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    Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

     

     A picture of Ferrari's board of directors says it will pull out of Formula One competition if a budget cap is enacted for the 2010 season.
    Ferrari's board of directors says it will pull out of Formula One competition if a budget cap is enacted for the 2010 season.
    LAT PHOTOGRAPHIC

    Ferrari's board of directors met at company headquarters in Maranello, Italy, on Tuesday and confirmed that the company will quit Formula One if the FIA's plan to introduce a "budget cap" in 2010 goes ahead.

    FIA president Max Mosley wants to allow teams to run with a £40 million ($61 million) spending limit, minus marketing expenses, engine costs and driver salaries. The FIA expects such a cap to allow new teams to enter the championship at a reasonable--in F1 terms, anyway--price. Teams will be allowed to operate while ignoring the budget cap if they wish, but with performance restrictions not imposed on those who choose to accept the spending limit.

    This effectively will create a "two-tier" F1, and the budget cap has left established teams, including Ferrari, seething.

    "The board of directors . . . examined developments related to recent decisions taken by the Federation Internationale de l'Automobile during an extraordinary meeting of the World Motor Sport Council on April 29, 2009," Ferrari said in a statement. "Although this meeting was originally called only to examine a disciplinary matter [involving McLaren-Mercedes], the decisions taken mean that, for the first time ever in Formula One, the 2010 season will see the introduction of two different sets of regulations based on arbitrary technical rules and economic parameters.

    "The board considers that if this is the regulatory framework for Formula One in the future, then the reasons underlying Ferrari's uninterrupted participation in the world championship over the last 60 years--the only constructor to have taken part ever since its inception in 1950--would come to a close.

    "The board also expressed its disappointment about the methods adopted by the FIA in taking decisions of such a serious nature and its refusal to effectively reach an understanding with constructors and teams. The rules of governance that have contributed to the development of Formula One over the last 25 years have been disregarded, as have the binding contractual obligations between Ferrari and the FIA itself regarding the stability of the regulations.

    "The same rules for all teams, stability of regulations, the continuity of the FOTA's endeavors to methodically and progressively reduce costs, and governance of Formula One are the priorities for the future. If these indispensable principles are not respected, and if the regulations adopted for 2010 will not change, then Ferrari does not intend to enter its cars in the next Formula One world championship.

    "Ferrari trusts that its many fans worldwide will understand that this difficult decision is coherent with the Scuderia's approach to motor sport and to Formula One in particular, always seeking to promote its sporting and technical values."

    Ferrari is not the only team known to be willing to quit F1 if the two-tier system comes to fruition. Toyota boss John Howett toldAutoSport at the Spanish Grand Prix last weekend that Toyota was not willing to race under such a scenario, and Red Bull owner Dieter Mateschitz said that he would pull both of his teams--Red Bull Racingand Scuderia Toro Rosso--from F1, too, while BMW and Renault are also believed to hold the same attitude.

    Almost certainly, McLaren-Mercedes holds the same view, though its recent troubles with the FIA over the 2007 industrial-espionage scandal against Ferrari, and this year's lying affair at the Australian Grand Prix, are likely keeping the team silent on the matter--for now.


    --

     


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

     

     

    I don't think that Dancing Donkey is going anywhere.

    They'll work it out with Spanky; the Midget will see to it.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Spyderidol:

     

     

    I don't think that Dancing Donkey is going anywhere.

    They'll work it out with Spanky; the Midget will see to it.

    F1 needs a new broom. Those has-beens, Spanky and the Midget, need to be given the bum's rush.

    It is unforgivable that FIA and the teams did not grasp the opportunity to get rid of Mosley last year.


    --

    fritz


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    fritz:

    F1 needs a new Brawn.


    There, fixed that for you Smiley


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Eunice:
    fritz:

    F1 needs a new Brawn.


    There, fixed that for you Smiley

    Thank you, but in fact F1 already has brawn.

    It now needs  brains. Smiley


    --

    fritz


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    hahahaha yeah god forbid performance has to come out of efficient use of financial resources!! Im not surprised Ferrari of all is crying the most 

    Honestly how can you complain about the fact that your costs will be cut significantly

    It will be more about racing, rather than about $$$.

