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    Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    German car magazine just tested the Cayman S in their latest issue, here are some of the test results:

    0-100 kph in 5.5 sec. (Boxster S: 5.4 sec., 997 CS: 4.7 sec.)
    0-160 kph in 12 sec. (Boxster S: 12.4 sec., 997 CS: 10.7 sec.)
    0-200 kph in 19.2 sec. (Boxster S: 20.2 sec., 997 CS: 16.6 sec.)

    Weight (measured): 1415 kg (Boxster S: 1418 kg without PCCB and 997 Carrera S: 1482 kg)

    Cayman S was equipped with PCCB brake!
    997 Carrera S was equipped with PASM (standard).
    Boxster S was equipped with standard brake.

    Slalom 18m: 66.1 kph (Boxster S: 67.9 kph, 997 CS: 66.9 kph)
    ISO Handling Test: 140.9 kph (Boxster S: 134.2 kph, 997 CS: 142.4 kph)

    High Speed Braking Test (from 190 kph to 0): 128 m (Boxster S without PCCB: 130 m and 997 CS: 129 m)

    Guys, I hate to say this but in my opinion, a 997 Carrera for almost the same money would be the better buy.
    The car tested in AMS had a price tag of over 81000 Euro, the 997 Carrera is slightly over 76000 Euro over here in Germany and the best thing, you can get it with the 20 mm chassis and the limited slip differential, not to speak about the almost identical weight figure and 30 HP more.

    Your choice guys...but I still don't see how the Cayman S fits in between the Boxster S and the 997 Carrera.
    The weight WITH PCCB is only 67 kg lighter than the weight of the Carrera S! The difference to a 997 CS with PCCB would be around 47 kg only. Not really impressive.

    BTW: AMS made a last comment about the fact that Cayman S owners may have to live with the "smell" driving a "poor man's" 911. Nothing more to say...I'm afraid.

    Just for comparison, the test data of the 997 Carrera:
    Weight: 1475 kg (standard brake)
    0-100 kph: 4.9 sec.
    0-160 kph: 11.4 sec.
    0-200 kph: 18.1 sec.
    Slalom 18m: 66.8 kph
    ISO Handling Test: 141.9 kph
    Braking from 190 kph to 0: 130 m

    Do yourself a favor, buy for almost the same money an almost "naked" 997 Carrera. Not only will you drive the REAL thing, you have more space and sooner or later, you'll want a 911 anyway because Porsche marketing secretly hopes that the Cayman S is some sort of jumping board to upgrade to the 911 sooner or later.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    RC,

    Thanks for the info. Pretty disappointing to say the least. I thought Porsche factory numbers were supposed to be conservative.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Whoever was driving the Cayman must have been drinking - the numbers don't make sense............

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Very disappointing to be sure. I'm sure the test is accurate as well. Good thing they noticed the "smell" since other magazines seem olfactorarily challenged. I certainly don't want to be driving around town as people sniff the air and grimace as my Cayman passes by. My expectations were not as high as some others, but the car doesn't even seem to have even a small edge on the Boxster S except the price differential which is not particularly small. For me the issue was whether I'd be happy with this car at $70K USD rather than the 80-100K for a C2 or C2S. If that's not the case and I decide to fork out the big money I'll have to look beyond Porsche before I "pull the trigger". Thanks RC.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Say this slowly ...

    Porsche cayman got my money when I could have gotten a
    Carrera!

    !!!!!!!!!

    Its obvious that the Boxsters LOWER center of gravity helps it compete against the Cayman got your money car.

    For all the Porsche PR instigated media hype, its few more hp and its lower first and second gear ratios, it does nothing really measurable better than a Boxster, except
    require more of your money. Its a deal for suckers and its name even proves it.

    RC warned us early on that the Cayman was just a market price segment trick and now the numbers prove it.

    If the car was meant to be a brilliant, innovative 2 seat Porsche sports coupe from the get go, the performance, trim
    and dynamics would be drastically better than a Boxster!

    The Cayman is another invidious! Weideking marketing play. Add that to the M96 engine, hesitating Cayennes, gun at your head stereo/nav option prices and you have a new legacy of mediocrity and absolute customer rape.

    Thank gawwwwd he did not get his bean counter analysts and cheap charlie engineer team to foul up the GT3's, Turbos and the CGT.

