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Board: Porsche - 911 - 997 - Turbo Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

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    May 13, 2006 6:22:19 AM

    MKSGRM
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Like one of the poster's (Turbo or S. Cal ) for what the 997TT is offering a MB SL65 or an M6 would give me the same driving experience for my driving abilities. To REALLY enjoy the 997TT you need to employ W. Rohrl and have him drive you.



    The experience of driving a SL65 or M6 fast (even if only on a Autobahn) is entirely different from the feeling you have in a 996TT. These cars are no competition in terms of driving excitement. They are close to the TT as straight line acceleration is concerned - however, they feel entirely different. Having said that, I must admit that SL65/M6 etc. also provide fun to the driver. The fun of travelling very releaxed and very fast. A different category but also nice.

    May 13, 2006 6:24:28 AM

    MKSGRM
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: What's your guess on the actual price of a 599 in CA

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    For those who aren't "on the list". I just saw a 430 spider with 200 miles on it with a $330K asking price. I'm guessing that a 599 with 200 miles on it will approach Carrera GT used prices. For that kind of money, it better be exalted.



    This is ridiculous, honestly. 330 k for a used F430 Spider? You get them over here in Germany slightly below or at MSRP.



    Well I guess German are not enamoured with Italian sport cars like we are in the US. There really are good reasons for our love of the Spider. Many also love German sport cars and Porsche is getting rich producing them. They just are not as highly prized as the Ferrari.

    The 599 is going to command huge premiums. I now am seriously reconsidering my position about buying one. I may order one.

    Trip your welcome. If there is one thing to learn about chat sites is DO NOT personalise any thread. it is only a car.



    There is no single German market for Ferraris. There is only a European market.

    When I sold my last Ferrari I had many calls from Italy, Belgium, France etc. I finally sold the car to Italy. I.e. the market prices you observe in Germany are European prices.

    May 13, 2006 7:29:17 AM

    ADias
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    Reply to: SoCalHoosier

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    For a P-car lover no comparison with an F-car matters. But... for poseurs... it is interesting that magazines have the nerve to compare the Turbo to a car costing almost twice as much... and argue which is better...

    May 13, 2006 8:10:24 AM

    andrea
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    Reply to: ADias

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    woowwwwww

    May 13, 2006 10:42:42 AM

    dhayek Offline
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    Reply to: trip

    Re: What's your guess on the actual price of a 599 in CA

    Quote:
    trip said:
    Nick I appreciate the way you stay so civil despite the critisism of your car taste by myself and others. I hope you don't take any of it personally. I agree that their are intangibles that make a car great however I keep coming back to the "best sports car ever" line. That is definitely saying alot.


    no doubt that its the best sports car,but at the 993 tt days porsche was in the supercar league..

    May 13, 2006 11:45:02 AM

    WR
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    Reply to: dhayek

    Re: What's your guess on the actual price of a 599 in CA

    just like to say... 'nice discussion here everyone'. I really enjoy read this worldly discussions between F and P.

    May 13, 2006 12:01:08 PM

    Freak 2
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    Reply to: dreamcar

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    THANKS Dreamcar

    May 13, 2006 12:38:32 PM

    dhayek Offline
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    Reply to: Freak 2

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    if the 599 11sec 0 to 200kph is true,its fast, its VERY fast...

    May 13, 2006 12:49:19 PM

    Porker
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    Reply to: dhayek

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Thanks for scanning the article.
    I had no idea Autocar was of such high quality!

    May 13, 2006 2:59:02 PM

    JZ
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    Reply to: Porker

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Big gaff though by Harris on page 71. The picture title shows the 997 Turbo vents and states, ''huge side vents ram air into turbos''.

    Rubbish.

    The side vents always have been to supplt air to each turbos oil cooler. And anyway Turbos work by using EXHAUST gas to spin a turbine to FORCE air into the cylinders. They don't work by ramming air into them.

    Apart from that, not a bad article.

    Cheers,

    JZ

    May 13, 2006 3:55:27 PM

    AUM
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    Reply to: JZ

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Brilliant as it is for an over-priced pasta-blasta, the 599 fails to ignite any impulse for ownership in me. Of the two cars, I would choose the Turbo even if price were equal.

    But I won't buy a 997 TT either. I will wait for the best 911 of all time and the sports car of the decade: the 997 GT2.

    AUM

    May 13, 2006 6:20:30 PM

    fritz
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    Reply to: JZ

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Quote:
    JZ said:
    Big gaff though by Harris on page 71. The picture title shows the 997 Turbo vents and states, ''huge side vents ram air into turbos''.

