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    997 Design

    A lot of rumors and camoflaged pictures were available on the internet over the past few months.
    Some people even thought that camoflaged 997 were the final thing, making pretty bad comments about the 997.
    To be honest: I expected a more spectacular design for the 997 at the beginning but after I saw the first picture a few months ago and after thinking over the whole thing over and over again, I have to say that the 997 proves to be a very nice and refined product.
    The 997 pictures I have now (two 997 Carrera and two 997 S pictures) show a perfect evolution of the 996 design. To some people the 997 might look like a 996 at first look. But the 997 is actually the perfect evolution of the 996 design and in my opinion the most beautiful and perfectly designed 911 ever built by Porsche.
    I'm pretty sure that some people will be disappointed with the 997. I'm also sure that some people will say to themselves "thanks god, I bought a 996". But after the first 997 will show up on the street after July 17th, I'm pretty sure people will start to love the 997. The form flow of the 997 is just perfect, it is a very modern interpretation of the classic 911 design.
    Some people will start again with speculation about a 998 and some people even might view the 997 as a facelift and not a new model. But try to look very carefully at the body and shape of the 997 and I'm sure that after a while, you'll see the difference between the 996 and 997.
    The 997 is actually good for 996 owners because people on the street won't probably see immediately a difference.
    That said, the 997 is a great product and I'm looking forward to drive one as soon as possible.

    Re: 997 Design

    ok..but now we need pictures...

    Can't work today....

    Ciao
    Dario

    Re: 997 Design

    I love what I have seen so far, except maybe for the passenger weight gauge on the center dash (but I won't judge that until I know its purpose and have seen it in flesh.

    Do you have any idea when the first 997 will show up on dealer floors?

    Re: 997 Design

    Is the rear grill we have seen in these new spy shots the finalized product? It is the only part I don't like. Ayone know for sure?

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    RC said:
    But after the first 997 will show up on the street after July 17th, I'm pretty sure people will start to love the 997. The form flow of the 997 is just perfect, it is a very modern interpretation of the classic 911 design.




    it is always like that. At least in 90 % of the cases. More you see a new car, more you like it from his derivative.

    Re: 997 Design

    i've never had any doubts that the 997 will look good after i saw a mule with my own eyes at zuffenhausen in december. the overall body shape was so great. very athletic.

    however, i'd personally would have preferred "combo lights" and not putting the indicator and fog lights in the bumper again.

    but what i am really disappointed about is the interior. this could be any limousine.

    Re: 997 Design

    Very well stated. You obviously understand the 911 concept and bring your inside knowledge, as editor of this preeminent P-site, for the benefit of us all. Thanks!

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    Matt C said:
    I love what I have seen so far, except maybe for the passenger weight gauge on the center dash (but I won't judge that until I know its purpose and have seen it in flesh.

    Do you have any idea when the first 997 will show up on dealer floors?



    July 17th in Europe (not UK!), don't know about the US yet.

    Re: 997 Design

    very well said

    The evolution is a good word. I personally like the way Porsche has designed the 911 from the inception. With every new model there are some subtle changes yet distinguishable from the previous model. This is why Porsche has never lost momentum and loyalty from Porsche owners.

    We all state our opinions regarding I won't buy a Porsche again, their design is ugly, and blah blah blah, and I'm guilty of it too. Nevertheless, when I still see a 964 or a 993 out in the streets, I hugely appreciate the beauty of these cars which by the way never look out dated and ugly what so ever. You can't say this about other brands, can you?

    I love Porsche and can't wait to see the new 997 in flesh. We all may at first criticize the design, the HP, and so on.... but fellows you know it too, as time goes on we'll fall in love with this model as we all we have in the past with the older models .

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    RC said:
    The 997 pictures I have now (two 997 Carrera and two 997 S pictures) show a perfect evolution of the 996 design.



    RC, is one of your pictures the one that Autocar magazine UK is running on its cover?


    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    but fellows you know it too, as time goes on we'll fall in love with this model as we all we have in the past with the older models



    Right, Ron. I'm just afraid resale value of the 996 will drop substantially after 997 introduction.

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    but fellows you know it too, as time goes on we'll fall in love with this model as we all we have in the past with the older models



    Right, Ron. I'm just afraid resale value of the 996 will drop substantially after 997 introduction.



    I think I'll keep mine for a while, till 997TT shows up

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    but fellows you know it too, as time goes on we'll fall in love with this model as we all we have in the past with the older models



    Right, Ron. I'm just afraid resale value of the 996 will drop substantially after 997 introduction.



    Actually, I was afraid of just the opposite, when I heard a rumor that list price was going to start at $100+. That would have helped hold up 996 pricing.

    But these prices don't seem to be much out of line with current list, if I'm reading them right. Looks like base should be about $75,000 which is, I believe about in line with current pricing.

