Rennteam 2.0 - EN - Forum - Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar? - Page1

Dec 31, 2008 12:24:49 AM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002

Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Think new Audi S4 (sedan or station wagon).

I just drove one today out of curiousity and I honestly think that you can't get a better value for your money than with the new Audi S4.

This car has 4WD, a powerful supercharged engine and does 0-100 kph in 5.1 seconds.

From 0-180 kph, the Audi S4 is even 1 second faster than Audi's monster Diesel SUV, the new Q7 V12 TDi.

It is also faster than the BMW 335i by around 2 seconds from 0-180 kph.

My dealer offered me a pretty well equipped car for around 55000 EUR.

The only real competitor I can think of would be the new BMW M3 sedan but it costs around 10000 EUR more with similar options, not to mention the fact that the Audi S4 has also 4WD.

--
RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor 997 Turbo, Cayenne Turbo S, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW

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Dec 31, 2008 12:38:11 AM

Atzporsche: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Vancouver , Canada; Posts: 9118, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 7, 2005; Reply to: RC

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Certainly my pick in this sector. I think Audi is doing extremely well. Value is great, quality is excellent and performance and looks are elegant and classy yet also very sporty and stunnung. It's certainly a potent daily but a little out of my price range...
--

2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
1986 Porsche 944, 5spd

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Dec 31, 2008 8:51:26 AM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Atzporsche

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Wouldn't be my choice. I dont like the look and I dont like the Audi-Handling. For me those cars are to stressful from the layout on Autobahn trips. The M3 has for my taste, the perfect setup. The 4WD you dont really need that often. Even for driving to the mountains for skiing (I go almost every other week) I'm fine with RWD.

Further on, the current "new" A4 looks to much like the old one as well to much like an A6 or standard A4 (which are the travelling salesmen car No. 1 in Germany).

If I would go for one of the A4 Avants, I would foil it matt dark grey and put 20 inch matt black rims on it, teinted windows, etc. etc.

Its your decision RC and as far as I know you, you listen a lot to your stomach feeling - so if this is the car you really want go for it!

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Jan 1, 2009 9:40:45 PM

nberry: Rennteam VIP; Loc: La Jolla, USA , United States; Posts: 13737, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 11, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

If your choice is between a M3 sedan or the S4 I would pick the S4. Price, safety, drivability, space and performance is what the S4 has over the M3 sedan. A no brainer.

BUT then again rarely does any one on this board take my advice when it comes to cars. Smiley

--

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Jan 1, 2009 9:59:03 PM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: nberry

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

nberry:

BUT then again rarely does any one on this board take my advice when it comes to cars.

--

Ooooohhhhhhhhh ... one round of compassion from all of us to you Nick Smiley Smiley Smiley

Smiley

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Jan 1, 2009 10:39:35 PM

Carlos from Spain: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Spain. , Spain; Posts: 21156, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 9, 2003; Reply to: nberry

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

nberry:BUT then again rarely does any one on this board take my advice when it comes to cars.

--

But we do Nick, we always follow your advice, just not in the direction you had in mind Smiley Smiley

--

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Jan 2, 2009 12:10:14 AM

Atzporsche: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Vancouver , Canada; Posts: 9118, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 7, 2005; Reply to: Carlos from Spain

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

RC you already have the BMW M3 Cab DKG... what year? e46 i suppose?

--

2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
1986 Porsche 944, 5spd

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Jan 2, 2009 3:03:51 PM

AUM: Veteran; Loc: Germany; Posts: 1203, Gallery; Registered on: May 2, 2006; Reply to: Atzporsche

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Audi-S4-saloon-2008-CAR-review/?content-block=2

Interesting summary:

Match the S4 up against an M3 or C63 and it won’t come out on top. But then these cars aren’t rivals – better to face the S4 off against the 335i and C350. If you do, you’ll find an Audi that’s quicker point-to-point.

But the beauty of the new S4 is in its understated looks – this is a real Q-car, and a bloody quick one too. Some potential customers may actually find it too unassuming, but we rather like it.

--

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Jan 2, 2009 5:13:31 PM

Super Darius: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Italy-Como , Italy; Posts: 4084, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 7, 2002; Reply to: AUM

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

I had the old Audi S4 Avant(2.7 V6 TwinTurbo) and then the RS4(same series),love those cars

You can use them every days,they are fast,they can go everywhere and you can take on family,luggage and dog too Smiley

The only sad thing in Italy was the price drop at the sales time..mines were yellow too Smiley

but great cars indeed! Smiley

--
997 TT, what a car/che'mmmmmaghena!!!

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Jan 2, 2009 6:09:37 PM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Super Darius

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Darius - the price drop is the same here in Germany. But its the same with an BMW, too.

I never leased a car, always bought it, but I think if I would get a new car right now I probably would go for a lease. The advantage is, that you know what costs you have until end of the lease period. On the other hand side, many manufactures are not offering Leasing anymore at all, as they are facing the same issues with the resell value after the lease period.

