Crown

Board: Porsche - 911 - 997 Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread

    Jun 4, 2006 12:37:51 AM

    chipper
    Pilot
    chipper
    Loc: Hawai'i
    Posts: 400, Gallery
    Registered on: Dec 20, 2003

    18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Just turned in my 19" wheels for stock 18s and find that the ride is quieter, more comfortable, and the car feels more "natural" on the road--that is, the handling seems less forced, less planted, less railroad-tracked. The 18s feel to me like the "right" wheels for the base 997.

    By the way, I specified Continental Contact Sport tires on teh 18s, rather than the Michelin Pilots I had on the 19s, which I find to be loud on the road.

    I'm 57, have owned eight Porsches, and was disappointed in how hard the base 997 rode on 19s. Next time, I'd wouldn't order 19s, or maybe just pop instead for a Carrera S with PASM.

    This is just my preference. If I were younger and sportier, , I'd might well stick with the 19s.

    Take it for what it's worth.

    Jun 4, 2006 2:28:10 AM

    Damian
    Senior
    Damian
    Loc: Pa, USA
    Posts: 646, Gallery
    Registered on: Feb 10, 2005
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Thanks for the info, I remember your posting about this a long time back. Do you notice any difference in acceleration due to the lighter 18's?

    Jun 4, 2006 2:29:09 AM

    WAY
    Rennteam Master
    WAY
    Loc: Melbourne, Australia
    Posts: 3344, Gallery
    Registered on: May 11, 2004
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Just out of interest, is the rear width of the 18's 265 instead of 295? I find that it is easy enough to lose traction on the rear in first gear (coming out of corners) with 295. Guess you will have to be a lot more careful if it is 265 then?

    Btw, the tyre pressure makes a huge differece in the ride quality on the 19's. When I drop the pressure to the minimum recommended by Porsche, the ride was much more acceptable.

    Jun 4, 2006 2:37:30 AM

    MMD
    Rennteam VIP
    MMD
    Loc: usa
    Posts: 9652, Gallery
    Registered on: Dec 16, 2004
    Reply to: WAY

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Glad you got the 18s for ride and greater pothole survivability. It bothers me that fashion and style are the main reasons I got stuck with 19s on my S.

    Jun 4, 2006 2:48:21 AM

    1st997
    Co-Pilot
    1st997
    Loc: CT
    Posts: 272, Gallery
    Registered on: Oct 21, 2005
    Reply to: WAY

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Hi Chipper, Thanks for your thoughts on 19" vs. 18" and the harshness of the ride. I ordered and purchased a 2006 C2 specifically for the 18" wheels (and I did not like the white aluminum dials (only to learn after my purchase that the dials can be ordered in other darker colors)) and am really sorry that I did not include the PASM option.

    As this was my first Porsche and I'm 59, I too find the ride a bit harsh at times (mostly due to the poor roads we have here in CT and NY). Being a Tiptronic driver, I could not find that many dealers having cars to test drive, nor those who where knowledgeable about how I could address the exchanging of 19" for 18" wheels / tires.

    Mine came with the Conti Contact Sports, and am happy with them as you are too.

    Jun 4, 2006 3:07:52 AM

    AS
    Co-Pilot
    AS
    Loc:
    Posts: 224, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 1, 2004
    Reply to: WAY

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    997 C4 comes with 295/35 ZR 18" rears (these would also fit on a C2).

    Jun 4, 2006 9:22:43 PM

    chipper
    Pilot
    chipper
    Loc: Hawai'i
    Posts: 400, Gallery
    Registered on: Dec 20, 2003
    Reply to: AS

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    The 18s in the rear are 265/40 and are noticably not as wide as the 19s (which are huge!). I haven't noticed any difference in acceleration and since I don't push the car, I can't say if the back wheels break lose more easily than with the 19s.

    I like the way my car drives better with the 18s. Even so, I have tire pressures down about 4-5 pounds below recommended. Right now I'm at 33 and 39. Our roads are really bad in Hawaii. I tried that (lowering pressure) with the 19s and it helped some, but not as much as with the 18s, where you have more sidewall, more tire to work with.

    I wish Porsche or Porsche dealerships would advise unknowing buyers like myself about the effects of putting the big wheels on a base Carrera without PASM. I didn't order a Carrera S partially because of PASM since I thought (from what I read and heard) that all it did was make the suspension harder. Now I realize that PASM also makes the ride softer in "normal" mode.

