's tend to cheat on their wife more than any other car ownership.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Nick, you're a hopeless case as we say in medicine.
    I wonder what would happen if I go to a Ferrari forum somewhere on the internet and tell the owners that actually only pimps drive Ferraris, that Ferraris actually are a sort of substitute for the owner's inferior developped private parts or that a Ferrari actually is some kind of Viagra for people who wouldn't be able to get sex otherwise.

    Honestly, Nick: your Porsche criticism starts to go below the belt, especially since you don't seem to find real arguments anymore.
    I didn't want to say it but I have to: I'm a little bit disappointed.

    Maybe I should put it this way:
    1. the 997 S outruns your great Ferrari 360 Modena ANYTIME, ANYWHERE.
    How much does the 997 S cost and how much did you pay for your 360?
    2. looks lie in the eye of the beholder. The fact that you can see a car more seldom on the street doesn't mean it is looking better. Ferrari builds nice cars but I'm afraid I care more about performance and not looks
    3. why did you buy a Cayenne and not something else?
    4. I hope the Mini is your wife's car
    5. I don't like the new BMW 6 series and I even hate the Smart or the VW Beetle. Do I go to a BMW, Smart or VW forum and start to argue about looks, performance, etc.?

    You know what I really think? You're actually regretting having bought a Ferrari but you don't want to admit it.
    You like the looks (or better said: the attraction "factor" towards other people) but you secretly wish to own a Porsche because you know that performance sucks on your 360.
    We can help you, Nick: just sell your 360 and we'll find a nice 997 GT3 for you.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Nick, you're a hopeless case as we say in medicine.
    I wonder what would happen if I go to a Ferrari forum somewhere on the internet and tell the owners that actually only pimps drive Ferraris, that Ferraris actually are a sort of substitute for the owner's inferior developped private parts or that a Ferrari actually is some kind of Viagra for people who wouldn't be able to get sex otherwise.

    Honestly, Nick: your Porsche criticism starts to go below the belt, especially since you don't seem to find real arguments anymore.
    I didn't want to say it but I have to: I'm a little bit disappointed.

    Maybe I should put it this way:
    1. the 997 S outruns your great Ferrari 360 Modena ANYTIME, ANYWHERE.
    How much does the 997 S cost and how much did you pay for your 360?
    2. looks lie in the eye of the beholder. The fact that you can see a car more seldom on the street doesn't mean it is looking better. Ferrari builds nice cars but I'm afraid I care more about performance and not looks
    3. why did you buy a Cayenne and not something else?
    4. I hope the Mini is your wife's car
    5. I don't like the new BMW 6 series and I even hate the Smart or the VW Beetle. Do I go to a BMW, Smart or VW forum and start to argue about looks, performance, etc.?

    You know what I really think? You're actually regretting having bought a Ferrari but you don't want to admit it.
    You like the looks (or better said: the attraction "factor" towards other people) but you secretly wish to own a Porsche because you know that performance sucks on your 360.
    We can help you, Nick: just sell your 360 and we'll find a nice 997 GT3 for you.



    Oh my, you brought out all the old bromides regarding Ferrari ownership. Look I realize that taste is subjective but one thing you can not deny. All agree that the 997 is retro, has a VW front end appearance and the back end a rip off from the old wide bodies. As for performance, I have never commented whether it is better than Ferrari or anything else for that matter.

    I know you have a relationship with Porsche you do not wish to disrupt. Negative comments on this board can possible prevent good information be given to you and thus prevent its distribution.

    Fair enough. I will not post negative comments regarding Porsche automobiles.

    I leave you with this thought; "One defends when his strength is inadequate; he attacks when it is abundant."

    Sun Tzu "The Art Of War"

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    "You know what I really think? You're actually regretting having bought a Ferrari but you don't want to admit it. "

    Well said! :-) I think nberry wants to come home and his obsession with Porsche is evident. Look at Ferrari forum here, he posts much less there than here.

    Common, nberry, come home, we will all understand and will not say a word. I am sure you can get a nice deal replacing your Spider with 996 TT convertible, or GT2? :-)

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    Nick, you're a hopeless case as we say in medicine.
    I wonder what would happen if I go to a Ferrari forum somewhere on the internet and tell the owners that actually only pimps drive Ferraris, that Ferraris actually are a sort of substitute for the owner's inferior developped private parts or that a Ferrari actually is some kind of Viagra for people who wouldn't be able to get sex otherwise.

    Honestly, Nick: your Porsche criticism starts to go below the belt, especially since you don't seem to find real arguments anymore.
    I didn't want to say it but I have to: I'm a little bit disappointed.

