Crown

WAY:

Great pics and video Bluelines. Keen to hear Dave's view of it relative to GT3.

I didn't actually get around to going out in it.. :-(

2011 987S, 1964 Type 1

Dave and Bluelines, Thanks again for letting me take your cars around the track . It is much appreciated .

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Gnil:

It was a standard track day . There was maybe 25/30 cars max. So most of the time you had an empty track .

I drove Dave's GT3 and then directly after , I drove Blueline's GT4 . Both for about 3 or 4 laps.

Verdict :  

The GT3 is faster , no dougt about that . It feels like a razor sharp track setting time machine . The speed you reach are getting  frightening ( to me anyway  )

The GT4 is more dramatic . The noise is more brutal , the car feels much lighter  ( if only the GT3 could feel like that !!! ), it pulls strongly , the balance is superb ( I personally prefer a heavier back as in the Gt3 ) . Probably more fun , but not in the same league as a GT3 .

I did not like the '' blips'' on the downshifts . I like to '' blip'' myself and felt them intrusive  . Maybe I would get used to them after a while . It does allow you to do very fast downshifts  .

So, I did find it very fun , but maybe in the long run one could feel that he reaches his limits quicker in the GT4 . In the GT3 there is probably a very long way to go until you get to the limits and master fully that car.

The GT4 is a great ' toy ' ( not to be taken lightly )  , the GT3 is a more serious, faster older cousin..

Great to hear your perspective!  With regard to the downshift blips, this is something that is normally off (default setting) and has to be activated with the button.  So, you can easily do blipping yourself.

--

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they differ much and which one did you like better, if any? 

--

Porsche 911 GT3 - Guards Red 997 MKII Clubsport

Thanks for the views, pics and vid - makes me ache for mine even more

Spent an hour at the dealers today - confirmed that I'm ok for the LWBs & CS as my spec was submitted prior to 9 May, they had another put in this week and it had the LWBs declined.

Still haven't made a final decision on the colour - though need to do so by next Wed if I was to get PTS as they need 3 months before build to sort it. They had the UK press car on the lot in racing yellow (current spec) but got to see a 918 in Mexico. They are just getting a sample of Voodoo for Monday and then will decide. Spoke with the UK vehicle planning team - only 27 cars of 100ish specced ordered in yellow, but more in Riviera and Voodoo, interesting the amount of folks in the UK who've jumped on the PTS option. Also had a good look at a 997GT3 in Viper, whilst initially a serious option for me having seeing it in the changing light conditions I don't think it'll work on the GT4 somehow...

So, Oct build for me... but then have to allow a 10 week delay due to LWB/CS and PTS, so car probably a Jan build... new UK plate come out on Mar 1 and by coincidence that's my birthday too.... s hopefully a really happy birthday for me in 2016.

So, Bluelines, keep posting the thoughts, vids and pics... and for me... well it's sunny.. the 987 Spyder is parked outside.. it's time for a blast.....

Gauss:

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they differ much and which one did you like better, if any? 

--

Porsche 911 GT3 - Guards Red 997 MKII Clubsport

 

I was busy with a lot of things on my short time in the car . So, I did not have my 100% attention on trying to feel the differences in the steering feel .

But , basically, I found them to be very similar .

A friend who also tried the car, was commenting that he found the GT4 to be sharper .

If there is a difference , it is small and will not be a decision maker at to buy one or the other .

--

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

Gnil:

Gauss:

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they differ much and which one did you like better, if any?

I was busy with a lot of things on my short time in the car . So, I did not have my 100% attention on trying to feel the differences in the steering feel .

But , basically, I found them to be very similar .

 

What about both new cars compared to the hydraulic steering in your 997.2?

--

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

Grant:

Gnil:

Gauss:

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they differ much and which one did you like better, if any?

I was busy with a lot of things on my short time in the car . So, I did not have my 100% attention on trying to feel the differences in the steering feel .

But , basically, I found them to be very similar .

 

What about both new cars compared to the hydraulic steering in your 997.2?

--

 

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

 

A lot heavier in the GT3/GT4 , but so much more precise . You do feel conected with the wheels

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

DaveGordon:

WAY:

Great pics and video Bluelines. Keen to hear Dave's view of it relative to GT3.

I didn't actually get around to going out in it.. :-(

At Scuderia we switch  Want to try yours too on the track.

