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    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    I do like it a lot to be honest. It looks "smart" and different, but i still would rather have a 918 over this if i had the money kiss


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    At least the design is brave, which wasn't quite the case with the 12C. Where I think McLaren is walking on a thin line is their statement: The quickest and most rewarding car to drive on a circuit!

    Quickest? Wait and see, but Ferrari is showing the new Enzo in paris in two weeks time and it will be very quick too I am sure. Any other cars that are ridiculously quick? Surely yes. The benchmark seems to be the Nordschleife because its shit surface replicates real world conditions. Well, the LFA nurburgring pack achieved a good time there, 7'15 I think, the Gumpert Appolo even 7'10 or something like that, so the P1 has to break that barrier. That's exactly what McLaren announced.

    Even if it does, claiming it will be the most rewarding to drive, well surely, that's entirely subjective isn't it? Each driver have their own reward don't they? A perfectly executioned heal and toe, a perfectly mastered 100m drift, etc.

    Quite arrogant from McLaren marketing department I think. It reminds of the their ad when they launched the 12C:

    We are McLaren and this is the 12C.

    Er... Ok. Well you are McLaren and the older 458 is just as good, sorry chaps.

    Paris will be great though, Ferrari vs McLaren, I can't wait!!!

    I categorise the 918 in another group. The innovative supercar. You see, Porsche is german, and ze germans are pragmatic, so they set engineer's goal: Less than 7'22 on the north loop and less then 3 l/100.

    I predict both the Fezza and Macca to be quicker, by how much will be interesting, on a track, quite a lot I think, light is right and in that respect the 918 is very wrong!

    But it is the politically correct supercar! You have your cake and you CAN eat it! Plus from a technological pov, it's mega exciting, how those three engines will work together, and driving in town on electric power alone, that's just cool.

    Cant' wait to get my ecological bonus from the french authorities too. 550 euros for vehicles with less than 90 g CO2/kmSmiley


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    REALZEUS:
    964C2:

    ......the 918 is no "beauty" either.

    You should know better by now. Critisising P cars is prohibited in here. Smiley

    True. This is why I never do that (or others for that matter). Smiley

    Are you actually reading the posts in this forum or just the (Ferrari) posts/threads you like? Just saying...

    Yes, the 918 is a beauty in my opinion but of course beauty sometimes lies in the eye of the beholder.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche Panamera Turbo S, BMW X5M, Mercedes C63 AMG Coupe PP/DP, Mini Cooper S Countryman All4


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    A truly ugly design ... making a statement, being distinctive etc is all very well ... but the actual design matters ... and this is truly awful to look at.


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    I'll go with the MP4 with bigger turbos + engine rebuild and I'll be saving a lot of $$$ indecision

    If I was thinking of switching to McLaren (not anytime soon or in the future) smiley


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    easy_rider911:

    A truly ugly design ... making a statement, being distinctive etc is all very well ... but the actual design matters ... and this is truly awful to look at.

    +1.  That bulbous rear end is truly hideous.  Smiley


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    1300 kgs. 

    Active aeros that give it circa 2g lateral grip. 960+ hp with Kers. I wish the 918 was within 200kgs of this car..

    Anyway regarding the looks while the side picture is representative, the people that have actually seen the car in fresh  unanimously said that that the rear (and front) picture is quite distorting in terms of proportions - another blunder of mclaren's PR department? So while i also think it is a bit OTT I would wait for a better look in the flesh or some other pictures.

    But i have to also say that while I am a huge P fan, the 918 is no stunner either and as for the weight and specs.. 

     


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    It makes me suspect that the McLaren designers are on the payroll of Ferrari. No other excuse, I could think of.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    I think its hard to compare P1 and 918... These are uncomparable cars, like 959 and F40. They were made after very different number of tasks. Porsche is looking for maximum performance with minimum fuel consumption. P1 is looking for maximum track performance. Anyway we will see how 918 performs on track with help of all these gizmos. Porsche is very well known for the maximum lap times even with less HP.

    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    One word: Overdesign

    And that seems to be the current theme in the automotive design industry at the moment. No matter how many great ideas you have they might not all go together, it's very important to know when a design needs to lose a few elements. obviously this conversation was never had in the McL design room. If the roofline ended a bit further back, the rear didn't slope down at the end, and the front didn't have those vents in the hood, it might be acceptable. Also am I the only one who notices a little Koeniggseg in the proportions and shapes? As it happens often in design, it could've been great, but it wasn't. 


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    I can't understand, how does the windshield works without wipers... What the driver will see under heavy rain or...f.e. if the bird will make a bad thing...I understand, this plastics is very slippery, but doesnt it mean that the bird's sh8t will be spreaded all over the car?angryyes


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Futch:

    At least the design is brave, which wasn't quite the case with the 12C. Where I think McLaren is walking on a thin line is their statement: The quickest and most rewarding car to drive on a circuit!