    Maybe I should put it this way:
    1. the 997 S outruns your great Ferrari 360 Modena ANYTIME, ANYWHERE.
    How much does the 997 S cost and how much did you pay for your 360?
    2. looks lie in the eye of the beholder. The fact that you can see a car more seldom on the street doesn't mean it is looking better. Ferrari builds nice cars but I'm afraid I care more about performance and not looks
    3. why did you buy a Cayenne and not something else?
    4. I hope the Mini is your wife's car
    5. I don't like the new BMW 6 series and I even hate the Smart or the VW Beetle. Do I go to a BMW, Smart or VW forum and start to argue about looks, performance, etc.?

    You know what I really think? You're actually regretting having bought a Ferrari but you don't want to admit it.
    You like the looks (or better said: the attraction "factor" towards other people) but you secretly wish to own a Porsche because you know that performance sucks on your 360.
    We can help you, Nick: just sell your 360 and we'll find a nice 997 GT3 for you.



    Oh my, you brought out all the old bromides regarding Ferrari ownership. Look I realize that taste is subjective but one thing you can not deny. All agree that the 997 is retro, has a VW front end appearance and the back end a rip off from the old wide bodies. As for performance, I have never commented whether it is better than Ferrari or anything else for that matter.

    I know you have a relationship with Porsche you do not wish to disrupt. Negative comments on this board can possible prevent good information be given to you and thus prevent its distribution.

    Fair enough. I will not post negative comments regarding Porsche automobiles.

    I leave you with this thought; "One defends when his strength is inadequate; he attacks when it is abundant."

    Sun Tzu "The Art Of War"



    Truth is Nick, the 360 is an evolution car too... the latest rendition of the 3xx series that began with the 308 in the late 70s... it had 5 itterations... 308, 328, 348, 355, and now 360... I'm not gonna get into power/looks nonsense... (911s have ALWAYS beated Ferrari's 3XX cars) but unlike Ferrari, Porsche never forgets its roots and doesn't change its cars to appease the fleating fancies of their fancy owners... Porsche is rooted in tradition... the 998 is NOT the next 911 it is... a new breed of Porsche... if it "replaces" the 997... the 911 as we purists (read ALL old-school Porsche fans) know it is dead... a 911 was, is, and will always be a boxer 6 engine car... boxer 8 does not equal 911... it equals 998..

    As for looks... a 911 is always distinguishable as such... the rake of the b-pillar, the flow of the front fenders to be tapered off with oval lights, the grill in the rear... you can't mistake it for any other car... Ferrari's have always had design copies... dating back to the beginnings of the 3XX series... you had the Detomasi's, you had the Bricklins, you had the Mantises... 911s have no equal, in design or function... 959 is STILL the best car ever built... of the last 20 years... the CGT is just the best car for the NEXT 20 years.

    911s look the way they do because they have to... they are 911s... they aren't Astins... they arent Lambo's... they aren't Lotus's... and they shouldn't ever change so much so they wouldn't be 911s... the lights have to be a certain way... the rear has to have a raising engine lid spoiler, they should always have the key on the left side... they are Porsche 911s... nothing more, nothing less...

    Porsche, there is no substitue.

    AMEN!

    Nu, 15 days till I get my new toy.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    911s look the way they do because they have to... they are 911s... they aren't Astins... they arent Lambo's... they aren't Lotus's... and they shouldn't ever change so much so they wouldn't be 911s... the lights have to be a certain way... the rear has to have a raising engine lid spoiler, they should always have the key on the left side... they are Porsche 911s... nothing more, nothing less...

    Porsche, there is no substitue.

    AMEN!

    Nu, 15 days till I get my new toy.



    Couldn't agree more . 40 years and they still shine like the sun, classy, distinguishable, and the tradition has been followed through. This is what makes the 911 THE 911 .

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Fair enough. I will not post negative comments regarding Porsche automobiles



    Nick, you don't understand. You can post ANY negative comment about Porsche cars as long as you explain at the same time your opinion with ARGUMENTS.

    I didn't want to be rude and I didn't want to make you feel not welcome on this forum, don't get me wrong.
    I just wanted to let you "feel" the same way some people might feel due to your provocative posts.

    I understand your criticism regarding the 997 and you might have some points in your opinion which have some truth in them. But some posts are ONLY provocative without really getting to the point of your criticism.

    BTW: war is no art, it is hell. And to escape hell, everything is allowed as long as it keeps you alive. I don't believe in rules or even "the art of war". At the end, the winner takes it all.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Fair enough. I will not post negative comments regarding Porsche automobiles



    Nick, you don't understand. You can post ANY negative comment about Porsche cars as long as you explain at the same time your opinion with ARGUMENTS.