    Its almost like Porsche is two car companies under the same roof. The TT's, Gt3, GT2, CGT are all excellent. The regular
    production cars are built to a scheme instead of customer value. Now ask me how I really feel.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Guys you are confusing the hell out of me. I thought I finally settled on a Cayman S over a 997S. Not because I want to save but because that I was convinced that it worths the money and that is what I can afford. I have always been a fan of 911 but dont want to go broke or miss up other plans. I thought I will take it in steps, a Cayman then a 911

    If that is the case I'd rather wait without a P car until I can afford my dream 911

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    RC, many thanks for the post. As always, with hard numbers we can now base the Boxster S/Cayman S/Carrera debate on facts rather than conjecture and as much as I wanted the Cayman S to be all that Porsche claim, it is indeed nothing more than a Boxster S with a hard top. And a very expensive hard top at that.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    So what do we make of Road & Track getting a 0-60 time of 4.8 and Walter Rohrl's supposed base Carrera beating time at the Nurburgring?

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    God, you guys are amazing ! Do you believe everything you read ? Do the math - there is no way the Cayman could perform that poorly - think HP to weight - think suspension - think frame rigidity ! Come on - just because 1 magazine driver can't drive......... how stupid do you think Porsche is ?

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Wow, the Boxster S was quicker in the slalom than the CaymanS! The Boxster always excels in the slalom though.
    These performance figures are pretty disappointing. Maybe the conditions during the test were poor compared to the Boxster S?

    If I were looking into any of those cars right now, I'd probably get into a VERY lightly optioned base 997.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Thanks RC for the info.

    I hope Porsche will eventually build a mid-engine car for less than $440K that can compete with the F430s and Gallardos out there.

    I doubt anyone on this forum can actually detect the small difference in performance between the Cayman S and the Boxster S, even on the track.

    Unless you dislike open tops so much that you'd pay Porsche $5K to remove it, there's no reason to buy a Cayman.

    And if, like the poster above, you really would prefer a 911, there's absolutely no reason to buy the Cayman as a "stepping stone." Just be patient a little longer and get the base 997 as RC suggests.

    I'm not a particularly cynical person, but just how stupid does Porsche think its customers are?

    mcdelaug

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    bdc said:
    So what do we make of Road & Track getting a 0-60 time of 4.8 and Walter Rohrl's supposed base Carrera beating time at the Nurburgring?



    Well for starters, Walter is a factory paid driver.

    The Cayman S he drove had the optional 19" wheels,PASM and Optional PCCB and sport chrono.

    The Carrera test time it was compared to was a base Carrera
    without sport or PASM suspenspions,no sport chrono, 18 inch wheels and the last generation of tires.

    Whatever, the Cayman wants your money, but doesnt deliver for the price difference over a Boxster.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    There's only one problem here.....and its a big one.....

    Unless all three cars are tested right next to each on the same track, on the same day, with the same conditions, and the same equipment, tires, wheel size, mileage, etc......it really doesn't mean squat. It is one magazines findings and only one....most others have decided differently.

    We already know that the Cayman will handle as well as the Boxster S which is just fine with me as it is pretty much one of the benchmarks for sports cars anyway. Every article that I have read puts Cayman S handling way ahead
    of the base 911 and on par with the 911S.....and I still firmly believe this as a Boxster S handles better than a base 911.

    In a straight line?.....sure the base 911 is faster, never doubted it. The Cayman will be faster than a Boxster S in a straight line though.....I firmly believe this also, maybe not by much, but definitely a few tenths.....we have already seen a US road test with a 4.8 0-60 and a 13.3 1/4 mile....not estimates, a valid test.

    If anyone thought a Cayman S was going to be a match for a 911S they were thinking wrong in the first place, but it will be more than a match for a Boxster S and equal (or better) to the base 911 in many areas.

    As far as price goes, yes the Cayman S is still overpriced IMO, but I don't want a Boxster and a base 911 with the same equipment as my Cayman would have been $10k more which is still a chunk of $$$ even in this price range.

    Any finally......I like the Caymans looks better.....to me it is really starting to shine in this area with me and is already making the 997 look a little old. So even if a similar base 911 was within a few $K of my Cayman S, I still would have picked the Cayman.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    I will not 100% believe this car report; instead, there will be more comparison test reports to come and we should judge latter.