2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White

Gnil:

Gauss:

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they differ much and which one did you like better, if any? 

--

Porsche 911 GT3 - Guards Red 997 MKII Clubsport

 

I was busy with a lot of things on my short time in the car . So, I did not have my 100% attention on trying to feel the differences in the steering feel .

But , basically, I found them to be very similar .

A friend who also tried the car, was commenting that he found the GT4 to be sharper .

If there is a difference , it is small and will not be a decision maker at to buy one or the other .

--

 

 997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm

 

Thanks 

Porsche 911 GT3 - Guards Red 997 MKII Clubsport

bluelines:

DaveGordon:

WAY:

Great pics and video Bluelines. Keen to hear Dave's view of it relative to GT3.

I didn't actually get around to going out in it.. :-(

At Scuderia we switch  Want to try yours too on the track.

Heh, sure ;-)

2011 987S, 1964 Type 1

Gnil:

Grant:

Gnil:

Gauss:

Gnil, can you tell us something about the steering feel in both cars. Do they 

 

What about both new cars compared to the hydraulic steering in your 997.2?

--

 

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

 

A lot heavier in the GT3/GT4 , but so much more precise . You do feel conected with the wheels

Not sure if it's new, but Sport PASM mode adds weight to the steering when in sport mode. It's lighter in normal mode.

2011 987S, 1964 Type 1

FWIW, Andy thought turn-in was better on the GT4.  Supposedly, mechanically the front ends are identical (Preuninger) and from my previous Boxster vs 911 experience I think that difference comes from the weight balance.  The 991 certainly feels more 'mid-engined' than the earlier generations so I think it comes down to if you prefer the weight management side of 911-driving or not.  I doubt one or either is better or faster than the other in that respect - just a preference based on driving style.

2011 987S, 1964 Type 1

DaveGordon:

FWIW, Andy thought turn-in was better on the GT4.  Supposedly, mechanically the front ends are identical (Preuninger) and from my previous Boxster vs 911 experience I think that difference comes from the weight balance.  The 991 certainly feels more 'mid-engined' than the earlier generations so I think it comes down to if you prefer the weight management side of 911-driving or not.  I doubt one or either is better or faster than the other in that respect - just a preference based on driving style.

+1

I also think any difference is down to the weight balance. My old Boxster felt like GT4, not just quite as sharp and precise, but still the same behaviour at turn-in.

Edit: Maybe the weight difference might make a change though? Gnil seemed to think so.
--

2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White

DaveGordon:

FWIW, Andy thought turn-in was better on the GT4.  Supposedly, mechanically the front ends are identical (Preuninger) and from my previous Boxster vs 911 experience I think that difference comes from the weight balance.  The 991 certainly feels more 'mid-engined' than the earlier generations so I think it comes down to if you prefer the weight management side of 911-driving or not.  I doubt one or either is better or faster than the other in that respect - just a preference based on driving style.

The technical term for it is "polar moment of inertia". Mid-engined cars tend to have lower polar moments of inertia than those with the engine nearer either end of the car, resulting in them being able to react more nimbly to changes in direction. 

It can also mean though, that they can also more easily take you by surprise when you push them to their limits, as they do not signal their intent to give way at one or both ends as early or as clearly. 

fritz

Did you "miss" PDK ? I started to drive mine in manual and intend to try this also next week on the track. Though I loved the PDK in the beginning, like in city traffic, I seem not to have adjusted fully with the gear changes - also in manual I sometimes do not feel fully connected - does this make sense to you or anybody ?

d997h:

Did you "miss" PDK ? I started to drive mine in manual and intend to try this also next week on the track. Though I loved the PDK in the beginning, like in city traffic, I seem not to have adjusted fully with the gear changes - also in manual I sometimes do not feel fully connected - does this make sense to you or anybody ?

Did you intend to say you do not always feel fully connected in automatic mode, maybe, rather than manual? 
That way round it would make sense to me. 

fritz

fritz:

d997h:

Did you "miss" PDK ? I started to drive mine in manual and intend to try this also next week on the track. Though I loved the PDK in the beginning, like in city traffic, I seem not to have adjusted fully with the gear changes - also in manual I sometimes do not feel fully connected - does this make sense to you or anybody ?

Did you intend to say you do not always feel fully connected in automatic mode, maybe, rather than manual? 
That way round it would make sense to me. 

I think he means that PDK even in manual never quite feels as fully connected as a real manual.