    I didn't want to be rude and I didn't want to make you feel not welcome on this forum, don't get me wrong.
    I just wanted to let you "feel" the same way some people might feel due to your provocative posts.

    I understand your criticism regarding the 997 and you might have some points in your opinion which have some truth in them. But some posts are ONLY provocative without really getting to the point of your criticism.

    BTW: war is no art, it is hell. And to escape hell, everything is allowed as long as it keeps you alive. I don't believe in rules or even "the art of war". At the end, the winner takes it all.



    Though it is true I include my opinion in many post, most if not all of my post are based in fact. Everyone post their opinions but the difference is mine are negative. Positive opinion posts are welcomed and embraced. Since this board is populated by rabid Porsche fans, anything that hints of negativity is viewed as disagreeable. Some of course is in good fun though there are those who would rather ignore or hope the comments go away.

    You run a good board with terrific information and I do not wish to create a hostile environment among the readers.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    Everyone post their opinions but the difference is mine are negative.


    No Nick, that's not the problem, and you know it
    The difference is your opinion is _provocative_. And when we react, you're quick to turn the page to the 'my negative opinion bothers you rabid fans' side.

    [more things to say here, but too tired to type]

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    I've always enjoyed Nick's opinions, and there's always a thread of truth to all highly opinionated arguments.

    However, Ron's picture shows Porsche's 911 best (terrific photo, btw). The 997 will fit perfectly in the shot (and arguably more so than the 996), and I can't really find any fault in that.

    After all, there's some tradition in everything. Nick, why is your Ferrari red? And why do red Ferraris sell the most? If Ferrari's style is so dramatically new and unique for each model, why do people get the same color Red or Yellow, when they can get any color they want from Ferrari for free?

    Think about it.

    -=Scree=-

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Womens opinions are not welcome in here.

    Men only apply.

    Sissies cannot understand a porsche.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    mmm208 said:
    Womens opinions are not welcome in here.
    Men only apply.
    Sissies cannot understand a porsche.


    Some 'sissies' would kick your ass anytime on a racetrack.


    "The #81 G&W car was energetically piloted into a creditable 6th place in GT by an all female driver line-up of Divina Galica, Cindi Lux and Belinda Endress (ahead of both Roock 911 GTS cars!)."

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Brunner,

    Great post! Do you have more info about those women drivers?

    We must make them to post here too! :-)

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    women belong in the Kitchen, not on the track.

    Why do brides wear white?

    Because the dish washer should match the fridge and the washing machine.

    LOL

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    Scree said:
    I've always enjoyed Nick's opinions, and there's always a thread of truth to all highly opinionated arguments.

    However, Ron's picture shows Porsche's 911 best (terrific photo, btw). The 997 will fit perfectly in the shot (and arguably more so than the 996), and I can't really find any fault in that.

    After all, there's some tradition in everything. Nick, why is your Ferrari red? And why do red Ferraris sell the most? If Ferrari's style is so dramatically new and unique for each model, why do people get the same color Red or Yellow, when they can get any color they want from Ferrari for free?

    Think about it.

    -=Scree=-



    Your right about the color. I disagree about styling. Show me a 10-15 year old Ferrari and see if it has a remblance to the 360. Now look at Ron's picture of three generations of Porsche's. The 30 year model looks like the 997!!!

    Now I realize some people like that because change is viewed cautiously. But you have to admit in Porsche's case, it is glacial.

    Oops is that a negative or provocative comment? Sorry!

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    mmm208 said:women belong in the Kitchen, not on the track. Why do brides wear white? Because the dish washer should match the fridge and the washing machine.



    My fridge is stainless steel and my washing machine is white. What color should my future wife wear?

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    Your right about the color. I disagree about styling. Show me a 10-15 year old Ferrari and see if it has a remblance to the 360. Now look at Ron's picture of three generations of Porsche's. The 30 year model looks like the 997!!!




    Nick, my point was that for most 911 owners/admirers, the tradition and heritage is in the styling, the way the color red is the tradition for Ferrari.

    It's (partly) why the 928 didn't succeed as the 911 successor, and how the 911 will always remain the symbol for Porsche's vitality, as long as it remains relatively consistent in design.

