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    Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Latest article in the June issue of Excellence describes the author's "riding" experience in a 997TT at Weissach with factory test drivers....needless to say the author, Ian Kuah, was very impressed. In a 1/4 mile drag race with a 996TT, the 997TT was ahead by 3 car lengths at the 1/8 mile point and at the finish the 996TT was no where to be seen. He also mentions that the 997TT with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires is 7 secs. faster at the 'Ring. His ending quote was, "....so get ready for a monster of a 911".

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    it is a monster 911

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    any way we could get a scan? Thanks alot.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    964C2 said:
    Latest article in the June issue of Excellence describes the author's "riding" experience in a 997TT at Weissach with factory test drivers....needless to say the author, Ian Kuah, was very impressed. In a 1/4 mile drag race with a 996TT, the 997TT was ahead by 3 car lengths at the 1/8 mile point and at the finish the 996TT was no where to be seen. He also mentions that the 997TT with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires is 7 secs. faster at the 'Ring. His ending quote was, "....so get ready for a monster of a 911".



    I read it last night. The drag race was w/ both tip cars right ? 996 Turbo Tip VS. 997 Turbo Tip. Too bad they had very wet track conditions. Would have loved to read more about each cars dry track limiations versus each other.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Yes, both were Tips....

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Yep, GT Purely Porsche has a similar report: both tip. So that's no surprise that the 996 stayed in the dust.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    964C2 said:
    He also mentions that the 997TT with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires is 7 secs. faster at the 'Ring.


    This is not too impressive as the new tires are worth at least 7 sec. on their own. Maybe you meant that the 996TT had Cup tires too? Or did you mean that the differenc in tires is 7 sec (no comparison to 996TT)? Sorry for the confusion...

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Grant said:
    Quote:
    964C2 said:
    He also mentions that the 997TT with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires is 7 secs. faster at the 'Ring.


    This is not too impressive as the new tires are worth at least 7 sec. on their own. Maybe you meant that the 996TT had Cup tires too? Or did you mean that the differenc in tires is 7 sec (no comparison to 996TT)? Sorry for the confusion...



    No, the article said the 997 Turbo is 7 seconds faster and with the Cup Tires minus an additional 7 seconds.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    Quote:
    Grant said:
    Quote:
    964C2 said:
    He also mentions that the 997TT with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires is 7 secs. faster at the 'Ring.


    This is not too impressive as the new tires are worth at least 7 sec. on their own. Maybe you meant that the 996TT had Cup tires too? Or did you mean that the differenc in tires is 7 sec (no comparison to 996TT)? Sorry for the confusion...



    No, the article said the 997 Turbo is 7 seconds faster and with the Cup Tires minus an additional 7 seconds.


    That's right, sorry I wasn't clear....

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Thanks, guys! Yes, 14 sec improvement (with new tires) is very good! That would make it around 7:42, which has been mentioned earlier...

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    996 Turbo Tip VS. 997 Turbo Tip. Too bad they had very wet track conditions. Would have loved to read more about each cars dry track limiations versus each other.



    Porsche tests the slowest 996 Turbo against the fastest 997 Turbo...in very traction limited conditions, which favor the new AWD system of the 997 Turbo. I'd say you couldn't stack the deck any more in favor of the 997 Turbo.

    The comment "nowhere in sight" at the end of the quarter mile is suspect. I guess it depends though on the definition of "nowhere in sight". Each 0.1 sec faster ET in the quarter equals about 1 car length. For example, a 12.4 versus a 11.7 would mean a difference of 7 car lengths...

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    996 Turbo Tip VS. 997 Turbo Tip. Too bad they had very wet track conditions. Would have loved to read more about each cars dry track limiations versus each other.



    Porsche tests the slowest 996 Turbo against the fastest 997 Turbo...in very traction limited conditions, which favor the new AWD system of the 997 Turbo. I'd say you couldn't stack the deck any more in favor of the 997 Turbo.

    The comment "nowhere in sight" at the end of the quarter mile is suspect. I guess it depends though on the definition of "nowhere in sight". Each 0.1 sec faster ET in the quarter equals about 1 car length. For example, a 12.4 versus a 11.7 would mean a difference of 7 car lengths...


    I'd personally would love to see a tip 997 vs. your car Dock that would be interesting to watch

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    BD 997 said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    STRADALE said:
    996 Turbo Tip VS. 997 Turbo Tip. Too bad they had very wet track conditions. Would have loved to read more about each cars dry track limiations versus each other.



