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    High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Some of you may have remembered that I had posted on inquiring from other mates here whether or not they had experienced brake squealing while driving. I brought my car into the dealer twice and the problem persisted. I wonder if the explanation provided was logical and would like to share with all.

    They recommended that to reduce the high pitched squealing, the only way was to change the pads (no way my car was never tracked and only had 6000 km on it after 9 months and I don't think pads are needed until 30K or so).

    The good news is that technician checked the brake disc and assured me that the disc was fine (it wasn't warped or anything). Advisor mentioned that the uneven wearing out of the brake pads at times on high performance brakes would cause vibration noises and he said it was a FEATURE/CHARACTERISTIC of Porsche/high performance vehicles. The degree depends on individual driving habits and cars (living on twisty hilly roads would cause the brake to squeal more going downhill). He cited examples of BUSES when braking (that part was right cos oftentimes, you would hear similar squealing when buses stopped) and he said it would be more evident in a boxster cos of the soft top. He asked me to listen carefully with the window rolled down driving and he said it would become apparent that even most normal vehicles would produce those noises. Well,
    regardless of the explanation, I think I am through with this. To have them further look into this case would cause not only my time but also my patience. I did however regret taking it in because the characteristic they mentioned did not go away ultimately and they ended up SHAVING away the sides of the brake pads so my rear pads have uneven contact with the disc. Hence, I can distinctly see the disc top side and bottom side retaining a strip of rust even with hard braking because of the uneven pads (imagine, top and bottom sides shaved away leaving only the middle). My advisor however reassured me that with times, the pads would wear itself down naturally and become even again and the rust would go away.

    Any input and comments? Was it a mistake for me to go through so much hassle to get this looked at?

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    I am no mechanic, so I can only comment from a Boxster drivers point-of-view. I have never had this problem - ever. It seems as though the explanation the technician has given you does not make logical sense. How does the buses comparision relate to a 2 seater roadster? Each vehicle due to weight, dimension...etc would react completely different to the laws of physics. Further to that how does the fact that it is a softop add to this problem? I guess it is a difficult situation, maybe you need to get a second opinion from a brakes specialist. Anyway, good luck with this one.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Surely if the pads are not touching the discs (the rust remains) then you braking performance is well reduced!! Stupid mechanics.
    I'd get all the pads replaced, and start again. At least the discs aren't damaged. I had similar experience with my old VW - dealer couldn't fix the squeal (present even when I wasn't braking!) so I got them to swap the pads and stop messing about. This cured it. Though VW pads are cheaper!
    Hope you get it sorted.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Shaving away the pad material - i'm not sure what their thinking is there but less contact area i consider to be a safety issue !

    I actually had EBC brake pads on my 986 from the factory they are usually Brembo. I';m not sure what my 987S has but suspect its the latter as the norm. Certainly EBC yellow pads squeal when used with the factory discs, but they are at least one compound spec harder than normal (probably 2 compounds harder).

    I have heard my 987S brakes squeal on one occassion only, and that was driving hard on a downhill mountain section, so working them pretty hard.

    My thoughts are that your driving style may not be compatible with the hardness of the brake pad compound - have you tried an email to Brembo for recommendations ??

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    I had a similar problem and read in a thread to brake hard from 70MPH (strongly suggest a safe deserted road of course) and the squealing would go away. Not sure about the logic but my squealing is a thing of the past!

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Quote:
    Porky Tokyo said:
    I had a similar problem and read in a thread to brake hard from 70MPH (strongly suggest a safe deserted road of course) and the squealing would go away. Not sure about the logic but my squealing is a thing of the past!



    Porky, can you be a bit more specific on a step by step? It's even harder than TOKYO because I live in HONG KONG.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Guys I am definitely gonna get to the bottom of this this is too much. Anything above 50km/h would cause persistent and apparent high pitched squealing it is just not normal. Maybe it means I have to replace the brakepads even at 7000 km. This is ridiculous cos usually pads are not needed until 30,000KM. I notice rust building up on rear disc due to uneven brake pads contact and some scratches on the brake disc. It's worrying me.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Quote:
    cookie monster said:
    Quote:
    Porky Tokyo said:
    I had a similar problem and read in a thread to brake hard from 70MPH (strongly suggest a safe deserted road of course) and the squealing would go away. Not sure about the logic but my squealing is a thing of the past!



    Porky, can you be a bit more specific on a step by step? It's even harder than TOKYO because I live in HONG KONG.



    Thanks porky. I tried it myself and it didn't work and I took it into the dealership. The German technician confirmed your point and he showed me what braking hard meant. He said I was too much of a soft braker and he went from 150 km/h to a dead stop twice and my squealing went away. He said these vehicles were meant to be driven hard and coming over from the Mercedes side, I had to learn to drive them hard.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Sorry, I couldn't reply to your earlier question. Basically, you must not press the brake lightly for too long to keep the squealing away, use engine breaking whenever possible and the last minute, stop definitely (don't get shunted from behind or hurt your passengers of course) and you will find the squeals will not return too often, if they do, 150Km to 0 in a few short seconds is an instand fix.