    However, I do think it'd be worth it for Porsche to build a mid-engined mini-Carrera GT that's pricier than the 911, but lighter and more agile. (The Boxster doesn't count because it's positioned as an entry-level roadster)

    -=Scree=-

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    lev said:
    Do you have more info about those women drivers?


    no, sorry, i just did a quick google search

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    Scree said:
    Quote:
    Your right about the color. I disagree about styling. Show me a 10-15 year old Ferrari and see if it has a remblance to the 360. Now look at Ron's picture of three generations of Porsche's. The 30 year model looks like the 997!!!




    Nick, my point was that for most 911 owners/admirers, the tradition and heritage is in the styling, the way the color red is the tradition for Ferrari.

    It's (partly) why the 928 didn't succeed as the 911 successor, and how the 911 will always remain the symbol for Porsche's vitality, as long as it remains relatively consistent in design.

    However, I do think it'd be worth it for Porsche to build a mid-engined mini-Carrera GT that's pricier than the 911, but lighter and more agile. (The Boxster doesn't count because it's positioned as an entry-level roadster)

    -=Scree=-



    I know where you are going with this. However thing about the most successful years at Porsche. 1999 until now. Why?

    Boxster new model

    Some what radical deviation in styling in 996 with new water cooled engine

    Model Variations of the revolutuonary 996

    All equal record sales. When Porsche steps away from the traditional design it becomes successful. The 997 is a step back.

    I agree that the CGT is a leap forward which hopefully Porsche will build upon. It is a terrific looking car and if they price it right, make it driveable for the average and above average sport enthusiast, they could sell another 10,000 within a year.

    The CGT should be the template for all future Porsche's.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    mmm208 said:
    Womens opinions are not welcome in here.

    Men only apply.

    Sissies cannot understand a porsche.



    This is not very nice of you.... I just started to like this forum until I found this Honestly, I don't take this personal, but I think that I can very well understand what Porsche is about... that it is more than an "equation" to cash (some of you wrote), of course! I love the 911 and especially the 997 since it combines past, present and future so fitting! I think that this is a place to share thoughts and knowledge about the beautiful cars and that that any offenses to the other gender should not be posted here.... There are women out there who do understand the beauty and technical features of cars and some might doing them wrong.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    Now look at Ron's picture of three generations of Porsche's. The 30 year model looks like the 997!!!




    Yes. That's why it has the most distinctive automobile in the world and is synonimous with the Porsche marque. Anyone who sees the car recognizes it immediately. Try that with a 456 Ferrari...

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion





    Yes. That's why it has the most distinctive automobile in the world and is synonimous with the Porsche marque. Anyone who sees the car recognizes it immediately. Try that with a 456 Ferrari...



    Porsche has both benefited and been burdened by this view of what a "true" Porsche is/should-be for decades. Anything that looks like a 356/911 sells. Anything that doesn't has to "prove" itself. Yet the same company and engineering team develops all the cars. Shouldn't that team do as well (aside from the inevitable, though hopefully rare, lemons) when they design and engineer these other cars as well as when they do so for the 911 family?

    Isn't the Carrera GT a completely different car than a 911? V-10, carbon fiber, mid-engine, doesn't look anything like a 911, etc? I don't think anyone believes it should suffer the fate of the 928 because it doesn't "look" like a Porsche (as the 959 did). Yet, if you follow the rationale given, it could.

    The idea that the Porsche engineering team succeeded over 4 decades in making a flat-6, rear-engine car an icon of automotive history appears to me to be a triumph of persistence and ingenuity over reality (the only reason it's rear-engine is because Dr. Porsche wanted the seats for golf clubs, many of Porsche's successful racers were MID-engine when relieved of this constraint).

    If we insist that a Porsche should look like a "911", then I think the marque is living off of poseurs (where looks are more important than automotive techonology) more than not. And not off the its reputation for engineering brilliance which has been truly earned (and which Porsche still needs to deliver if it is to maintain it's reputation for another 40 years).

    It is fine to have a few styling cues (the Bugatti radiator, the Mercedes star, Ferrari red, etc) which say "This is a XXXX". But it is completely unnecessary and has nothing to do with automotive performance that headlights are one shape vs another.

    OK, I suppose you could argue that round headlights are a Porsche styling cue - the only problem with that is that every car built until the mid-90's also had round headlights, not a very distinctive cue. More effective would be things like: front L/R fender "wings", rear/mid grille, and so on. Settle on these cues and after that let the engineering team determine the shape/form which delivers the performance/handling/braking/reliability that we pay for.

    Re: 993, 996 and 997 women opinion

    Quote:
    the only reason it's rear-engine is because Dr. Porsche wanted the seats for golf clubs,


    You're kidding, right?
    Ferdinand Porsche designed rear-engined race cars long before the 911 saw the light of day.

     
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