    Next time, I would probably buy the S bec. of PASM. Though I only test drove an S very briefly, not enough to see if PASM really gives the S a more comfortable ride than the base Carrera with 18s.

    Anybody tried both on rough roads--base Carrera with 18s and S with PASM and 19s?

    Aloha.

    Jun 4, 2006 11:34:02 PM

    hellgelb
    Senior
    hellgelb
    Loc: Ecosse , United Kingdom
    Posts: 659, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 31, 2005
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Quote:
    chipper said:
    I wish Porsche or Porsche dealerships would advise unknowing buyers like myself about the effects of putting the big wheels on a base Carrera without PASM.



    Surely the effect is the same on any car ? Reducing the profile of the tyres is never going to make the ride anything but worse. You figured the ride would be improved by fitting the 18s with higher profile tyres, no?

    Jun 5, 2006 9:34:13 AM

    AS
    Co-Pilot
    AS
    Loc:
    Posts: 224, Gallery
    Registered on: Aug 1, 2004
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    in terms of comfort, PASM (normal mode) + 19s is similar to non-PASM + 18s.
    O.E. 19s on base carrera makes the car feel less nimble, dynamic or balanced (for lack of a better word). it's as if there's: (a) too much grip; (b) too much rotational mass; or (c) both. all IMO of course.

    Jun 5, 2006 7:42:25 PM

    chipper
    Pilot
    chipper
    Loc: Hawai'i
    Posts: 400, Gallery
    Registered on: Dec 20, 2003
    Reply to: AS

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    quote:
    O.E. 19s on base carrera makes the car feel less nimble, dynamic or balanced (for lack of a better word). it's as if there's: (a) too much grip; (b) too much rotational mass; or (c) both. all IMO of course.


    This was my experience exactly. I like my Carrera much better with the 18s. The only reason I ordered 19s was looks, but I'm starting finally to accept and even enjoy the appearance of the stock 18s. Especially from a distance they look right on the car.

    Jun 5, 2006 8:53:43 PM

    MHakkinen
    Pilot
    MHakkinen
    Loc: SoCal-freeway shooting capital
    Posts: 381, Gallery
    Registered on: Feb 15, 2005
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Just in case some of you are interested I reposted this pic of my 997C2 non-PASM. She's fitted here with 18" Carrera III's off a 997C4. The rears are 11" wide and fill the wells beautifully.





    In this pic there's no spacer up front, and none in the rear (I've since picked up 5mm spacers for the fronts).

    Ride quality very comparable to standard 18's. If anything I think I was feeling the difference between the Conti;s and the PS2's. I cannot comment about high speed handling because I only had them on the car for a few days; I switched back to my stock 18's for track days (I'm burning off the Conti's asap so I can mount track tires).

    For those of you who own C2's and are looking for a more aggressive look, or for those of you on 19's looking for a bit better ride might want to consider this solution. They should be easy to acquire as well from places such as Wheel Enhancement.

    I have since decided to put them up for sale (been chomping at the bit for Rennworx wheels) but didn't get any buyers, so at this point may wind up keeping them. Either way, it makes for having a set for the track, and a even nicer looking set for the street

    Jun 6, 2006 12:41:33 AM

    Jim_in_Iowa
    Pilot
    Jim_in_Iowa
    Loc: US
    Posts: 336, Gallery
    Registered on: May 18, 2005
    Reply to: chipper

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Quote:
    chipper said:
    Just turned in my 19" wheels for stock 18s and find that the ride is quieter, more comfortable, and the car feels more "natural" on the road--that is, the handling seems less forced, less planted, less railroad-tracked. The 18s feel to me like the "right" wheels for the base 997.

    By the way, I specified Continental Contact Sport tires on teh 18s, rather than the Michelin Pilots I had on the 19s, which I find to be loud on the road.

    I'm 57, have owned eight Porsches, and was disappointed in how hard the base 997 rode on 19s. Next time, I'd wouldn't order 19s, or maybe just pop instead for a Carrera S with PASM.

    This is just my preference. If I were younger and sportier, , I'd might well stick with the 19s.

    Take it for what it's worth.



    I have read where Paul Frere (racing driver and journalist) also prefers the 18s and standard suspension on the base Carrerra. I wish we had a conventional suspension and 18s option on the S in the U.S.