    Byebye Ferrari


    --

    2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
    1986 Porsche 944, 5spd


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    There should not be a cost cap for F1 period, it's the world's top racing series for christ sake. As the old saying goes, "Speed Cost Money, How Fast Do You Want To Go?"

    If they were to cap the cost, what's the difference between watching F1 and lesser racing series? There is not much innovation, certainly not bleeding cutting edge tech as those cost too much to fit under a cap. We watched F1 to see the latest and greatest car technology on display, not some cost cutting cars swarming around a race track pretending to be the top dog in automobile racing.

    It's not out of the blue to imagine Ferrari contacting MacLaren and Toyota and others to discuss running their own series, kind of like last time they got together in order to get concession from FIA.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    I agree that the technical part is a critical aspect of what F1 is all about, but a budget cap of $61 million will not completely destory all technological advancaments and developments. nor will it make F1 a lesser racing series. It will just give more of an equal opportunity. Cause if Brawn is racing with chewed up front wings from the past race and JB is doing laps around Ferrari and McLaren who spend tens of millions more on development and windtunnel testing, i wonder where the upper hand comes from. The budget cap will only affect the big spenders who are at the tail of the pack right now. And it's not the diffusor issue alone because Red Bull is running solid without that!

    I think that more so, F1 regulations will limit those technological advancements we need to continue to see in F1. They really defy what extend of innovations will be applied by teams in F1. Deregulation is the way to go... most teams are so sketched out by all the regulations these days that they lose oversight..

    And finally, by cutting costs to a more managable level, will this not trigger developments of innovations with a smaller price sticker, therefore becoming more lucrative to the automotive alltogether as a prodcution alternative such as ABS was back in its day? 

    I bet the 3 teams you mention crying over the budget cap ( Ferrari, McLaren and Toyota) are the only teams actually spending more annually to run their F1 ventures, while the rest isn't even spending $61 Million a year. I'd love to see a statistic on the running costs of all F1 teams.


    --

    2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
    1986 Porsche 944, 5spd


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    2008
    Toyota: $445.6m
    McLaren: $433.3m
    Ferrari: $414.9m
    Honda: $398.1m
    Renault: $393.8m
    BMW Sauber: $366.8m
    Red Bull Racing: $164.7m
    Williams: $160.6m
    Toro Rosso: $128.2m
    Force India: $121.85m
    Super Aguri: $45.6m
    http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/09/22/toyota-has-b...


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Atzporsche:

    I agree that the technical part is a critical aspect of what F1 is all about, but a budget cap of $61 million will not completely destory all technological advancaments and developments. nor will it make F1 a lesser racing series. It will just give more of an equal opportunity. Cause if Brawn is racing with chewed up front wings from the past race and JB is doing laps around Ferrari and McLaren who spend tens of millions more on development and windtunnel testing, i wonder where the upper hand comes from. The budget cap will only affect the big spenders who are at the tail of the pack right now. And it's not the diffusor issue alone because Red Bull is running solid without that!

    I think that more so, F1 regulations will limit those technological advancements we need to continue to see in F1. They really defy what extend of innovations will be applied by teams in F1. Deregulation is the way to go... most teams are so sketched out by all the regulations these days that they lose oversight..

    And finally, by cutting costs to a more managable level, will this not trigger developments of innovations with a smaller price sticker, therefore becoming more lucrative to the automotive alltogether as a prodcution alternative such as ABS was back in its day? 

    I bet the 3 teams you mention crying over the budget cap ( Ferrari, McLaren and Toyota) are the only teams actually spending more annually to run their F1 ventures, while the rest isn't even spending $61 Million a year. I'd love to see a statistic on the running costs of all F1 teams.

    Whether or not one agrees with the whole philosophy of a cost-cap, the main contention Ferrari has is that it is simply unrealistic for the FIA to expect teams with current budgets in excess of $400 million to suddenly strip down to an operating budget of almost 10x less in less than a year. Hence, the only other option for such teams is to compete on technical terms which are vastly differential in favor of the smaller teams capable of attaining the budget limit, therefore creating a "two-tier" championship.

