Crown

keithos27:

Aren't "Turbo" models generally geared towards luxury in the Porsche lineup anyway?  If so, I think it makes sense that the sound is a bit quieter.  An option of a Sport Exhaust is always nice, though.

True but I think that 90% of the customers will be happy with the sound, the other 5% would probably prefer a little bit more sound and the remaining 5% a really loud sound.

If I don't like the sound at all, I will probably opt for an aftermarket exhaust like Akrapovic for example. Not cheap though. I'm not a fan of aftermarket stuff, not at all but the exhaust should be OK if it is a high quality product. Just keep in mind possible warranty issues but with an exhaust, issues are less likely than with other mods, especially ECU tuning (which I really really wouldn't recommend for the new Turbo S for various reasons I cannot unveil).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Life is one....and this report make me not easy to sleep.white with red/black interior,bucket seats....

damn!

997TT RS Tuning stage II(sold),2011 Cayenne Turbo

RC: 

If I don't like the sound at all, I will probably opt for an aftermarket exhaust like Akrapovic for example. Not cheap though. I'm not a fan of aftermarket stuff, not at all but the exhaust should be OK if it is a high quality product. Just keep in mind possible warranty issues but with an exhaust, issues are less likely than with other mods, especially ECU tuning (which I really really wouldn't recommend for the new Turbo S for various reasons I cannot unveil).

An aftermarket exhaust leads to the loss of the guarantee. I would not not risk that with a 200k car. The 991 series is not known for having bad engines, but I know at least one 991 with an massive engine failure - unfortunately mine. I dont know what Porsche would say when you come up with a blown up engine and an aftermarket exhaust attached. I can imagine that there is some discussion potential. To avoid that, I would not modify a brand new car, especially with that price tag.

Thomas

TomSilver:

RC: 

If I don't like the sound at all, I will probably opt for an aftermarket exhaust like Akrapovic for example. Not cheap though. I'm not a fan of aftermarket stuff, not at all but the exhaust should be OK if it is a high quality product. Just keep in mind possible warranty issues but with an exhaust, issues are less likely than with other mods, especially ECU tuning (which I really really wouldn't recommend for the new Turbo S for various reasons I cannot unveil).

An aftermarket exhaust leads to the loss of the guarantee. I would not not risk that with a 200k car. The 991 series is not known for having bad engines, but I know at least one 991 with an massive engine failure - unfortunately mine. I dont know what Porsche would say when you come up with a blown up engine and an aftermarket exhaust attached. I can imagine that there is some discussion potential. To avoid that, I would not modify a brand new car, especially with that price tag.

Thomas

I absolutely agree. I would wait with an aftermarket exhaust for at least 10k km and I would make sure that it is a high quality exhaust like Akrapovic or Cargraphic (which gives Porsche less leverage in case on a serious issue related to the engine). From a technical point of view, nothing really speaks against a high quality sport exhaust on the 991 Turbo S but of course Porsche would never admit that...I guess.

In the end, Porsche would have to prove that the sport exhaust caused the damage or was part of the problem and with a high quality exhaust, I really don't see that happen. I wouldn't however start experimenting with x-pipes, cat removals or 100 cell cats, this would surely void the warranty.

Personally, I would go with Akrapovic or Cargraphic but for now, I am going to stick to the original setup until I get bored. It is good to know that I have an option though.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

RC:

SoCal Alan:

RC:

A Ferrari driver won't enjoy this sound, this is pretty sure but someone coming from the 997 Turbo S will surely appreciate the sound improvement, especially from the interior. Oh, when you do not switch to Sport or Sport Plus mode, the sound symposer is closed and at speeds over 240 kph, you only hear the wind, the car can be comfortable too.

RC, is this "sound symposer" only supposed to be heard inside the vehicle?  Or is it a mechanical device, kind of like the PSE in the 997 (ie., baffles), which would allow the sound to be heard both inside and outside of the vehicle.

The sound symposer kind of "opens" a "duct" from the engine bay to the interior. The whining/hauling sound at higher rpm, which is actually pretty cool, cannot be heard outside the car but the hissing outside the car when fully accelerating is really loud, very loud and quite noticeable. Also the Turbo (non S) has a less loud whining/hauling sound in the upper rev range, another argument for the Turbo S.