    Jim

    Jun 6, 2006 7:44:13 AM

    WAY
    Rennteam Master
    WAY
    Loc: Melbourne, Australia
    Posts: 3344, Gallery
    Registered on: May 11, 2004
    Reply to: MHakkinen

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Quote:
    MHakkinen said:
    Just in case some of you are interested I reposted this pic of my 997C2 non-PASM. She's fitted here with 18" Carrera III's off a 997C4. The rears are 11" wide and fill the wells beautifully.

    In this pic there's no spacer up front, and none in the rear (I've since picked up 5mm spacers for the fronts).

    Ride quality very comparable to standard 18's. If anything I think I was feeling the difference between the Conti;s and the PS2's. I cannot comment about high speed handling because I only had them on the car for a few days; I switched back to my stock 18's for track days (I'm burning off the Conti's asap so I can mount track tires).

    For those of you who own C2's and are looking for a more aggressive look, or for those of you on 19's looking for a bit better ride might want to consider this solution. They should be easy to acquire as well from places such as Wheel Enhancement.

    I have since decided to put them up for sale (been chomping at the bit for Rennworx wheels) but didn't get any buyers, so at this point may wind up keeping them. Either way, it makes for having a set for the track, and a even nicer looking set for the street



    How much do you want for them? IM me. I wonder how much shipping is to Australia though...

    Btw, you must have lowered your car? It looks real low compared to mine...

    Jun 6, 2006 2:34:24 PM

    MHakkinen
    Pilot
    MHakkinen
    Loc: SoCal-freeway shooting capital
    Posts: 381, Gallery
    Registered on: Feb 15, 2005
    Reply to: WAY

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Quote:
    WAY said:
    How much do you want for them? IM me. I wonder how much shipping is to Australia though...

    Btw, you must have lowered your car? It looks real low compared to mine...



    Way, PM sent, but check your local shops first; I'm sure you can get a pretty good deal locally.

    And yes, car is lowered on Eibachs

    Mar 26, 2007 5:33:07 AM

    Newco
    Newbie
    Newco
    Loc: N. California
    Posts: 4, Gallery
    Registered on: Mar 14, 2007
    Reply to: AS

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    How much is the PASM option helpful for normal mode in the base model with 18s?

    Mar 26, 2007 1:28:16 PM

    Silver Bullet
    Veteran
    Silver Bullet
    Loc: Canada
    Posts: 1126, Gallery
    Registered on: Nov 24, 2004
    Reply to: Newco

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Olaf Manthey is quoted in Porsche World as categorically stating that for racing, 18's are the best suited rim size for a 911. They have a fantastic set of 18's that are ultralight and strong and that wheel is used on their racing cars, and is available on their website for your modified 911!

    Mar 26, 2007 2:23:00 PM

    Dan L
    Expert
    Dan L
    Loc: Santa Barbara, CA , United States
    Posts: 1957, Gallery
    Registered on: Jan 2, 2006
    Reply to: Silver Bullet

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    It's really funny--this topic--a few years ago this was the subject back then about the evolution to 18s from 17s. EXACTLY the same comments. Yet you guys seem perfectly happy with your 18s. Progress. I prefer the 19s. If you're driving a Porsche you should want maximum performance. Or maybe you really wanted a Chevy?

    Dan

    Mar 26, 2007 3:00:02 PM

    easy_rider911
    Rennteam VIP
    easy_rider911
    Loc: London , United Kingdom
    Posts: 22190, Gallery
    Registered on: Nov 8, 2004
    Reply to: Dan L

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    IMHO the optimal factory fitted 'sporty' combination for a 997S is:

    P17 -20mm sports suspension with rear LSD (not US or Canada)
    Manual transmission (& XCZ short shifter if desired)
    450 PCCB
    X51 Carrera S Powerkit
    640 Sport Chrono (for revised throttle map)

    All the other options are not performance orientated really.

    Now, to have this -20mm set up, one must have 19 inch wheels, coupe body style and not tiptronic S.

    So, in one's option choices, IMHO, the closer one can get to this set-up, the better...just my 2 cents.

    Mar 26, 2007 3:11:45 PM

    JMShrink
    Pilot
    JMShrink
    Loc: California
    Posts: 395, Gallery
    Registered on: Oct 12, 2005
    Reply to: Dan L

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    I have the 997C2 with 19s and no PASM. Mine came with the Conti IIs and to me they are much more comfortable than the Pilot Sport or Pirelli. The treadwear has been quite favorable as well. I couldn't comment about track use, since I don't go to the track. The Contis aren't very popular on this site, but they are probably the most practical, pricewise as well. BTW, Michigan has some pretty bad roads and I have no complaints regarding my 19" Conti IIs.

