Quote:
doyle said:
I've been watching this and it just doesn't seem to add up with Porsche's recent history. Bugatti is owned by VW of whom Porsche now has a sizeable stake. Why would they want to complete against what is essentially, themselves? CGT's all sold as far as I know, but didn't they end up cutting the final tally short because of questionable demand? Would there even be a demand for what would probably be a much more expensive vehicle?
Jul 1, 2006 5:51:05 AM
Jul 1, 2006 2:11:47 PM
Quote:what period of time should lapse before porsche builds another supercar "pro bono nick"?
nberry said:If there are dollars to be made Porsche will build it. The learned from their fiasco involving the CGT and will be more circumspect in how they market this car if they decide to do it.
However, I believe it would be a slap in the face of the present CGT owners if this car is built. They have taken their licks financially and this would be piling on.
Jul 2, 2006 6:46:35 AM
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
doyle said:
I've been watching this and it just doesn't seem to add up with Porsche's recent history. Bugatti is owned by VW of whom Porsche now has a sizeable stake. Why would they want to complete against what is essentially, themselves? CGT's all sold as far as I know, but didn't they end up cutting the final tally short because of questionable demand? Would there even be a demand for what would probably be a much more expensive vehicle?
However, I believe it would be a slap in the face of the present CGT owners if this car is built.
Jul 3, 2006 6:08:31 AM
Jul 3, 2006 3:10:25 PM
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
doyle said:
I've been watching this and it just doesn't seem to add up with Porsche's recent history. Bugatti is owned by VW of whom Porsche now has a sizeable stake. Why would they want to complete against what is essentially, themselves? CGT's all sold as far as I know, but didn't they end up cutting the final tally short because of questionable demand? Would there even be a demand for what would probably be a much more expensive vehicle?
If there are dollars to be made Porsche will build it. The learned from their fiasco involving the CGT and will be more circumspect in how they market this car if they decide to do it.
However, I believe it would be a slap in the face of the present CGT owners if this car is built. They have taken their licks financially and this would be piling on.
Quote:
amjf088 said:
Nick, you really say the funniest things some times. Let's see, either way this goes, there is a bashing strategy ready for you:
1) Porsche does not build this car: "Morally bankrupt truck company, leaving its high performance heritage behind, not building the type of extreme car it used to...etc."
2) Porsche builds the car: "Cynical, money-grubbing Porsche... Lures customers in with the sub-standard, fiasco GT and then later introducing a faster/better (and most important to you) more exclusive successor. Pathetic losers!"
Ever heard of progress? Should Porsche stop with the GT? I'm sure Ferrari would never try to improve on the Enzo...
Quote:
RC said:
Nick, what are you talking about? CGT fiasco? Porsche sold all planned cars, production was planned to be stopped after the number of cars built. I agree that the CGT has been slightly difficult to sell over the past few months but there was no fiasco, there was no unplanned production stop, I really don't know why people blow that much hot air?!
Jul 4, 2006 7:23:50 PM
Quote:
nberry said:First they indicated they would sell 750 cars at around $350,000. Then they increased the number to 1500 and increased the price to $450,000.
Quote:
nberry said:Second, racing clutch was a nightmare for the average driver. The journalist in reviewing the car all commented on it difficulty. Thus, it scared away many possible buyers.
Quote:
nberry said:Third, the car lacked a PDK type tranny which has led to its lack of desirability among money people.
Quote:
nberry said:Fourth, the failure to install adequate stability devices with the power and weight ratio being what it is. Predictably there have been a host of single car accidents involving the car.
Quote:
nberry said:Fifth, this supercar with its performance parameters should have required driver training to many of the buyers. Instead, what Porsche did was to give buyers a hot ride around the track by TRAINED professional factory drivers to "show" what the car can do. As expected, several of these single car accidents have led to death and serious injury.
Quote:
nberry said:Though a great performing car, the CGT is also undriveable for the average and above average driver.
Quote:
nberry said:
Second, racing clutch was a nightmare for the average driver. The journalist in reviewing the car all commented on it difficulty. Thus, it scared away many possible buyers.
it's not a nightmare, just different.
once used to it owners like it just fine.
where is your data on how many buyers changed their mind based on the clutch?
Third, the car lacked a PDK type tranny which has led to its lack of desireablity among money people.
oh! so only poor people have been buying the 450k cgt.
i wasn't aware of that.
Fourth, the failure to install adequate stability devices with the power and weight ratio being what it is. Predicatably there have been a host of single car accidents involving the car.
again, where is your data? it's a leading edge high performance car with 600hp.
of course there are going to be some accidents.
the enzo seems to be far surpassing it in number of accidents even though there are only 400 units out, compared to more than 1200 cgt's.
Fifth, this supercar with its performance parameters should have required driver training to many of the buyers. Instead, what Porsche did was to give buyers a hot ride around the track by TRAINED professional factory drivers to "show" what the car can do.
no oems require driver training.
porsche does offer driver training for a price.
As expected, several of these single car accidents have led to death and serious injury,
complete bullshit!
you should NEVER state something like this without the data to back it up!
we all know about ben's tragedy, but the fact that he decided to carry a passenger had nothing to do with porsche.
it also was not a single car accident from all accounts.
personally, i have only heard of one other death attributed to an accident involving a cgt!
Though a great performing car, the CGT is also undriveable for the average and above average driver.
Quote:
nberry said:
"I can drive mine quite well enough and I definitely belong in a group called "average and above average driver". Sorry Mike, that dog will not hunt.
You are an accomplished track driver to the point of being considered an instructor. Yet you took the time to get instruction and found you were making critical error's with steering input that could have caused you to lose control of the car.
Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
nberry said:
"I can drive mine quite well enough and I definitely belong in a group called "average and above average driver". Sorry Mike, that dog will not hunt.
You are an accomplished track driver to the point of being considered an instructor. Yet you took the time to get instruction and found you were making critical error's with steering input that could have caused you to lose control of the car.
What? Critical errors leading to loss of control?
Never happened.
Get your dosage corrected, Nick. You're hallucinating again
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Nick Qoute: "Sorry Mike, that dog will not hunt."
I was curious when a common LBJ expression would be used here.
Be careful Mike, as Nick goes running down the hall throwing
arguments out hes just looking for one of them to stick. He cant help, its his job coming out.
Quote:
nberry said:
Was on smoking something when you wrote this?
Hurley made a point of repeating, every time I went out with him, that the CGT has very sensitive steering and cautioned me more than once to be VERY steady with my steering inputs at speed. He said the car turns in more accurately and more directly than any 911/935/etc. One needs to be respectful of the car's capability.
It appears old Hurley was a little scared.
Quote:
nberry said:Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Nick Qoute: "Sorry Mike, that dog will not hunt."
I was curious when a common LBJ expression would be used here.
Be careful Mike, as Nick goes running down the hall throwing
arguments out hes just looking for one of them to stick. He cant help, its his job coming out.
James, my dear comrade, my days are numbered just like LBJ.
Quote:
W8MM said:Quote:
nberry said:
Was on smoking something when you wrote this?
Hurley made a point of repeating, every time I went out with him, that the CGT has very sensitive steering and cautioned me more than once to be VERY steady with my steering inputs at speed. He said the car turns in more accurately and more directly than any 911/935/etc. One needs to be respectful of the car's capability.
It appears old Hurley was a little scared.
Nope, you were up to your old tricks of applying the most pejorative interpretation possible to imagine.
Hurley was far from scared. He was telling me the same thing he told every student all day long. He wanted to make sure I heard him.
I never did anything to come close to losing the car while on the track.