    Porsche tests the slowest 996 Turbo against the fastest 997 Turbo...in very traction limited conditions, which favor the new AWD system of the 997 Turbo. I'd say you couldn't stack the deck any more in favor of the 997 Turbo.

    The comment "nowhere in sight" at the end of the quarter mile is suspect. I guess it depends though on the definition of "nowhere in sight". Each 0.1 sec faster ET in the quarter equals about 1 car length. For example, a 12.4 versus a 11.7 would mean a difference of 7 car lengths...


    I'd personally would love to see a tip 997 vs. your car Dock that would be interesting to watch




    Hey,

    I would run mine for a comparison.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:

    I would run mine for a comparison.



    Your Turbo should no question be faster than the 997 Turbo...unless of course Porsche hasn't been up front about the 997 TT's actual power numbers.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    cmon guys.. im a 997tt fan... but its hard to believe that a 997turbo can do a nice job against a 996 turbo with 600 hp
    Im JUST REALIST but GO 997TT

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    In a 1/4 mile drag race with a 996TT, the 997TT was ahead by 3 car lengths at the 1/8 mile point and at the finish the 996TT was no where to be seen






    Quote:
    "....so get ready for a monster of a 911"



    he he he

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    ...Porsche tests the slowest 996 Turbo against the fastest 997 Turbo...in very traction limited conditions, which favor the new AWD system of the 997 Turbo. I'd say you couldn't stack the deck any more in favor of the 997 Turbo...



    This is one way to look at it - on the other side those are both the "basic" Turbos with automatic gearbox, which makes them pretty similiar in the end. If you consider MSRPs for both cars it becomes obvious that the 997TT is not the worst value for money in the lineup. Just my 02 cents.

    On the other hand, 7 seconds improvement on the Ring shows that quite a substantial amount is due to increased hp numbers and bigger brakes - it would be pretty silly to expect bigger improvements due to the 996 TT's already fabulous performance!

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Ferdie said:
    This is one way to look at it - on the other side those are both the "basic" Turbos with automatic gearbox, which makes them pretty similiar in the end.



    The quarter mile is about performance - it is obviously one of the platforms used to judge how much a manufacturer has improved their new car. The 996 Tip is at the bottom in terms of launching off the line, and it's the slowest 996 Turbo. Matching these two cars allows Porsche to enjoy the biggest "WOW" factor, but does not serve as a measurement of how much real performance increase the 997 TT is over the 996 TT.

    Quote:
    Ferdie said:On the other hand, 7 seconds improvement on the Ring shows that quite a substantial amount is due to increased hp numbers and bigger brakes - it would be pretty silly to expect bigger improvements due to the 996 TT's already fabulous performance!



    Notice that you've never seen any Ring times for a 996 Turbo with X73? There's a reason for this...Porsche is in the business of selling cars (I have no problem with this, but realize it has much to do with how cars are advertised). If Porsche advertised that a 996 Turbo with X73 can run in the low 7:50's at the Ring, it doesn't leave much difference between that car and the next version to be released (the 997 TT). My guess is that if you add X50 to the 996 TT with X73, it would be very close to the 997 TT's Ring time.

    When determining what performance increases a manufacturer is offering with their new model, it's important to match the best performing "old" model to the best performing "new" model.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    I recognize the X50 option...b ut what is X73? Thanks in advance for the reply..:-)

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    LoranTw said:
    I recognize the X50 option...b ut what is X73? Thanks in advance for the reply..:-)



    The X7 option is Porsche's best suspension for the 996 Turbo (includes new springs/shocks/motor mounts). It lowers the car and makes a HUGE difference in handling. It's also available as an after market installation...that's what I did.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    LoranTw said:
    I recognize the X50 option...b ut what is X73? Thanks in advance for the reply..:-)



    The X7 option is Porsche's best suspension for the 996 Turbo (includes new springs/shocks/motor mounts). It lowers the car and makes a HUGE difference in handling. It's also available as an after market installation...that's what I did.


    Thanks for the reply.What price did that option go for and is this a potential for this 997tt or not available for whatever reason? I take it you were very happy with the upgrade.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    LoranTw said:What price did that option go for and is this a potential for this 997tt or not available for whatever reason? I take it you were very happy with the upgrade.



    I ordered the X73 package from Gert at Carnewal...paid 1995 euros at the time. My dealer installed the suspension and motor mounts.

    I couldn't be more pleased with the X73 suspension! It lowers the car, and the handling is a HUGE improvement. The car is also much more planted at speed. The ride is no question stiffer/harder, but it drives and rides like a proper Porsche sports car...there's nothing "GT' about it.

