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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla's Model 3 electric motor is a clever mystery box, says auto experts

    https://apple.news/AdyNX8A6pTAiP2AC82AkgbA

    The Taycan will be the best built, best interior, best handling EV out there, for a price of course. After all Porsche has been successfully building sporty/luxury cars for decades and they always deliver in terms of real world measures.

    Since it is still a prototype, price, confort, infotainment, true performance and range remain a mystery.

     On some highways, if you have an efficient vehicle, you can use lanes that are reserved for carpooling, they are less congested. Sometimes, it can save a lot of time...

     

    Hence why hybrid makes much more sense right ow than EV cars. 

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Only the most efficient hybrids can use them, No Porsches...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Only the most efficient hybrids can use them, No Porsches...

     

    In my neck of the woods, and all the way down the West Coast, all hybrids qualified to run single rider on HOV lanes.

    Inn fact, I have yet to see a HOV lane that only let in EV but not hybrids anywhere in the world.


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Only some Prius are allowed. The others are not efficient enough.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Only some Prius are allowed. The others are not efficient enough.

     

    That's where you live?

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Yup. Every year they qualify only the most efficient cars. Since there are tons of hybrids on the market now, they do not all qualify. As you can understand, if they allow all hybrid cars, there will be too many cars in the lanes and the benefit will disappear. Would not be surprised if at some point it will be EV only and carpooling.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Elon Musk to receive 2019 Stephen Hawking Medal for Science Communication

    https://apple.news/A8Q7A5HynR-quFNYYRu9thA

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla is a pioneer that drives Volkswagen's EV initiatives, says CEO Herbert Diess

    https://apple.news/A44X75R10Sgav6EiXTf_t3A

    Whatever happens to Tesla, they have already changed the future of automobile wink


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    There is no one inn the world denying Tesla leads the charge to introduce proper EVs to the general public.

    But a lot of people seems to think Elon goes the wrong way. Their business mode hasn't proven sustainable yet.

    EV is one form of 'green' transport. It's the easiest to make, but may not be the best option, only time will tell.

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

     

    Whatever happens to Tesla, they have already changed the future of automobile wink

    It remains to be seen if EV cars will gain substantial market shares. Just mention it as the future might look very different from a EV driven car culture...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    MKSGR:
    SciFrog:

     

    Whatever happens to Tesla, they have already changed the future of automobile wink

    It remains to be seen if EV cars will gain substantial market shares. Just mention it as the future might look very different from a EV driven car culture...

    Agreed. Yes, Tesla has changed the future in a way or another but it remains to be seen if Tesla is actually the future.

    The VW emissions scandal is currently still blurring how the car markets in Europe are going to evolve sooner or later, so we need to be careful with predictions. People aren't ready (yet) for EVs for various reasons and the issues with charging infrastructure/time, high cost and battery production/recycling are also not really solved yet for a mass production market scenario. There is a lot of fantasy priced in into Tesla stocks. Smiley


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    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Lamborghini Huracan Performante (2019), Mercedes E63 S AMG Edition 1 (2018), Mercedes C63 S AMG Cab (2019), Range Rover Evoque Si4 Black Edition (2019)


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla is priced for beyond perfection. But they just raised $2.7bio without a glitch so there are a lot of believers out there...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla is priced for beyond perfection. But they just raised $2.7bio without a glitch so there are a lot of believers out there...

    Musk just needs to be a bit more careful and concentrate on making the company sustainable. $2.7B is a good cash reserve to move forward. 

    this EV truck stuff is silent since ages...

    the S needs some refresh...

    the roadster can wait.


    --

    GT Lover, Porsche fan

    991.2 GT3 manual, 991 GT3 2014(sold)

    Cayenne GTS 2014


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    From today's Wall Street Journal

    Brother, Tesla can't spare a dime

    Investors shouldn’t expect much mileage out of Tesla’s latest capital increase.

    The electric car company raised a total of $2.7 billion in convertible debt and stock earlier this month, its first trip to the capital markets since August 2017. That nearly two-year stretch was the company’s longest between raises since it went public in 2010. It would be a big surprise, however, if Tesla can wait that long next time.

    Elon Musk’s decision to shore up Tesla’s finances was certainly the right one given its likely trajectory without fresh cash. The auto maker posted a 31% sequential decline in first-quarter vehicle deliveries and burned nearly $1 billion in free cash. That left Tesla with $2.2 billion in cash and $3.2 billion in accounts payable at the end of the quarter, putting its long-term growth story, and even its medium-term survival, very much in question.