    I don't think buying a Cayman S imply can't afford a 997S. For myself, I want a 2 seater coupe so I choose Cayman S. It's nothing about 997.

    BTW, does anyone knows the power to weight ratio of these 3 cars?

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    mcdelaug said:
    Thanks RC for the info.

    I hope Porsche will eventually build a mid-engine car for less than $440K that can compete with the F430s and Gallardos out there.

    mcdelaug



    Me too, Mcdelaug, all they would need do is thrown in the 911Turbo equivalent engine (996 or 997), tune it to around 500HP, sharpen up its lines, add a good spoiler setup, they could price it in 911Turbo territory so as not to be a 911Turbo price-beater model, and it would sell quite well.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Thanks for the info RC .

    I agree 110% opt for a 911 that's the real thing.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    Chris Lo said:
    I will not 100% believe this car report; instead, there will be more comparison test reports to come and we should judge latter.

    I don't think buying a Cayman S imply can't afford a 997S. For myself, I want a 2 seater coupe so I choose Cayman S. It's nothing about 997.

    BTW, does anyone knows the power to weight ratio of these 3 cars?



    Chris, get it, enjoy it. Its okay. You will probably have one of the few in HK anyway. If you want more power and
    more everything RUF or one of the others can help you.

    For hp to weight ratios just look at the tests in the print
    or online media.

    As an aside, non of the magazines buy the cars they test. So what they get are press pool cars, and sometimes in ratty
    condition. However, the Cayman does little more than a Boxster S. Dont expect it to runaway from your neightbors
    Carrera.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Look, getting 4.8 in one mag and 5.5 or what ever it was does not make sense. Also getting worse handling than the boxster doesn't make sense unless porsche is sabatoging the car with with loose screws and who knows what. It just doesn't make sense from a scientific point of view. More power, less weight(although tiny) more rigidity, faster gear box etc. I don't believe this article untill they test side by side.
    However that said, I am a little disappointed with the cayman. It should be noticibly better in handling than the boxster but probably only slightly on paper(assuming it is better at handling). I think it should have more power and this and that but it doesn't so what can you do. Porsche loves 911s and if they don't broaden their performance cars I think it will become a problem with upcoming competion from the bigger companies. They need a super midengine but one thats affordable for the very rich rather than just the ridiculously rich.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Thanks, JimFlat6. If I want to runaway from my neightbors Carrera, I will drive my Gallardo or E55, haha~~~. I am sure I will enjoy Cayman S very much.

    Actually, horse power and accelerartion is not the selling point of this car. I think Porsche had focused more on handling rather than horse power. And obiously Porsche doesn't want it as faster as 997, this is easily understood. So there is no doubt 997 is faster in all run. I would rather consider Cayman S is a small sportscar rather than a supercar. However, I think it has a beautiful shape and really nice for daily drive. May be it's fun for track day too.

    IMHO, if really want a supercar, forget about Cayman S, it won't be the one, go for a 997S or wait for a 997TT.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    I think it pretty clear some 911 owners see the Cayman as a threat and are trying to justify there purchase of a 911 or it's just 911 snobby.

    Those 997 figures are some of the best I've seen compared with the worst Cayman figures I've read. Having just sold a 996 I pretty sure the Cayman will be slower at the top end(bet the handlings miles better though) and its no great shock to me, but the basic 997 is a lot more money in the uk, an extra Pounds14k( or $24.k) it hardly a small amount of cash.
    Other magazines mentioned how the Cayman is great value and questions the need for a basic 997.
    I'd be very surprised if the person who started this topic isn't a 911 owner or has had one in the past or is getting another in the future

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    RC, read the article too and I underline nearly all of your comments.

    Also agree to your advice to buy a naked Carrera instead of a fully loaded Cayman.

    However, to be fair you have to compare Carrera and Cayman in standart condition
    which means you can get a car 17k euro cheaper than a Carrera with same performance.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Not very encouraging, but still worth the money vs a Carrera. I plan on getting a very lightly-optioned Cayman S , so the difference between the two is still very large. The Cayman S is overpriced, no doubt, but still the only choice if you want a reliable mid-engine sports coupe. It's just annoying to know Porsche could easily be offering that car with 315hp instead of 295 out of the same engine. That would justify the price hike. Or... just charge the same as a Boxster S and avoid the price comparisons.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    Chris Lo said:
    I will not 100% believe this car report; instead, there will be more comparison test reports to come and we should judge latter.

