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    Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Rumors say that Schumacher will announce on this comming Italian GP that he will retire after this season, suposedly because Ferrari has not offered or assured him a serious enough project/car for next season. Guess we know were Kimi will be next season for sure now

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    If I was him I would go to the smallest of F1 teams (Super Aguri or MF1) and put all my experiences and efforts in it. After all, there isn't much for him to pursuit anymore. He basically has all records under his belt.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    ha said:
    If I was him I would go to the smallest of F1 teams (Super Aguri or MF1) and put all my experiences and efforts in it. After all, there isn't much for him to pursuit anymore. He basically has all records under his belt.



    Very true. And everybody knows he's the best anyway, so why not just have some fun and help some newer faces into the sport? I'm not sure anyone could just disconnect from the F1 lifestyle after 15 years.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    he is the best driver ever,no doubt, and the worst character...

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    dhayek said:
    he is the best driver ever,no doubt, and the worst character...



    It is often lonely at the top. Besides, I hear he's quite nice in his private life, while being a dick on the circuit is part of the whole "winner" act.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Lets open champagne and celebrate

    After Kovalainen being confirmed in Renault next year, Raikkonen will 99% go to Ferrari, and Schumacher would not go head to head with him

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    dhayek said:
    he is the best driver ever,no doubt, and the worst character...



    I disagree. Schumi is a great driver, but he's always had the benefit of the most dominant car. I think Senna and Fangio are both superior to Schumi...

    Furthermore, Schumi's lackluster character would lead us to believe that he would never join a team like Super Aguri...

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    Quote:
    dhayek said:
    he is the best driver ever,no doubt, and the worst character...



    I disagree. Schumi is a great driver, but he's always had the benefit of the most dominant car. I think Senna and Fangio are both superior to Schumi...

    Furthermore, Schumi's lackluster character would lead us to believe that he would never join a team like Super Aguri...



    Schumi also did well with the inferior Ferrari, so I still maintain that he's the best driver of the bunch. I've always rooted against him, just because everybody else rooted FOR him, but he is the best, without any doubt.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    If this is true, as an american f1 fan, im disappointed. I have really enjoyed watch MS over the past 7-8 yrs. I think he is the best driver of all time. He might have a bad attitude sometimes, but he knows racing better than anybody. I doubt Ferrari will let him go. But if they do, I hope he retires. Also, I really hope were not going to have to watch Alonso be the only dominate racer for to long. He speaks bad english an looks like a waiter. And if I were Ferrari I would give Button a shot over Kimi.. Kimi just has to bad of luck..

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    I disagree. Schumi is a great driver, but he's always had the benefit of the most dominant car. I think Senna and Fangio are both superior to Schumi...

    Furthermore, Schumi's lackluster character would lead us to believe that he would never join a team like Super Aguri...



    I totally 100% agree and can't believe no one else has said this. From 2000-2004 the Ferrari was superior to everything. In 1994 he had to take out Damon Hill to win the title. The current season is an excellent example of why Schumacher is no better than Alonso or Raikonnen- he always must have the fastest car to win. When the Renault is on form, Schumi can;t do anything and looks totally mortal.

    And now he is finally winning some races, but again, the Ferrari is superior to everything else on the grid. What gets me is some people act as though if Schumacher were driving a Midland he could lap the whole field due to his immense talent. And look what happens when his teammate gets some equal treatment- He wins the race!

    Ok, I'll stop the rant. No disrespect to you Schu fans, I get really passionate of the subject.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Schumi's is an excellent driver no doubt. But here's how I differentiate the stratas of talent in F1:

    The testdriver: technically sound, yet mentally flimsy. Put him on a barren track and you can call him Senna. Put him on the grid and the knees will clamor.

    The basic driver: interchangeable, adequate. He has the drive and the push to get through the race, but something is lacking for him to push towards the top. Often times its political ("you crash again, you're out Sato"), other times its mental ("oh my goodness, that's Michael Schummacher in my rearview...*gulp"). They float around and they service their teams, but their whispers of talent and explosiveness never materialize.

