Crown

This is not about progress, its about emissions, hardly something anyone would consider progress in a sportscar. A Turbocharged V8 may be more fuel efficient and have lower emissions than an atmospheric V10, but it pales in comparison in terms of sportiveness.

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

The turbo charged V8 may also have more power and be lighter than a NA V10. I doubt this is all about fuel efficiency and emissions.

Do you really think that Ferrari, Bugatti, Koenigsegg, etc. turbo charge their cars for environmental reasons? 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

Turbos are about economics. Far lower development costs since the same engine can be spread across a bunch of models, more or less, and they can very easily adjust boost for whatever performance they want. No need to work hard and spend so much time and money massaging an extra 50 hp out of an NA engine when you can just change a couple parameters in code and use it for 10 years in 4 cars.

Also, NA engines can only put out so much power. No way you're getting 488 performance from the 458 V8. Just not going to happen.

RS 991:

It makes no sense at all to ditch the V10, who cares about a few cars driving around with a V10, almost all of them with low mileage. Sports cars are about feel and emotions, not about emissions and fuel consumption.

They have to...to be able to keep the V12.

Lamborghini is planning to grow (Urus is a first step) and growing means stricter emissions regulations.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

bluelines:

The turbo charged V8 may also have more power and be lighter than a NA V10. I doubt this is all about fuel efficiency and emissions.

True. It is much easier to achieve more power through a turbo charged engine. Also, the tech is compatible to the hybrid tech which will be introduced in many VW Group brands.  Just imagine they'd need to adapt hybrid tech to the V10, it would cost them a fortune. VW Group wants to use the same platform for their super sportscars, so...  There is even a strong rumor (actually more than that) that the next Aventador will share the same platform with the Huracan and the next R8 (if there is going to be one), also the "960". This would clearly save them tons of money.

Do you really think that Ferrari, Bugatti, Koenigsegg, etc. turbo charge their cars for environmental reasons? 

Of course not but this is one of the reasons because they need to fulfill certain regulations, especially Ferrari.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

noone1:

Turbos are about economics. Far lower development costs since the same engine can be spread across a bunch of models, more or less, and they can very easily adjust boost for whatever performance they want. No need to work hard and spend so much time and money massaging an extra 50 hp out of an NA engine when you can just change a couple parameters in code and use it for 10 years in 4 cars.

Sounds easy but it isn't. The increased torque creates huge problems for the drivetrain and gearbox, also the tires and the ESP, steering and so on. In the past, the drivetrain/gearbox had a high reserve in the upper range (remember the 993/996 and the Mezger engines?). Later on, manufacturers went cost effective. Meaning: The drivetrain/gearbox are exactly made for the current power/torque with a small margin to the upper side for a facelift or tolerances. With the next facelift or next generation, the parts will be improved to withstand higher torque. The modern engines don't have much reserve to the upper side. The new Audi R8 is no different: The old cars (first gen with V10) could be easily upgraded with a software mod to 50-80 hp more, no kidding. Quite amazing for a n/a engine but Audi artificially  actually limited power in these engines, this is why. For example the throttle valve didn't fully open. On the new generation, only the 540 hp version V10 is artificially limited (same engine number as V10 Plus but software limits power), the 610 hp engine version is "open" and to achieve more power, you need to change the exhaust system and the intake, also some minor engine parts (titan valves, etc.), the new Huracan Performante is the best example. 30 hp more only, the V10 engine is currently at it's power limit. To increase power, it would require lots of internal mods, maybe incl. a displacement increase. Not worth it for Audi/Lamborghini.

Also, NA engines can only put out so much power. No way you're getting 488 performance from the 458 V8. Just not going to happen.

True. I am pretty sure that the 488 engine is good for at least 750 hp in it's current technical state and it's most advanced setup. The old V8 in the 458 was at it's power zenith with the Speciale. Maybe a few horses more and the engine would have been done.

N/a engines are a dying breed but I am pretty sure that some will stay for a while, maybe even supported by hybrid tech. In the end however, ELV sportscars will take over. It is just a matter of time but I still believe that it won't happen very soon. Sportscar manufacturers will however put an ELV on the market each at some point, at least to prove their competence. Won't be cheap for them in the beginning. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

bluelines:

The turbo charged V8 may also have more power and be lighter than a NA V10. I doubt this is all about fuel efficiency and emissions.