    Rubbish.

    The side vents always have been to supplt air to each turbos oil cooler. And anyway Turbos work by using EXHAUST gas to spin a turbine to FORCE air into the cylinders. They don't work by ramming air into them.




    FWIW, the side vents feed air to the intercoolers, which cool the charge air after it has been compressed by the turbine and before it is fed to the inlet manifold.

    The charge air which Chris Harris had in mind is fed into the air filter through the engine cover lid slats, not the side vents. It goes from the air filter chamber to the turbine side of the turbocharger to be compressed, as mentioned above.

    The efficiency of the íntercoolers, and therefore the engine's max power output, are dependant on the amount of cold air which can be induced to go thru the intercoolers. So the side vent shape will have been optimized in a wind tunnel as an additional measure to maximize the cars performance on the road. So it would have been more correct to say: "huge side vents ram air into the intercoolers".

    The side vents are not just a "design gimmick", as some people appear to think.

    May 13, 2006 7:53:01 PM

    Hurst
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    Reply to: fritz

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    This was good journalism. Read this quote and see what I mean:

    On the 997TT
    "Its competence is so overwhelming that it starts to undermine your admiration for its subjective appeal- because as we all know charming characteristics only prosper through the polarity of glaring inabilites."

    Wonderful writing...

    May 13, 2006 8:21:42 PM

    SoCalHoosier
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    Reply to: fritz

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    The side vents are not just a "design gimmick", as some people appear to think.



    Once again you're right fritz... to be a design gimmick, it would've actually required some design.

    May 13, 2006 11:52:27 PM

    nberry Offline
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    Reply to: Hurst

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    This was good journalism. Read this quote and see what I mean:

    On the 997TT
    "Its competence is so overwhelming that it starts to undermine your admiration for its subjective appeal- because as we all know charming characteristics only prosper through the polarity of glaring inabilites."

    Wonderful writing...



    I am not sure I agree. It is obtuse.

    Your interpretation please. I think I know what he is referring to but I would be interested in your thoughts.

    May 14, 2006 12:53:04 AM

    TulsaTurbo
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    I would paraphrase what he is saying is by suggesting that the 997TT is so capable (all systems networked and computerized) that it reduces the danger that many drivers will lose control (by self correcting) as the driver approaches the limits of his driving capabilities and hence allows the driver to go faster in many situations than he might normally be ale to go withiut even realizing how much faster he is going. The absence of always being on the edge,'one slight wrong move and you toss the car' (like my 96 Viper GTS), the absence of those 'near death experiences' that the 997TT is programed to minimize or eliminate might start to make you question its appeal. No eminate danger, no fun. This is the sum and substance of the ongoing debate in this forum about the desirability of the GT3 and GT2 versus the 997TT. They are more raw and will require a greater level of skill and concentration and hence a higher level of risk (IMO) to go as fast as the Turbo. Yes, I know with the right driver and the right track, under the right circumstances, they will go faster than the Turbo.

    May 14, 2006 7:39:09 PM

    ed_moree
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    Reply to: dreamcar

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Thanks for the scan. The 599 may be faster, but I still don't like it's looks, so maybe the turbo will do it.... hmm....

    May 15, 2006 4:33:52 AM

    jcparki
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    Reply to: nberry

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day



    RC, there is no doubt it is one fast car. The best way to describe the 997TT is "fast transportation". Nothing more.



    Quote from Porsche 993 911 Turbo Printed Ad
    "Calling it transportation is like calling sex reproduction!" ha ha

    May 16, 2006 9:03:57 AM

    temm
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    Reply to: dreamcar

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Thank you, thank you, thank you Dreamcar

    May 17, 2006 3:25:06 AM

    TulsaTurbo
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    Reply to: temm

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    I honestly wonder how many people on earth (including professional drivers) would drive a 997 tt and honestly come away and sum up the experience as only 'fast transportation.' I would be willing to bet a lot of money that that the number would statistically be 'ZERO'!

    May 17, 2006 11:23:24 PM

    polo
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    Reply to: TulsaTurbo

    Re: Autocar - Two Amazing Cars, One Unforgettable Day

    Quote:
    TulsaTurbo said:
    I honestly wonder how many people on earth (including professional drivers) would drive a 997 tt and honestly come away and sum up the experience as only 'fast transportation.' I would be willing to bet a lot of money that that the number would statistically be 'ZERO'!



    Well said He or she would have a very simple mind!
     
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