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    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    RC:
    watt:

    RC,

    so a Turbo S will likely run as fast as the Speciale for half the price?

    The Speciale is rumored to cost around 235k EUR (base price incl. 19% German VAT). I guess a well equipped car will be around 260k EUR, as I predicted before. The Turbo S is unfortunately not half the price. Smiley A well equipped Turbo S is around 205k EUR. The Speciale however is rumored to do 0-200 kph in 9.1 seconds, so the performance of the Speciale should be better than the one of the 991 Turbo S, especially in the over 150 kph range.

    .... I like Ferrari's approach of lowering the 458 weight by 90 kg. I know that, considering the new AWS system and wider body, the weight of the new 991 Turbo S is actually 25 kg lower than the previous model but they should have dropped the weight by real 50 kg. ....

    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)

    The Ferrari expert of the board is Iain. But I would like to chime in here.

    I think value of the Speciale is very very good, especially in Ferrari measures. It is only 30k euro (exc. German VAT) more expensive than regular italia but offers:

    Racing Seats (5000 euro) - Alcantara trim (3500 euro) - interior carbon fiber pack including doors (11000 euro) - Forged dark color rims (4300 euro) - Scuderia shields (1000 euro) - carbon fiber airbox (some 5000 euro) as standart options on the car.

    And it has much better brakes, active aero, 35 hp more, at least 50-60 kg lighter (I'll come to that 90 kg), better dynamics, sportier transmission software and all over better car.

    The only thing it lacks is the radio/Hi-Fi system Smiley If I were to buy one, I would only get hi-fi system, colored brake calipers and rear parking sensors. That's all you need to have all of which will cost around 5-6k euro and the rest comes with the car. I think it is a much better value than Scuderia in terms of extra equipment. Now the cabin has enough alcantara upholstery as standart which will give that rich feel and several different colors of 3D fabric can be chosen for the middle part of the seats and the headlinear. It is still possible to load the car with every carbon option, expensive stripes, more alcantara or leather, telemetry data and even in-cam. But they are not essential to enjoy the car.

    As for the 90kg lower weight: It is possible to have it that way if you check all the extra carbon options including engine bay and the diffuser. Also you should not choose any equipment which would add weight such as radio/Hi-Fi, leather, navi, telemetry, roll-bar etc.


    --

    ONUR

    THE BEST CAR EVER smiley

    11 E92 M3 CP - 09 Audi TTS Coupe - 07 997 Carrera S - 05 M3 Coupe - 03 M3 Coupe - 96 M3 Coupe EVO (PASS TIME HISTORY)

     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    4trac:

    OK, now they've got me.... I am a sucker for those red alcantara seats, the weird sheen on the Scud seat fabric just didn't work.  Performance, handling, blah blah, it's really all about the seats my friends.  

    scientifically speaking this is really where all the performance improvement comes from. ask any pro. 


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Enmanuel:
    4trac:

    OK, now they've got me.... I am a sucker for those red alcantara seats, the weird sheen on the Scud seat fabric just didn't work.  Performance, handling, blah blah, it's really all about the seats my friends.  

    scientifically speaking this is really where all the performance improvement comes from. ask any pro. 

    He may be joking but its one thing F does very well, from strad to scud to speciale their racing seats are fantastic, and they a very important to me after 3 spine surgeries.....

    the gt3 (buckets) seats in the 2000 decade as we called them in usa arent bad either, the buckets in my 2011 turbo s were decent, but i dont like the standard 991 s seat i have here in usa it hurts my back,butt and legs.  I expect the buckets in my RHD gt3 to be pretty good....  But again, F does it best


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    RC, Porsche doesn't care if they lose sales to Lamborghini or Audi. They are all the same company. The 911 may have better margins, but that's about it.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    There not the same company


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    noone1:

    RC, Porsche doesn't care if they lose sales to Lamborghini or Audi. They are all the same company. The 911 may have better margins, but that's about it.

    Smiley I think that you kind of misunderstood the position of Porsche and even Audi or Lamborghini in the VW Group (despite the fact that Porsche SA actually practically owns VW right now Smiley).

    I get it, Ferrari and Fiat are the same company but actually, they are not. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Cayenne GTS (958), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Ferrari 458 configurator, quite nice:

    http://car-configurator.ferrari.com/458speciale/#config/1|40400|18024400|11800000|40||240532|2a180000||||||||ffe7040


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    So it few days ago. With few "minor" options you are at €250K price in Germany.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Ferrari prices are just retarded now. I saw the option prices and they were simply insulting.  I'll never buy one on principle alone.

    $12K for painted racing stripe
    $12K for two-tone paint
    $950 for red seat belt
    $7000 parking sensors and camera

    Hell, $1200 for cruise control. FUCKING CRUISE CONTROL. I don't even think you can buy a car without cruise control these days, yet its $1200 of a Ferrari.