Do you really think that Ferrari, Bugatti, Koenigsegg, etc. turbo charge their cars for environmental reasons? 

Not only, turbocharging is also cheaper power, but its the main reason, regulations are getting more strict every time. Its not the case for every car, the 700HP+ cars like Bugatti, Koenigsegg, etc you mentioned need turbocharging to reach those numbers but the 500-600HP club like the R8 of this don't, it could easily keep the V10 for the facelift.
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⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

I believe RC will not be satisfied with 500-600hp for the next R8 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

bluelines:

I believe RC will not be satisfied with 500-600hp for the next R8 

Not sure I understand this. 

I am very happy with the 610 hp my R8 has right now. Actually, it is more than enough for my driving needs, driving fun and even driving skills. Actually, the R8 fits my driving style quite perfectly. Would I want more power? Of course, who doesn't want more power?!

If the R8 facelift keeps the V10 engine, with the rumored 25 hp more and it gets the rear axle steering with a few chassis improvements, I could be tempted. I would not get a facelifted R8 with V8 Biturbo and even 700 hp. No way. 

Why should I lie to myself though: I love new cars and new tech. So if there is going to be a R8 with 700 or 800 hp at some point, with a nice sounding V8 Biturbo, maybe I get tempted. I don't know.

Right now, I am a sucker for good exhaust/engine sounds and I wouldn't want less than I have in the R8 right now.

Maybe I drive a S class in 10 years and you make me the godfather of your next kid, who knows?   

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Silly question: how many hp to you need to drift a R8 on a public road? 

SciFrog:

Silly question: how many hp to you need to drift a R8 on a public road? 

610. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

I did it, after all the good reviews of RC!  With pain in my hard I traded in my "old" Daytona grey R8 for a Sazuka white brand new V10. Decided not for a plus but a plus but a full-full option R8. The car came with 20" rims and Michelin cup2 tires the 19" are extra. The dealer made a mistake in ordering so I now have 2 set of rimes and tires. Will pick up next week, got a good deal good discount on new one and a fair price for 2008 R8.

I am looking forward how it compairs to my wifes Porsche 911 991-2 Turbo!

IMG_1651.m4v

Nice, congrats!

Porsche, separates Le Mans from Le Boys

JR-550:

I did it, after all the good reviews of RC!  With pain in my hard I traded in my "old" Daytona grey R8 for a Sazuka white brand new V10. Decided not for a plus but a plus but a full-full option R8. The car came with 20" rims and Michelin cup2 tires the 19" are extra. The dealer made a mistake in ordering so I now have 2 set of rimes and tires. Will pick up next week, got a good deal good discount on new one and a fair price for 2008 R8.

I am looking forward how it compairs to my wifes Porsche 911 991-2 Turbo!

IMG_1651.m4v

 

 

Congrats, beautiful car and I am still thinking to get black rims with my suzukagrey R8, they look so good on this car. 

You remember I recommended against getting the R8 V10 (non plus) because of the chassis setup (more comfortable, not sporty enough)? I hope you had a testdrive before you got the car because it really feels more like an Audi A5 than an Audi R8. 

The engine is the same as in the V10 Plus, so you can basically raise power with a simple software update (tuning) but be aware that the gearbox has a different gearing ratio, so you cannot really fully benefit from this power upgrade.

Don't misunderstand me: I am not trying to spoil the fun, just making you aware of it (although I think you already know because I mentioned this a couple of times).  I don't want you to blame me for not being happy with this car. 

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

He RC I know read all your post, but for me the "non" sporty is the reason for buy it. There were here, in Aachen area, a few plus on stock but choose this one!. Will let you know my review!

JR-550:

He RC I know read all your post, but for me the "non" sporty is the reason for buy it. There were here, in Aachen area, a few plus on stock but choose this one!. Will let you know my review!

Good to know , sorry for my words...I really didn't want to spoil the fun.  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

German car market February 2017 new registrations in the sportscar segment (comparison):

Lamborghini Aventador 16 cars

Ferrari 488 GTB 26 cars

Nissan GT-R 27 cars

Audi R8 56 cars

AMG GT 59 cars

Porsche Cayman 69 cars

Worst: Aston Martin...only 1-2 cars per model.

