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    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes


    I can see both sides of the discussion. The only thing that irritated me was some young 'whipper-snapper' saying that Colm and I were overeducated and underpaid - I founded and sold 2 companies for a large profit, I have found that as I mature, I just tend to be more careful about my money.

    I also liked Frayed's input for more data (as well as his avatar - I look like Notle most of the time).

    Here are some probably irrelevant data:

    Porsche SuperCup and Carrea Cup 2007 GT Rules on brakes:

    The braking system may be replaced by any system from
    the Porsche range and can be chosen freely within the
    following parameters:
    * Max. brake disc diameter 380 mm
    * On the front axle, max. 6 piston brake calliper
    * On the rear axle, max. 4 piston brake calliper
    * Max. 2 brake pads per brake calliper
    * Brake discs and rotors must be of metallic material.
    * It must be a 2 circuit braking system.
    There are no regulations governing brake ventilation on
    the front axle.

    SCO LeMans (including American Le Mans) - 2007 LM GT Rules

    12.2 - Brake rotors must be made of steel
    12.2.1 - Brake callipers shall be made from aluminium materials
    (elasticity modulus < 80 Gpa).
    12.2.2 - Only one calliper (maximum 6 pistons) per wheel is
    12.2.3 - Pistons (brake plungers) must have a round section.
    12.3 - Disc brakes :
    12.3.1 - Number : one brake rotor maximum per wheel.
    12.3.2 - Material : ferrous exclusively.
    12.3.3 - Brake pads : two per wheel maximum.

    Grand Am 2007 GT Rules

    8-1 Brake Rotors
    8-1.1 Only magnetic cast iron or cast steel rotors.
    8-1.2 Maximum rotor diameter:
    Prep 1 - OEM diameter or as described in car specsPrep 2 - 330 mm
    8-2 Brake Calipers -
    8-2.1 Only one two-piece (split into two halves) brake caliper of aluminum alloy, with amaximum of four pistons and two pads per wheel is permitted. Maximumcaliperstack width is 78mm.
    8-2.2 Titanium pistons are allowed in brake calipers.
    8-2.3 The brake pedal must operate all four wheels through a dual master cylinder system.
    8-2.4 Anti-lock/ABS brakes are prohibited on prep 2 cars. Factory installed ABS allowed on
    prep 1 cars as approved.
    8-2.5 Prep 1 cars may use prep 2 brakes.

    So these series may be trying to level the playing field by miniminizing cost, or doing additional testing. Who knows? It is clear that the PCCBs are more responsive, and weigh about 50% less unsprung, but in none of the Porsche material that I have read does it say that the PCCB braking distance is shorter than the steel brake option - the Motor Trend says the PCCBs stop from 60mph in 99 feet, MotorWeek in 107 ft, and Road and Track 107 ft.. We shall see.

    I think the statement that RC said makes sense - "Regarding track racing: for serious semi-professional track racing over more than a dozend of rounds, I would recommend the steel brake for cost reasons.
    For street driving and casual track racing, the PCCB is much better from many points of view. Stopping distance at higher speeds, fading on hotter days, lower unsprung weight, etc. And maybe the PCCB even looks better."

    Thanks for listening once again - Gerry

    2007 997 Turbo - Jan Build
    2005 GT3 - in shop
    2002 996TTX50 - gone and sorrely missed
    1995 993 GT2 - driver (not owner)
    1993 RSA
    1992 911 Turbo S2
    1980 SC- best car ever made

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    DJ996 said:
    IMO, the PCCBs probably make a marginal difference on a heavy street car with an amateur driver in terms of lap times.

    actually i think its with an amateur where it would make the biggest difference

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    I would disagree. Even experienced track drivers rarely use their brakes (steel) to the full potential.

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    PCCB is Brill compared to st 6 pots on the 997TT no comparison

    1 new rotor for the latest version Pounds900

    996TT 2 track days this year 1 set of front disc's ? my pal 7 track days in his with PCCB no parts or wear and can brake 30% later than steels , Walter Rohl stated clearly on his interview that he though the PCCB was the best ceramic currently available for fast road and track use in early 2006 ?

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    yep no comparison between PCCB and steels even with the new 6 pots

    The PCCB is awesome and yes of course no brake dust oh god that makes like easier, and prices to replace rotors is no where near what it used to be on ceramics !!

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    Tboner said:
    PCCB is Brill compared to st 6 pots on the 997TT no comparison

    1 new rotor for the latest version Pounds900

    Is that the price for a new version of a PCCB rotor or steel? That's for the new larger ones (997TT and GT3)? That price seems too high for steel and too low for PCCB...

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    New version only i am told

    Re: Any hard objective facts comparing PCP and steel brakes

    STill $5K to replace ceramic disc.....which is fairly hefty from most folk's pocket books.



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