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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
The simple answer is a resounding YES 
My budget was in the range of the 987 base. I called up the local Porsche dealership to arrange a test drive for both the base and the "S" back to back. I drove the base first because I had no frame of reference - honestly, I was a little disappointed in the power and acceleration - in comparison to "older" 911's Then I drove the "S" and the difference is apparent when you first turn the ignition ; the sound of the engine as it comes to life is much more throaty and aggressive (and that's before even driving it) - acceleration was definitely faster and much more enjoyable. I was disappointed by the base. I decided to wait a couple of months to save a few more pennies and spring up into an "S" - ordered it Aug 13/05 for Oct build and hopefully will have delivery end of November. I would say, if you can, get a naked "S" over a loaded base. The difference in price is significant, but if performance is what you want then go "S" - there is no substitute
The performance and numbers are similar to a Carrera 993 which I was a passenger in a few years ago - I even read somewhere that a 987S can go around a track faster than a 993
P.S - the 987 base is an excellent car and would pick it over any Z4, 350Z, SLK , etc ,etc, but if you have the money for the S, get it , if not, the base is a very satisfying driver's car with a true Porsche soul
My budget was in the range of the 987 base. I called up the local Porsche dealership to arrange a test drive for both the base and the "S" back to back. I drove the base first because I had no frame of reference - honestly, I was a little disappointed in the power and acceleration - in comparison to "older" 911's Then I drove the "S" and the difference is apparent when you first turn the ignition ; the sound of the engine as it comes to life is much more throaty and aggressive (and that's before even driving it) - acceleration was definitely faster and much more enjoyable. I was disappointed by the base. I decided to wait a couple of months to save a few more pennies and spring up into an "S" - ordered it Aug 13/05 for Oct build and hopefully will have delivery end of November. I would say, if you can, get a naked "S" over a loaded base. The difference in price is significant, but if performance is what you want then go "S" - there is no substitute
The performance and numbers are similar to a Carrera 993 which I was a passenger in a few years ago - I even read somewhere that a 987S can go around a track faster than a 993P.S - the 987 base is an excellent car and would pick it over any Z4, 350Z, SLK , etc ,etc, but if you have the money for the S, get it , if not, the base is a very satisfying driver's car with a true Porsche soul
Sep 16, 2005 2:01:51 PM
- teutonictrio
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
I'm sure a 987S can outrun a 997 base, as the 986S can outrun a 996 base (again, in the right hands and on a technical course). The corner speeds of the 986S are much higher, and with the 987S improving on that, I can't imagine how it wouldn't be faster than a 997
Sep 16, 2005 10:08:54 PM
- longislander1
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Sep 17, 2005 1:50:01 AM
- derder
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
lets tip the balance a little bit. and I have said this many times on this forum.
the difference is NOT great (between S and non-S). I test drove S after owning my 2.7L for ~2 months. Yes, there is a power difference, sound (a bit sexier than my one), but overall the driving experience is not much difference.
I much prefer to use /invest the money I saved and work towards my Ferrari
Two theories behind my comment:
1) Porsche packed more horses in my 2,7L boxer
2) the S I drove was a lemon.
better still. stop asking questions and test drive both.
Sep 17, 2005 1:57:36 AM
- LowPolarMoment
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Derder, I'm glad you said that. I'm a Boxster owner and I was somewhat disappointed in my recent test drive of a 997. It had more power if you pressed the "go pedal" hard but the handling was inferior to the Boxster. If the Boxster had the same engine as the 911, no one who drove both would buy a 911. Hello Cayman.
Sep 17, 2005 2:29:41 AM
- long720
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Dilinger, JPN didn't had RHD 6spd as standard so had to wait a little longer. my SY987s is now sitting at the harbour waiting for the vessel ride. Funny thing is I ordered MY05 but now I will be getting MY06, and JPN now also offer RHD 6spd for MY06. Well my time isn't wasted as mine will be the first batch RHD MY06 shipped to JPN. I am looking at early NOV delivery. that's 1 whole yr of wait. 
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
And let's not forget, despite of power delivery, 987 / 987s with PASM ties with the CGT in terms of salom speed (i believe i read somewhere it was in the 70s, and was faster than an Enzo)
Bringing my argument back to the power difference btw an S and a non-S, I believe that a sports car with this sort of handling ability can ALWAYS appreciate more power, hands down.
I drove all 4 models. 987, 987s, 997 & 997s and I think (subjective opinion here b4 you flame me) 997 s or non s is a very fast car in reality but it doesn't FEEL fast because it's so god-damn well made, you don't really feel you're doing the spd you're doing but 987's got that DIRECTNESS which makes it feel as fast as it is.