    The fresh infusion hasn’t boosted Tesla’s flagging stock price, though. It is down nearly 30% so far this year. In the past, issuing equity usually has sparked a rally. It didn’t assuage debtholders either. Tesla’s senior unsecured bonds due in 2025 yield about 600 basis points more than a comparable U.S. Treasury note—close to a record high.

    Get news and analysis on politics, policy, national security and more, delivered right to your inbox

    One reason is that intense competition, both in the luxury and mass-market ends of the electric-vehicle market, is much closer. Most is coming from legacy auto makers able to absorb poor or no profits to meet environmental goals.

    Another reason this time has been different: $2.7 billion won’t go nearly as far as in the past. For starters, Tesla spent a net $300 million to hedge its dilution risk from convertibles it just issued. Repaying debts will eat up another large chunk of the fresh cash. A $180 million term loan comes due at the end of June, while about $566 million in convertible bonds mature in November.

    Related video: Elon Musk’s Big Bet on Electric SUV

     

     

    Suppliers, too, will take their cut. Tesla could spend the entire remainder of the offering on paying down its bills and still owe vendors about $1.5 billion. Meanwhile, the auto maker says it will devote $2 billion to $2.5 billion this year to capital spending following a meager just $280 million in the first quarter.

    Tesla can certainly make that cash last longer by generating positive cash flow from its operations. Free cash flow in the final six months of 2018 was nearly $1.5 billion.

    A repeat performance is unlikely, though. Tesla benefited from years of pent-up demand for the Model 3 sedan in those quarters. Now it faces a shrunken retail presence, reduced U.S. tax incentives and the aforementioned wave of competitors.

    The company can conserve cash in other ways, like reducing capital spending or laying off more employees. But such moves risk further impairing its shaky growth prospects and suddenly fragile stock price. A recent flurry of IPOs shows that capital markets are, for now, still willing to fund unprofitable growth stories.

    Given that backdrop, Tesla would be wise to sell more stock when it can, not when it must.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla is priced for beyond perfection. But they just raised $2.7bio without a glitch so there are a lot of believers out there...

     

    See what was just posted above my post.

    The devil is in the details. Which Elon/Tesla didn't highlight. They only highlight the headline grabbing 2.7b.

    After all that's said and done, that 2.7b pretty much becomes 1.5b ish.

    Not much.

    And it was already hard work for Tesla to work out the deals to secure the 2.7b in the first place.

     

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Everything in that WSJ article was known maybe except for the $300mio. Anyway at first they said a little over $2bio which ended up being $2.7bio, all in 2 days... Hard work says who?

    The point is they decided to raise money and raised it without disrupting the market. A troubled company would have a hard time doing that.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Everything in that WSJ article was known maybe except for the $300mio. Anyway at first they said a little over $2bio which ended up being $2.7bio, all in 2 days... Hard work says who?

    The point is they decided to raise money and raised it without disrupting the market. A troubled company would have a hard time doing that.

     

    Who says they haven't been asking for money in the background for a long time? Did you not see the terms? Tesla has to pay out of pocket to hedge the debt, what healthy company does that? 

    And most people only sees the 'Tesla obtain 2.7b financing" headline and move on to other news. 

    Face it, Tesla is NOT a healthy company. 

    It is making cars that there is a market for, but then again it is in a monopoly right now. Motorola had a monopoly for flip phones for a while too, now where is Motorola in the cell phone market?

    It doesn't have a solid plan to profitability, all their numbers are based on hope and dreams. As far as I can remember, they never meet a single guidance they issued. Every quarter they ended up rushing the last 2 weeks just to get close to their numbers. 

    They had 2b in the bank, but not all of them are their money, together with the fresh money they have perhaps 3b to work with for the coming 4 quarters, would that be enough? The initial pent up orders for the Model 3 are gone, and those were the driving force for that 2 profitable quarters. Even then they missed the target for the 2nd profitable quarter and then the ship sank for the last quarter, big time.

    This is not doom and gloom, but just pointing out the obvious.

    Elon has a vision, but he also has ADD quality about Tesla, he simply cannot focus on making it great. He will run Tesla to the ground if he continues this path.There is a reason why every other car makers are profitable but Tesla is not, being different isn't advantageous. He would do well to cede control to a more experienced executive to right the ship. 

