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    Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Hello!

    I have been woundering: Wich design theme should Ferrari have? Well, personaly i think they should have a design that symbolies Formula1. Mostly because they are it and after my orpintien it looks awesome.

    What do you think?

    There will be a poll later...

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:
    I have been woundering: Wich design theme should Ferrari have? Well, personaly i think they should have a design that symbolies Formula1.

    What do you think?




    Welcome, StradaleF1!

    I can see the reasoning behind your idea up to a point, but also see 2 problems:

    1) It would mean copying Mercedes, who have put a McLaren nose on some of their road cars, and it doesn't seem to do them much good.

    2) I don't know if there is much of a market for single seater Ferrari road cars!

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Hehe... I see what you mean.

    1) They have the Enzo.

    2) Hehe... I meant for 2!

    But what do you think?

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:
    But what do you think?



    Seriously, I think they are already doing pretty well with their road cars. To try to flog the F1 thing to death by carrying over irrelevant elements from an F1 car to a road car would be pretty cheap and unconvincing.

    It's better to stick with road car features which really work in the environment they have to live in. "Form follows function".

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    fritz said:
    It's better to stick with road car features which really work in the environment they have to live in. "Form follows function".


    Well, I agree that "Form follows function" but why shouldn't it do it in the F1 inspired design? I think that the Enzo is that car (production) in the world that shows form follows function.

    I meant that the design should only should representing features (Nose, front wing etc.) from F1 and of cause the spirit.


    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:
    Quote:
    fritz said:
    It's better to stick with road car features which really work in the environment they have to live in. "Form follows function".


    Well, I agree that "Form follows function" but why shouldn't it do it in the F1 inspired design? I think that the Enzo is that car (production) in the world that shows form follows function.

    I meant that the design should only should representing features (Nose, front wing etc.) from F1 and of cause the spirit.




    Part of the design problem for any manufacturer are the various regulations State and Federal and EU. I do not believe some of the F1 designs will pass inspection for general public use.

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Part of the design problem for any manufacturer are the various regulations State and Federal and EU. I do not believe some of the F1 designs will pass inspection for general public use.



    Saw that coming!

    Well, of cause some design features will be lost their, but not very many of them.

    If you where LdM and could decide wich design theme Ferrari's sholud have. Wich theme would it be: current, new (never-seen before), F1, classic etc.

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    i find the enzo quite unattractive with its f1 look. and the newpricy mercedes [cant think of the model] with the f1 nose and all the retro chrysler louvres has got to be the most hideous car on earth, on top of being a mercedes...

    form and function for fast street cars is different than form and function for f1 cars. Ferrari's need to be beautiful, like a 360... or 550... or ....

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    watt said:
    form and function for fast street cars is different than form and function for f1 cars. Ferrari's need to be beautiful, like a 360... or 550... or ....


    I can see what you mean. I to think that the Enzo maybe is to extreme but I think the design has some cool features that really shows the ture, pure spirit of Ferrari.

    Look at this picture i shot some weeks ago: http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1951.JPG

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    My opinion: for me there is no use in Formula 1-style design gimmicks, simply because there is no use for them at road cars. I don't mean diffusors or retractable spoilers which help the stability of the car at high speeds and deliver a certain ground effect. But what good for is a F1-style nose, especially if you don't even reach the finishing line? (got it DC? )

    How I expect a Ferrari to be is beautiful, aggressive with style and grace. Difficult to describe. Perhaps you should say outstanding and breathtaking. It also depends on the modell you're talking about. A 456 or 612 should have a more elegant and timeless design, which might be not as exceptional at first glance but will last for quite a while without looking dated, whereas the 360 should have a meaner styling.

    BTW, except for the nose (and for me the nose of the Enzo just looks ugly, but that all depends on personal taste), I can find no further F1-styling clues at the Enzo and although a big rear wing a la F40/F50 would fit the car extremely well, there is none...

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    rossi said:
    My opinion: for me there is no use in Formula 1-style design gimmicks, simply because there is no use for them at road cars. I don't mean diffusors or retractable spoilers which help the stability of the car at high speeds and deliver a certain ground effect. But what good for is a F1-style nose, especially if you don't even reach the finishing line? (got it DC? )

    How I expect a Ferrari to be is beautiful, aggressive with style and grace. Difficult to describe. Perhaps you should say outstanding and breathtaking. It also depends on the model you're talking about. A 456 or 612 should have a more elegant and timeless design, which might be not as exceptional at first glance but will last for quite a while without looking dated, whereas the 360 should have a meaner styling.

    BTW, except for the nose (and for me the nose of the Enzo just looks ugly, but that all depends on personal taste), I can find no further F1-styling clues at the Enzo and although a big rear wing a la F40/F50 would fit the car extremely well, there is none...


    I agree that cars some 612, Maranello etc. shouldn't have that design but cars with a centre motor should. Have you ever seen an Enzo for real? For if something is breathtaking it is the Enzo. Why can't an Ferrari with F1 design NOT be beautiful?

    I do not know you so don't take it personal. I think that you just can't see the beauty and wildness in the pure, real F1 Ferrari design. You have to be helped a little. What do you think of the Mercedes McLaren SLR's nose?

