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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
I don't believe Carmine Red is offered on the Sport Turismo so this car must presumably be a factory owned car or one that someone has managed to order in PTS. I'd expect Carmine to be offered on a future GTS variant as Porsche have little imagination when it comes to colour offerings and tend to stick to a formulaic approach.
Sep 29, 2017 5:57:03 AM
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SportCarGroup
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
Wonderbar:When does the sport turismo go into production ?
My dealer already has a Turbo in his showroom. 
Demand? Almost zero. 
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Nov 20, 2017 7:18:05 AM
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the-missile
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RC
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
Really demand is 0? 
I am surprised, this is the first time they release a proper 5 seaters.
most probably for another market than Europe, oh well, when you see the price of the Pany, it is very very overpriced...
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Nov 20, 2017 7:34:35 AM
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ALDO
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
the-missile:
I am surprised, this is the first time they release a proper 5 seaters.
You must be kidding? Maybe a child up to 140 cm could sit in the middle.
The car has at the end only 20 liters more storage room
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Nov 20, 2017 8:14:20 AM
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the-missile
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
it looks better and you can put 5 people...
small, big, squeezed.
regular pany, what ever you try is only 4 
but still think the price tag is the issue on this car. you can see the second hand market....value falls like a rock.
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Nov 20, 2017 8:50:18 AM
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ISUK
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
I saw my first one at my dealer on Saturday. It was finished in black with black leather and looked liked a hearse
In a better colour combination with the sport design kit it will look better but there really isn't much in the way of additional usable trunk space. They had orders for 3 turbo hybrids so the novelty factor is obviously a draw for those wanting to be seen driving something different.
Nov 20, 2017 9:34:29 AM
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RC
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
the-missile:it looks better and you can put 5 people...
regular pany, what ever you try is only 4
but still think the price tag is the issue on this car. you can see the second hand market....value falls like a rock.
Exactly. The Panamera Turbo Sport Turismo at my dealer has a price tag of...hold your breath...206k EUR. 
Porsche has a general price issue: The 991.2 Carrera GTS Cab I am picking up on Friday has a price tag of almost 170k EUR. The C63 S AMG Cab I ordered, fully optioned, has a price tag of 123k EUR. Almost 50k and discounts are much better for the Mercedes, incl. lease offer. Maybe both cars aren't really comparable but you get my point.
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Nov 20, 2017 10:12:35 AM
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Carlos from Spain
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RC
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
To me, and this is my own personal opinion, the Sport Turismo looks much much worse than the regular Panamera, it looks like a stationwagon, a step backwards in terms of sportiness.
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Nov 20, 2017 11:26:22 AM
- JR-550
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Carlos from Spain
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
Talking about prices, in the Netherlands a Panamera Sport Turbo costs 257,313 Euro! I wonder what the depreciation of this car will be. At the Maastricht/Eindhoven dealer there are app 20 Panamera's on stock some of them already for more then 6 month. Also the number of hybrides on stock is shocking.
Nov 20, 2017 11:26:30 AM
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RC
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Carlos from Spain
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
Carlos from Spain:To me, and this is my own personal opinion, the Sport Turismo looks much much worse than the regular Panamera, it looks like a stationwagon, a step backwards in terms of sportiness.
Honest opinion: It looks really good for a station wagon (it is what it is) but the price tag is insane (206k EUR, when you can get an E63 S AMG for at least 50-60k less, with similar or better performance).
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Nov 20, 2017 11:27:49 AM
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Carlos from Spain
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
If you want good value in a car, Porsche is definitely not the brand you should look into. It used to be compared to Bmw and Mercedes but not anymore.
The main issue is with their SUV and sedans as you can compare the Panamera, cayenne and Macan to the RS6, S8, S65, GLC43/63 or whatever.
The only "good value car" in the range is the base 991 carrera, even if you start compare it to the M4 and C63.
Everyone likes the carrera S and the GTS in the model range but the introduction of these models have had a dramatic impact on the value of other models, like the turbo. Second-hand prices tell you the real value of a turbo and it ain't 220K.
Nov 20, 2017 11:46:29 AM
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the-missile
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
200+ KEuros is a disaster....
I don't know where they go with their pricing strategy but surely at some point they will understand the mistake...
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Nov 20, 2017 12:12:03 PM
- reginos
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
IMO the Panamera Sport Turismo should be compared to something like the Ferrari Lusso (especially the one with the California engine) rather than mainstream BMWs and Audis etc. Even a Mercedes E class AMG is basically a taxi fitted with an oversized engine, not a bespoke car whatever the M-B publicity let's its customers to believe.
In my eyes the new Panamera especially the ST is a very attractive design with unparalleled road presence.
It might potentially depreciate more than a Ferrari but OTOH any Ferrari used as heavily and extensively as a Porsche will have enormous running costs and a significally smaller residual value compared to the typical "delivery mileage" used Ferrari.