    I would be downright embarrassed to spec a car. I'm sorry, but Ferrari caring about their customers is bullshit. They want nothing more than to squeeze every last penny from you. They are laughing all the way to the bank.

    I think you have more money than sense if you spec anything other than a bare-bones Ferrari, though from what I've heard, dealers won't even let you fill an order with less than $30K in options.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Yes, Ferrari prices for options are pretty high, even in EU.

    Just...

    Same thing about your beloved 650S. Check out for prices for following options on 650S:

    -exterior carbon package

    -sport exaust

    -front lifter

    I was offered 650S Coupe with these options and car price in Germany is close to €260K... Ouch!

     

    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Lets face it if Ferrari are going to limit production to 7000 cars and boost profits then they can only increases prices and/or reduce costs and/or squeeze customers for as much either options and custom stuff..... they will find customers no matter for 7000 cars as long as their products fit the brand.


    --

    2013 BMW 750 xDrive & 2012 x5 & 2014 991 TTS Cab. Range Rover V8 on order June14 - GT3 or Huracan to add next......decisions decisions decisions.....


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Well... With Porsche we have to pay for floormats.... And that's a mass-produced car!! Nothing exotic or exclusive. A €7000 euro new Kia Picanto gets all those things as standard and even comes with a 7 years warranty. Smiley

    Maybe we shouldn't buy any expensive cars anymore Smiley

    i'd rather pay $12k for a painted N.A.R.T. stripe on a Ferrari than $11k for a PTS color on a 911 that happens to be a VW Golf color! (Oryx White).

    All these premium and exclusive brands are squeezing customers... Because they can.


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    SuzyF:

    i'd rather pay $12k for a painted N.A.R.T. stripe on a Ferrari than $11k for a PTS color on a 911 that happens to be a VW Golf color! (Oryx White).


    Ah, Suzy and her Onyx white trauma again. Smiley

    All these premium and exclusive brands are squeezing customers... Because they can.


    Sad, but true. Smiley

     


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    noone1:

    Ferrari prices are just retarded now. I saw the option prices and they were simply insulting.  I'll never buy one on principle alone.

    $7000 parking sensors and camera

     

    7K for sensors SmileySmileySmiley they make 6.5K profit with this option alone.


    --

    J.Seven

    997.2 Cab 2S. Maserati Quattroporte Sport GTS, BMW X6 4.0D, BMW X5 4.4i V8


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    I wonder how many options you could get on a F40 or a 288, or even a 355. They've really been milking it these last 15 years.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    The most expensive options are not really necessary. Compared to Porsche more things are standard and they produce many less cars, so I would say it is fair...


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Rossi:
    SuzyF:

    i'd rather pay $12k for a painted N.A.R.T. stripe on a Ferrari than $11k for a PTS color on a 911 that happens to be a VW Golf color! (Oryx White).


    Ah, Suzy and her Onyx white trauma again. Smiley

    LOL! Yeah I know... i'm still not over it Smiley  I'm trying to find professional help.... Smiley


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Before we laugh too much at Ferrari, has anyone seen what Porsche charges for special paint or decals on the 918?


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    They can charge whatever they want, because obviously there are people paying for it. $12k for a painted stripe? Who is actually retarded, the seller or the buyer? angry


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    JoeRockhead:

    I wonder how many options you could get on a F40 or a 288, or even a 355. They've really been milking it these last 15 years.


    F355 was nearly perfect straight from the production line. Basically nothing to add, perhaps leather ceiling or drilled brakes, done. Smiley

    Those were the days... Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Man I saw a 355 spider the other day... I remember why it's my favorite Ferrari ever... it's stunning and simple!


    --

    1991 BMW 535i Granitsilber/White Leather

    Ex: '91 BMW 318i, '89 BMW 525i, '74 Mercedes-Benz 280E, '87 BMW 325is, '86 BMW 325e, '05 Ford Focus ZX4 S, '85.5 Porsche 944

    
    

    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    bluelines:

    They can charge whatever they want, because obviously there are people paying for it. $12k for a painted stripe? Who is actually retarded, the seller or the buyer? angry

    Yes and 2600 euro for spare tyre, and 8000 for historical or hysterical colours.... But porsche is just as bad.. But we do get 7 years free maintenance...   Bet no clutch or pads....Smiley


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    KresoF1:

    Yes, Ferrari prices for options are pretty high, even in EU.

    Just...

    Same thing about your beloved 650S. Check out for prices for following options on 650S:

    -exterior carbon package

    -sport exaust

    -front lifter

    I was offered 650S Coupe with these options and car price in Germany is close to €260K... Ouch!

     

    True, still expensive, but many options are still far cheaper than Ferrari. I personally don't care about CF very much and wouldn't spec more than a few things in it, but I do care a lot about interior/exterior colors and amenities. 