    So that means 996 prices should soften a little.

    But that's good for anybody, like me, planning on buying a 2002 996 when they start coming off leases this autumn.

    My gripe with the price is this: a new, tricked out Range Rover stickers at about $76,000, US. And they have nothing to add but maybe Nav. Great level of detail. An M5 comes about the same, with everything. Same with an E55. Shouldn't a fully loaded 911 come in under $80,000?

    Can't believe they can't make money at that price point. Or course, that would REALLY hurt 996 prices, the way 964 prices tanked when the 993 came out at $10,000 less than the previous list price.

    And, as I said, dropping 996 prices are OK with this boy

    Dain

    Re: 997 Design

    I'd hate to be critical, and may get flamed for this but, if this is the "final" thing I only see a seriously now underpowered facelifted 996. However those two aspects are, in my own personal list of priorities, behind handling-performace & sporty drive feel-character. So they better get the other specs right or I will be really dissapointed. Already the PASM will probably be to soft for me and if I get a 997 it will have to have the sportier suspension for me and the optional LSD with the sport suspension is the best news I have heard so far. What else has the 997S have to offer besides 19" wheels, PASM standard and less than a 10% power increase? aesthetically they even look the same except for wheels and pipes.

    So I have 4 big issues that need to be resolved for my case:

    - WHEELS: 19" wheels of the "S" model are heavier than 18" wheels, hence more un-sprung weight, but performance wise not necesarilly better so remains questonable to me if its just for looks like the quad exhausts on a 6cil 997S. I couldn't care less how cool it looks, I expect handling over looks, and I tend to think that form prevailed over function since 295 width for the rear wheels may look "cool" but too wide for 355HP, and is what the 996GT3RS fits and more than what the Mk1 GT3 needed...

    - WEIGHT: the final weight specs of the +5HP 997 may offset even more the power-to-weight ratio, so this would be the first new 911 that isn't any faster than the previous old model since the 911SC or Furmann's times.

    - HANDLING IMPROVEMENT: they better offer some incredible suspension improvements vs the 996 cause othewise I am very disappointed, but if they make the 997 handle significantly better than the 996 I will be a very happy camper however they use the same chasis so they don't have much room for improvement and also did not take advantage of new technologies and R&D to lighten the car a single bit to offset the lack of increased power or new chasis for improvement.

    - 998: so little has changed for a "new" model that I'm worried it was not meant to last 6 years +/-, like the 964, 993, 996... and the 998 may pop up earlier and with the big improvements in engine performance and newly developed chasis.

    - and a side note, I hope that the 997 won't still get RMS leaks, cause that would really be something.

    Any clues on the weight of the 997C2 and 997S RC? and a very delicate question: any clue as to when Porsche plans the 998? less than 6 years?

    Ok, flames away now

    BTW, 7:56 on the ring with 355HP, the PASM and 19" wheels? not on your life! either exagerated, not a full 20.8km lap or that particular 997S was running on kerosene

    Re: 997 Design

    Wait until you see it in person. The pics are a bit artificial, agreed, but I'm sure you will be pleased with the car on the 17th of july

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    Joel///M3 said:
    Wait until you see it in person. The pics are a bit artificial, agreed, but I'm sure you will be pleased with the car on the 17th of july



    I know what you mean Joel, it will look much better in person than in the pics, but even if it didn't impress me in real life (I'm not into retro-fashion, specially with serious sportcars) I wouldn't care, looks are secondary (its so similar to a 996 that if you slap in an aerokit, it will look great no matter what), however the fact that its just a +5HP facelift bothers me for the other reasons I mentioned

    Re: 997 Design

    I still have some concerns, and are refered to performance.

    OK, we already know for shure that the car will have a very slightly improoved power, though, as said by Carlos, it has a wider rear, 19' wheels, and extra weight.

    I humbly think that only a brilliant step forward with susspension (or gearing) can overpass those facts, because this can really have a positive influence in the behaviour of the 997.

    I agree with the comments done about the steering wheel, but I really like the overlook of the creature. Just have to see the real thing.

    In any case, I also think is early to have a formed opinnion (at least for me). And, beyond the looks of the car (wich I certainly like), if it performs better than the 996, It is a step forward.....weeks or months to come will show many things.

    P.D. Once again: Has anybody some data about the functions or utility of the "Chronometer"?

    Re: 997 Design

    My feeling is that the new Carrera (not S) is for the Boxster or Boxster S owners that wanted to step up to the Carrera world.

    And for the existing owners of Carrera, the "S" is the answer.

    Re: 997 Design

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    My feeling is that the new Carrera (not S) is for the Boxster or Boxster S owners that wanted to step up to the Carrera world.

    And for the existing owners of Carrera, the "S" is the answer.



    Nah... this 996 owner (and previously Boxster S) would rather find a used 996 TT to play with than the 997S.

     
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