What the occupants hear through the duct is mostly induction noise, not exhaust. On the 991 I find it irritating because you cannot close the duct when you prefer a quiet cruise. I am glad that on the Turbo it is not continuously on but again you may wish to use Sport without the noise. The duct should be given an independent switch.

"Form follows function"

reginos:

 

What the occupants hear through the duct is mostly induction noise, not exhaust. On the 991 I find it irritating because you cannot close the duct when you prefer a quiet cruise. I am glad that on the Turbo it is not continuously on but again you may wish to use Sport without the noise. The duct should be given an independent switch.

I'm not sure but I heard that Porsche is working on individual sport chrono settings, like I and other users suggested in previous posts. I think however that the current "Sport" setting is just fine, it activates the sound symposer but it doesn't make the suspension stiffer, this happens only in "Sport Plus" mode. This setup is new for the 991 Turbo/Turbo S.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Why not to be able to drive in Sport and without the symposer, if you so wish?

All these parameters should be independently controlled by the driver either through buttons or better through the PCM.

--

"Form follows function"

reginos:

Why not to be able to drive in Sport and without the symposer, if you so wish?

All these parameters should be independently controlled by the driver either through buttons or better through the PCM.

--

"Form follows function"

They are working on that according to rumors but it may take some while until it is going to be available. Also I think they are preparing a nice surprise in that domain to satisfy gadget/tech lovers but I better shut up now.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

RC:

keithos27:

Aren't "Turbo" models generally geared towards luxury in the Porsche lineup anyway?  If so, I think it makes sense that the sound is a bit quieter.  An option of a Sport Exhaust is always nice, though.

True but I think that 90% of the customers will be happy with the sound, the other 5% would probably prefer a little bit more sound and the remaining 5% a really loud sound.

If I don't like the sound at all, I will probably opt for an aftermarket exhaust like Akrapovic for example. Not cheap though. I'm not a fan of aftermarket stuff, not at all but the exhaust should be OK if it is a high quality product. Just keep in mind possible warranty issues but with an exhaust, issues are less likely than with other mods, especially ECU tuning (which I really really wouldn't recommend for the new Turbo S for various reasons I cannot unveil).

RC, I agree.  And I'm the kind of person that never modifies my car, hence why I always suffer with paying for so many options from the factory (and partly why I'm looking at getting the Turbo S as well).  :)  I'm sure the exhaust will be loud enough for my preferences.

RC:

Enjoy (keep in mind that this is in South Africa, very hot, mule testing...just enjoy the video).

http://brightcove04.brightcove.com/21/67005934001/201307/318/67005934001_2538610558001_PorscheTurbo-spa.mp4

I know it´s not acurate but from the video according to speedometer it made 3,4sec to 100Kph and 11,4 to 200Kph!!!

J.Seven

Oh tell us more about what us tech gadget geeks can expect!!! :)

J.Seven:

RC:

Enjoy (keep in mind that this is in South Africa, very hot, mule testing...just enjoy the video).

http://brightcove04.brightcove.com/21/67005934001/201307/318/67005934001_2538610558001_PorscheTurbo-spa.mp4

 

I know it´s not acurate but from the video according to speedometer it made 3,4sec to 100Kph and 11,4 to 200Kph!!!

J.Seven

The video has been made in a very dusty, hot and humid atmosphere, also there could have been other issues since this was a test mule. Like I said before, do not read too much into this mule video, it was made for entertainment purposes only, not as a precise portrayal of the performance.

The final product will achieve 0-100 kph in 3.1 seconds and 0-200 kph in 10.3 seconds under all weather/driving conditions (which in reality probably translates into better real life performance).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

I thought it was 2.9?

keithos27:

I thought it was 2.9?

I am talking about the factory claims (the ones written on paper ). If you are referring to 2.9, maybe you mean the official 0-60 mph time. The 3.1 claim is for 0-62 mph (100 kph).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Ah okay yes I was referring to 0-60 mph as stated on the Porsche US site?

