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    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Thanks - hope I have a chance to sample one sometime!


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    To add few comment from original article:

    -991 Turbo S offers sharper throttle response at low revs and in comparison there is a noticable turbo leg below 3000rpm on 650S. Above 4000rpm 650S goes like a starship with warp like till its rev limit.

    -991 Turbo S brakes are better on limit and uneven surface. They are better calibrated as well.

    -650S is really only marginally faster on the track with ESP off and then it requires more experienced driver with firmer hand. Its traction is amazing for a sportscar with open diff.

    -991 Turbo S PDK is way smoother at low speed and city driving. It offers amazing low speed comfort for such a car.

     


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    People who are after the McLaren's colossal power and speed advantage might consider the above-mentioned deficits (brakes,turbo lag, DCT) as insignificant. But they show that the Porsche's development is more thorough and complete with attention to detail.

    Small manufacturers often leave some things somewhat unfinished and their cars can never be totally honed because of the constraints of resources and numbers.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    reginos:

    People who are after the McLaren's colossal power and speed advantage might consider the above-mentioned deficits (brakes,turbo lag, DCT) as insignificant. But they show that the Porsche's development is more thorough and complete with attention to detail.

    While I have yet to drive both cars or read the article, all the reports I hear indicate the ride quality and comfort of the 650S is far superior to the Turbo S's around town - that could offset the above disparities in favor of the 650S, particularly if you live in a place without smooth roads.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    McLaren has this innovative damping.

    Porsche own PASM system might not be the best. This is an area where Porsche could improve IMO, although 991 rides significantly better than the 997.

    Audi's damping using magneto-rheological fluid (also used by Ferrari) gives better results.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    reginos:

    Audi's damping using magneto-rheological fluid (also used by Ferrari) gives better results.

     

     This was first used on Chevrolet, before Ferrari Smiley


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Grant:
    reginos:

    Audi's damping using magneto-rheological fluid (also used by Ferrari) gives better results.

     

     This was first used on Chevrolet, before Ferrari Smiley

    I am amazed Smiley


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Wasn't it actually a Cadillac that had the first car with the magnaride system? (Also GM of course). 


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    SuzyF:

    Wasn't it actually a Cadillac that had the first car with the magnaride system? (Also GM of course). 

     I thought it was Corvette, but you could be right.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Grant:
    SuzyF:

    Wasn't it actually a Cadillac that had the first car with the magnaride system? (Also GM of course). 

     I thought it was Corvette, but you could be right.

    I remember some 10-12 years ago back in Holland, one of our neighbours had a Cadillac Seville STS?? (don't see them very often in Holland) and that car had that Magnaride. I remember him bragging that it was the first car ever to have such system. Not 100% sure though... Smiley I only remember that car because it had a 3rd brakelight over the complete width of the trunk. I'd never seen something like that Smiley


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Grant:
    reginos:

    People who are after the McLaren's colossal power and speed advantage might consider the above-mentioned deficits (brakes,turbo lag, DCT) as insignificant. But they show that the Porsche's development is more thorough and complete with attention to detail.

    While I have yet to drive both cars or read the article, all the reports I hear indicate the ride quality and comfort of the 650S is far superior to the Turbo S's around town - that could offset the above disparities in favor of the 650S, particularly if you live in a place without smooth roads.

    Not so sure, last time I tried to fit into a Mac it was a whole new experience getting in. 


    --

     

    2014 991 Turbo 
    2012 991 C2S w/Fabspeed SOLD
    2011 Turbo S Cab SOLD
    2006 Cayman S SOLD

     


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    I have heard on ML that the 650S CCB brakes are near-Porsche perfect. Maybe not 100%, but very close. Take it for what it's worth I guess.

    I disagree that the magnetic shocks on Audi are superior. I've driven them and they aren't IMO. I find even the 12C ride to be vastly better. Just my seat of the pants opinion though.


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    noone1:

    I have heard on ML that the 650S CCB brakes are near-Porsche perfect. Maybe not 100%, but very close. Take it for what it's worth I guess.

    I disagree that the magnetic shocks on Audi are superior. I've driven them and they aren't IMO. I find even the 12C ride to be vastly better. Just my seat of the pants opinion though.

    McLaren has worked very hard to improve on the aspects of the 12C for which owners/drivers had complaints.  This sort of evolution is very much encouraging.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    EnglishManInNY:

    I would never replace my TTS Cab with a 650s due to my kids and the weather where I live. I also use it on a daily basis which I think it's better suited for. As an Exotic addition maybe. 

    But you can't argue with these stats...

    Smiley Agreed. I told Porsche before, numbers will be decision makers. I guess they need to learn that the hard way.

    The 991 Turbo S needed 600 hp from the start and a 0-200 kph performance of 9.5 seconds and 0-300 kph performance of 27 seconds. What Porsche is doing is keeping up with the competition and then throwing in the facelift. This may work but it will make customers angry at some point. 

    I love my 991 Turbo S, in real life driving situations, I never had a single car being faster but this doesn't mean Porsche couldn't do better. Numbers sell cars and while the 0-100 kph acceleration is phenomenal on the 991 Turbo S, Porsche could have done much better in the 0-200 and 0-300 kph department. Oh well...what do I know?! Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    SuzyF:
    MKW:
    SuzyF:

    I'm not a fan of McLaren. .... can't stand Ron Dennis' face angry


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     

    that's a new one...is it a chick thing ? 

    how many here have ever factored in the buying decision of any product based also on the appearance of  that firm's execs running the firm ?  Like saying I won't buy a  Porsche until Matthias  Mueller fixes his bangs hiding his obvious receding hairline !