    Quickest? Wait and see, but Ferrari is showing the new Enzo in paris in two weeks time and it will be very quick too I am sure. Any other cars that are ridiculously quick? Surely yes. The benchmark seems to be the Nordschleife because its shit surface replicates real world conditions. Well, the LFA nurburgring pack achieved a good time there, 7'15 I think, the Gumpert Appolo even 7'10 or something like that, so the P1 has to break that barrier. That's exactly what McLaren announced.

    Even if it does, claiming it will be the most rewarding to drive, well surely, that's entirely subjective isn't it? Each driver have their own reward don't they? A perfectly executioned heal and toe, a perfectly mastered 100m drift, etc.

    Quite arrogant from McLaren marketing department I think. It reminds of the their ad when they launched the 12C:

    We are McLaren and this is the 12C.

    Er... Ok. Well you are McLaren and the older 458 is just as good, sorry chaps.

    Paris will be great though, Ferrari vs McLaren, I can't wait!!!

    I categorise the 918 in another group. The innovative supercar. You see, Porsche is german, and ze germans are pragmatic, so they set engineer's goal: Less than 7'22 on the north loop and less then 3 l/100.

    I predict both the Fezza and Macca to be quicker, by how much will be interesting, on a track, quite a lot I think, light is right and in that respect the 918 is very wrong!

    But it is the politically correct supercar! You have your cake and you CAN eat it! Plus from a technological pov, it's mega exciting, how those three engines will work together, and driving in town on electric power alone, that's just cool.

    Cant' wait to get my ecological bonus from the french authorities too. 550 euros for vehicles with less than 90 g CO2/kmSmiley

     

    I don't think that McLaren cares about Ring times. There is a rumour that they demolished the Silverstone reckord for production vehicles though. In that respect, they are like Ferrari and well done to both of them. A track is a smooth place that maximum performance can be extracted. The Ring is no such place.

    Also, it is my understanding that Ferrari won't be showing the new Enzo in Paris. It is scheduled for 2013 public viewing from what I hear. 


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    RC:
    REALZEUS:
    964C2:

    ......the 918 is no "beauty" either.

    You should know better by now. Critisising P cars is prohibited in here. Smiley

    True. This is why I never do that (or others for that matter). Smiley

    Are you actually reading the posts in this forum or just the (Ferrari) posts/threads you like? Just saying...

    Yes, the 918 is a beauty in my opinion but of course beauty sometimes lies in the eye of the beholder.

    The topics that I like actually. I also read the 918 thread and found the car interesting if a bit unspectacular design-wise. Techically all hypercars are mental anyway! Smiley


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    REALZEUS:
    Futch:

    At least the design is brave, which wasn't quite the case with the 12C. Where I think McLaren is walking on a thin line is their statement: The quickest and most rewarding car to drive on a circuit!

    Quickest? Wait and see, but Ferrari is showing the new Enzo in paris in two weeks time and it will be very quick too I am sure. Any other cars that are ridiculously quick? Surely yes. The benchmark seems to be the Nordschleife because its shit surface replicates real world conditions. Well, the LFA nurburgring pack achieved a good time there, 7'15 I think, the Gumpert Appolo even 7'10 or something like that, so the P1 has to break that barrier. That's exactly what McLaren announced.

    Even if it does, claiming it will be the most rewarding to drive, well surely, that's entirely subjective isn't it? Each driver have their own reward don't they? A perfectly executioned heal and toe, a perfectly mastered 100m drift, etc.

    Quite arrogant from McLaren marketing department I think. It reminds of the their ad when they launched the 12C:

    We are McLaren and this is the 12C.

    Er... Ok. Well you are McLaren and the older 458 is just as good, sorry chaps.

    Paris will be great though, Ferrari vs McLaren, I can't wait!!!

    I categorise the 918 in another group. The innovative supercar. You see, Porsche is german, and ze germans are pragmatic, so they set engineer's goal: Less than 7'22 on the north loop and less then 3 l/100.

    I predict both the Fezza and Macca to be quicker, by how much will be interesting, on a track, quite a lot I think, light is right and in that respect the 918 is very wrong!

    But it is the politically correct supercar! You have your cake and you CAN eat it! Plus from a technological pov, it's mega exciting, how those three engines will work together, and driving in town on electric power alone, that's just cool.

    Cant' wait to get my ecological bonus from the french authorities too. 550 euros for vehicles with less than 90 g CO2/kmSmiley

     

    I don't think that McLaren cares about Ring times. There is a rumour that they demolished the Silverstone reckord for production vehicles though. In that respect, they are like Ferrari and well done to both of them. A track is a smooth place that maximum performance can be extracted. The Ring is no such place.

    Also, it is my understanding that Ferrari won't be showing the new Enzo in Paris. It is scheduled for 2013 public viewing from what I hear. 

     

    Road cars are not race cars, so although you are right, Mc Laren has to deliver at the Ring because they wrote it.

    Look at the Enzo, developed at Fiorano, but it's faster at the ring than the Carrera GT. Why? Because it's a great car.