I know the Rt35 have better times in Michelins testrack than the 991 Turbo. Already confirmed and tested :) 991 Turbo does not hold a candle to the Ruf Rt35.

RC:

TomSilver:

RC: The engine sound is a little bit disappointing if you compare it to the 991 Carrera S Porsche Sport Exhaust or any other sports car for that matter. 

I do not understand why Porsche does not want the Turbo to have a more emotional sound. I have a 991S and I like the sound, but it is nothing compared to a Ferrari. My daily driver  is a Panamera GTS  and I am enjoying every mile with it. I would die for a 911 with that kind of sound quality. 

Sound is for me a major part of the driving experience. Will I pay 200k for a 911 with the typical muted Turbo sound? No. It can be faster than light, I would not buy it. 

Are you sure that there is no sport exhaust option?

It is not possible because of the VTG chargers, not that they don't want it. They seem to have issues getting it certified and if you wonder why tuners can, the answer is simple: They do not have the same legal requirements like car manufacturers. Why didn't Porsche forget about the VTG chargers then? Well...they have huge advantages and Porsche really has now a lot of experience with them, the turbo lag is practically non-existent and it would be a pity to throw this all away.

Yes, aftermarket exhausts will still sound OK and no, Porsche will not offer a sport exhaust option. Sorry.

Also, it is my understanding that most Turbo customers (not me for sure) seem to prefer a more decent sound.

However, the sound of the new 991 Turbo S has been greatly improved vs. the 997 Turbo S sound and while it may not sound like the typical sport exhaust sound of the 991 Carrera and/or competition, it is a very loud and special sound. Also, in the upper rev range, the whining/hauling sound is quite nice and loud, everything more would be quite uncomfortable (not that I wouldn't like it).

 

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Regarding your comment  " it is my understanding that most Turbo customers (not me for sure) seem to prefer a more decent sound" I am one of those individuals!  The TT and TTS models are unique in the high end car world in providing massive acceleration without the enormous noise that similar cars produce.   In an urban environment it is borderline rude/obnoxious to blast out 110 ++ DB of sound rattling windows and startling people around you.  I currently have a 12C and take care where I floor it.  The sound is quite massive and not saying I don't like it but can't help cringing a bit when a lot of people are around.  My ferrari's were even worst.  With both brands you have to get up in the rpm's to develop any meaningful torque and be pushed back into the seat and you are really putting out a screech/bellow when you do that.  Particularly with Ferrari's I believe one reason for such low average miles is the noise gets old after a while and becomes tiring - after an hour or so you start asking yourself if you are still enjoying yourself.

So, my personal hope is that Porsche will always keep the noise within bounds and spend their energy improving the quality of the exhaust note and not the level of it. I am pretty sure the majority of their customers feel this way as well and Porsche knows this.

Super Darius:

Life is one....and this report make me not easy to sleep.white with red/black interior,bucket seats....

damn!

I think you have fallen love with the Russian Model..... Turbo S ... White outside but Red inside.

Conrad2:

RC:

TomSilver:

RC: The engine sound is a little bit disappointing if you compare it to the 991 Carrera S Porsche Sport Exhaust or any other sports car for that matter. 

I do not understand why Porsche does not want the Turbo to have a more emotional sound. I have a 991S and I like the sound, but it is nothing compared to a Ferrari. My daily driver  is a Panamera GTS  and I am enjoying every mile with it. I would die for a 911 with that kind of sound quality. 

Sound is for me a major part of the driving experience. Will I pay 200k for a 911 with the typical muted Turbo sound? No. It can be faster than light, I would not buy it. 

Are you sure that there is no sport exhaust option?

It is not possible because of the VTG chargers, not that they don't want it. They seem to have issues getting it certified and if you wonder why tuners can, the answer is simple: They do not have the same legal requirements like car manufacturers. Why didn't Porsche forget about the VTG chargers then? Well...they have huge advantages and Porsche really has now a lot of experience with them, the turbo lag is practically non-existent and it would be a pity to throw this all away.

Yes, aftermarket exhausts will still sound OK and no, Porsche will not offer a sport exhaust option. Sorry.