    I have no idea if the X73 suspension could be installed on a 997 Turbo...

    Here's a picture of the ride height with X73.



    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    LoranTw said:What price did that option go for and is this a potential for this 997tt or not available for whatever reason? I take it you were very happy with the upgrade.



    I ordered the X73 package from Gert at Carnewal...paid 1995 euros at the time. My dealer installed the suspension and motor mounts.

    I couldn't be more pleased with the X73 suspension! It lowers the car, and the handling is a HUGE improvement. The car is also much more planted at speed. The ride is no question stiffer/harder, but it drives and rides like a proper Porsche sports car...there's nothing "GT' about it.

    I have no idea if the X73 suspension could be installed on a 997 Turbo...

    Here's a picture of the ride height with X73.






    I'm sure Porsche will release a suspension kit sooner or later, in the guise of the new X73, for the 997TT.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Or maybe not.

    The 977TT and GT3 come with PASM, suposedly much improved from the carrera PASM, retrofit of another suspension would be prohibitive...

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:

    The X7 option is Porsche's best suspension for the 996 Turbo (includes new springs/shocks/motor mounts). It lowers the car and makes a HUGE difference in handling. It's also available as an after market installation...that's what I did.


    Did it make the car's suspension communicate better. My largest fear is to lose that feeling of being in touch with the road. I went with the pccb's for that reason. I did enquire with my sales rep to ensure I had all the performance options available and specifically asked about the x73. I'll post if something positive comes out of it. Thanks for the help.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    You look like the perfect candidate for the X73, It will communicate better.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    LoranTw said:
    Did it make the car's suspension communicate better.



    Yes.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    Ferdie said:
    This is one way to look at it - on the other side those are both the "basic" Turbos with automatic gearbox, which makes them pretty similiar in the end.



    The quarter mile is about performance - it is obviously one of the platforms used to judge how much a manufacturer has improved their new car. The 996 Tip is at the bottom in terms of launching off the line, and it's the slowest 996 Turbo. Matching these two cars allows Porsche to enjoy the biggest "WOW" factor, but does not serve as a measurement of how much real performance increase the 997 TT is over the 996 TT.

    Quote:
    Ferdie said:On the other hand, 7 seconds improvement on the Ring shows that quite a substantial amount is due to increased hp numbers and bigger brakes - it would be pretty silly to expect bigger improvements due to the 996 TT's already fabulous performance!



    Notice that you've never seen any Ring times for a 996 Turbo with X73? There's a reason for this...Porsche is in the business of selling cars (I have no problem with this, but realize it has much to do with how cars are advertised). If Porsche advertised that a 996 Turbo with X73 can run in the low 7:50's at the Ring, it doesn't leave much difference between that car and the next version to be released (the 997 TT). My guess is that if you add X50 to the 996 TT with X73, it would be very close to the 997 TT's Ring time.

    When determining what performance increases a manufacturer is offering with their new model, it's important to match the best performing "old" model to the best performing "new" model.



    Agree that 996TTS w/street tires prob would do 7:50ish N-ring, so P is doing clever marketing of 997TT vs typical clueless cust to compare vs 5-6yo N-ring times of 996TT w/415hp and old tech tires, etc.....

    But don't know if a stiff X73 (or PASM in Sport) necessarily generates best times on a bumpy mtn road (akin to N-ring), esp in hands of a good rennteam driver (vs a pro).....

    I suspect what P will struggle w/in marketing the 997TT to a few is lack of material N-ring time improvement for a pro driver, but perhaps 997TT will deliver important "feel" improvements to a rennteam-lvl driver on a bumpy mtn road in terms of traction/chassis balance/brake feel....and 60-120MPH fwy accel, w/no turbo lag

    Given I'd bet 90%+ of 997TT/SL55 buyers just fixate on hp figs, 0-60MPH times, base price and lease terms (and when's the softer Cab coming out? ), the marketing challenge may not be as great as we fear.....

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Quote:
    VKSF said:But don't know if a stiff X73 (or PASM in Sport) necessarily generates best times on a bumpy mtn road (akin to N-ring), esp in hands of a good rennteam driver (vs a pro).



    Based on my experience on curvy mountain roads in both my stock 996 Turbo and my Turbo with X73, I'd have to say that the X73 packaged Turbo is significantly better/faster.

    Re: Latest Excellence article on the Turbo

    Well at least the 997TT i cheaper than the old 996TTS, for the same performance. They have to leave room for 997TTS or powerkit, and GT2.

     
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