    If this isn't aggressive and style what is it then? http://www.itana.it/images/ferrari/ferrari%20enzo.jpg

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    In Antwort auf:
    StradaleF1 said:
    I agree that cars some 612, Maranello etc. shouldn't have that design but cars with a centermotor should. Have you ever seen an Enzo for real? For if something is breathtaking it is the Enzo. Why can't an Ferrari with F1 design NOT be beautiful?

    I do not know you so don't take it personal. I think that you just can't see the beauty and wildness in the pure, real F1 design. You have to be helped a little. What do you think of the Mercedes McLaren SLR's nose?



    Dear StradaleF1,
    yes, I have seen an Enzo in person, several times, inside and outside .
    Yes, midengined cars should be breathtaking and outstanding (I wrote that before).
    And yes, the Enzo surely is breathtaking but for me it has no beautiful design, perhaps you could describe it as raw. And as I said before, this is surely my absolutely subjective point of view (but I'm not the only one with that opinion). The Carrera GT is beautiful (also subjective).
    And for me the Enzo has no F1-clues (talking about styling, NOT technology) except for that nose, that I don't like. Or can you name some? And the car misses a rear wing, it would fit the back quite well.
    Concerning the SLR, I neither like its nose (don't like it at any Mecedes model), nor the car as a whole or its design. I think its design is somehow overdone, it lacks the purity and simplicity of Enzo and CGT. For me it's neither fish nor flesh, if I wanted a powerful, but luxurious GT I would head for SL65 or Bentley GT/Aston Martin DB9/575M Maranello/612 Scaglietti (and save an awful lot of money), if my goal is the ultimate sportscar, I would prefer the Carrera GT. Note: again absolutely personal!

    And I don't think I have to be helped a little and no, I don't take it pesonal.

    All the best,
    rossi

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    [qu
    Quote:
    rossi said:
    Dear StradaleF1,
    yes, I have seen an Enzo in person, several times, inside and outside .
    Yes, midengined cars should be breathtaking and outstanding (I wrote that before).
    And yes, the Enzo surely is breathtaking but for me it has no beautiful design, perhaps you could describe it as raw. And as I said before, this is surely my absolutely subjective point of view (but I'm not the only one with that opinion). The Carrera GT is beautiful (also subjective).
    And for me the Enzo has no F1-clues (talking about styling, NOT technology) except for that nose, that I don't like. Or can you name some? And the car misses a rear wing, it would fit the back quite well.
    Concerning the SLR, I neither like its nose (don't like it at any Mecedes model), nor the car as a whole or its design. I think its design is somehow overdone, it lacks the purity and simplicity of Enzo and CGT. For me it's neither fish nor flesh, if I wanted a powerful, but luxurious GT I would head for SL65 or Bentley GT/Aston Martin DB9/575M Maranello/612 Scaglietti (and save an awful lot of money), if my goal is the ultimate sportscar, I would prefer the Carrera GT. Note: again absolutely personal!

    And I don't think I have to be helped a little and no, I don't take it pesonal.


    All the best,
    rossi


    Dear rossi

    Hehe, the thing is that the Enzo is not as beautiful as the Porshe CGT (I have been in both around a track), but I think if you dropped some features in the Enzo and make it much more simple like the CGT it will really be beautiful.

    About the SLR I agree. It is to much! All does design details aren't beautiful.

    Ciao,
    StradaleF1

    Dad and me driving (dad) the CGT. Awesome car:
    http://www.upit.dk/files/(0)DSCN1512.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1479.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1491.JPG

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    rossi said:
    Quote:
    StradaleF1 said:
    I agree that cars some 612, Maranello etc. shouldn't have that design but cars with a centermotor should. Have you ever seen an Enzo for real? For if something is breathtaking it is the Enzo. Why can't an Ferrari with F1 design NOT be beautiful?

    I do not know you so don't take it personal. I think that you just can't see the beauty and wildness in the pure, real F1 design. You have to be helped a little. What do you think of the Mercedes McLaren SLR's nose?



    Dear StradaleF1,
    yes, I have seen an Enzo in person, several times, inside and outside .
    Yes, midengined cars should be breathtaking and outstanding (I wrote that before).
    And yes, the Enzo surely is breathtaking but for me it has no beautiful design, perhaps you could describe it as raw. And as I said before, this is surely my absolutely subjective point of view (but I'm not the only one with that opinion). The Carrera GT is beautiful (also subjective).
    And for me the Enzo has no F1-clues (talking about styling, NOT technology) except for that nose, that I don't like. Or can you name some? And the car misses a rear wing, it would fit the back quite well.
    Concerning the SLR, I neither like its nose (don't like it at any Mecedes model), nor the car as a whole or its design. I think its design is somehow overdone, it lacks the purity and simplicity of Enzo and CGT. For me it's neither fish nor flesh, if I wanted a powerful, but luxurious GT I would head for SL65 or Bentley GT/Aston Martin DB9/575M Maranello/612 Scaglietti (and save an awful lot of money), if my goal is the ultimate sportscar, I would prefer the Carrera GT. Note: again absolutely personal!