    The pseudo-materialist: The driver that shows flashes of brilliance but can't put the pieces together. They might have the potential to be greater than anyone, but for whatever inexplicable reason the wheels come apart.

    The materialist: he gets the job done, no questions asked. People question his talent and his ride (as being his ticket), but he really never buckles down under pressure.

    The magician: you give him a set of wheels and he'll race. He'll manuver and plot and scheme and make moves and somehow, when the checkered flag is waving, he's raising the trophy.

    ------

    I think Senna is more magician than Schumi ever was. Think back to races at Monaco, where his gearbox was faulty, missing 3rd and 4th gear. He carefully averts the field, coping with the failures, manuvering, mastering.

    Schumi definitely has touches of magic, but he has more touches of soundness than extrordinary displays. Most of his wins this years were via qualifying/pit strategies. Did he make a single brilliant pass a la 2005 Raikkonen on Fisichella @ Suzuka.
    You might argue that Schumacher shouldn't be penalized for allying himself with a competitive ride, and I agree, but he just doesn't transcend the sport.

    If anything, his most impressive year to date, in my opinion, was last year where he did not win nor competed at the top for most of the year. He had a few landmark races where his racing skills shined through his woeful car. I haven't seen that from him much at all this year...

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Please, let's not forget that it takes "TWO"- the driver and the team to win. Michaels experience in the car definitely helps Ferrari improving and winning.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Rumors say that Schumacher will announce on this comming Italian GP that he will retire after this season, suposedly because Ferrari has not offered or assured him a serious enough project/car for next season. Guess we know were Kimi will be next season for sure now



    Another rumor is that Ferrari will announce that they have Kimi, Schumi and Massa in their lineup next year, to give Schumi a few more races to decide (and try to win the championship). If Ferrari wins a 1-2 at Monza he is 8 points behind Alonso.

    As a Ferrari fan since '92, I have been following MS closely and in this discussion I think you are missing one important point about MS - his ability to build a winning team around him.

    Yes he can be an [censored] on the track, the latest example was the Hungaroring where I think he lost this years championship by not letting de la Rosa and Heidfeld past and settle for 4th.

    But he has a ruthless determination to win, like the great Senna who also ran several people off the track to win, which means that he makes some bad decisions sometimes.

    But it is his ability to work WITH his team, to build a winning spirit even in the lady who cleans the floors in the engine factory that makes him one of the greatest of all time. What exactly this ability consists of I'm not sure, I just know that he has it. (Another person who has this ability is Briatore) MS will go testing and testing and testing until the car is perfect, will sit down with his engineers, engine, or tire people for hours and days to sort things out and has probably worked harder than any of the other (current) drivers to get to where he is today.

    Compare that to "divas" like Montoya who mostly worked against his team in McLaren

    You can't just show up on sunday and drive fast, you have to look at the whole operation of a F1 team and make it work with and for you. And that's what MS does better than anybody else, and that is why he is a 7 times world champion.

    That's my 2 cents.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    I agree with Hurst.

    Schumacher works very hard, in paddock after practice he still talks to his engineers while many other drivers are already on launch or whereever. But the best driver dont crack under pressure like Schumacher, the best driver can pass driver whose car is worse (Turkey 2006).. and dont need to crash to other drivers and park a car in tight corner to make sure that no one will do better time.

    Remember Silverstone 1999 when he hurt himself in crash, before that Eddie Irvine almost never won, after this, he won two races in row. He said that Schumi`s car is better. Schumacher was always favorized in Ferrari and he had really dominant car from 2000 - 2004. Even Button could win a championship in Ferrari in those years

    For sure he is excelent driver with very good tehnical knowledge, but he do to many mistakes to be the best.

