Crown

Board: Ferrari Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    June issue has comparo. With 550 hp, the GT is a bit quicker, but not by much, the difference is 0.1 to 60 (3.7 for the 430, 3.6 for the GT) and half a second to 100. A quote: "The Ferrari feels more special...the Ford returns to Michigan with its head held high - but without an overall victory."

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    June issue has comparo. With 550 hp, the GT is a bit quicker, but not by much, the difference is 0.1 to 60 (3.7 for the 430, 3.6 for the GT) and half a second to 100. A quote: "The Ferrari feels more special...the Ford returns to Michigan with its head held high - but without an overall victory."

    Gary



    interesting. so on an objective performance measuring basis (ie: factual), the GT wins, but on an objective "feels more special" basis (ie: one person's opinion), it loses?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    That "one" person probably thought there is more than just straight line performance numbers to judge a car.

    Gary,

    What was the 1/4 mile times?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:
    That "one" person probably thought there is more than just straight line performance numbers to judge a car.

    Gary,

    What was the 1/4 mile times?



    so what other objective performance measure(s) besides 0-60 and 100 did they use then?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    I recently heard a rumor and read an article by Jeremy Clarkson regarding a recall on the Ford GT, is this true?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    krown05 said:
    I recently heard a rumor and read an article by Jeremy Clarkson regarding a recall on the Ford GT, is this true?



    There have been several. Some serious enough to warn the owner NOT to drive the car.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    What was interesting was the second set of acceleration numbers- the ones in parentheses- which were signif better than the " official " ones, where the Ferrari people pushed a few buttons in special sequence in the car to activate a secret speed algorithm . Of course, they won't give this out, as warranty considerations of the clutch/tranny/engine longevity have to be considered by the manufacturer.It was " just for fun " !
    ( of course this Holy Grail will now be searched for by many F430 owners )

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:
    That "one" person probably thought there is more than just straight line performance numbers to judge a car.

    Gary,

    What was the 1/4 mile times?



    430: 11.7/122.8
    GT: 11.6/126.2

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:

    interesting. so on an objective performance measuring basis (ie: factual), the GT wins, but on an objective "feels more special" basis (ie: one person's opinion), it loses?



    Clearly. And not surprisingly.

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Ferrari people pushed a few buttons in special sequence in the car to activate a secret speed algorithm



    I would call it a special "launch" algorithm, and yes, I would assume it will be "outed" sooner rather than later. But really, the 430 (and any Ferrari) isn't about 1/4 times, although they are interesting. The whole Ferrari experience is just so much more visceral than anything Ford has to offer, even Motor Trend "gets it".

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:


    But really, the 430 (and any Ferrari) isn't about 1/4 times, although they are interesting. The whole Ferrari experience is just so much more visceral than anything Ford has to offer, even Motor Trend "gets it".

    Gary



    Yeah, but they'll all want to know it , despite what they say , like above , for " special situations only " .

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Very interesting. But what's the use in it, when you burn your clutch after two attempts?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Ferrari people pushed a few buttons in special sequence in the car to activate a secret speed algorithm



    I would call it a special "launch" algorithm, and yes, I would assume it will be "outed" sooner rather than later. But really, the 430 (and any Ferrari) isn't about 1/4 times, although they are interesting. The whole Ferrari experience is just so much more visceral than anything Ford has to offer, even Motor Trend "gets it".

    Gary



    I am assuming the launch sequence algorithm was necessitated because of the lack of launch function on a US car. All I can say, based on all the reviews, this is one hell of a car.

    My car lands on US soil Thursday.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:

    430: 11.7/122.8
    GT: 11.6/126.2



    A previous comparison test between an Enzo, CGT, and the Ford Gt showed the Ford with a 1/4 mile time of 11.2 @ 131.2 mph. Now, it's 0.4 seconds slower?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    svtrader1 said:
    A previous comparison test between an Enzo, CGT, and the Ford Gt showed the Ford with a 1/4 mile time of 11.2 @ 131.2 mph. Now, it's 0.4 seconds slower?



