Burning coal in china   ---- pointless article

we are not China and we can choose to produce our electricity in many clean ways, AS I HAVE POSTED IN OTHER THREADS, until now we have chosen to be stupid in our lack of a coherent national energy policy. Keep voting for folks who care more about abortion and ghey marriage and we can be as dirty as the chinese and in a very distant 2nd place.

This just in: Tesla to build electric Mercedes-Benz

Tesla and Daimler are set to collaborate on a new electric Mercedes-Benz. According to Gigaom.com, the fourth-quarter earnings report released by Tesla earlier this week revealed the company is set to supply a full powertrain for an unnamed electric Mercedes-Benz in the near future. Those components include a motor, transmission, inverter and all of the software necessary to keep the car whirring along. Funds from the deal are supposed to begin trickling in by the second quarter of this year, though no details about production timing or volume were available in the report.

The two automakers aren't strangers. Daimler is an investor in the small electric vehicle manufacturer, and Tesla already supplies battery packs for the low-production Smart ED. Mercedes-Benz made waves at the 2011 Frankfurt Motor Show when it unveiled the B-Class E-Cell Plus. At the time, the vehicle boasted a lithium-ion battery sourced from a joint venture between Daimler and Evonik, though it's certainly possible the German automaker has changed course on the five-door. Then again, the B-Class E-Cell Plus was an extended-range hybrid, whereas the Tesla earnings report seems to hint toward a full-electric model. Consider us curious.

Source: autoblog.com


 

Chevy Volt sales so slow, GM idles production

Chevy Volt sales should be perking up with high gas prices. Instead, General Motors has decided to stop producing the Chevy Volt for five weeks.

Volt sales have been so slow this year, the company needs to adjust production to demand. And so far, Volt demand has fallen well short of original expectations. Back when GM launched the Chevy Volt, it boldly targeted sales of 10,000 in 2011 and 60,000 in 2012. Last year, GM sold 7,671 Volts and just 1,626 this year

Why have sales been slow?

 Some of it is due to the slow ramp up in sales last year. While the entire country saw ads for the Volt, the car was sold most of the year in select markets. Then the controversy and investigation into Volt battery fires left a cloud hanging over the electric car.

But the biggest factor may be the price of the Volt. At $33,500, the Volt is not cheap. Yes, for that price owners can get impressive mileage and pay a fraction what others are paying for gas. Still, with 22 models for sale offering at least 40 MPG, a lot of buyers looking for fuel efficiency are content to buy a hybrid or gas powered car for well under $30,000.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/Latest-News-Wires/2012/0303/Chevy-Volt-sales-so-slow-GM-idles-production

The part about it not making sense compared to cars that get almost the same MPG for le$$ sure sounds familiar....

hahaha well it's a terrible car! I am not surprised at all.

Meant to post it in the Volt thread, sorry for the duplicate post.

Except for the people who are happy to pay extra for the novelty & the badges on the car the demand just isn't there even with record priced gas.

STRADALE:

 even with record priced gas.

 

Yes, almost record priced gas EVEN AS the US became a NET EXPORTER of gasoline for the first time in decades in december. The Drill, Baby, Drill Mantra of the FoxNews junkies is a flawed logic. Oil is a fungible, international commodity, that willl continue to climb in price as long as it is the major source of energy for the planet and a major source of cash for the greedy thru speculation on the nymex.

Drilling here may make a few individuals/companies wealthy but it will do no good for the general economy (under current rules) The US economy needs cheap stable energy to flourish. That is not oil. For now that involves a combined approach with many different sources that are part of a national energy plan regulated similar to Utilities. The goal is cheap energy,  not windfall profits for a few, because cheap energy will bring back the prosperous economy of generations past, where real jobs/industries will grow.

It's all doable and proven NOW. Only the lack of capable leadership in Washington has prevented the change. Obummer has failed miserably on this. Natural gas as I have predicted is slowly proceeding to replace diesel in trucking, electric is the way to go for cars despite the volt headlines above.

re: Tesla bricking  

http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/307483/20120301/tesla-model-s-battery-will-brick.htm

Coal to Gas progress -

http://blogs.wsj.com/venturecapital/2012/02/20/bluer-skies-for-beijing-u-s-start-up-strikes-1-25-billion-deal-to-turn-chinese-co...

CO2 + sunlight (from the coal plant^^ ) = diesel

http://www.electricenergyonline.com/?page=show_news&rss=1&id=163396

and of course once the previously mentioned breakthru's in solar panels become a mass produced reality (5 years) power for cars and home needs will be an after-thought.

multiplying like rabbits, previously posted a pic of a nice blue one charging up and then saw this one a week ago, saw red, white, and black yesterday,

The Opel Ampera, Euro equivalent of the Volt is doing well here too.. in Germany at least that is.