    Driving in cities like HKG or TYO is the problem. The fix is easy though, even if they do squeak, don't worry about it, not a big problem!

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Cookie, if you don't have enough road real-estate and/or lack of traffic to do high-speed breaking you can get a similar effect from lower speed breaking on loose gravel, like near a construction area. You'll also not burn rubber and more likely activate ABS which should be triggered from time to time.

    Don't worry, kicked up gravel won't be going high or hard enough to chip, not to mention will be moving in the same direction or away from the car.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Note that this is also a sign of improperly-broken-in brakes. When you get a set of new rotors and pads, do successively-faster stops, from 60-0, 80-0, 100-0, applying strong pressure to the pads. Do this repeatedly to bed the pads into the rotors.

    The squealing you're hearing has many sources, most often it's the pads vibrating within the calipers once you've got enough dust in there to displace the grease. Sometimes a simple hosing-out will make the squealing go away, other times, repeated hard stops will make the sound go away as it did for you.

    I say all that, but then I didn't have any luck with my 987. I just replaced my pads at 20,000 miles. Before that, they had been squealing quite a bit and I was never able to make the noise go away despite trying all the usual tricks! I hope it doesn't happen this time around.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    More info on bedding brake pads:

    http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_bedincontents.shtml

    More info on brakes than anyone really wants to read:

    http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/tech_white_papers.shtml

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Eslai yes ER doc told me a bit about my probably not bedding in my brake properly. I will PM you a bit more to get info. It seems like there are some TSBs out on this. I thought Porsches these days are everyday enough to be driven by housewives that it should be a no brainer. Apparently not.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Also nothing on the menu on breaking in except not going past 4000 or driving too aggressively before first service. They should put some info. in on that.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    did u install performance brake pads or something?
    no braking noise on my factory set up

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    na factory setup... performance enough for sure.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Based on your PM, I think you got your problem solved No more soft braking, ok?

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Too bad it wasn't solved. It came back. It's annoying so I think I will go replace the brake pads at my own cost.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Before plunking down the money on new pads, will the dealership guarantee that the sound issue will be resolved. Would surfacing the rotors be of any help possibly (as was suggested to me on my previous car)? The sound only appears with VERY LIGHT pressure right? It completely goes with slightly more moderate application?

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Big waste of money to buy new pads. The dealership owes you an explanation. If they can't get it to go away, I'd talk to Porsche Customer Care...I don't know what that experience is like in Hong Kong though.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Quote:
    cookie monster said:
    Too bad it wasn't solved. It came back. It's annoying so I think I will go replace the brake pads at my own cost.



    If I were in your position I would just drive the car HARD for sometime and re-evaluate.

    Do not waste more money on another set of brake pads.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Quote:
    eslai said:
    Big waste of money to buy new pads. The dealership owes you an explanation. If they can't get it to go away, I'd talk to Porsche Customer Care...I don't know what that experience is like in Hong Kong though.



    Exactly the case at speed >50-70 km/h apply the brake slightly causes squeeking. Unfortunately, I scheduled an appt yet they said they couldn't guarantee solving it but highly likely to be solved.

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    Quote:
    cookie monster said:
    Quote:
    eslai said:
    Big waste of money to buy new pads. The dealership owes you an explanation. If they can't get it to go away, I'd talk to Porsche Customer Care...I don't know what that experience is like in Hong Kong though.



    Exactly the case at speed >50-70 km/h apply the brake slightly causes squeeking. Unfortunately, I scheduled an appt yet they said they couldn't guarantee solving it but highly likely to be solved.



    Agree ERdoc but it never went away not yet. There's nothing I can do they said it would be present in selected vehicles though not typical but they assured me that it would not affect safety so they are off the hook. It brakes fine. Just some noises so live with it type of deal but it is not present on any friend's Porsche and ER doc definitely thinks this is not normal but who am I to argue with right?

    Re: High Pitched Brake Squealing on 987s

    To end this fuss, I ended up paying for my pads HKD 2780 rear pads and I had requested for my old pads to be extended to me for double checking at another brake specialist if need be. So far the car doesn't squeak. There's no vibration so it is unlikely that the brake disc is warped and the caliper seldom gives me problem so squeaking usually means that the pads are worn (but unlikely on mine at 7000km) but in any case, I had gotten myself new pads. Also put in 5 mm spacer set the difference is minimal. I wish they had the old 986 set on simply rear 14 mm but now I have 4 sets of 5 mm.

    I repeatedly asked and the answer was this:

    Selected vehicles of Porsche would exemplify squeaky noises due to the materials of these racing stock brakes and we wrote to the factory and they said it was absolutely normal and safe.

    Well, what can I say right?

     
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