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Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
reginos:IMO the Panamera Sport Turismo should be compared to something like the Ferrari Lusso (especially the one with the California engine) rather than mainstream BMWs and Audis etc. Even a Mercedes E class AMG is basically a taxi fitted with an oversized engine, not a bespoke car whatever the M-B publicity let's its customers to believe.
Not true I'm afraid. Due to my new found love for AMG (and the fact that they make more affordable cars for my pocket), I looked into the new E63, GLC63, C63, etc. and I can assure you that the E63 has been completely revamped and doesn't have much to do with your regular E class taxi models. Just look at the latest Nordschleife test result. AMG put a lot of work into the E63, completely new rear axle, gearbox, AWD, etc..
In my eyes the new Panamera especially the ST is a very attractive design with unparalleled road presence.
Yes, the Panamera, incl. the ST, have indeed an unparalleled road presence but this is exactly the problem in some regions: With a Panamera, you just attract a lot of attention, something you actually don't really want in this class, unless you live in Miami, Dubai or London.
It might potentially depreciate more than a Ferrari but OTOH any Ferrari used as heavily and extensively as a Porsche will have enormous running costs and a significally smaller residual value compared to the typical "delivery mileage" used Ferrari.
Looking at the previous Panamera generation and it's depreciation, well...almost shocking.
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RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
RC:reginos:IMO the Panamera Sport Turismo should be compared to something like the Ferrari Lusso (especially the one with the California engine) rather than mainstream BMWs and Audis etc. Even a Mercedes E class AMG is basically a taxi fitted with an oversized engine, not a bespoke car whatever the M-B publicity let's its customers to believe.
Not true I'm afraid. Due to my new found love for AMG (and the fact that they make more affordable cars for my pocket), I looked into the new E63, GLC63, C63, etc. and I can assure you that the E63 has been completely revamped and doesn't have much to do with your regular E class taxi models. Just look at the latest Nordschleife test result. AMG put a lot of work into the E63, completely new rear axle, gearbox, AWD, etc..
I didn't want to offend AMG, of which I am also a fan, but I wanted to highlight that you don't get a totally bespoke model, even though under the skin the reworking is admirable. However, in some regions like Germany having an understated car is a blessing.
In my eyes the new Panamera especially the ST is a very attractive design with unparalleled road presence.
Yes, the Panamera, incl. the ST, have indeed an unparalleled road presence but this is exactly the problem in some regions: With a Panamera, you just attract a lot of attention, something you actually don't really want in this class, unless you live in Miami, Dubai or London.
Indeed, I was in London last week that is full of supercars and hypercars and Phantoms etc. and the Panamera, even the Gen I never goes unnoticed. Surprisingly the new 982 Cayman/Boxsters have a lot of road credibility in a city full of 456s, 488s and extravagant Lamborghinis!
It might potentially depreciate more than a Ferrari but OTOH any Ferrari used as heavily and extensively as a Porsche will have enormous running costs and a significally smaller residual value compared to the typical "delivery mileage" used Ferrari.
Looking at the previous Panamera generation and it's depreciation, well...almost shocking.
Use a Ferrari for a few years like you do with a Porsche and you might not even find a buyer, never mind the depreciation!
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"Porsche....and Nothing else matters"
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
amazon:If you want good value in a car, Porsche is definitely not the brand you should look into. It used to be compared to Bmw and Mercedes but not anymore.
The main issue is with their SUV and sedans as you can compare the Panamera, cayenne and Macan to the RS6, S8, S65, GLC43/63 or whatever.
The only "good value car" in the range is the base 991 carrera, even if you start compare it to the M4 and C63.
Everyone likes the carrera S and the GTS in the model range but the introduction of these models have had a dramatic impact on the value of other models, like the turbo. Second-hand prices tell you the real value of a turbo and it ain't 220K.
Actually the Macan is having even better residuals than a base 911 (unless it is a very bare base 911 but no one buys that since the car would lack some really basic items).
These $260k Porsche Panamera cars will be trading $100k in 3-4 years. That’s Ferrari FF depreciation territory, ugly...
Nov 20, 2017 4:45:22 PM
- bluelines
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Carlos from Spain
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
Carlos from Spain:To me, and this is my own personal opinion, the Sport Turismo looks much much worse than the regular Panamera, it looks like a stationwagon, a step backwards in terms of sportiness.
It is a stationwagon 
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Nov 20, 2017 6:28:25 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Nov 20, 2017 7:40:11 PM
- bluelines
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Carlos from Spain
Re: OFFICIAL: Panamera Sport Turismo expands the Panamera model line
RC:Wonderbar:When does the sport turismo go into production ?
My dealer already has a Turbo in his showroom.
Demand? Almost zero.
They are so dumb. If they would have stuck to their concept design it would see like hot cake!
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