    I think EU prices for the 650S are a lot higher than the US though. I think you can get a really nice 650S coupe in the US under $300K.


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    noone1:

    Ferrari prices are just retarded now. I saw the option prices and they were simply insulting.  I'll never buy one on principle alone.

    $12K for painted racing stripe
    $12K for two-tone paint
    $950 for red seat belt
    $7000 parking sensors and camera

    Hell, $1200 for cruise control. FUCKING CRUISE CONTROL. I don't even think you can buy a car without cruise control these days, yet its $1200 of a Ferrari.

    I would be downright embarrassed to spec a car. I'm sorry, but Ferrari caring about their customers is bullshit. They want nothing more than to squeeze every last penny from you. They are laughing all the way to the bank.

    I think you have more money than sense if you spec anything other than a bare-bones Ferrari, though from what I've heard, dealers won't even let you fill an order with less than $30K in options.

    I don't know the situation in the States but there is no one at the dealer to force you to put extra options on the car in European dealers.

    The racing stripes are too expensive -7700 Euro + VAT in Germany- but they are painted in a different facility. The options you have listed are not essentials, IMO. You only need rear parking sensor which is something like 900 euro, -again very expensive but possible to live with.

    At least, all the alcantara and the carbon in the cabin comes standart with the car. If you choose different 3D fabric color, the stitching comes in that color, too -without paying extra. Last time I look, Porsche asks more than 1000 euro for the deviated stitching just for the steering wheel.

    The stitched Cavallino on the standart alcantara seats also come free like the carbon intake monifold and carbon airbox.

    IMO, if you don't ask extreme options on colors and luxury items; and just focus on the performance oriented options, the prices are reasonable, IMO. At least you don't need to pay extra for launch control and sportiest settings of the transmission and the engine like you do in Porsche by paying for sport chrono OR you don't need to pay extra for LSD. 


    --

    ONUR

    THE BEST CAR EVER smiley

    11 E92 M3 CP - 09 Audi TTS Coupe - 07 997 Carrera S - 05 M3 Coupe - 03 M3 Coupe - 96 M3 Coupe EVO (PASS TIME HISTORY)

     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    SuzyF:

    Well... With Porsche we have to pay for floormats.... And that's a mass-produced car!! Nothing exotic or exclusive. A €7000 euro new Kia Picanto gets all those things as standard and even comes with a 7 years warranty. Smiley

    Maybe we shouldn't buy any expensive cars anymore Smiley

    i'd rather pay $12k for a painted N.A.R.T. stripe on a Ferrari than $11k for a PTS color on a 911 that happens to be a VW Golf color! (Oryx White).

    All these premium and exclusive brands are squeezing customers... Because they can.

    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     

    +1 SmileySmiley

    I didn't even get a usb on my 981 Cayman. I had to pay for the Navi to get it.

    At least bluetooth phone, usb and floor mats are standart in a 458 with all the leather.


    --

    ONUR

    THE BEST CAR EVER smiley

    11 E92 M3 CP - 09 Audi TTS Coupe - 07 997 Carrera S - 05 M3 Coupe - 03 M3 Coupe - 96 M3 Coupe EVO (PASS TIME HISTORY)

     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    watt:
    bluelines:

    They can charge whatever they want, because obviously there are people paying for it. $12k for a painted stripe? Who is actually retarded, the seller or the buyer? angry

    Yes and 2600 euro for spare tyre, and 8000 for historical or hysterical colours.... But porsche is just as bad.. But we do get 7 years free maintenance...   Bet no clutch or pads....Smiley

    At least there are several metalic colors on offer which come free such as titanio, tour de france, silverstone, argento nurburgring, nero to name the few.


    --

    ONUR

    THE BEST CAR EVER smiley

    11 E92 M3 CP - 09 Audi TTS Coupe - 07 997 Carrera S - 05 M3 Coupe - 03 M3 Coupe - 96 M3 Coupe EVO (PASS TIME HISTORY)

     


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    Atzporsche:

    Man I saw a 355 spider the other day... I remember why it's my favorite Ferrari ever... it's stunning and simple!

    +1 Smiley


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    bluelines:
    Atzporsche:

    Man I saw a 355 spider the other day... I remember why it's my favorite Ferrari ever... it's stunning and simple!

    +1 Smiley

    Simple until you need to change the timing belt. Smiley


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    PDK, navi and ceramic brakes are also standard...


    Re: 458 Speciale intro

    JoeRockhead:
    bluelines:
    Atzporsche:

    Man I saw a 355 spider the other day... I remember why it's my favorite Ferrari ever... it's stunning and simple!

    +1 Smiley

    Simple until you need to change the timing belt. Smiley

    Replacement cost is ridiculous Smiley but the 355 has a timeless shape Smiley

    The older a Ferrari gets, the more mechanics you'll need for a quick push and go SmileySmiley

     


     
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