    The P1 can be the quickest on a smooth track, if it's awful on the road or at the ring, for it's not a good road car.

    And you know, some tracks are not smooth at all! Spa, Estoril, Catalunya.

    Silverstone has just been redone so yes it's smooth alrigth, Castellet too and all the new F1 tracks but for the old ones, you need quite supples suspensions.


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    If I am not mistaken they said it would be great on a track, not specifically on the Ring. Unless I have missed that claim of theirs. 

    Any manufacturer is free to choose the kind of roads/tracks its cars are optimised for. I find nothing wrong if McLaren or Ferrari or whomever said that their cars are optimise for Silverstone or Monza rather than the Ring. A (smooth) track biased hypercar then? Why not?


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    As with all obviously over-designed cars...the appreciation wont last over time, even if it perceived as a trail blazer in the early days it will wilt away very fast in the face of more timeless/classic looks...just my 2c


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    What do you think about wipers and birds...

     


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    kudryavchik:

    What do you think about wipers and birds...

    --

    sportcars-history.com

     

    Or squashed bugs. Smiley


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Birds sh.t even worse... Just have imagined the driver of this car with paper in handsSmiley


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Is Bangle now working for Mac?


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    It is hardly a Bangle design. Not his concept. Really looks like it was made by Korean or Japanese designer... Really strange that it was made by english designer. 


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    REALZEUS:

    If I am not mistaken they said it would be great on a track, not specifically on the Ring. Unless I have missed that claim of theirs. 

    Any manufacturer is free to choose the kind of roads/tracks its cars are optimised for. I find nothing wrong if McLaren or Ferrari or whomever said that their cars are optimise for Silverstone or Monza rather than the Ring. A (smooth) track biased hypercar then? Why not?

    My worry is that if a car is setup for super fast laptimes on a very smooth track, it may then be too stiff for the road or an older track like the north loop.

    But McLaren claims, not only to be quickest on a track, may that be Silverstone then, but also to be as useable as a 12C. 

    If that's the case, I pull my hat off, quite an achievement. Let's wait and see. Just a very bold statement from our English  friends, especially with the Ferrari coming out this month. 

    You would think they learnt their lesson after failing to deliver a car superior to the 458 with the 12C. Good car the 12C, very good car, but by no means better than the 458.

     


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Arent they using hydraulic suspension,which allows them to optimise it for any type of circuit surface via software?

    And it those pictures at least,its just plain ugly,like some students try at a concept

    Seems to be small and compact though,which is good

    Jim Glickenhaus' P4/5 LMP sketches look modern and beautifull at the same time


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Wow -  nobody would be confused that this is a McLaren forum.... angry  But my impression has always been that McL is a company where the engineers rule, and that applies equally to design of their cars.  The design is what it has to be to make all the engineering decisions and objectives fit.  You might also say Porsche has a similar philosophy, but they have had many more decades to develop a pleasing and distinctive design esthetic.  


    --

    2011 Range Rover Sport S/C,  2009 Porsche 911S


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    More pictures - I have to say its growing on me:

    mclaren_p1_concept_10.jpgmclaren_p1_concept_9.jpg

    mclaren_p1_concept_7.jpgmclaren_p1_concept_6.jpgmclaren_p1_concept_6-1.jpg


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Surely that's at concept stage and not final production? It seems so.... unfinished. Front, back and side could all need some fine tuning. This just isn't striking the same design DNA of its smaller brother.. I'd be seriously and negatively surprised if this is the real thing.


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Atzporsche:

    Surely that's at concept stage and not final production? It seems so.... unfinished. Front, back and side could all need some fine tuning. This just isn't striking the same design DNA of its smaller brother.. I'd be seriously and negatively surprised if this is the real thing.

    I am pretty certain this is close to final.


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    Still ugly...made without taste...


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    I like it.  guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder.  I thought the MP4-12C was missing some strength in its design and I think this has it (I also like the proposed Mclaren 12C Can Am).  Having said that I think the 12C as a spyder is very attractive.  BTW-I was at Mclaren and asked if I could purchase a P1 - less serious than curious.  Their reply was classic.  They stated that they do not have a Ferrari policy.  BUT - they probably could not sell one to me b/c it is a limited edition and they need to meet the demand of their customers who have been 'friends of Mclaren' first.  What was interesting is they classify those friends of Mclaren as F1 owners in the area.  So even if I bought a 12C right there and then, he said there are over 60% of F1 owners are in the greater New York area (I would think this is 60% of US allocated F1s).  Sounds exactly like Ferrari's policy to me.  I bet anyone $100 bucks that they call three months after delivery and say they just happen to have an unallocated unit (or someone dropped out) and I could have it for a 35% premium.  


    Re: McLaren P1 - Official

    This is the rare sports car design where adding a front license plate will actually enhance its looks ,especially in Europe, with its long rectangular ones that would cover some of that vast expanse of black plastic above that wide  lower middle intake .

     

     

     


     
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