    Smiley Sorry I can't help it. No idea if it is a female thing. FWIW... It wouldn't effect my buying decision if wanted a McLaren. i just never liked their cars . Matter of taste I guess. Smiley (doesn't take away anything of the cars themselves. It's just my own opinion)


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     

    I'm with Suzy. I have hated Ron Dennis' smug mug for years!!!!  the road cars are growing on me, the depreciation makes 12c's relative value kinda like 599 hgte's


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    964C2:

    Pricing dynamics are interesting...here in the US the Turbo S is the equivalent of 132,000 Euros and here in Texas the sale tax is another 8.25%. 

    in New Zealand a decent turbos S is 225k euro, lots of fun.  importation here we come.  and the Macan turbo i have coming locally in Auckland is 100 euro with just VCT, Chrono, and few small options.....  Smiley


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    RC:
    EnglishManInNY:

    I would never replace my TTS Cab with a 650s due to my kids and the weather where I live. I also use it on a daily basis which I think it's better suited for. As an Exotic addition maybe. 

    But you can't argue with these stats...

    Smiley Agreed. I told Porsche before, numbers will be decision makers. I guess they need to learn that the hard way.

    The 991 Turbo S needed 600 hp from the start and a 0-200 kph performance of 9.5 seconds and 0-300 kph performance of 27 seconds. What Porsche is doing is keeping up with the competition and then throwing in the facelift. This may work but it will make customers angry at some point. 

     

    Porsche also needs a replacement for the GT2/GT2RS. If the turbo is not as fast as the competition (although at the same price point, nearly...) they should at least have another offer for those interested in the fastest car around. Those who drive the GT2RS would consider a new model for sure. Alternatively, they could just continue driving their "old" cars as they are still competitive with all the new 650/700 hp cars Smiley


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    What is the maximum potential output from the new Turbo engine? Maybe they cannot go up to the 650 hp for a GT2 RS replacement. RUF do a 650 hp tuning on that engine but small manufacturers can do things differently and more freely.

    A Turbo RWD is a must, as well as a McLaren rival and a front engined coupe. The latter one could cover anything from Mercedes to Maserati and even the F12. The small roadster would be a hit too, if done properly.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    SuzyF:

    Wasn't it actually a Cadillac that had the first car with the magnaride system? (Also GM of course). 

    Here's the latest exotic car to have this suspension:

    http://www.autoblog.com/2014/04/26/2015-chevrolet-ss-manual-transmission-magnetic-ride-suspension-report/


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    RC:
    EnglishManInNY:

    I would never replace my TTS Cab with a 650s due to my kids and the weather where I live. I also use it on a daily basis which I think it's better suited for. As an Exotic addition maybe. 

    But you can't argue with these stats...

    Smiley Agreed. I told Porsche before, numbers will be decision makers. I guess they need to learn that the hard way.

    The 991 Turbo S needed 600 hp from the start and a 0-200 kph performance of 9.5 seconds and 0-300 kph performance of 27 seconds. What Porsche is doing is keeping up with the competition and then throwing in the facelift. This may work but it will make customers angry at some point. 

    I love my 991 Turbo S, in real life driving situations, I never had a single car being faster but this doesn't mean Porsche couldn't do better. Numbers sell cars and while the 0-100 kph acceleration is phenomenal on the 991 Turbo S, Porsche could have done much better in the 0-200 and 0-300 kph department. Oh well...what do I know?! Smiley

    Christian, what do you know)?


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Every time I make a complaint or a suggestion, I get the same reply: "we are considering this for future products" or my most beloved reply "you are one of the low percentage of 3% of customers who want that...".


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    That is so funny!


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    RC:

    Every time I make a complaint or a suggestion, I get the same reply: "we are considering this for future products" or my most beloved reply "you are one of the low percentage of 3% of customers who want that...".


    Well, in the meantime they know you. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    The 650S spider is the car to buy in the 200-300k range IMHO...


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Price of press example of 650S Spider that Sport Auto tested is 313K Euro in Germany...

    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    When will the super test happen Kreso? 


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    650S is an amazing car, but definitely not cheap. I think Euro prices are higher, but you're probably looking at $300K for a 650S Coupe in the US. I think the Spider is only $15K more though, which is quite reasonable compared to how much of a premium some exotic convertibles are to the coupes.

    I still think coupes look best and have more space inside, but Spider is probably the way to go on a McLaren due to it being pretty much identical in performance to the coupe.

    Note that you can also do pretty much anything to the McLaren with MSO. They offer a lot of cool stuff if you have the coin, much like Ferrari, though probably a bit cheaper than Ferrari special order items.


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    noone1:

    650S is an amazing car, but definitely not cheap. I think Euro prices are higher, but you're probably looking at $300K for a 650S Coupe in the US.

    Retail starts at $265k.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    Grant:
    noone1:

    650S is an amazing car, but definitely not cheap. I think Euro prices are higher, but you're probably looking at $300K for a 650S Coupe in the US.

    Retail starts at $265k.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550

    Retail starts without options though. I'd expect $30K in options.


    Re: 991 Turbo S vs McLaren 650S Spider Sport Auto test results

    KresoF1:
    Price of press example of 650S Spider that Sport Auto tested is 313K Euro in Germany...

    It's amazing for the Turbo S @ €197K, that everybody compares it with a super-expensive and bespoke supercar made in limited numbers by a F1 outfit.

    If I were Porsche, I would have introduced a further price hike immediately Smiley

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


     
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