    Thus, how is your preference to giving teams "more of an equal opportunity" consistent with a two-tier system?

    In any case, this whole "social justice" the FIA is trying to advance by evening out the playing field is just idiotic, IMHO. Certain teams have always/will always have the upper hand in terms of competitiveness so whats the point of artificially impeding ALL teams just to create a new order of teams that will again give rise to the same monotonous order on the grid? Just look at this season: the results are consistent with previous years in as much as certain teams clearly have the better car (ie. Brawn and Red Bull), just that these new "dominant" teams are others than the traditional Ferraris, McLarens and Williams' of old.

    Also, I just dont agree with your view on technical innovation. Although I'm not an engineer by any stretch of the imagination, its clear that a budget cap to the extent the FIA propose will severly impede innovation. There must be a reason why the top teams like Ferrari and McLaren have huge budgets - and also why their excellent achievemnts throughout history has a causal relationship with their resources. If F1 loses the very thing that makes Formula 1 what it is - a technological tour de force accompanied by the best drivers and most recognizable names in the automotive world - then the reason to watch F1 in favor of any other series is lost.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Spyderidol:

    2008
    Toyota: $445.6m
    McLaren: $433.3m
    Ferrari: $414.9m
    Honda: $398.1m
    Renault: $393.8m
    BMW Sauber: $366.8m
    Red Bull Racing: $164.7m
    Williams: $160.6m
    Toro Rosso: $128.2m
    Force India: $121.85m
    Super Aguri: $45.6m
    http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/09/22/toyota-has-b...


    Thank you. 61mil pretty much means a budget slightly over the now bankrupted Super Aguri. Do we want to see 2-3 year old cars racing each other? That's what teams can afford to race with a tiny 61mil cap.

    Interesting to know Renault has joined Red Bull and Ferrari to declare pulling out, while MacLaren is keeping it's mouth shut, perhaps politics from FIA to blame with the so-called 'suspended sentence'?

    MacLaren could be FIA's Ace-in-the-hole, may not be a willing partner but MacLaren didn't really have a choice, they are pretty much being blackmailed into the FIA side.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Renault has also threatened to withdraw:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8048112.stm

    So that means Ferrari, Renault, Toyota (and, according to this article, Red Bull - which presumably also includes Toro Rosso) may not be in F1 next year unless the rules are changed.

    Interesting view from Andrew Benson of the BBC:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/andrewbenson/2009/05/f1_battle_lines_are_drawn.html

     


    --

    Rennteam Moderator - 997.1 C2S Coupe GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    So no Ferrari, no Renault, no Toyota, no Red Bull, no Toro Rosso, maybe no MacLaren also if MacLaren can say something.

    WIlliams racing against Brawn, Force India, USGP, ProDrive, maybe with a tiny cap Hyundai might join in the fun, and a bunch of Chinese unknown manufacturers.

    I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO looking forward to F1 racing.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    I don't really follow F1 racing, but why not have a two-tiered system.  One for entrants who want to be capped at $61M, and and one for unlimited budgets, like the Ferraris and the Renaults, etc.  And then, let the audience decide who they want to watch.  Smiley


    --

    2005 997S Blk/Blk


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    But do they crown 2 winners? One for each class a la Le Mans? In that case, the overall winner is still the most important winner.

    There is already F2, F3, F2000, A1 GP, GP2 etc for those who cannot afford the big cost of F1.

    GP2 is Bernie's pet project, they could raise the cap on GP2 to 61mil and let those who cannot afford the 10 digit cost.

    Granted GP2 is a spec-ed series, but F3 is not.

     

    If someone can't afford the cost, they should find something that's more affordable.

    This is like walking into the no-limit poker room and demanded that a cap be put on chips because someone can't afford to play in no-limit poker. Rediculous.

     

     


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    I was tongue-in-cheek making this suggestion because in the end, nobody would really care about a class of race where the entrants were limited financially, when the truly best, financially unlimited, participants were also allowed to compete, in a different league.

    It would be like the NBA having two leagues.  One in which the salary of each player was limited to $250K per year, and another league which had no such salary limits.  Which league would all the best players play in and which league would you therefore be more interested in watching.