    I will never forget race of champions, when Schumacher raced against Kovalainen, they both had F360 Challenge and Kavolaninen won

    ocnatv: Alonso`s engislh mybie isnt the best, but it is not language turnament but F1 racing and there he is right now on top of top class Mine engish isnt the best too, so I dont hear Alonso`s mistakes

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    Schumi's is an excellent driver no doubt......
    I think Senna is more magician than Schumi ever was. Think back to races at Monaco, where his gearbox was faulty, missing 3rd and 4th gear. He carefully averts the field, coping with the failures, manuvering, mastering.

    Schumi definitely has touches of magic, but he has more touches of soundness than extrordinary displays. Most of his wins this years were via qualifying/pit strategies. Did he make a single brilliant pass a la 2005 Raikkonen on Fisichella @ Suzuka.......



    I guess you choose to remember specific events to justify your opinion and forget other events that may contadict it. Schumi was left with only one gear, 5th gear to be exact, in 1995 during the Spanish Grand Prix for half of the race distance and he still won. Check 4th paragraph..
    http://www.castrol.com/castrol/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9000007&contentId=7000119

    I 've been following F1 since 1986, when I was only 10, and when the SENNA and PROST era came, Senna was very similar to Schumi, in both performance, and attitude.

    I remember how so many people disliked or hated Senna for his behavior on and off the track.
    Not because he was doing stupid things, but because he was unapproachable, enigmatic and very, very competitive on the track.
    He would block anyone and attack anyone, regardless of who was involved.

    In fact he deliberately (he admitted it himself!) slammed on Prost's Mclaren 1989 (1st occasion) and Prost's Ferrari 1990 (2nd occasion) in order to secure the title.

    And then came the tragic day of May 1st 1994 when all the viewers, including me, were left speechless on the announcement that he had been killed in IMOLA.

    From then on, even the most ignorant and clueless person claims that SENNA was, is, and will be the best driver ever.

    So come on!
    Does Schumi have to get hurt in order to be respected?
    I am sick of listening to people claiming that Senna was the best, simply because he past away.

    Get a clue people, this is racing, not charity. Of course Schumi performed some ugly moves but he has also pulled some astonishing victories.

    I totally agree that blocking Damon Hill in Adelaide in 1994 was very bad, as well as slamming Villneuve the year later, but is this the only thing you remember from the carrier of the 7times world champion?

    Give me the name of one multiple (more than twice) world champion who was nice and kind in F1.

    Do you really think that Hakinen and Schumi had the same equipment in 1998? Mclaren was far better during that year, and Mika should have won much easier.
    And do you really consider that in 1999 Mika beat Schumi? Schumi broke his leg at Silverstone and was out for 6 races.

    Same story in 1996, his first year with Ferrari, when Ferrari was in terrible shape, having a very unreliable car scoring 6 DNFs in the first 10 races.
    In 1997 again the Williams of Villneuve was unstoppable and again it came down to the last races, a situation Villneuve should have avoided if he is that good.

    So Schumi did not really have an easy carrier, and if your opinion is based on the championships he won in 2002 and 2004 then you should look better into his carrier and not jump into any conclusions..

    Michael took the title down to the last race in both 1997 and 1998 when Williams and Mclaren, respectively, were far superior during those seasons.

    Also in 1994, 1995, 2000, 2003 he did not have the best car. In case you disagree, just for reference check these short reports of each season as well as of each race:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher

    I am stating facts, and I have not said that he is the best ever. It is just that I cannot understand how the perception of people about facts (not assumptions or rumors) can be different.

    Seasons 2001, 2002 and 2004 (32 wins) were easy for Schumi, no doubt about it.
    So even if you take away the three most successful seasons of Schumi he still has 57 wins (Total Wins: 89 - Wins during 2001, 2002 and 2004: 32), which is more than second place man Alain Prost who has 51. And Prost had absolutely no competition in 1993, when Senna was struggling with a Ford powered Mclaren.. and his team mate in Williams was Damon Hill...