    The ship is not sinking yet, it's just listing and taking in water, but it can be righted in time and sail off to the distant. 

     

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    How different is it from Uber, Lyft or WeWork? None of them makes money and yet they raise capital as easily as Tesla. They are all priced for what they COULD become, not for their cash flow, “hope and dreams” have been fueling all angel, VC and such investing forever.

    Other car mass market manufacturers have been making cars for decades, and many if not all have gone bankrupt at one time or the other. Starting a new mass market car manufacturer in the USA was deemed impossible by many, including here, and everyone knew it would be extremely capital intensive. The surprise is that Tesla already got as far as it is today, not that it does not make enough money yet, all the while changing the landscape of automobile in the most significant way for decades. That’s what has all the Germans shaking in their boots: how far will they go before blowing up?

    Would I buy their stock or bonds even today? Absolutely not. It is not worth the hassle.

    Should Elon be put aside as chief strategist and have a solid CEO run the company day to day while Musk pushes for his visions? Probably at some point, but there is too much experimentation left to be played with.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla isn't a tech company.  While there is a technology component to its products, it remains a metal bender just like any other automaker.  Profitability is made or loss on the plant floor, just like GM, Ford, or Toyota.  Consequently, its economics and its business model doesn't resemble that of Uber, Lyft, or WeWorks.  Additionally, until recently none of those companies were under the scrutiny of the public markets to perform.  Tesla, on the other hand, went public many, many years ago, and its CEO has promised profitability for how many quarters?  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    WeWork is a tech company 

    Public or not, the insiders still know what is happening...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    WeWork is a tech company 

    Public or not, the insiders still know what is happening...

    The WeWork business model is closer to that of a bank; however, its valuations are defined by growth and investment in the tech sector.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    That’s exactly my point. The dichotomy in opinions on Tesla share price is largely due to how you think the company is valued like: a tech or a car manufacturer. For me it is neither, a hybrid...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2019-05-15/wework-wants-to-be-its-own-landlord-it-also-wants-2-8-billion

    At least Tesla has plants and machinery and some tech and patents. WeWork has just a “culture” and a LOT of long term leases on their books.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Audi goes after Tesla Supercharger V3: 'sustained power beats top power'

    https://apple.news/AIIT703aaSkG8VSAnWM_fpQ

    Anyone will come to their own biased conclusion.

    Personally, the Tesla approach suits much better since I would only use a supercharger if I cannot make it to my destination, so I would be low on battery, thus would benefit significantly from more charging in the beginning. Just recharge enough to get to you destination then slow charge there.

    If you charge all the way, it is a wash.

    So the Audi approach benefits people who use superchargers for 50 to 90%. The only group this would benefit is the one that cannot charge at home or at their destination, clearly that’s the minority.

    One very interesting data in the article is that Audi reserves 4% at the bottom (same as Tesla) but also 8% at the top of the battery, of course at the expense of range. Tesla recommends to limit the battery to 90% for daily usage but lets you use all the way to 100% for trips, and the user can set any limit it wants or needs in between.

    So Audi 95kw battery gives you 83kw usable, Tesla 102kw (real measure as per users) battery give you 98kw for trips. If you add up the efficiency difference, this explains the massive difference in EPA range rating in case you were doubting it.

    For a fair comparaison, the Audi graph right side should be shifted left by 8% on the X axis which would give a less dramatic visual impact.

    For a more Tesla biased comparaison, the X axis would have “miles of range” and not “battery %”. Because after all, what matters is how many minutes it take to get a certain number of miles (you know, so you can get to your destination), not how many % you just charged your battery by. If you do that, Tesla pretty much is always on top. As everyone knows here, graphs can be tweaked to make them reflect your opinion. In this case, it is very clear who made the chart smiley

    Also just to prove a point for bias, the graph of the Tesla 90D tops out at 110kw when today they can charge up to 150kw already. And I will not even go down the route of battery charger pre-conditioning capabilities of Tesla’s network which significantly affects charging times in case you did not know.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Personally, the Tesla approach suits much better since I would only use a supercharger if I cannot make it to my destination, so I would be low on battery, thus would benefit significantly from more charging in the beginning. Just recharge enough to get to you destination then slow charge there.

    I do the same for trips longer than 400km or if I like to speed. Typically this means a 10-15min break @110kW at a SUC. The only difference is in situations where there is no convenient destination charger or I don't know if it will work. In such cases I'll charge enough to get in and out of my destination. 