    --

    2005 997S Blk/Blk


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Haha, got you Alan :)

    Max and Bernie obviously thinks differently.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Whoopsy:
    Spyderidol:

    2008
    Toyota: $445.6m
    McLaren: $433.3m
    Ferrari: $414.9m
    Honda: $398.1m
    Renault: $393.8m
    BMW Sauber: $366.8m
    Red Bull Racing: $164.7m
    Williams: $160.6m
    Toro Rosso: $128.2m
    Force India: $121.85m
    Super Aguri: $45.6m
    http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/09/22/toyota-has-b...


    Thank you. 61mil pretty much means a budget slightly over the now bankrupted Super Aguri. Do we want to see 2-3 year old cars racing each other? That's what teams can afford to race with a tiny 61mil cap.

    Interesting to know Renault has joined Red Bull and Ferrari to declare pulling out, while MacLaren is keeping it's mouth shut, perhaps politics from FIA to blame with the so-called 'suspended sentence'?

    MacLaren could be FIA's Ace-in-the-hole, may not be a willing partner but MacLaren didn't really have a choice, they are pretty much being blackmailed into the FIA side.

    Wow i certainly did not expect costs to be so high. Makes this $61 million budget cap very unrealistic... only one team falls within that and they're not even going noticed on the track while being almost bankrupt :s

    In retrospect i applaud the idea of a budget cut to keep things on the ground financially while still keep the sport alive. But a 61mil cap is certainly very abrupt and will be the death of F1. Perhaps a cap of say 300 million is more realistic. I still think some sort of cap is the way to go given the current situation of technological advancements... Or else we will see things that cost $100 million + to get 0.001 seconds out of a lap Smileyand thus F1 could fall into the boring trap of the team with the most $$$ will be at the top... that would be the death of the sport also Smiley


    --

    2005 Ford Focus S, 5spd
    1986 Porsche 944, 5spd


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Spyderidol:

    2008
    Toyota: $445.6m
    McLaren: $433.3m
    Ferrari: $414.9m
    Honda: $398.1m
    Renault: $393.8m
    BMW Sauber: $366.8m
    Red Bull Racing: $164.7m
    Williams: $160.6m
    Toro Rosso: $128.2m
    Force India: $121.85m
    Super Aguri: $45.6m
    http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2008/09/22/toyota-has-b...

    Good information - do you know whether this expenditure includes drivers salaries, marketing and all the other high cost items which are excluded from the 'Cap' proposals?Smiley


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    I think these costs include drivers salaries, but I'll check.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    John, these numbers include:

    Sponsorship, supplier deals, prize money, team owner contributions, tyre provision and supply of customer engines where appropriate.


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    More intersting analysis:

    2007 team cost per point

    2007 team resources divided by points scored.

    Ferrari: $1.9m
    BMW Sauber: $3.3m
    Williams: $4m
    Red Bull Racing: $5.9m
    Renault: $7.3m
    Toro Rosso: $10.6m
    Super Aguri: $19.4m
    Toyota: $34.2m
    Spyker: $52.95m
    Honda: $57.2m
    McLaren: No points scored

    Average length of current sponsorships by team

    Ferrari: 13 seasons
    McLaren: 7.07 seasons
    Toyota: 5.36 seasons
    BMW Sauber: 4.27 seasons
    Renault: 3.97 seasons
    Williams: 3.83 seasons
    Honda: 3.28 seasons
    Red Bull Racing: 2.73 seasons
    Force India: 2.16 seasons
    Super Aguri: 1.88 seasons
    Toro Rosso: 1.86 seasons


    Re: Ferrari taking its ball and going home?

    Nice article debating whether F1 can survive without Ferrari:

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1898892,00.html

     And they come to a very true conclusion:

    The uncertainty reflects poorly on those in charge of the sport — essentially Ecclestone and the FIA. The snafu "brings to light that there's no real professional process in place to agree on the future" of Formula One, says the former adviser. Stewart agrees. "There's got to be a restructuring of the governing body to project more stability," he says, "to take it through the long term." For now, fans will just be hoping that that future includes Ferrari.


     
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