Dealership registrations are included, so these figures say nothing about real sales figures.

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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Don't worry be happy. This is the same reason why I bought an 911 Turbo and not a Turbo S, 540 hores is suffient for me. But if a Caymen GT4RS comes on the market I will buy this for driving on the track!.

My poor "old" R8 now traded in with only 24.000 km in 8 years!

Many congrats JR-550

The R8 is always a good decision. Hope y'll be satisfied with the V10 without "plus'. But I assume you thought about thoroughly. So, happy driving.

JR-550:

I did it, after all the good reviews of RC!  With pain in my hard I traded in my "old" Daytona grey R8 for a Sazuka white brand new V10. Decided not for a plus but a plus but a full-full option R8. The car came with 20" rims and Michelin cup2 tires the 19" are extra. The dealer made a mistake in ordering so I now have 2 set of rimes and tires. Will pick up next week, got a good deal good discount on new one and a fair price for 2008 R8.

I am looking forward how it compairs to my wifes Porsche 911 991-2 Turbo!

IMG_1651.m4v

 

 

Very nice, bud. ...

Congrats...

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

Conny997:

Many congrats JR-550

The R8 is always a good decision. Hope y'll be satisfied with the V10 without "plus'. But I assume you thought about thoroughly. So, happy driving.

The problem is the chassis (different dampers, different stabilizers, different magnetic ride setup, even steering setup is different... ). Audi has been criticized many times by the German car press for the R8 V10 (non Plus version) because of this weird comfort setup in a sportscar with 540 hp.

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/einzeltests/audi-r8-v10-im-test-10886051.html

The review on the V10 Spyder came up with similar results:

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/einzeltests/audi-r8-spyder-test-11647016.html

I guess JR-550 knows what he is doing, he read my posts (and warnings) and I am pretty sure he had a test-drive. 

I like the Spyder a lot but it just doesn't feel like a sportscar.   Probably one of the many reasons Audi decided to put a V10 Plus Spyder on the market this summer. 

Btw: The R8 V10 Plus chassis setup isn't perfect either. It is actually quite comfortable for such a car, even in Dynamic mode (magnetic ride). Maybe a bit too comfortable because when driven hard, I wish the car had a slightly stiffer damper setup. Only a tiny bit would be sufficient. It would add a razor sharp precision to that razor sharp steering. Maybe Audi was afraid customers couldn't handle it and/or it would be too uncomfortable, I don't know. 

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

Many congrats! and the color combo works very well on his car 

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

Congrats!  Great looking car 

Don't let RC spoil the fun because you decided to not get the plus. Your R8 is newer than his rented one. That is what counts 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

bluelines:

Congrats!  Great looking car 

Don't let RC spoil the fun because you decided to not get the plus. Your R8 is newer than his rented one. That is what counts 

And definitely faster than your GT4...so no worries.  

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

bluelines:

Congrats!  Great looking car 

Don't let RC spoil the fun because you decided to not get the plus. Your R8 is newer than his rented one. That is what counts 

Hahaha,,

You tired ?, bud....

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

throt:

bluelines:

Congrats!  Great looking car 

Don't let RC spoil the fun because you decided to not get the plus. Your R8 is newer than his rented one. That is what counts 

Hahaha,,

You tired ?, bud....

Hahahaha, yeah. The first two nights were not much sleep... last night started to get some rhythm, like a two-stroke engine misfiring  Just fed one, off to do the next, yay... but I love it! Such great feeling 

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White

bluelines:

throt:

bluelines:

Congrats!  Great looking car 

Don't let RC spoil the fun because you decided to not get the plus. Your R8 is newer than his rented one. That is what counts 

Hahaha,,

You tired ?, bud....

Hahahaha, yeah. The first two nights were not much sleep... last night started to get some rhythm, like a two-stroke engine misfiring  Just fed one, off to do the next, yay... but I love it! Such great feeling 

Good on yu, buddy. Must be a very special feeling for the two of you with the two of them  ...

throt

"I Have Done It!".

991 GT3 pick up in October 2014.

Rennteam Hairy Chest Advisor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cd7h1KX_ix4

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

5 minute intro for 10 sec race.

noone1:

5 minute intro for 10 sec race.

Jesus noone are you like that in real life? you must be a joy to be around 

--

⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS