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Board: Porsche - 911 - 997
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Jun 20, 2005 9:57:24 PM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
Grant said:Quote:
CF said:
997 GT3 will get 3.8 liter engine.
CF - Will it be a modified version of wet-sump 997S motor or enlarged GT3 Mk II dry-sump motor?
Thats the million dollar question
I would really really be surprised if the Gt3 doesn't get a dry sump. I mean a wet sump is perfectly fine for the carrera o Turbo, but the GT3 is another matter, its Porsche's track car. It may be 3.8L but I'm willing to be its based on the 3.6L of the 996GT3 just like the 997S' 3.8L is based on the 996C2's 3.6L.
Jun 21, 2005 1:26:20 AM
- Grant
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Reply to:
Carlos from Spain
Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:I mean a wet sump is perfectly fine for the carrera o Turbo, but the GT3 is another matter, its Porsche's track car.
Actually Carlos, this is a rare occasion that I'll have to disagree with something you said
I think the Turbo is the least likely to have a wet sump. Turbo motors are under tremendous stress (high heat and high power). Furthermore, it's VERY common for users to mod the turbo to even higher power limits. The GT1 based motor is quite a bit stronger and able to handle these stresses better than the newer designs.
You're right that a Turbo is rarely needing the dry-sump for oiling reasons (high g-forces on a track), but it does need it for the strength of the old-style engine block.
Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
Grant said:Quote:
Carlos from Spain said:I mean a wet sump is perfectly fine for the carrera o Turbo, but the GT3 is another matter, its Porsche's track car.
Actually Carlos, this is a rare occasion that I'll have to disagree with something you said
I think the Turbo is the least likely to have a wet sump. Turbo motors are under tremendous stress (high heat and high power). Furthermore, it's VERY common for users to mod the turbo to even higher power limits. The GT1 based motor is quite a bit stronger and able to handle these stresses better than the newer designs.
You're right that a Turbo is rarely needing the dry-sump for oiling reasons (high g-forces on a track), but it does need it for the strength of the old-style engine block.
Grant,
Agreed. Isn't the 996TT dry-sump lubricated? Presumably, the 997TT will be, as well.
Re: 997 GT3
More and more the decision to get a used 996 GT3 or 997 GT3 hinges on the motor for me. I like giving Porsche the benefit of the doubt on new motors. I definitely want the motor dry-sump, but I'd trust a new design if they raced it. The problem for me with what is going on now is that although we don't know if the next GT3 will have a newer style motor, we know even less about whether that newer motor will ever be used in endurance races like Le Mans. If Porsche is going to bring a new motor to the GT3, they should race it for a season first.
Jun 21, 2005 7:12:13 AM
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Carlos from Spain
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Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
Grant said:
I think the Turbo is the least likely to have a wet sump. Turbo motors are under tremendous stress (high heat and high power). Furthermore, it's VERY common for users to mod the turbo to even higher power limits. The GT1 based motor is quite a bit stronger and able to handle these stresses better than the newer designs.
I agree, but I was just talking about lubrification needs of the TT, not strength of the current dry sump engine
so we still agree again 
Re: 997 GT3
Im sure the GT3 997 will come with a 3.8 version of the GT1 engine and its dry sump lube system.
Porsche has given no hints about any M96 development for competition, and the M96 engine cannot really be enlarged to much due to the design of its coolant passageways.
If they do put a M96 engine into a 997GT3 it would have to be factory certified for racing tires, something that no other M96 powered car has received, so its unlikely that the M96 motor will be used for the GT3.
I rest my case!
Porsche has given no hints about any M96 development for competition, and the M96 engine cannot really be enlarged to much due to the design of its coolant passageways.
If they do put a M96 engine into a 997GT3 it would have to be factory certified for racing tires, something that no other M96 powered car has received, so its unlikely that the M96 motor will be used for the GT3.
I rest my case!
Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
JimFlat6 said:
Im sure the GT3 997 will come with a 3.8 version of the GT1 engine and its dry sump lube system.
Porsche has given no hints about any M96 development for competition, and the M96 engine cannot really be enlarged to much due to the design of its coolant passageways.
If they do put a M96 engine into a 997GT3 it would have to be factory certified for racing tires, something that no other M96 powered car has received, so its unlikely that the M96 motor will be used for the GT3.
I rest my case!
Makes sense if you make a couple of assumptions. The first assumption is that Porsche will continue to build GT series racecars. The second is that the standard GT3 will be used to homologate those cars. Do we know that the GT3 RSR will be replaced by a 997 version? If the answer is uncertain then there is still uncertainty surrounding whether the next GT3 will have a race bred motor. They could also pull the "RS" trick many have suspected and put a different motor in a special RS version of the car for homologation. I don't think the cup cars are indicators because they could just keep building those with race motors and start using the M96s in the street cars (cup cars don't need homologation, GT cars do). If there is no continued GT2 program since they are entering the P2 class, then homologation wouldn't be required and the motor in the street cars wouldn't have to be approved for slicks.
Re: 997 GT3
Quote:
997 GT3 will get 3.8 liter engine.
thanks for the info.
here are my speculations:
- IMO this indicates that the engine will be based on the M97 S engine, without real dry sump.
- having this TFT monitor and PSM in mind, the GT3 may be not too far away from a powerkit carrera S with the 20mm kit and LSD.
- the RS version some time later will be what the GT3 was: raw, track biased and powered by the famous dry sump 964 crankcase engine. this model will be even more extreme than the current RS and homologates the FIA GT/ALMS cars. probably this model won't be available to the US.
in a way i hope that i'm wrong, though.
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