Also, it is my understanding that most Turbo customers (not me for sure) seem to prefer a more decent sound.

However, the sound of the new 991 Turbo S has been greatly improved vs. the 997 Turbo S sound and while it may not sound like the typical sport exhaust sound of the 991 Carrera and/or competition, it is a very loud and special sound. Also, in the upper rev range, the whining/hauling sound is quite nice and loud, everything more would be quite uncomfortable (not that I wouldn't like it).

 

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Regarding your comment  " it is my understanding that most Turbo customers (not me for sure) seem to prefer a more decent sound" I am one of those individuals!  The TT and TTS models are unique in the high end car world in providing massive acceleration without the enormous noise that similar cars produce.   In an urban environment it is borderline rude/obnoxious to blast out 110 ++ DB of sound rattling windows and startling people around you.  I currently have a 12C and take care where I floor it.  The sound is quite massive and not saying I don't like it but can't help cringing a bit when a lot of people are around.  My ferrari's were even worst.  With both brands you have to get up in the rpm's to develop any meaningful torque and be pushed back into the seat and you are really putting out a screech/bellow when you do that.  Particularly with Ferrari's I believe one reason for such low average miles is the noise gets old after a while and becomes tiring - after an hour or so you start asking yourself if you are still enjoying yourself.

So, my personal hope is that Porsche will always keep the noise within bounds and spend their energy improving the quality of the exhaust note and not the level of it. I am pretty sure the majority of their customers feel this way as well and Porsche knows this.

Agreed!

JimFlat6:

Super Darius:

Life is one....and this report make me not easy to sleep.white with red/black interior,bucket seats....

damn!

I think you have fallen love with the Russian Model..... Turbo S ... White outside but Red inside.

  i must go back to school..hahaha

997TT RS Tuning stage II(sold),2011 Cayenne Turbo

Christian,

For you, three 991's, foreground basaltschwarz, right is GT silber, left background Agate grau.

The color is very hard to capture, especially under the extreme lighting conditions of a showroom. I tried some more shots, but nevere really succeeded. This pic comes closest to reality. It is a relatively light color grey, lighter than I expected it to be. I think I would opt for a slightly darker, like the old sealskion grey or so. However, you stated that you feared that black would make the accents and design features of the turbo disappear too much, so in that case a lighter grey would make sense I guess.

-Joost-

Thank you but I think that the Turbo S really looks good in white, I saw almost every color (not Rhodium Silver unfortunately...) live, incl. black (not sure if it was plain black or basalt black) and agate grey and I liked white most. The car has a certain presence in white, for those who want to attract attention, I would recommend racing yellow (better than red in my opinion).

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

GustavGustav:

I know the Rt35 have better times in Michelins testrack than the 991 Turbo. Already confirmed and tested :) 991 Turbo does not hold a candle to the Ruf Rt35.

Wow, you compare a tuned car with a standard production car, which also has much more power. 

Does this make sense to you? 

A little comparison: Despite the fact, that the RUF Rt35 costs more than a Ferrari F12 in Germany and 76k EUR more than the standard 991 Turbo S, the Rt35 has 630 hp, 70hp more. Still...from 0-100 kph, I bet with you, it won't beat the new 991 Turbo S. 

Also on the track, I would be very careful with false claims: The rear axle steering and the new PTM system, both are not available on the Rt35, make a huge difference. Even if Alois will probably compensate for that with a sportier chassis and more horses than he claims on paper, the Rt35 will have a rough time to beat the 991 Turbo S. Unless of course RUF delivers the car with UHP tires, which is very likely but Porsche delivers the 991 Turbo S with street tires and the 7:27 claim on the Nordschleife has been achieved with these (PZero).

Most drivers who get a Rt35 or a 991 Turbo S for that matter are not professional drivers and an amateur driver will always be faster on the track in the new 991 Turbo S due to the rear axle steering and the hugely improved PTM/PSM system. Even with PSM turned off, the new 991 Turbo S handles very easy, very precise and with no surprises.Turn PSM off on the Rt35 and...good luck. 