So - now back to the topic!

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Jan 6, 2009 11:47:29 AM

TEE: Veteran; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 929, Gallery; Registered on: Feb 5, 2003; Reply to: Lars997

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

I have the RS4 as the family car. It is ok with one kid but two gets a bit tight if you actually want to go places with luggage.

Next time I would go with the bigger S6 or 5 series to get the extra space.

--
Off enjoying my car...

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Jan 6, 2009 12:34:01 PM

MKSGR: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: Germany , Germany; Posts: 8098, Gallery; Registered on: Jun 17, 2002; Reply to: RC

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

The S4 has two major advantages over the M3 sedan:

- it is a touring (i.e. more space, if needed that is an important point...)

- it has AWD (could be of major importance depending how often you drive it in the snow; also, the M3 rear axle feels pretty light - lacks traction - if the BMW recommended winter tires are installed, such would never be the case with Audi's AWD and could be an important consideration if the car is really used as a family car by various drivers (saftey...))

Also, the low-rev torque might be convincing compared to the n/a M3 engine?

The M3 sedan:

- is quicker

- is lghter and handles better

- offers PDK.

In summary, the M3 is probably the more "extreme" car: The M3 is closer to a sportscar than the S4. The S4 is safer and offers more space. Difficult choice Smiley Smiley

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Jan 6, 2009 4:59:39 PM

reginos: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Nicosia , Cyprus; Posts: 12130, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 20, 2005; Reply to: MKSGR

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Question:If the S4 is not sporty and more removed from a sportscar, do you need this amount of power?

Why not a more normal A4 Avant and save money?

--
It's not where you're going, it's how you get there that counts

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Jan 6, 2009 5:36:06 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: reginos

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

I am waiting until RS6 Avant second hand prices come down

--

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Jan 6, 2009 9:33:47 PM

Crash: Rennteam VIP; Loc: Never been to , Antarctica; Posts: 8287, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 17, 2002; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Alex_997TT:

I am waiting until RS6 Avant second hand prices come down

--

Good man Smiley .

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Jan 6, 2009 11:58:24 PM

WAY: Rennteam Master; Loc: Melbourne, Australia; Posts: 3344, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: Crash

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

I like the S4 too. But the price of an S4 here is roughly $135k, compared to a 335i at $105k and a M3 sedan at $150k. So it's not really a competitor to either M3 or 335i. Is this the case where you guys are too?

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Jan 7, 2009 12:44:44 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: Atzporsche

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Atzporsche:
RC you already have the BMW M3 Cab DKG... what year? e46 i suppose?

--

2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
1986 Porsche 944, 5spd

The M3 (E92) Cab DKG is my wife's car.

Guys, I think you misunderstood me.

I just drove the S4 for fun, simply because I had the chance to and I always like trying something new. Smiley

I do not want to buy one.

The Audi RS6 is much more fascinating and my primary choice as a family sportscar if money doesn't really matter.

--
RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor 997 Turbo, Cayenne Turbo S, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW

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Jan 7, 2009 3:17:40 PM

racerx: Rennteam VIP; Loc: 1985 porsche dealership , Bouvet Island; Posts: 8751, Gallery; Registered on: Jul 27, 2004; Reply to: RC

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

think this is very nice;

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Jan 7, 2009 4:01:59 PM

RC: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Rennteam HQ , Germany; Posts: 59607, Gallery; Registered on: Mar 26, 2002; Reply to: racerx

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

racerx:

think this is very nice;

The RS5 may be more interesting...if Audi decides to put it on the market.

The S4 is price-wise and perfomance-wise more interesting than the S5(which also has the "old" and pretty thirsty V8 engine) but I have to admit that I really like the S5, it has a very clean design, almost timeless.

For those who like the S5, here's a picture of the new S5 Cabriolet (which btw. also carries the S4 supercharged engine as far as I heard).

--
RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor 997 Turbo, Cayenne Turbo S, BMW M3 Cab DKG, Mini Cooper S JCW

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Jan 7, 2009 4:24:30 PM

Alex_997TT: Rennteam Master; Loc: Reading , United Kingdom; Posts: 3320, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 20, 2005; Reply to: RC

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Can't fit a dog in the back of an (R)S5. Would need an Avant version for that and I don't think Audi would do this.
--

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Jun 15, 2009 5:06:22 PM

WAY: Rennteam Master; Loc: Melbourne, Australia; Posts: 3344, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: Alex_997TT

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

I am thinking of getting a station wagon to replace our X3. S4 Avant or wait for RS4 (when is it coming?)? My wife said get a C63 wagon, but we already have a C63 sedan. I do admit that the C63 is such a great car to drive day to day that it would be tempting to get that in a wagon. I am afraid no one will want to drive the S4 and we end up not using it much (like it is now - X3 hardly gets used and we rather squeeze things into the C63 or leave things out!).