    I don't think buying a Cayman S imply can't afford a 997S. ...



    Spot on. I can't understand how much interpretation can pe put into such a little AMS report. I read the test as well and as far as I remember, RC once said that there are not many cars that can keep up with his family BoxsterS, despite automatic transmission. So how does THIS translate into driving a car with a chassis twice as stiff and stiffer suspension?

    Noone should expect to get a real bargain from Porsche - which is definately a sad thing - but expect a car that has different advantages and downsides than the 911. After four decades of development you can be sure that Porsceh more or less gets the rear-engined layout right - the only big downside is understeer and lacking the crispness in handling due to weight balance. Apart from that it is still a strong selling and well running concept. Why don't you guys wait until you have driven the car?

    If you compare the Cayman's numbers to the 996 Mk.I's it becomes obvious that the traction advantage on the 911 will result in better 0-60 numbers.

    The Cayman is not THE choice, it is just another alternative in the Porsceh range. A pretty good one though...

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    The 911 is undeniably a legend, a benchmark to all other sports cars, the one to beat in comparisons.

    There are vey few car that have the kudos, and "street legend" that the 911 has. However can you justify what is a 15000 GBP differnce between the Cayman and a 911? Even the Boxster S and a 911 Convertible.

    I haven't driven a Cayman yet, but have a deposit down.

    I drove a Boxster S (986) and a 911 C4 (996) back to back, and yes the 911 had a bit more grunt, but put the 2 on a windy road, there was very little diffence.

    With the Cayman it has come within a whisker of the Carrera. The only thing that separates them in my opinion are the 3 numbers 911. This is all that makes a Carrera better to those that still stand by the opinion of 911 is better (because its a 911) . I could have bought a 997 911, but felt that the money for the 911 was not worth it in comparison to the Cayman, and I would add that to the Boxster S and the 911 Cab.

    The king is dead, long live the king

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Thanks for the info RC .

    I agree 110% opt for a 911 that's the real thing.



    Pretty dumb remark coming from anyone especially a Rennteam editor.....I guess nothing but a 911 is the "real" thing in the Porsche world?? I really hate to see a great list such as this succumb to statements like this.

    RC was genuine in his remarks and stated his valid opinion of the Cayman compared to the Boxster S.....but remarks such as yours Ron we can all do without. This is a Porsche list.....not a 911 list.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    I guess we all agree that the Cayman isn't cheap. You can spec it up with components that are identical to a 997, or leave it basic - your choice.

    As for driving, test figures mean very little IMHO. What's really going to matter is how the car suits the driver.

    Have you considered that some people might buy a Cayman because it isn't a 911? I'm hoping the better balance and lower cost will mean I can extract more from it, on the road and track.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    MikeN said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Thanks for the info RC .

    I agree 110% opt for a 911 that's the real thing.



    Pretty dumb remark coming from anyone especially a Rennteam editor.....I guess nothing but a 911 is the "real" thing in the Porsche world?? I really hate to see a great list such as this succumb to statements like this.

    RC was genuine in his remarks and stated his valid opinion of the Cayman compared to the Boxster S.....but remarks such as yours Ron we can all do without. This is a Porsche list.....not a 911 list.



    Mike,
    getting so technical indicates that you're pretty brand new to the world of sports cars; or may be you always suffered from not being able to agree with everyone and tend to argue with them in your life. This is a forum which in essence deals with 911 first and then Porsche.

    So for some reference you may want to buy a copy of "Excellence was expected" for your library.

    Sorry if I was somewhat harsh in my post but sometimes you need to tell people the way it is.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    MikeN said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Thanks for the info RC .

    I agree 110% opt for a 911 that's the real thing.



    Pretty dumb remark coming from anyone especially a Rennteam editor.....I guess nothing but a 911 is the "real" thing in the Porsche world?? I really hate to see a great list such as this succumb to statements like this.

    RC was genuine in his remarks and stated his valid opinion of the Cayman compared to the Boxster S.....but remarks such as yours Ron we can all do without. This is a Porsche list.....not a 911 list.



    Mike,
    Point taken but take it easy dude, this forum's alive thanks the RC and Ron in the first place. If you think one's of them dumb, ciao ciao amigo and have a good life!