I've only seen one white one so far in the wild... doing 110km/h on the Autobahn in the left lane btw

nice video on the volt functionality

finally 2 respected guys are pushing the plan that should have been enacted many years ago and Joe Kernen has to be the dumbest phuck to ever get a degree from mit.

W8MM:

racerx:

... energy for all lighting, heating, cooling, and transportation needs of the middle-middle class and above families will be free and unlimited. Killing the need for even domestic energy producers.

You seem to have forgotten amortizing the capital expended over the useful service life and maintenance costs.  Free is a bit of a stretch, don't you think?

What will electricity cost per kWh in your scenario?  $0.00?

--

Mike

Carrera GT + Tesla Roadster 1.5 + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T + GT3 RS 4.0

...or transmission costs...many components to the price of electricity.  What would the price of bread be if the price of wheat went to zero?  Pretty much the same as now!  But I do like your point in general.  And we can use energy more efficiently from a centralized generating source.  I just saw this recently about pure electric and plugin hybrids:  http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-04-16/electric-cars-cost-1-200-a-year-less-to-run-study-says - electrics could save us $1,200 a year?

Also, I have read through this whole thread and do not see mention of Toyota's 50 million investment in Tesla and the upcoming RAV4EV Tesla sourced battery and motor: http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/reviews/hybrid-electric/2012-toyota-rav4-ev-prototype-test-drive, but maybe I missed it.

GM Austin:

W8MM:

racerx:

... energy for all lighting, heating, cooling, and transportation needs of the middle-middle class and above families will be free and unlimited. Killing the need for even domestic energy producers.

You seem to have forgotten amortizing the capital expended over the useful service life and maintenance costs.  Free is a bit of a stretch, don't you think?

What will electricity cost per kWh in your scenario?  $0.00?

--

Mike

Carrera GT + Tesla Roadster 1.5 + Panamera Turbo +  BMW Z8 + BMW 3.0 CSi + Bentley Arnage T + GT3 RS 4.0

...or transmission costs..

No transmission costs when the power is coming off your roof or a backyard array. My point regarding electricity in this thread and transportation also to a lesser extent is that ENERGY will become so cheap as to be just about free. The technology and economies of scale within 5 years should make solar energy dirt cheap.

Despite the stupidity of our political leaders dirt cheap energy is on the way and with this many of our current problems will slowly melt away, trade deficits, budget deficits, and giving a hoot about the middle east region. If we can get a smart leader who is open to changing the status qou we could really see a bright future. (I'm hoping Romney is the guy)

Recent story I read said that GM has produced 24,000 Volts and are now selling 2,000/month. Very good. Soon Tesla's will be hitting the roads and by the time Solar is a competitive option the model X will be on sale and the cheap volume model will be in development. Sounds like good timing for Tesla.

Here is Elon from 2 days ago on CNBC, host is kinda slow

So hoping these projections are right. It's just a matter of time really, when we will have to turn away from burning fossil fuels like it's 1881.. We've got the technology and sooner or later the general public will catch a grasp for it. As soon as that happens it will become a silly mainstream trend and my early Tesla buy-in will buy me my first Porsche. A mint 993 for $25,000 CAD. It's possible

Seriously though, if Tesla can survive and sell some Model S they have really great cards. They've already got deals with Toyota and MB and so the next few years will be quite tough to stay afloat. I think and hope it is a brand to last and become the new age Ford in the Automotive history books of the future.

The Opel Ampera is selling here too (Volt's German brother).. trying to find actual sales figures still, but seen 3 on the road thus far..

Atzporsche:

The Opel Ampera is selling here too (Volt's German brother).. trying to find actual sales figures still, but seen 3 on the road thus far..

The article I read yesterday included the ampera in the 24,000 produced so far.  Once they get the panels to the right efficiency I will be buying some. It will be turning into a world that we have only seen in movies, where once we don't have to worry about the basics - ENERGY - much more can be accomplished.  (sell your gold, buy and hold tesla and telecomm)

look at this - http://dvice.com/archives/2012/05/telepod-is-a-fu.php

I wanted to discuss more about solar panels, but that was on a different thread; so for this thread I will try to stick closer to electric cars. I had to pass multiple Amish buggies on the highway today. I have great respect for them, but they seriously make electric cars look extremely safe and fast compared to horse drawn buggy.

The electric grid has plenty of excess capacity at night (when cars would charge) and we will eventually be paying for our electricity based upon the time of day of usage (it is coming).