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Jun 16, 2009 4:20:32 AM

Eunice: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Karlsruhe , Germany; Posts: 6155, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 27, 2008; Reply to: WAY

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

The S4 is a real pleasure to drive, comfortable for long trips yet sporty.

I don't know if the back seats in the avant provide more space, the S4 and S4 convertible only provide enough space for smaller adults and short trips.

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Jun 16, 2009 7:35:03 AM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Eunice

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

IMO I think the S4 or C63 or even an M3 are a very close peer. Its also something to do with personal taste and favor for the brand. All cars are great and amazing machines.

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Jun 16, 2009 7:54:14 AM

WAY: Rennteam Master; Loc: Melbourne, Australia; Posts: 3344, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: Lars997

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Eunice, you have the new S4? If so how do you think it compares against the C63?

Lars, that is the problem. I just am not so sure if it is on par with the M3 and C63. I look at the specs and it isn't quite there, even the brakes look tiny compared to what I have on the C63. But then again this is going to be our family car to carry our baby so it isn't going to be driven that hard lol.

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Jun 16, 2009 12:08:33 PM

Eunice: Rennteam Administrator; Loc: Karlsruhe , Germany; Posts: 6155, Gallery; Registered on: Oct 27, 2008; Reply to: WAY

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

WAY:

Eunice, you have the new S4? If so how do you think it compares against the C63?

Lars, that is the problem. I just am not so sure if it is on par with the M3 and C63. I look at the specs and it isn't quite there, even the brakes look tiny compared to what I have on the C63. But then again this is going to be our family car to carry our baby so it isn't going to be driven that hard lol.

I don't have the new S4, but I drove one for a very short time without the opportunity to push it, while my A4 was at the garage.

I liked it a lot and I think it would be more comfortable as a family car than the M3, but on the track I doubt that the S4 is a match for the BMW.

As for the C63, I don't know it well enough to say something qualified.. Audi certainly is cheaper...

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Jun 18, 2009 7:58:13 AM

Lars997: Rennteam Moderator; Loc: South , Germany; Posts: 9448, Gallery; Registered on: Apr 8, 2002; Reply to: Eunice

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

@Way:

hmmm - you might be right that the naked figures are a bit away. Anyway lets face it, those cars are all as you say "family sport cars", so if you put it into this angle, the differences are not that huge. If you want to have a reasonable track car, which offers a bit more space the story might look different. But again, for a reasonable track car, you might consider a Lotus instead?

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Jun 18, 2009 8:12:28 AM

pride355: Rennteam Pro; Loc: iSTANBUL , Turkey; Posts: 2475, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 28, 2005; Reply to: Lars997

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

WAY,

Is RS6 avant out of your budget?

If it is so, I would have wait for RS4 avant instead of getting S4 which I believe is a nice car but not that special.

--

ONUR

09 Audi TTS Ibis

07 997 Carrera S / 05 M3 Coupe / 03 M3 Coupe / 96 M3 Coupe EVO (ALL BUT HISTORY)

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Jun 18, 2009 9:36:20 PM

WAY: Rennteam Master; Loc: Melbourne, Australia; Posts: 3344, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: pride355

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Lars, I have a track car so this car will never see the track. Even my C63 sedan never see any track work. The only thing is that my wife likes driving the C63 now because of the torque and incredibly strong brakes, and she would like a similar sort of driving experience with the new car. I really have to go drive the RS4 to know, but I suspect it isn't going to live up to that requirement. Even the M3 isn't torquey like the C63.

Pride355, RS6 Avant cost $280k here and is out of the budget for our family car. Unless I get rid of another car which I don't really want to do. I would love the RS4 avant but not sure when that is coming! I have always wanted to try a RS4.

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Jun 18, 2009 10:39:41 PM

pride355: Rennteam Pro; Loc: iSTANBUL , Turkey; Posts: 2475, Gallery; Registered on: Nov 28, 2005; Reply to: WAY

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

WAY,

What I don't like about regular Audis is they intervenes too much to drive; read ESP; this includes S models.

What I don't like most about my TTS is even if I turn off the ESP compelately, it kicks in back.

However, given the choices and the requirements S4 avant seems to be the best option if you don't want to go SUV style like Q5 or A4 Allroad.

--

ONUR

09 Audi TTS Ibis

07 997 Carrera S / 05 M3 Coupe / 03 M3 Coupe / 96 M3 Coupe EVO (ALL BUT HISTORY)

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Jun 18, 2009 11:07:26 PM

WAY: Rennteam Master; Loc: Melbourne, Australia; Posts: 3344, Gallery; Registered on: May 11, 2004; Reply to: pride355

Re: Thinking daily driver "budget" or "family" sportscar?

Q5 is too slow, so it's the same problem with our X3 right now as neither my wife nor I want to drive it. ESP isn't going to be an issue for us as it is not going to be pushed that hard. I will go test drive the S4 when I have time.

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