    Mar 26, 2007 5:17:45 PM

    911c2s
    Newbie
    911c2s
    Loc: MA, USA
    Posts: 24, Gallery
    Registered on: Jun 21, 2005
    Reply to: Dan L

    Re: 18s vs. 19s on base Carrera 997 without PASM

    Quote:
    Dan L said:
    It's really funny--this topic--a few years ago this was the subject back then about the evolution to 18s from 17s. EXACTLY the same comments. Yet you guys seem perfectly happy with your 18s. Progress. I prefer the 19s. If you're driving a Porsche you should want maximum performance.

    Dan



    Some would probably put 17" rims on their 997 if they could it. The brakes might be too large to fit 17's. Big rims aren't necessarily better performing.. usually manufacturers have moved to the larger size because they've been running bigger and bigger brakes. The downfall of these larger rims is the rotational mass is moved further towards the edge, the rims are increasing in weight (relative to the smaller diameters) and the tires are becoming less compliant to the road surface as the sidewall is made thinner and thinner. If maximum performance is desired, a lot of times you would actually try to get the smallest rim diameter that your brakes will allow.
     
    Edit

    Forum

    1. All 

    Boards

     
    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA (Part II) 4/17/24 7:16 AM
    GnilM     		759545 1798
    Porsche Sticky Welcome to Rennteam: Cars and Coffee... (photos) 4/7/24 11:48 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS     		433705 565
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Cayman GT4 RS (2021) 5/12/23 12:11 PM
    W8MM     		259725 288
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 911 (992) GT3 RS - 2022 3/12/24 8:28 AM
    DJM48     		256861 323
    Porsche Sticky The new Macan: the first all-electric SUV from Porsche 1/30/24 9:18 AM
    RCA     		80580 45
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Taycan 2024 Facelift 3/15/24 1:23 PM
    CGX car nut     		5304 50
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 2/1/24 7:01 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    		 870653 1364
    Porsche 992 GT3 7/23/23 7:01 PM
    Grant     		805643 3868
    Porsche Welcome to the new Taycan Forum! 2/10/24 4:43 PM
    nberry     		385932 1526
    Porsche GT4RS 4/17/24 8:53 PM
    GaussM     		384249 1452
    Others Tesla 2 the new thread 12/13/23 2:48 PM
    CGX car nut     		367018 2401
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 7/3/23 12:30 PM
    Porker     		365393 797
    Ferrari Ferrari 812 Superfast 4/21/23 8:09 AM
    the-missile     		287886 550
    Porsche Red Nipples 991.2 GT3 Touring on tour 4/11/24 12:32 PM
    Ferdie     		285479 668
    Porsche Collected my 997 GTS today 10/19/23 7:06 PM
    CGX car nut
     
     
     
     
     
    		 258845 812
    Lambo Huracán EVO STO 7/30/23 6:59 PM
    mcdelaug     		236713 346
    Lotus Lotus Emira 6/25/23 2:53 PM
    Enmanuel     		224715 101
    Others Corvette C8 10/16/23 3:24 PM
    Enmanuel     		219459 488
    Others Gordon Murray - T.50 11/22/23 10:27 AM
    mcdelaug     		166683 387
    Porsche Back to basics - 996 GT3 RS 6/11/23 5:13 PM
    CGX car nut     		138656 144
    BMW M 2024 BMW M3 CS Official Now 12/29/23 9:04 AM
    RCA     		115458 303
    Motor Sp. 2023 Formula One 12/19/23 5:38 AM
    WhoopsyM     		107357 685
    Others Valkyrie final design? 4/28/23 2:45 AM
    Rossi     		99249 219
    Porsche 2022 992 Safari Model 3/7/24 4:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		83556 239
    AMG Mercedes-Benz W124 500E aka Porsche typ 2758 2/23/24 10:03 PM
    blueflame     		74884 297
    Porsche 992 GT3 RS 3/3/24 7:22 PM
    WhoopsyM     		53059 314
    Motor Sp. Porsche 963 3/16/24 9:27 PM
    WhoopsyM     		24664 237
    Ferrari Ferrari 296 GTB (830PS, Hybrid V6) 1/21/24 4:29 PM
    GT-Boy     		20932 103
    BMW M 2022 BMW M5 CS 4/8/24 1:43 PM
    Ferdie     		19200 140
    AMG G63 sold out 9/15/23 7:38 PM
    Nico997     		16456 120
    129 items found, displaying 1 to 30.