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    Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Did you ever think it's odd that we have to try so hard to find out about the 997/S from various "random" internet sources?

    The Porsche website isn't very informative; it's not indepth. I have no good idea of what some of the options and colors look like from the Official Website.

    My salesman has a measily little notebook with more or less the same photos on the website. Some of his answers to my questions are WRONG; this I find out after going to various boards and unofficial websites..

    There are no actual cars at the dealer with, for example, sports seats, I can try out before I order them. I have to rely on the good-intentioned writings of guys who actually have them.

    What's going on here? Why are we mostly relying on the good cheer and resourcefullness of the guys on the various boards (esp. Renntean! Thanks!) to get the information we need?

    You'd think Porsche website would grow with an ever more in-depth photo gallery of the various options as they are built into actual cars. Maybe have a guy out on the test track with a camera photographing actual cars that are heading off to customers after the road tests. Heck, I would even volunteer to do this for a week.

    It seems strange to be collecting information unofficially.

    BTW:three cheers go to RC for setting up that Gallery for us!!! THANK YOU RC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Do you know of any other internet sources which have been helpful to collecting information about the 997/S?

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    I agree with you MMD,i am due to collect my 997 c2s today ,but i must say i have not been impressed with the dealership/salesman.This is my first porsche ,previously been a bmw man,and i have to say i have found the whole buying experience to be very stressful,which was not the case with previous car purchases in the uk.I think i had false expectations,in that i maybe thought as i was spending Pounds70,000 on a car that i would receive top quality advice and service,but it didnt work like that.I think a lot of my problems are basically due to the fact that my salesman is just incompetent,dont get me wrong he is a nice guy but i have lost confidence in him over time.He has given me poor info on many issues and if it wasnt for the brilliant "rennteam" i would probably be non the wiser,so i would like to thank all you guys out there for your help I am sure the car will be awesome when i pick it up in 2 hours ,but beleive me i am going to check it over carefully to make sure the spec is exactly as ordered

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    I have spoken to numerous different sales people at numerous different dealerships, and I too have been given wrong and incomplete information by many of them. I even had one guy tell me that the current TT was a 997-based car! I found that after spending a few weeks educating myself to prepare for a 997 purchase, I knew more about the car than at least 50% of the people selling them.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Each salesperson in North America attended a 1.5 day training event in Ontario, CA called COOL. It was a whirlwind of team learning, but if they have not done there reading, the lack of knowledge does not surprize me.

    I'am not a salesperson but I did attend COOL, it was interesting to be among this crowd,, the majority were just salespeople who could could just as well be selling refrigerators, pathetic. The number who were genuine CAR people were few.

    Each Dealer Salesperson should have a copy of : "Produce Information 911 Carrera/911 Carrera S" a 116 pg book with loads of information...ask to see it!

    Another Great Info reference for your 997
    the official Porsche(C) Service Information 2005 Technik Introduction 997 Carrera/997 Carrera S.
    This is a wonderful spiralbound book, about 100 pages of great color pictures, photographs, and detail explanations of how the newest 997 works.
    Order thru your dealers parts dept
    Porsche part number PNA 489 421 05
    About $25

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    One thing I've realized after purchasing many "enthusiast" vehicles like the M3, M5, C-TT, and now the 997S is that the "enthusiasts" aggressively pursue any tidbit of news/knowledge/expertise on the vehicle being considered. While most salespersons (not all mind you ), aggressively pursue how to get the most money from the "enthusiast." For us it's a passion. For them (again not all), it's a cold business.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    bgarrett said:
    I even had one guy tell me that the current TT was a 997-based car!

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    The whole process of buying a Porsche to order in the UK is extremely complicated and highly stressful. As I posted previously on Rennteam, on the week I was due to pick up my car it was found out that it was manual instead of tiptronic. It also turned out that the car had no sunroof, an option I would simply not have done without.

    They have now agreed to give me the Sales Managers 997 tip on loan until my new car arrives but I have to say that I must echo the sentiments of others and say that we the buyers know far more about the cars than the sellers and that is an unacceptable state of affairs. I can't imagine any other industry where you would accept the idea of paying Pounds70k to buy something where you are telling the salesman what they should know about the product.

    I have also had a number of (and still have) BMWs and this is always a much easier process for a number of reasons:

    (a) there are less options
    (b) more cars sold which are standard spec rather than factory orders.
    (c) the ordering systems are less chaotic than Porsche.

    Luckily for Porsche, their products sell themselves and so they can survive with less than expert sales staff.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    The problem is that car has sold itself for years now. The car hasn't needed a good sales force to sell it. Porsche AG is in no hurry to improve the sales force as this means relinquishing power within the distribution structure.

