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    International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

     Discovered by accident this alternative to Hanseat. Almost as old (48th edition), similar format (sectional training + a few sessions of open lapping). Started as a BMW course but it feels like half of the cars are Porsches now. Main differences are:

    - Nordschleife only (no GP track, won't miss it)

    - no fill-the-time buffer sections (GP track, FSZ)

    - no resident instructors in the sections, the only instructors you get are your groups so format is mostly lead and follow, feedback is not as sharp as Hanseat

    - significantly cheaper

    - more free lapping (full afternoon on the 3rd day)

    I was not planning to follow a structured course again, but since Manthey had to cut down their open pitlane day to 10-17.30 instead of 8-17.30 without prior notice, I bailed out and went for this event instead.

    Practice laps allowed me to take my BTG times down by 8 seconds, from 7'53" with Sean Paul Breslin coaching me in the car to 7'44"90 during my exam lap, first thing in the morning with cold tires.

    I've posted videos and data for two laps, the 7'44"90 exam lap and another one in 7'49" in traffic. Interesting to see where time is so hardly gained or easily lost. And still so many things to work on. My exam lap earned me second place of the Routiniers with 32 points behind a fellow swiss Porscheman with 26 points, I think that the judges score much nicer than Hanseat ...

    DISCLAIMER: these are "standard" Racelogic Bridge-To-Gantry times, the Bridge GPS point is too late, and the Gantry end point is too early, so you have to add a few of seconds to transpose in real BTG terms. Easily visible on the videos. Can be fixed using different coordinate files, but not after the fact.

    A few "scenery" pictures here:

     

     

     


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Thanks for the post zeshark. What a great lap! Very interesting to see, specially interesting with the graphs and the comparison with your prior lap. You seem to have a very good speed in many of the curves. :) A friend participated on the same course with a Gulf-painted GT3RS, he was also quite pleased with the course. I participated on the Sport Auto course in June and was really pleased with that. With Wolfgang Kaufmann as a coach I managed to get my time to 7:57:0 BTG, had definately faster laps but without proper measurement. On the 16/8 I'm participating on the Manthey trackday, hope to get some good laps then. :)
    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Thanks, Anne. Still so many things to work on, especially Schwedenkreuz. Individual coaching with a VLN racer (Sean Paul Breslin) at the Black Falcon day in July helped me a lot to identify sections where I have the biggest margin of progression.

    Yes, I saw your friend's GT3, I think he is visible in Kesselchen on this video.

    I had registered for Manthey on 08/16, but 10-17:30 is just too short for a long drive, and the casual way they handled this "schedule change" (i.e. say nothing and let people believe they are forking out 800€ for a full day starting at 8am) just pissed me off. So I went to this event instead.

    What is the format of the Sport Auto course ? Do you get a more decent amount of open laps than Hanseat ?


    --

    997 GT3 - 550M - 355 GTS F1 - Prius - S4


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Zeshark ..I will most probably attend the Sport Auto course next year. Anne has praised the course and as she has lots of experience with different courses and with N'Ring driving, I think it will be a good thing to do.


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Nice. Yes, thats him, saw him on the second lap. Its a shame if the driving on th 16th is only from 10. But we are there anyway at that time, so its much better than no driving that day. :-) I described the Sport Auto course here: http://www.rennteam.com/forum/thread/20169324/Pictures_from_Sport_Auto_course_on_Nurburgring_have_been_posted/page1.html
    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

     Apparently, it's been a recent pattern that the Nürburgring Gmbh chops off chunks of otherwise committed track days (Manthey) or double-books/cancels them altogether. If you are there, then yes, great opportunity to drive on a clear track, with gorgeous weather I hope. 

    I just think that Manthey could have been a bit more forthcoming and apologetic about it, rather than waiting for people to be surprised (and frustrated) on Monday 16th.


    --

    997 GT3 - 550M - 355 GTS F1 - Prius - S4


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    zeshark:

     Apparently, it's been a recent pattern that the Nürburgring Gmbh chops off chunks of otherwise committed track days (Manthey) or double-books/cancels them altogether.


    I dont know if the same compagny runs the N'Ring and the F1 circuit, but the latest is i a very difficult financial situation. So I would not be surprised if there were some very bad management.


    --
     

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    nice videos and excellent info's

    cheers Zeshark!!

    Does anyone have experience with the "Performance" course from Porsche Sport Driving School at the ring? Does it compare to the one from auto-sport?


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Thanks - very interesting thread  I was at the Nordschleife yesterday


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    SNiesler:

    nice videos and excellent info's

    cheers Zeshark!!

    Does anyone have experience with the "Performance" course from Porsche Sport Driving School at the ring? Does it compare to the one from auto-sport?