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    I think the younger members here do not know what a talent Senna was. MS is a few steps below. He is good but Senna was out of this world.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    He truly is one of a kind, like Mohammad Ali in Boxing and Michael Jordan in Basket Ball and Pley in Soccer

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Ah...there is still something Schum hasn't done...win at LeMans!

    Would love to see Schum in an Audi at LeMans in a post retirement career. While his career is at the end with F1, he could race in sports cars well into his 40's or more, dominate and become a true cross breed race car legend, like those famous names of the 60's and 70's, that would race one series on Saturday and another on Sunday!

    He won't be getting paid 100M, but I am sure he is at a point where he doesn't need money.

    Matter of fact, let's just bring Can-Am back and seperate the men from the boys!

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    TRF414WCR said:
    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    Schumi's is an excellent driver no doubt......
    I think Senna is more magician than Schumi ever was. Think back to races at Monaco, where his gearbox was faulty, missing 3rd and 4th gear. He carefully averts the field, coping with the failures, manuvering, mastering.

    Schumi definitely has touches of magic, but he has more touches of soundness than extrordinary displays. Most of his wins this years were via qualifying/pit strategies. Did he make a single brilliant pass a la 2005 Raikkonen on Fisichella @ Suzuka.......



    I guess you choose to remember specific events to justify your opinion and forget other events that may contadict it. Schumi was left with only one gear, 5th gear to be exact, in 1995 during the Spanish Grand Prix for half of the race distance and he still won. Check 4th paragraph..
    http://www.castrol.com/castrol/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9000007&contentId=7000119

    I 've been following F1 since 1986, when I was only 10, and when the SENNA and PROST era came, Senna was very similar to Schumi, in both performance, and attitude.

    I remember how so many people disliked or hated Senna for his behavior on and off the track.
    Not because he was doing stupid things, but because he was unapproachable, enigmatic and very, very competitive on the track.
    He would block anyone and attack anyone, regardless of who was involved.

    In fact he deliberately (he admitted it himself!) slammed on Prost's Mclaren 1989 (1st occasion) and Prost's Ferrari 1990 (2nd occasion) in order to secure the title.

    And then came the tragic day of May 1st 1994 when all the viewers, including me, were left speechless on the announcement that he had been killed in IMOLA.

    From then on, even the most ignorant and clueless person claims that SENNA was, is, and will be the best driver ever.

    So come on!
    Does Schumi have to get hurt in order to be respected?
    I am sick of listening to people claiming that Senna was the best, simply because he past away.

    Get a clue people, this is racing, not charity. Of course Schumi performed some ugly moves but he has also pulled some astonishing victories.

    I totally agree that blocking Damon Hill in Adelaide in 1994 was very bad, as well as slamming Villneuve the year later, but is this the only thing you remember from the carrier of the 7times world champion?

    Give me the name of one multiple (more than twice) world champion who was nice and kind in F1.

    Do you really think that Hakinen and Schumi had the same equipment in 1998? Mclaren was far better during that year, and Mika should have won much easier.
    And do you really consider that in 1999 Mika beat Schumi? Schumi broke his leg at Silverstone and was out for 6 races.

    Same story in 1996, his first year with Ferrari, when Ferrari was in terrible shape, having a very unreliable car scoring 6 DNFs in the first 10 races.
    In 1997 again the Williams of Villneuve was unstoppable and again it came down to the last races, a situation Villneuve should have avoided if he is that good.

    So Schumi did not really have an easy carrier, and if your opinion is based on the championships he won in 2002 and 2004 then you should look better into his carrier and not jump into any conclusions..

    Michael took the title down to the last race in both 1997 and 1998 when Williams and Mclaren, respectively, were far superior during those seasons.