Also I wonder how Ruf copes with that high torque figure and PDK because PDK is not made for that kind of torque, not even the improved PDK from the new 991 Turbo S and ZF does not offer a "stronger" version. 

Btw: I read you post on Teamspeed about the Michelin claim. Fun part is: Porsche has approved the PZero as a street tire and the Dunlop UHP (the same used on the GT3) as a sport tire. No Michelin is approved yet, so I don't know what you were referring to. Did Alois tell you a nice story at lunch? 

I really respect Alois Ruf and his work, I really do but he is a business man too and he wants to sell his products. 

--

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

GustavGustav:

I know the Rt35 have better times in Michelins testrack than the 991 Turbo. Already confirmed and tested :) 991 Turbo does not hold a candle to the Ruf Rt35.

I heard exactly the opposite. Go figure.

When a reputable source gets a hold of an RT35 and tests it in controlled conditions I'll be inclined to believe it. Until then, it's just typical tuner hearsay.

RC:

Thank you but I think that the Turbo S really looks good in white, I saw almost every color (not Rhodium Silver unfortunately...) live, incl. black (not sure if it was plain black or basalt black) and agate grey and I liked white most. The car has a certain presence in white, for those who want to attract attention, I would recommend racing yellow (better than red in my opinion).

Haha, I posted the picture and after that found out you'd already seen them in real life.
Must have been great seeing all the colors together. I understand you got to drive the car as well? Any pictures you can share?

They didn't have much special cars on the showroom floor sadly. Only found that it was way more crowded (with cars) than normal... looked like they have a lot of second hand 991's to sell. 

So white huh?  And what interior options were you able to see RC?

Joost:

 I understand you got to drive the car as well? Any pictures you can share?

They didn't have much special cars on the showroom floor sadly. Only found that it was way more crowded (with cars) than normal... looked like they have a lot of second hand 991's to sell. 

Sorry, no pictures (for obvious reasons ) and I really said everything I could say.

The exterior colors I saw were white, racing yellow, black (not sure if plain black or basalt black), sapphire blue (I think), dark blue met., agate grey met. and a a silver color I couldn't identify. In my opinion, white and racing yellow looked the best but of course people have different tastes in colors.

The white car had a black/Carrera red interior (very very nice), the agate grey met. car had a black/luxor-beige interior and I also saw a black interior but thats it. The luxor-beige interior looks very elegant (not sporty), the black/Carrera red interior looks sporty but may be a bit too much for people. I didn't see an agate grey and black/Carrera red interior, same combo I ordered but I've been told that the combo fits just perfectly. I really liked the black/Carrera red interior, I just can't say it often enough but white really seems to go best with that interior. Maybe black too.

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

Gustav, welcome. Now I know who you are. 

Remember that tuned M6 from Manhart Tuning (stage 4) in one of your videos? A car magazine just recently tested the M5 with the same stage 4 tuning. The results were not impressive (0-200 kph in 10.8 seconds) for a 700+ hp car. Also this kit is NOT street legal in Germany, for export only.

You shouldn't trust tuners and their claims too much but I also have to say that Alois Ruf is a very nice guy and his products are amazing, no doubt about it. I would wait however for real life test results with certified equipment. I prefer Sport Auto because they also recently started to dyno the car, they also check the chassis settings for "anomalies". 

Your videos are amazing and entertaining but the problem is that, especially on turbo charged cars, the power can be easily tweaked before such an event, to make a certain product look better. So while I enjoy the videos, I don't exactly trust the results. 

Still...good to see you here, it is an honor. 

RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S (Sept. 2013), Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

i changed my order from rhodium silver to dark blue ... ... and you saw the dark blue on the turbo S in real life.. how was it ,, does it cover all the Airintake contrast ? like on black does ?  

thanks 

RC:

The white car had a black/Carrera red interior (very very nice),

I really liked the black/Carrera red interior, I just can't say it often enough but white really seems to go best with that interior.

 are you changing to white?

glad you like some carrera red!

IMO, white works because of the contrast. Darker colours such as agate grey and black do not provide sufficient contrast, and compete, rather than complement each other.