I am a will-be 987 owner so you might say my opinion is biased but if you disagree then test drive a 997, do the same spd as a 987, and see if you feel as fast.
cheers guys, to those with their 987 pls enjoy and be safe. to those who are waiting -- well, at least now you know that you're not the only one who's waiting out there, at least not for 1 whole year....
Bringing my argument back to the power difference btw an S and a non-S, I believe that a sports car with this sort of handling ability can ALWAYS appreciate more power, hands down.
I drove all 4 models. 987, 987s, 997 & 997s and I think (subjective opinion here b4 you flame me) 997 s or non s is a very fast car in reality but it doesn't FEEL fast because it's so god-damn well made, you don't really feel you're doing the spd you're doing but 987's got that DIRECTNESS which makes it feel as fast as it is.
I am a will-be 987 owner so you might say my opinion is biased but if you disagree then test drive a 997, do the same spd as a 987, and see if you feel as fast.
cheers guys, to those with their 987 pls enjoy and be safe. to those who are waiting -- well, at least now you know that you're not the only one who's waiting out there, at least not for 1 whole year....
Sep 17, 2005 2:53:13 AM
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Louis
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
teutonictrio said:
I'm sure a 987S can outrun a 997 base, as the 986S can outrun a 996 base (again, in the right hands and on a technical course). The corner speeds of the 986S are much higher, and with the 987S improving on that, I can't imagine how it wouldn't be faster than a 997
Yes understood. But with the same driver in both cars the 997 should outpace a 987S on a track - according to Porsche figures done by their professional drivers. But I think the 987S is faster (or equivalent to) in STRAIGHT LINE ACCELERATION compared to 993.
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
You guys are on 987 fantasy island if you think a 987S will outrun a Carrera.
I suspect wishful thinking and a lack of experience with 911s makes you think it can.
The only way it could would be for a experienced Porsche pilot to drive a 987 against an inexperienced 911 driver.
No 987 S , or non S, tail wind or on a steam catapult, will accellerate as fast as a late 993 after 100mph. A 987S might be even up to 120 mph, but after that its all over. Boxsters are quick to 60, newer ones quick to 100, but after that they are a yawn.
Its partly due to electronics from emissions, gearing and the rolling resistance of its fat tires. The Boxster needs more HP than a 993 to move its wheels and tires at higher and higher speeds. It will get to a 150, but a 993 will reach that first and keep on going with out waiting.
I suspect wishful thinking and a lack of experience with 911s makes you think it can.
The only way it could would be for a experienced Porsche pilot to drive a 987 against an inexperienced 911 driver.
No 987 S , or non S, tail wind or on a steam catapult, will accellerate as fast as a late 993 after 100mph. A 987S might be even up to 120 mph, but after that its all over. Boxsters are quick to 60, newer ones quick to 100, but after that they are a yawn.
Its partly due to electronics from emissions, gearing and the rolling resistance of its fat tires. The Boxster needs more HP than a 993 to move its wheels and tires at higher and higher speeds. It will get to a 150, but a 993 will reach that first and keep on going with out waiting.
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
You guys are on 987 fantasy island if you think a 987S will outrun a Carrera.
I think we qualified it a little by saying 'on a twisty track'. There was a 987S vs 997 test in Evo mag, where both experienced and inexperienced drivers posted slightly faster lap times in the 987S than the 997. A track with longer straights and less bends would favour the 997, you are probably right.
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
to see how little the difference between the 987 and the 987S is, look at the 987S tip performance. You'll see the 987 2.7 manual is quicker or the same. I imagine there is a difference after 130mph, but who goes that quickly often.
People on this board can spot the difference, but most people won't. I went for a new 987 2.7 with the spec I wanted, as opposed to a basic S without ANYTHING I wanted. As a result, I will be happier in my nice 2.7 than bog basic S. Besides, the new 2.7 is as quick as the original 3.2, which seemed to be more than quick enough for people back then.
I guess most of the S/non S argument is badge snobbery. At the end of the day you are buying a Porsche. Not many people get to do that. Enjoy it.
By the way, there is NO difference between the suspension setup on the 2.7 vs the S. None whatso ever. Just a bit more grunt and bigger front disc brakes. Even the centre airvent on the new 987S manual is a blank. It just adds to the drag!! I have listened to the S and 2.7 back to back and can't really tell a differencein the exhaust note. This is because there is very little difference in the engine apart from the displacement. Both have dual stage induction, and both have a flat 6. Both exit out of a very similar exhaust (more free flowing headers on the S, but that doesn't give a better bark), and both have a Porshce badge on them.