    Development ringer vs. production car?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Ferrari people pushed a few buttons in special sequence in the car to activate a secret speed algorithm



    I would call it a special "launch" algorithm, and yes, I would assume it will be "outed" sooner rather than later. But really, the 430 (and any Ferrari) isn't about 1/4 times, although they are interesting. The whole Ferrari experience is just so much more visceral than anything Ford has to offer, even Motor Trend "gets it".

    Gary



    I am assuming the launch sequence algorithm was necessitated because of the lack of launch function on a US car. All I can say, based on all the reviews, this is one hell of a car.

    My car lands on US soil Thursday.




    What the test driver did to the LC programming was :
    "... a series of button pushes and shift-paddle manipulations that wouldn't occur by accident in normal driving . When it's set up, the car is in first gear with the clutch engaged and spinning . Holding the car in place with the brakes , the driver shoots the revs up to 4000 rpm and releases the brake pedal. Rather than spinning the tires, the clutch spins down to 4000 rpm until it locks up at the top of first gear for a launch that would be as smooth and quick as those you see on a Formula 1 grid ... it chops 0.3 secs from every measured speed ...", chopping qtr mile from 12.0 to 11.7 secs and incr qtr mile speed from 120 to 123 mph , normal vs. unapproved modded LC programming.

    The comparo was done in Europe where this particular Italian plated F430 had LC .Correct me if I'm wrong, but US cars don't get LC , so sorry , Nick ! Doubt US cars will get close to either of these two times w/o LC.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Doubt US cars will get close to either of these two times w/o LC.



    All that really matters to me is how the car performs from, say, 40 to 140 or so. Could care less about launch control or 0-60.

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    On the Ferrarichat forums there are some stats that seem to indicate that the Ferrari is better under braking.(from the same test)

    Braking
    100-0 430:278' GT:297'
    60-0 430:100' GT:109'

    It appears that they may have taken into account objective categories other than simply straightline speed. Imagine that!

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Doubt US cars will get close to either of these two times w/o LC.



    All that really matters to me is how the car performs from, say, 40 to 140 or so. Could care less about launch control or 0-60.

    Gary


    Very well said! I think the same!

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    More quotes from the article...

    "Where the Ferrari dives flat and instant into a corner like a racer, the Ford is nowhere near as eager, and there's a remote, viscous quality to the system that holds you at arm's length. This isn't an endearing quality in a supercar this fast."

    "Vision is poor to the rear (in the GT) and nonexistant over the shoulders, The windshield pillars approach your eyes closely, blocking out a lot of the arc of a tight bend."

    "Those cut-roof doors are sheer drama...they just happen to make the GT completely inaccessible unless the door is wide open. If someone parks next to you while you're in a restaurant, you won't be going home."

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    Quote:
    MKW said:
    Ferrari people pushed a few buttons in special sequence in the car to activate a secret speed algorithm



    I would call it a special "launch" algorithm, and yes, I would assume it will be "outed" sooner rather than later. But really, the 430 (and any Ferrari) isn't about 1/4 times, although they are interesting. The whole Ferrari experience is just so much more visceral than anything Ford has to offer, even Motor Trend "gets it".

    Gary



    I am assuming the launch sequence algorithm was necessitated because of the lack of launch function on a US car. All I can say, based on all the reviews, this is one hell of a car.

    My car lands on US soil Thursday.




    What the test driver did to the LC programming was :
    "... a series of button pushes and shift-paddle manipulations that wouldn't occur by accident in normal driving . When it's set up, the car is in first gear with the clutch engaged and spinning . Holding the car in place with the brakes , the driver shoots the revs up to 4000 rpm and releases the brake pedal. Rather than spinning the tires, the clutch spins down to 4000 rpm until it locks up at the top of first gear for a launch that would be as smooth and quick as those you see on a Formula 1 grid ... it chops 0.3 secs from every measured speed ...", chopping qtr mile from 12.0 to 11.7 secs and incr qtr mile speed from 120 to 123 mph , normal vs. unapproved modded LC programming.