    The only group this would benefit is the one that cannot charge at home or at their destination, clearly that’s the minority.

    Traveling with the family usually requires longer brakes; so that could be a plus for the Audis (I read somewhere that they use a different type of cell chemistry that allows for longer high power charging).

    Agree, that miles/km would have been a smarter choice for the x-axis


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla completes acquisition of Maxwell, officially takes over the battery technology

    https://apple.news/Av9QOxIEfQV6oHSep2SLtTw

    Again after raising capital, all the signs of a flailing company angry

    On another more on topic note, I never realized the Tesla roadster has 4 seat angel Tesla might have just designed my dream car if the seats are usable for teenagers: rear seats, convertible, fast, fun, full of tech and with some cargo space to put the shopping bags. The big difference between this and the Aston or Ferrari is that I could use it for commuting since it has EV and autopilot. It even looks good in its own design language.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla completes acquisition of Maxwell, officially takes over the battery technology

    https://apple.news/Av9QOxIEfQV6oHSep2SLtTw

    Again after raising capital, all the signs of a flailing company angry

    On another more on topic note, I never realized the Tesla roadster has 4 seat angel Tesla might have just designed my dream car if the seats are usable for teenagers: rear seats, convertible, fast, fun, full of tech and with some cargo space to put the shopping bags. The big difference between this and the Aston or Ferrari is that I could use it for commuting since it has EV and autopilot. It even looks good in its own design language.

    You do realize that the Maxwell acquisition is stock acquisition, with little cash outlay?  The premium that Maxwell shareholders received above market price ensures that Tesla needs to fall significantly in equity value before the Maxwell shareholders are underwater.  That said, this doesn't imply that Maxwell wasn't overvalued when the equity swap ratio was determined.  Plus, a quarter-billion dollar stock acquisition isn't even materially significant to a company with a $40 billion market cap.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Of course I know, still Maxwell shareholders accepted the deal and that’s the real point my friend. Now they own all their patents for no cash and just some minor stock ownership dilution smiley, behold the power of a large market cap.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Of course I know, still Maxwell shareholders accepted the deal and that’s the real point my friend. Now they own all their patents for no cash and just some minor stock ownership dilution smiley, behold the power of a large market cap.

    Again, what does it really mean?  The core patents are about fibrilization and nothing more.  It is only one component of a multi-step process to form lithium ion batteries.  

    Given Tesla's track record of producing product without a comprehensive testing regime, this will probably be rushed into to production with little to no additional value to the supply chain.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla CEO Elon Musk launches new ‘hardcore’ cost-cutting effort, will review all expenses

    Fred Lambert

    Tesla CEO Elon Musk told employees today that he and the company’s new CFO will personally review all expenses going forward in a ‘hardcore’ attempt to cut cost following massive losses during the last quarter.

    Musk made the announcement in an email sent to all Tesla employees and obtained by Electrek.

    In the email, the CEO argued that it is “extremely important” to “examine every expenditure at Tesla, no matter how small.”

    He referenced Tesla’s last quarter during which the automaker lost $700 million.

    Even Tesla still had a $2.2 billion cash position at the end of last quarter, Musk said that it wouldn’t last that long with their burn rate:

    “This is a lot of money, but actually only gives us about 10 months at the Q1 burn rate to achieve breakeven!”

    In order to stop the bleeding, the CEO is implementing a new cost-cutting initiative that will see all the teams examine every payment, including “parts, salary, travel expenses, and rent.”

    The CEO added that Zach Kirkhorn, Tesla’s new CFO, will review and sign every page of outgoing payment while Musk himself will review and sign every tenth page.

    Musk described the effort as “hardcore”:

    “This is hardcore, but it is the only way for Tesla to become financially sustainable and succeed in our goal of helping make the world environmentally sustainable.”

    He said that employees have a few weeks to take ownership of expenses and find ways to make improvements.

    It’s not the first time that Musk called for a company-wide effort to cut costs.

    After Tesla first achieved a Model 3 production rate of 1,000 units per day last year, Musk turned his focus on cost and encourage everyone to make contributions.

    At the time, the CEO said that very small efficiency improvements, like “better packing density or rearranging process flow to a fewer forklift moves”, can have a great impact if everyone works on it.

    The new cost-cutting effort comes afterTesla laid off many employees in another attempt to reduce cost.

    Earlier this month, Tesla also closed a massive $2.7 billion capital raise in order to support its operations.

     


     
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