The purists and magazines have said that the 2.7 987 is the biggest step forward in the new model, and that the S simply receives a power hike. Not so useful when the speed limit is 70mph. The 2.7 more than performs on the twisties.
Its all about personal choice. I would never buy a certain car because 'avatar from NY' tells me to.
Go out and get what suits you best.
JZ
People on this board can spot the difference, but most people won't. I went for a new 987 2.7 with the spec I wanted, as opposed to a basic S without ANYTHING I wanted. As a result, I will be happier in my nice 2.7 than bog basic S. Besides, the new 2.7 is as quick as the original 3.2, which seemed to be more than quick enough for people back then.
I guess most of the S/non S argument is badge snobbery. At the end of the day you are buying a Porsche. Not many people get to do that. Enjoy it.
By the way, there is NO difference between the suspension setup on the 2.7 vs the S. None whatso ever. Just a bit more grunt and bigger front disc brakes. Even the centre airvent on the new 987S manual is a blank. It just adds to the drag!! I have listened to the S and 2.7 back to back and can't really tell a differencein the exhaust note. This is because there is very little difference in the engine apart from the displacement. Both have dual stage induction, and both have a flat 6. Both exit out of a very similar exhaust (more free flowing headers on the S, but that doesn't give a better bark), and both have a Porshce badge on them.
The purists and magazines have said that the 2.7 987 is the biggest step forward in the new model, and that the S simply receives a power hike. Not so useful when the speed limit is 70mph. The 2.7 more than performs on the twisties.
Its all about personal choice. I would never buy a certain car because 'avatar from NY' tells me to.
Go out and get what suits you best.
JZ
Sep 17, 2005 7:51:37 AM
- JimFlat6
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
teutonictrio said:
Sheesh, who wants to go to 150?
It feels good. Why buy a Porsche if not to explore
and enjoy its capabilities? They are incredible on
the other side of 120 and worth every cent. Once you
feel and watch the speedo climb from 120 to 170 you
will realize just how totally inferior all other cars
are. Until then, you really dont know just how good
Porsches are and the amount of effort that their
engineers put into high speed stability and handling.
Its there to be used. So use it!
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
JZ said:
to see how little the difference between the 987 and the 987S is, look at the 987S tip performance. You'll see the 987 2.7 manual is quicker or the same.
Compare the 2.7 manual to the 3.2 tip? How does that help? You've lost me.
But I agree, the 2.7 aint bad at all, and you should get the one that suits you. You need to test both. In many ways the 2.7 is a more sensible purchase.
Sep 17, 2005 10:46:00 AM
- LowPolarMoment
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
wtsnet said:Quote:
JZ said:
to see how little the difference between the 987 and the 987S is, look at the 987S tip performance. You'll see the 987 2.7 manual is quicker or the same.
Compare the 2.7 manual to the 3.2 tip? How does that help? You've lost me.
Just pointing out that the addition of a tip brings the S performance down to the level of a manual 2.7, therefore indicating that there is not a great deal of difference between the S and the 2.7.....that or the Tip saps huge amounts of power (which it doesn't).
The performance figures for the 2.7 man box vd 3.2 tip box are the same if not better for the 2.7. Suggesting that there is not a world of difference between the 2 as some people on this forum would suggest.
Cheers,
JZ
Sep 17, 2005 12:00:27 PM
- LowPolarMoment
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:It actually beat the CGT too. The 987S has the highest slalom speed of any non-race car Road & Track has ever tested. The Enzo was the previous record holder. I'm anticipating that the Cayman S will beat the 987S with it's stiffer chassis.
long720 said: And let's not forget, despite of power delivery, 987 / 987s with PASM ties with the CGT in terms of salom speed (i believe i read somewhere it was in the 70s, and was faster than an Enzo)
Sep 17, 2005 12:04:17 PM
- JZ
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
LowPolarMoment said:Quote:Are you sure? There is between the 986 vs 986S.
JZ said: By the way, there is NO difference between the suspension setup on the 2.7 vs the S. None whatso ever.
Check here to read the comparison between the 986 MY04 vs the 987 MY 05 in the dealer product information. Its in chapter 1 and shows a table comparing the 986 and 987.
You'll see that there was no difference in the suspension setup between the 986 and 986S unless you ordered the sports suspension and that there are improvements in the 987 standard suspension but no difference between the 987 and 987S unless you order PASM, which is available on both cars.
http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=3443
Cheers,
JZ
Sep 17, 2005 12:18:37 PM
- LowPolarMoment
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
JZ said:Quote:
LowPolarMoment said:Quote:Are you sure? There is between the 986 vs 986S.