    The comparo was done in Europe where this particular Italian plated F430 had LC .Correct me if I'm wrong, but US cars don't get LC , so sorry , Nick ! Doubt US cars will get close to either of these two times w/o LC.



    No LC on US cars. I am fine with that. Would never use it.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    No LC on US cars. I am fine with that. Would never use it.


    LC is an electronic gimmick, that looks fine at your centre console, but no-one really needs it.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    So, were the 12-second 0-200 kph runs achieved with the LC on or off?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    So, were the 12-second 0-200 kph runs achieved with the LC on or off?



    i believe they were utilizing LC for those times. iow, those times are not available on US cars.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    So, were the 12-second 0-200 kph runs achieved with the LC on or off?



    Okay then. So I can correctly surmise that the F430 is in fact no faster than the 996TTS when not using the LC. Ferrari should do better.

    i believe they were utilizing LC for those times. iow, those times are not available on US cars.


    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    ben, lj said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    So, were the 12-second 0-200 kph runs achieved with the LC on or off?



    Okay then. So I can correctly surmise that the F430 is in fact no faster than the 996TTS when not using the LC. Ferrari should do better.

    i believe they were utilizing LC for those times. iow, those times are not available on US cars.





    I really don't get all the emphasis on LC. The performance is there, how many of us do full-on launches from a stop? LC is nice for magazine write-ups to compare to other cars, but who would use it in the real world? From a rolling start the 430 is awesomely explosive, let the whole LC thing just die.

    Gary

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:
    I really don't get all the emphasis on LC. The performance is there, how many of us do full-on launches from a stop? LC is nice for magazine write-ups to compare to other cars, but who would use it in the real world? From a rolling start the 430 is awesomely explosive, let the whole LC thing just die.


    Exactly!

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    tdf360 said:




    I really don't get all the emphasis on LC. The performance is there, how many of us do full-on launches from a stop? LC is nice for magazine write-ups to compare to other cars, but who would use it in the real world? From a rolling start the 430 is awesomely explosive, let the whole LC thing just die.






    I totally agree . Save the tire smoking burn out numbers for Mustangs with live rear axles and drag radials . People with the bucks and the understanding of what refined balanced sports cars/ sedans are really all about would never abuse their expensive cars like this , unless they plan to flip the poor thing after a few hundred miles on the odometer. For the number obsessed , why isn't there a standardized 100-200 kph ( or 60 -125 mph ) from a steady speed /drop the throttle in the best gear " highway acceleration " test for all these higher end cars ? It would make more sense and is more real world, than numbers that start form a dead stop be they to 100 or 200 kph or qtr mile , where cars of similar highway acceleration are variously hampered off the line depending on gearing , tire specs, drive configuration , traction of the particular dragstrip that moment, etc ?

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    MKW said: why isn't there a standardized 100-200 kph ( or 60 -125 mph ) from a steady speed /drop the throttle in the best gear " highway acceleration " test for all these higher end cars ? It would make more sense and is more real world, than numbers that start form a dead stop be they to 100 or 200 kph or qtr mile , where cars of similar highway acceleration are variously hampered off the line depending on gearing , tire specs, drive configuration , traction of the particular dragstrip that moment, etc ?



    I agree.

    Some spanish magazines offer roll-on acceleration figures usually from 20km/h to 70km/h and from 70km/h to 120km/h, which is what I really tend to look at and focus on. Standing start numbers are irrelevant in the real world since not only are the cars not normally abused from standing start launches nor are stupid stoplight races very popular here

    They also offer "recuperation" acceleration tests which is roll-on figures in just one gear, which reflects more torque than HP since its biased towards the ability of the car to "pull" at lower speeds from a tall gear. Not really representative of the real world performance since you always downshift when you want to accelerate fast but useful for those looking for more confortable to drive engines low-rev torquey engines, but not for sportcars. Diesel engines excell at this for example.