I was at PEC Silverstone this week having a drive of a manual 991GTS, which was pretty damn good. Then I had a go in a PDK 991GTS. Yes the PDK is fast, very fast but even in manual mode the car just lacked the same feeling of connection for me - it just isn't the same and I didn't like it Im afraid.  I'd love to experience PDK-S just to see if its capable of bridging the gap, but until then I will be sticking with real manuals again.

Bring on the manual GT4!

Current - Aston V12 Vantage, Morning Frost White, Buckets, Manual

On Order - Cayman GT4, Racing Yellow, LWB

Adam2S:

fritz:

d997h:

Did you "miss" PDK ? I started to drive mine in manual and intend to try this also next week on the track. Though I loved the PDK in the beginning, like in city traffic, I seem not to have adjusted fully with the gear changes - also in manual I sometimes do not feel fully connected - does this make sense to you or anybody ?

Did you intend to say you do not always feel fully connected in automatic mode, maybe, rather than manual? 
That way round it would make sense to me. 

I think he means that PDK even in manual never quite feels as fully connected as a real manual.

I was at PEC Silverstone this week having a drive of a manual 991GTS, which was pretty damn good. Then I had a go in a PDK 991GTS. Yes the PDK is fast, very fast but even in manual mode the car just lacked the same feeling of connection for me - it just isn't the same and I didn't like it Im afraid.  I'd love to experience PDK-S just to see if its capable of bridging the gap, but until then I will be sticking with real manuals again.

Bring on the manual GT4!

Ah yes, I get it now.    I know that feeling.  

fritz

there is no substituting a proper manual on the open roads. 

BMW 1 M + C63 (gone).   997.2 GT3

Thanks for sharing your experience - yeah, that's what I meant, the PDK is fast in manual, but, to me, it is always like I am faster with  my "thinking" and "somebody else" completing the gear change. All this may sound weird, but that is my sense of not being connected fully... However, for long distance driving on the autobahn the automatic mode is very comfortable...so, I guess I need to get some more km on the car to get more used to it. 

d997h:

Did you "miss" PDK ? I started to drive mine in manual and intend to try this also next week on the track. Though I loved the PDK in the beginning, like in city traffic, I seem not to have adjusted fully with the gear changes - also in manual I sometimes do not feel fully connected - does this make sense to you or anybody ?

In summary, no.

I would have been quicker with PDK, no doubt. Not only because I would have had the correct gear, but also because I could have focused 100% on position and speed, without the gears in mind.

It did take a few laps to get back into manual track driving, to be conscious about the gear changes and that third pedal  After a while I did not think about it, just happened automatically by "instinct". That is when it got real fun!

With PDK you just don't need to care and I found it more fun to care, even if I was slower. This was an interesting experience. To reiterate from my review, I do believe that a manual gearbox was the right choice for the GT4. It would not have been the same experience with PDK, because the manual gearbox is an important contributor to the mechanical and raw feel the car has.

This car rocks! 

2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White

By the way Bluelines, maybe you should update you signature, since the mention of the GT4 disappeared with the data loss. 

It is unbelievable ! Your excitement about this car seems to be "glowing" out of my iPad ! I hope to report something similar in two weeks time ! 

Ziggy:

By the way Bluelines, maybe you should update you signature, since the mention of the GT4 disappeared with the data loss. 

Voila!  

2015 981 Cayman GT4 | White | Full Bucket Seats | Sport Chrono
2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | Sport Chrono | SPASM

Dark Blue Metallic with a great Reg plate!

Current - Aston V12 Vantage, Morning Frost White, Buckets, Manual

On Order - Cayman GT4, Racing Yellow, LWB

Nice!

73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

Adam2S:

Dark Blue Metallic with a great Reg plate!

I've never liked dark blue as a car colour, but I'd make an exception for that car. 

fritz

fritz:

Adam2S:

Dark Blue Metallic with a great Reg plate!

I've never liked dark blue as a car colour, but I'd make an exception for that car. 

Sky loves triple blue dark metallic, but Sun is still glad the GT4 is coming in Silver

Recently spotted!

http://www.autogespot.co.uk/porsche-981-cayman-gt4/2015/06/20

Just who is this mystery owner?

Current - Aston V12 Vantage, Morning Frost White, Buckets, Manual

On Order - Cayman GT4, Racing Yellow, LWB