    Ron's remark was a cheerful one and very enthousiastic, he didn't need to elaborate because RC did all the work to be honest, and a pretty work too. I know the fat man (that would be Ron) personally and trust me, when it comes to car, we're all humbled, he does stuff with four wheels I didn't think possible. Contraty to what you might think, he is not a 911 freak but knows his stuff very well, that's all.

    Now back on the topic, great read RC and very interesting, it confirms what you said all along, Porsche are great at engineering but are clearly even better at marketing!
    Boxster coupe, a bit more HP et Voila! Cancel the 911! Cancel the 911! all the great journnos of the world write... Pfff...
    Great car nonetheless, I admit but not really a bargain.

    You did change your perspective on the 911 line though RC, I remember that when the Cayman was announced, you wrote that Porsche was testing the market to eventually replace the 911, hence the minimal change between the 996 and 997. Glad you realised that the 911 is the real deal, but do you really think that Porsche eventually wants to attract Cayman buyers to 911 ownership in the mid to long term? I'm not sure.

    Now a Cayman with a 997S, THAT would be something, but it's not gonna happen of course, because, although it's not true financially, Porsche wouldn't be anything without the 911, isn't it Mike?

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Quote:
    MikeN said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Thanks for the info RC .

    I agree 110% opt for a 911 that's the real thing.



    Pretty dumb remark coming from anyone especially a Rennteam editor.....I guess nothing but a 911 is the "real" thing in the Porsche world?? I really hate to see a great list such as this succumb to statements like this.

    RC was genuine in his remarks and stated his valid opinion of the Cayman compared to the Boxster S.....but remarks such as yours Ron we can all do without. This is a Porsche list.....not a 911 list.



    Mike,
    getting so technical indicates that you're pretty brand new to the world of sports cars; or may be you always suffered from not being able to agree with everyone and tend to argue with them in your life. This is a forum which in essence deals with 911 first and then Porsche.

    So for some reference you may want to buy a copy of "Excellence was expected" for your library.

    Sorry if I was somewhat harsh in my post but sometimes you need to tell people the way it is.



    Sorry Ron, your remark was still uncalled for IMO....and you are always free to dissagree as am I. It just so happens that when I click on the "main index" for this site a list of all current (and some past) models show up.....not just the 911. I was not aware that this was mainly a 911 forum and if this is the case then yes, there are better places to discuss the Cayman and I will do just that.

    As far as my sports car experience, the Cayman will be my 5th Porsche including a 911, 968, 944T, and 928GT and have owned ones from several other brands in the past. Tracked, maintained, tore down and built each one back up.

    IMO all Porsches are the "real" thing compared to most competitors.....with each one being truly great in its own right but very much different. I have done things in a 968/944T that a 911 would have a very tough time with and the 928 was one of THE best high speed GTs of all time.... much better in its day than any 911 for that purpose.

    Is the Cayman a 911?....no its not and it shouldn't be as it is a different car and will have attributes all its own...some will be better than a 911, some won't. What about the Boxster?....is it "real" or not?

    No matter what, the Cayman will be a very "real" Porsche and worthy of anyone looking for one of the best sports cars out there......a group that contains the 911, but is not limited to it.

    Re: Cayman S Test Drive with REAL numbers

    Quote:
    MikeN said:
    RC was genuine in his remarks and stated his valid opinion of the Cayman compared to the Boxster S.....but remarks such as yours Ron we can all do without. This is a Porsche list.....not a 911 list.



    You'll be surprised to hear that I still know Porsche "hardcore" hardliners and owners who still don't consider ANY other car than the 911 to be a true Porsche.
    I don't agree with them, just to make that clear.
    BUT personally, I have to admit that I don't see the reason to go for a Cayman S. Don't get me wrong, I bet the Cayman S it the hell of a little sportscar and I also bet it is fun. But so are other cars too, not only Porsches.

    Like it or not but many many people out there in the wide world view the 911 as the only true Porsche SPORTSCAR, not necessarily the only true Porsche. And sorry to have to admit it, they are somehow right. I love my wife's Boxster S, it is fun to drive. I love our family Cayenne Turbo Powerkit, it is the hell of a family mover. But when I get inside my 997 CS, I get this feeling...goose bumps allover. 911 magic...it gets you...

     
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