    I have really been pleased with Kronos Porsche in Belgium but they are the exception. They work very hard at getting information (not easy) and supporting their customers. But they are the exception and not the rule.

    Whenever I talk to my local dealership in Connecticut I am amazed at how bad they are. While they had no cars on the floor they were downright rude. Only now do they make any attempt whatsoever to try to promote the car.

    This is yet another reason why PAG will not ultimately be able to remain independent in an increasingly competitive market segment.


    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Absolutely agree. I have a Porsche-Audi dealership 20 miles from my home. While the service dept. is excellent, the salesman(?)would take an hour and a half to watch 60 minutes. Only 1 997, not an S, said it's "bacically the same a last years model", that's why I should consider buying one of the "previously owned" on the lot. BRILLIANT!! Should be a K-Mart greeter.I had to go 150 miles to get what I wanted, but it was worth the trip.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Congrats o the new car. Which Porsche centre did you buy from?

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Porsche has very basic sales training problems that are inherent with a straight commission sales force.

    Sure they are some very knowledgable and engaging Porsche sales people, but on the whole they have high turnover.

    Porsche is not willing to spend the time and money to educate them if their average life is 4 months.Porsche will do a corporate wide education seminar for a new product launch, but keeping them advised on limited slip diffs, windshield tint bands and details of 12 steering wheel options is too much for Porsche to deal with.

    Exclusive car but common sales experience does ruin the fun.

    Like anything else, there are good salesmen and bad salesmen

    Before I buy a car I learn all I can about the product through the internet, car magazines and the manufacturers information. I will not buy a car from a salesman who is not knowledgeable about his product.

    My wife doesn't like car shopping with me because she knows I will ask the salesman questions for which I already know the answers. Fortunately I have found knowledgeable salesmen that represent the brands of cars we currently own or are interested in owning. We give them our repeat business.

    It has become easier to stump even the knowledgeable salesmen since the advent of the internet. Sometimes I learn things here, for example, that my salesman has not yet heard officially from Porsche. I don't blame him for that since some of the info we get here is not yet official.

    The internet has even allowed me to download a copy of a manual for a 997 that I don't even have yet.


    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    I always wondered why Porsche doesn't set up their dealerships somewhat like Ferrari; in a sense that they don't carry any sample paint palettes or sample leather or threads no Exclusive or TEquip.option Samples.

    To tell you the truth when I ordered my Boxster in 97/98 I didn't even know what Ocean Blue looks like until I got the car. I just wanted something blue and dark like the 993 I used to own, fortunately it turned out beautiful but it would have helped if they carried sample paint. Just my 2 c.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Ron (Houston) said:
    I always wondered why Porsche doesn't set up their dealerships somewhat like Ferrari; in a sense that they don't carry any sample paint palettes or sample leather or threads no Exclusive or TEquip.option Samples.


    Yours is an interesting observation.

    Perhaps I don't have a good idea of what proper Ferrari dealerships look like, but the Porsche dealer I frequent has square-yard leather samples, paint samples of real finishes on half-round display devices the size of 5-pound coffee cans, a parts department with all sorts of Techquipment stuff, etc.

    They have a designer looking aluminum suitcase, branded with a Porsche logo, full of leather samples and paint-on-card-stock pages in a loose-leaf binder concept. You can talk them out of one for a few days to take it home to the wife for aesthetic approval.

    Maybe Porsche dealers vary quite a bit from one to the next?

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Interestingly in both Houston dealers there is no such thing at all; on the othe hand, Ferrari of Houston has one section of the show room wall to wall with sample paints and leather and thread samples very nicely done.

    I have heard that Houston will get its 3rd Porsche delaer which will be around the Woodlands (for those who know the area) which will be owned by an individual not a company like the other two (owned by Sonics), I have also heard that it'll be the biggest Porsche dealership after Chmpion; may be then they'll set something up visually for the customers.

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    Is Houston a large enough market to support a 3rd dealer? Or are they going to consolidate the other two to get some local competition started?

    Re: Internet strangers are selling me this Porsche

    I'm not sure about the consolidation of the existing two but the Woodlands area is a wealthy neighborhood that is lacking a Porsche dealership, they have already opened up a Merc, BMW, Land Rover, Lexus, and.... around that area (45 south) and Porsche would for sure have a place too.

    The other two dealers cover different areas of Houston one 59 South and one I-10 West pretty far from each other.

    To give you an over view if you were to drive to either one of these dealers from let's say the Woodlands you have around 50 to 60 miles drive to get to them.

    I have heard that PCNA had enough complaints regarding the Porsche monopoly in Houston that they've allowed a private owner to buy a franchise, we shall see.



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