    Re: Motor Trend 430 vs Ford GT

    Quote:
    Crash said:

    Okay then. So I can correctly surmise that the F430 is in fact no faster than the 996TTS when not using the LC. Ferrari should do better.





    If you're so fixated on 1/4 mile times, then get the manual and it will produce virtually identical times without LC. The 996tts driver will get a really clear view of the f430 rear end.

     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA 1/17/18 5:15 PM
    martini964
    262746 1682
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3 (2017) 1/17/18 2:59 PM
    throt
    259295 4017
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: 911 GT2 RS (2017) 1/17/18 5:26 PM
    Grant
    87950 1347
    Porsche Sticky 992 (Next 911 generation 2019/2020) 1/12/18 7:11 PM
    the-missile
    67215 673
    Porsche Sticky Porsche Mission E - the future of Porsche? 1/3/18 8:32 PM
    CGX car nut
    39766 468
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Turbo S Exclusive Series (2017) 11/28/17 12:15 AM
    EnglishManInNY
    23891 332
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New Porsche Carrera T 12/1/17 7:24 PM
    crayphile
    13682 243
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: Porsche 718 GTS models (Oct. 2017) 10/24/17 12:19 PM
    amazon
    7115 19
    Porsche 918 latest news Thread Closed 11/6/17 10:43 AM
    RCA
    547512 5574
    Porsche 991 GT3 RS 1/9/18 1:43 PM
    Kimi
    455918 5816
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S 10/26/17 1:33 PM
    NSXER
    445763 4239
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche Carrera 911 [991.2] Facelift 3/24/17 12:49 PM
    RCA
    254510 1382
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 1/4/18 9:14 PM
    wurlie
    247354 2558
    Porsche 997 GT3 RS 4.0 3/15/17 10:40 PM
    noone1
     
     
     
     
     
    231076 737
    Porsche Cayman GT4 12/30/17 11:07 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS
    212767 2482
    Porsche 991 GT2 RS (2017) - Rumors, speculations and gossip Thread Closed 7/3/17 2:04 PM
    RCA
    175366 1699
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 11/13/17 2:32 AM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    164498 874
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Turbo and Turbo S 12/15/17 1:44 PM
    RCA
    164055 1072
    Ferrari 488 GTB/GTS 12/15/17 11:32 AM
    RCA
    139733 1190
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 1/8/18 12:32 PM
    rhino
    138835 2855
    Porsche 991.2 GT3 Thread Closed 3/7/17 11:47 AM
    RCA
    124841 1651
    Porsche Boxster Spyder (981) 12/29/17 8:31 AM
    dreamcar
    110232 692
    Porsche Collected my 997 GTS today 1/22/17 7:32 AM
    BiTurbo
     
     
     
     
     
    108103 801
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016) 1/6/18 10:41 PM
    Wonderbar
    107978 1284
    Others Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016 model) - Review (updated Feb 13th 2017) 1/17/18 3:27 PM
    Lars997M
    105178 1861
    Ferrari Ferrari F12 Berlinetta / 599 GTO Successor 12/5/17 3:29 PM
    RCA
    86800 765
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 718 Boxster (2016) 10/20/17 11:17 AM
    DaveGordon
    81649 732
    Others VW caught cheating emissions tests 7/10/17 2:36 PM
    RCA
    80989 861
    Porsche 991 GTS 4/3/17 4:27 PM
    bluelines
    68212 247
    Porsche OFFICIAL: Cayenne (958) Facelift 2014 3/2/17 4:22 PM
    RCA
    66679 163
    373 items found, displaying 1 to 30.