I was really perturbed recently when my daughter told me about a speaker at her school that informed the children about how electric cars were mostly charged from coal burning power plants and still caused pollution. Pooh-poohing the green movement and liberal public education is my job. That was strike one against him. Then promoting mis-information that I wouldn't even use myself was strike two. He could have gone after the pollution from manufacturing the batteries (the soft exposed underbelly of the industry), but apparently wasn't that smart.

I also passed an antique Dodge Challenger with a 426 HEMI engine. That guy and the Amish both have really big (loads of nerve) to risk those vehicles on the highway.

Gladstone:

 they seriously make electric cars look extremely safe and fast compared to horse drawn buggy.

I also passed an antique Dodge Challenger with a 426 HEMI engine. That guy and the Amish both have really big (loads of nerve) to risk those vehicles on the highway.

The Volt has a great safety rating and the Tesla Model S has the best possible rating and will be extremely fast.

But I am responding because of your sighting, today on my bike after leaving the gym I was just cruising along when a stream of traffic came up a little hill in the city, not fast. The last car in the group, a very shiny all Black 599. It sounded very nice and had I not been wiped-out from my workout, I probably would have turned around and followed it to watch it and hear it in the wild.

racerx:

Atzporsche:

The Opel Ampera is selling here too (Volt's German brother).. trying to find actual sales figures still, but seen 3 on the road thus far..

The article I read yesterday included the ampera in the 24,000 produced so far.  Once they get the panels to the right efficiency I will be buying some. It will be turning into a world that we have only seen in movies, where once we don't have to worry about the basics - ENERGY - much more can be accomplished.  (sell your gold, buy and hold tesla and telecomm)

look at this - http://dvice.com/archives/2012/05/telepod-is-a-fu.php

That telepod technology is so cool. Related to this, google search 360 Panorama Camera Ball. It's a new tech that's also quite fun for the outdoors type or whatever. Some cool new stuff coming indeed.

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/05/07/u-s-german-automakers-will-demo-fast-charging-system-at-evs26/

Atzporsche:

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/05/07/u-s-german-automakers-will-demo-fast-charging-system-at-evs26/

Yup, fast-charging in 15 minutes, that will be like Grid- parity for solar in terms of car refueling, roughly the same amount of time to fill up with gasoline or to recharge the battery. Things are going to be changing, for the better, especially if we get the right leadership that can see a great opportunity to get out of the Oil based rut we are in.

Here is the Cadillac version of the Volt scheduled for production late next year, the ELR

Tesla Model S to go on sale in June, 1 month ahead of schedule with 10,000 orders

From Elon

Dear Fellow Shareholders,

We are pleased to report that we have nearly completed all regulatory approvals and certifications required to begin delivery of Model S to our customers in the United States. Thus, we anticipate that initial deliveries will begin in June, ahead of our announced schedule of July.

All aspects of the Model S program remain on track to commence deliveries in June. The Tesla Factory is producing vehicles at a steadily increasing rate, and so far this year we have built about 50 Beta and about 30 Release Candidate prototypes. All these vehicles are dedicated to a comprehensive testing program, including crash and safety testing, systems integration, reliability testing, and quality audits.

Model S has now been fully certified by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the State of California. We have also successfully completed almost all of the crash testing required under the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act using our Release Candidate prototypes. Once we complete and document the tests, we will be able to sell our vehicles in the United States. This leaves us confident we can begin Model S customer deliveries in June, ahead of our announced schedule of July.

I just hope that they have studied Preston Tucker and wish them the best of luck.

Gladstone:

I just hope that they have studied Preston Tucker and wish them the best of luck.

It's tough to decipher your intentions here. I do not know if you want to join the small peanut gallery here who are negative on Tesla and electric cars which consists of -- Fritz, Stradale, William, and Moogle -- wrong as you can get at this point.

Get used to seeing a lot of these around and a lot fewer mercedes and bmw mid-level sedans.

Sorry, I really do need to work on clarity. I think that they are moving into the next generation of transportation and many of the existing companies will work against them in much the same way Tucker was dealt with.

Also regarding safety, I did not intend to impune Tesla or any other serious electric car maker; I meant that even the more 'rinky dink' end of the electric car market is still quite a serious safety improvement over the horse and buggy.

I have had my doubts about batteries, but I figure that they can be recycled.

...my only concern would be: Will they manage to actually (mass-)produce the 10.000+ cars without problems ?...time will tell...

I am waiting for the stock to fall just a little. Gonna be the perfect buy-in in a couple of months - just before the Model S official sale.

This car will be a stunner! There only disadvantage for the time being - people are resistant going into new brands.

Nevertheless - I could see myself in one of those, really beautiful car! Love it!