    And I don't think I have to be helped a little and no, I don't take it pesonal.

    All the best,
    rossi



    Rossi,

    I agree w/many of your points. Enzo to me appears intimidating, but not necessarily beautiful. In fact, I also think CGT is the better looking of the two cars. Unfortunately, I suspect w/supercars function (high speed stability, etc) often supersedes form....sometimes yielding questionable forms like the SLR and 612.

    I think 360 is easily best looking current F car.....hopefully they don't muck it up w/430....these sketches w/a gaping smile in the front air dam concern me. 575 looks OK but to me seems to be rather bland for an F car....maybe the rumored mid-engined 575 replacement could be a more interesting car from a styling standpoint? And to me the 612 is simply an ugly car.

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    In Antwort auf:
    VKSF said:
    Rossi,

    I agree w/many of your points. Enzo to me appears intimidating, but not necessarily beautiful. In fact, I also think CGT is the better looking of the two cars. Unfortunately, I suspect w/supercars function (high speed stability, etc) often supersedes form....sometimes yielding questionable forms like the SLR and 612.

    I think 360 is easily best looking current F car.....hopefully they don't muck it up w/430....these sketches w/a gaping smile in the front air dam concern me. 575 looks OK but to me seems to be rather bland for an F car....maybe the rumored mid-engined 575 replacement could be a more interesting car from a styling standpoint? And to me the 612 is simply an ugly car.



    Absolutely right VKSF, form follows function is important for a car like the Enzo. But IMO Ferrari and Pininfarina could still have done A LOT better at the Enzo design (and the 612 design as well!), without compromising high speed function.

    Also correct, the Modena is just gorgeous (although I still like the back of the 355 better than that of the 360, I hope the 430 rear end will convince me more). I didn't like the double air inlet at the front at the beginning, but meanwhile I think they fit the car, giving it a unique appearance at the front (especially with the Challenge grid). So I'm not too concerned about the new front looks of the 430, especially when I think about the new front lights (yes, they are Gallardo style, but they are as well Enzo style). And I think (or should I say "hope" after the Scaglietti? ), that the front bumper will look fine.

    The 575 surely looks bland, but I guess that's what Ferrari intended how it should look like (and how the customers want it to be). I doubt we will see a midengined successor of the Maranello, but a midengined car like the Testarossa really would be a cracker.

    And concerning the Scaglietti, let us just shut our mouths and be quiet, having in mind that even a genius like Pininfarina has his bad days...

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    Rossi,

    I agree w/many of your points. Enzo to me appears intimidating, but not necessarily beautiful. In fact, I also think CGT is the better looking of the two cars. Unfortunately, I suspect w/supercars function (high speed stability, etc) often supersedes form....sometimes yielding questionable forms like the SLR and 612.

    I think 360 is easily best looking current F car.....hopefully they don't muck it up w/430....these sketches w/a gaping smile in the front air dam concern me. 575 looks OK but to me seems to be rather bland for an F car....maybe the rumored mid-engined 575 replacement could be a more interesting car from a styling standpoint? And to me the 612 is simply an ugly car.


    I agree in all your points. My dad has drove both the Enzo and CGT while I also sitting in them. He says that the Enzo is more easy to drive and also handles better and is more stabile in high speeds, but he think people will have a funnier experience because of it's removable roof.

    Pictures from both drives:
    Enzo:
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1980.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1975.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1973.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1951.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1946.JPG

    CGT:
    http://www.upit.dk/files/(0)DSCN1512.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1479.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1491.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1494.JPG
    http://www.upit.dk/files/DSCN1497.JPG

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    I believe a convertible looks better than a coupe. Certainly much more fun to drive and allows one to experience all the road sounds which enhance the driving pleasure.

    Is your father an auto journalist or race car driver?

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    In Antwort auf:
    VKSF said:
    I agree w/many of your points. Enzo to me appears intimidating, but not necessarily beautiful. In fact, I also think CGT is the better looking of the two cars. Unfortunately, I suspect w/supercars function (high speed stability, etc) often supersedes form....sometimes yielding questionable forms like the SLR and 612.




    Read this somewhere, think it hits the nail right on the head:

    The Enzo is a disjointed design - it looks like the rear end and front were styled by two different people - who never talked to each other.

    Re: Wich design theme should Ferrari have

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    I believe a convertible looks better than a coupe. Certainly much more fun to drive and allows one to experience all the road sounds which enhance the driving pleasure.

    Is your father an auto journalist or race car driver?


    His a race car driver. But the fastest car on a track he ever tested was the Enzo. He say it will be very difficult to make a choice between the 2 cars.

    The Porsche CGT is a so big experience to drive and it looks beautiful. On the other hand the Enzo is so extremely fast and it's like an Formula1 car. It's got so much spirit and it look's outstanding. Both cars follows form and function very much. I think (haven't asked him) that he will take the Enzo because of it's performance, handling and the design - (he's like me with that front.)

    Both cars are so good that it will be almost impossible to take the choice. It depends on - WHO YOU ARE!

     
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