JZ said: By the way, there is NO difference between the suspension setup on the 2.7 vs the S. None whatso ever.
Check here to read the comparison between the 986 MY04 vs the 987 MY 05 in the dealer product information. Its in chapter 1 and shows a table comparing the 986 and 987.
You'll see that there was no difference in the suspension setup between the 986 and 986S unless you ordered the sports suspension and that there are improvements in the 987 standard suspension but no difference between the 987 and 987S unless you order PASM, which is available on both cars.
http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=3443
Cheers,
JZ
I don't think you're interpreting the info correctly. They both have "basic" set up, according to the chart, but I'm under the impression that the suspension (springs and shocks) was calibrated a little stiffer on the S. The 030 set up on the 986 and 986S were different from each other too. All of the part numbers are different.
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
JZ said:Quote:
wtsnet said:
Compare the 2.7 manual to the 3.2 tip? How does that help? You've lost me.
Just pointing out that the addition of a tip brings the S performance down to the level of a manual 2.7, therefore indicating that there is not a great deal of difference between the S and the 2.7.....that or the Tip saps huge amounts of power (which it doesn't).
I see where your reasoning comes from, but you can't compare like that though, surely, as the gear ratios of the tip are different to the 5-speed manual.
Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
wtsnet said:Quote:
JZ said:Quote:
wtsnet said:
Compare the 2.7 manual to the 3.2 tip? How does that help? You've lost me.
Just pointing out that the addition of a tip brings the S performance down to the level of a manual 2.7, therefore indicating that there is not a great deal of difference between the S and the 2.7.....that or the Tip saps huge amounts of power (which it doesn't).
I see where your reasoning comes from, but you can't compare like that though, surely, as the gear ratios of the tip are different to the 5-speed manual.
I agree that the ratios are probably not the same, but surely it doesn't matter what the ratios are, all that matters is real world performance.
Cheers,
JZ
Sep 17, 2005 2:57:13 PM
- JZ
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Re: 987 boxster vs 987 boxster S
Quote:
LowPolarMoment said:Quote:
JZ said:Quote:
LowPolarMoment said:Quote:Are you sure? There is between the 986 vs 986S.
JZ said: By the way, there is NO difference between the suspension setup on the 2.7 vs the S. None whatso ever.
Check here to read the comparison between the 986 MY04 vs the 987 MY 05 in the dealer product information. Its in chapter 1 and shows a table comparing the 986 and 987.
You'll see that there was no difference in the suspension setup between the 986 and 986S unless you ordered the sports suspension and that there are improvements in the 987 standard suspension but no difference between the 987 and 987S unless you order PASM, which is available on both cars.
http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=3443
Cheers,
JZ
I don't think you're interpreting the info correctly. They both have "basic" set up, according to the chart, but I'm under the impression that the suspension (springs and shocks) was calibrated a little stiffer on the S. The 030 set up on the 986 and 986S were different from each other too. All of the part numbers are different.
Where do you get your info from? Nowhere in ANY of the ltierature I have read does it say that the S 'handles' better than the 2.7 due to uprated suspension. That is a complete fallacy. It doesnn't mention it in any brochure, info pack or indeed from any Porsche track day instructor that I had a chat with last month. Both cars (987) are the same chassis set up unless PASM is specced. Apart from cosmetic internal and external differences, the mechanical differences of the 987 and 987S are limited to the engine and exhaust system and the brakes. The S brakes are bigger and have a bigger brake booster. There is no difference on the chassis setup in any UK spec literature I have read.
I quote from the UK brochure,
" Both new Boxster models have a modified version of our proven McPherson-type suspension. All four corners have a coil-over strut which is located by a system of transverse links. The axle kinematics have been further enhanced and a wider wheel track introduced. The rear axle subsystem on both models is a completely new development. Lightweight materials are used throughout the chassis, particularly on the unsprung masses. Virtually all moving parts in the axle assembley are made from light yet robust aluminium.
The mid engined layout combines with the advanced chassis engineering to minimise pitch and roll The steering system uses a new gear assembley and variable steering ratio to achieve greater immediacy and precision of response as well as excellent feedback from the road. Lane change manoeuvers are smooth and secure, even when travelling at high speed.......straight line stability is equally impressive, as on every Porsche vehicle."
All the usual Porsche guff, but no where in the text does it mention that the suspension setup on the S is different or 'better' than the 2.7
Porsche are famous for using the same parts where possible to maximise profit andminimise cost. What may be the case for your 986, is not the case for the 987.
Cheers,
JZ
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