     I have participated at the "Performance" course from Porsche Sport Driving School, in May 2009. As far as I can remember it is similar to the sport auto course, but I think the groups were bigger. Our instructor was Steph an he is great. (dont remember his last name.) I was also our instructor at a Master course at the Grand Prix cirquit  at Nurburgring. This was also good, but sadly there were too many people who had bluffed about their skills before attending, and they were so slow that it affected the rest of the group. I even remember the instructor at one point got so frustrated that he over the walkie talkie said that at a master course your supposed to know what the normal ideal line is and have higher speed. :-o

    easy_rider911:

    Thanks - very interesting thread  I was at the Nordschleife yesterday 

     Lucky you! Smiley Well, 3 more days and I´m back. Smiley


    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Anne:

     

    easy_rider911:

    Thanks - very interesting thread  I was at the Nordschleife yesterday 

     Lucky you! Smiley Well, 3 more days and I´m back. Smiley

     


    Hope you have fun Smiley Smiley


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    I usually do, specially if the weather is dry. SmileyBy the way, here are two videos from the Sport Auto Course. I dont have a Driftbox, so its not as informativ and nice looking as the videos from zeshark:

    http://www.youtube.com/user/annewinn#p/a/u/1/QuXX_w0a8q4   (not in Germany because of music)

    http://www.youtube.com/user/annewinn#p/a/u/0/2lUGXAoS07I (chasing a 997 Turbo, not allowed to overtake here.)

    An one of my boyfriend chasing the instructor Wolfgang Kaufmann at the same course:  http://www.youtube.com/user/annewinn#p/a/f/0/qa1yVqpG1QM

     

     


    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

     Thanks for sharing the video, Anne. These GT2s don't rev, but they have BIG lungs. Both your BF and the instructor dive in very early in Aremberg, is that intentional ?


    --

    997 GT3 - 550M - 355 GTS F1 - Prius


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Thanks for posting, zeshark - excellent video: great picture quality and very good driving SmileySmiley I also like the graphs (actually I'm missing those for the Supertest laps).

    I also was scheduled for the 3 days BMW course (did it last year with some friends in the Group Neuhaus), but work crisscrossed my plans Smiley

    Now I'm hoping that I can make it next Monday for the Manthey trackday Smiley @ Anne: would be great to meet up again in the Green Hell Smiley

    IMHO the Porsche Performance course last year was excellent. After the first morning our group (10) was split into two sub groups of 5 (fast and not so fast) and that worked very well Smiley Weird that it was different in the Master course you've participated in - I'd expect a "Master" to be at least 20 seconds faster than me Smiley

    And yes, Nürburgring GmbH management sometimes acts a bit unprofessional to say the least Smiley


    --

    public roads: Porsche 987 S Seal/Cocoa, toll road Smiley : Porsche 997 GT3 Arctic/Black


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    zeshark:

     Thanks for sharing the video, Anne. These GT2s don't rev, but they have BIG lungs. Both your BF and the instructor dive in very early in Aremberg, is that intentional ?

    Yes it is. Kaufmann wanted us to drive much more of a race line compared to the Scuderia line. You see the same several other places, for instance in Wehrseifen and going into the double left before Brunchen. 

    Porsche-Jeck:

    Now I'm hoping that I can make it next Monday for the Manthey trackday Smiley @ Anne: would be great to meet up again in the Green Hell Smiley

    IMHO the Porsche Performance course last year was excellent. After the first morning our group (10) was split into two sub groups of 5 (fast and not so fast) and that worked very well Smiley Weird that it was different in the Master course you've participated in - I'd expect a "Master" to be at least 20 seconds faster than me Smiley

     It would be great to see you again Achim, hope you make it! Smiley

    If you were in our group at the Master course you would have been amongst the fastest. This was not on the Nordschleife but on the Grand Prix track. I think the problem was that Porsche hadn´t checked if some east european participants really had the training that they claimed that they had. Your supposed to have the Performance training before being allowed on the Master course, and some of these clearly had very little training. The instructor was not happy with Porsche for this. Smiley

     

     


    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Anne:
    Our instructor was Steph an he is great. (dont remember his last name.) I was also our instructor at a Master course at the Grand Prix cirquit  at Nurburgring. 

     Typo.Smiley Of course I wasn´t our instructor, but he was. That is Steff was our instructor. SmileySmiley


    --

    Anne Smile 
    '09 997 Carrera S, GT Silver 
    x '08 Porsche Cayman S Design Edition 1


    Re: International Fahrerlehrgang 2010 - Nordschleife - Aug 2-4 2010

    Anne:

     It would be great to see you again Achim, hope you make it! Smiley


    ...unfortunately yet another trackday which became victim of my work schedule Smiley

    I hope you had a blast Smiley I heard that the weather on Monday was not that crappy as Sunday so I guess it was worth it for you to participate.

    As the Sportauto training is fully booked I just registered for the Scuderia Course (as a novice Smiley).

    Nice bonus this year: instead of free driving in the Terroristenfahrten there is a RTS trackday on Wednesday which is free for the Scuderia participants Smiley


    --

    public roads: Porsche 987 S Seal/Cocoa, toll road Smiley : Porsche 997 GT3 Arctic/Black


     
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