    Also in 1994, 1995, 2000, 2003 he did not have the best car. In case you disagree, just for reference check these short reports of each season as well as of each race:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher

    I am stating facts, and I have not said that he is the best ever. It is just that I cannot understand how the perception of people about facts (not assumptions or rumors) can be different.

    Seasons 2001, 2002 and 2004 (32 wins) were easy for Schumi, no doubt about it.
    So even if you take away the three most successful seasons of Schumi he still has 57 wins (Total Wins: 89 - Wins during 2001, 2002 and 2004: 32), which is more than second place man Alain Prost who has 51. And Prost had absolutely no competition in 1993, when Senna was struggling with a Ford powered Mclaren.. and his team mate in Williams was Damon Hill...



    I clearly don't have as exhaustive of an F1 background as you and eprhaps I do romantacize Senna due to his death, but some statistics cannot lie as well:

    -Senna was a better qualifier than Schumi, no doubt. His pole position record was achieved in far fewer races than Schumi's comperable statistic.

    -Senna had Prost on the same team, another all-time great driver, to really portray his talent. Schumi has historically had a B driver, most flagrantly shown when he passed Barrichello in a lame 1-2 fix a few years ago.

    -Senna raced in an era where downforce setup was second to mechanical superiority, which makes it hard to compare their relative car setups, but I think we can unequivocally say that Senna's age was more of a driver's age, prior to the slew of deaths and increased safety/technological advancements...

    Thanks though, for the alternate view. I find it refreshing and educational

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Schumacher is not and never was as good as Senna,Prost,Lauda,Alonso,Raikkonen,etc.

    Schumacher makes a lot of mistakes under pressure and he is also "easy" to overtake.Alonso already passed him twice from the outside.

    I have never seen Schumacher make an opening lap like Senna did in the 1993 Donington GP where he overtook 4 or 5 cars.He was 5th or 6th on the grid and after the first lap he was leading the GP.
    Senna also once beated his teammate by over a 1 second in qualifying in Monaco GP.His team mate was a certain Alain Prost who qualified in 2nd position...

    Speaking of teamates:Schumacher ALWAYS refused to have good good drivers as his team mate.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    TRF414WCR said:
    Also in 1994, 1995, 2000, 2003 he did not have the best car. In case you disagree, just for reference check these short reports of each season as well as of each race:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher




    A good way to see which team build the best car is to look at the constructers championship.In 1995,2000 and 2003 the team of Schumacher finished first.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    Carlos from Spain said:
    Rumors say that Schumacher will announce on this comming Italian GP that he will retire after this season, suposedly because Ferrari has not offered or assured him a serious enough project/car for next season. Guess we know were Kimi will be next season for sure now



    Last weekend at the Goodwood Revival I had the privilege to talk to Sir Stirling Moss. I asked him when he felt that Michael Schumacher should retire. His reply "Should have retired by now - he's making far too many mistakes"

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Those are good points Walter. I have watched footage of Montoya overtaking Schumacher and making him look totally silly. The way I have observed it has been that Schumacher excels when his car is way beyond what everyone else has and he will set fast lap after fast lap. There is no one challenging him and he puts on a show. But when there is real racing involved he tends to stumble.

    Moss is right about mistakes - MS sould have one Turkey if not for the qualifying mistake.

    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    Quote:
    Walter said:
    Quote:
    TRF414WCR said:
    Also in 1994, 1995, 2000, 2003 he did not have the best car. In case you disagree, just for reference check these short reports of each season as well as of each race:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Schumacher




    A good way to see which team build the best car is to look at the constructers championship.In 1995,2000 and 2003 the team of Schumacher finished first.



    Benetton had great key people at that time... and when Schumacher moved to Ferreri (the richest team) almost all important personal from Benetton went to Ferrari with Schumacher (Ross Brawn and co), so 1997 Ferrari was almost red Benetton. So he putted really big effort to make Ferrari a top team

    LOL is that new fashion?


    Re: Rumor says Shumacher is retiring

    yet he still has most of records!

     
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