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    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    What happens if you're speeding in a car that isn't yours? Can they confinscate a car that doens't belong to you and sell it? Would the confinscate a rental car?


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    noone1:

    What happens if you're speeding in a car that isn't yours? Can they confinscate a car that doens't belong to you and sell it? Would the confinscate a rental car?

    You are still too fast. No. No.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Solution: Open a company, buy the car under the company, rent it for a small fee from the company. You'll still get in trouble, but they won't be able to take the car since it will be owned by the company.

    Too sketchy? ;)


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    LOL! I like your thinking. smiley

    You would still go to jail though. Plus pay a hefty fine. Plus no driver's license. I don't see the car confiscation as the main problem. It is a bummer, but you are in so deep sh*t that it does not matter. You will probably get the car back in better condition than when it was confiscated anyway 

    To those who preach freedom and equal rights. We are not talking about your usual speeding incident here. These laws target excessive speeding at twice the allowed speed. The laws are there to protect. If they don't hurt, they are pointless.


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    nberry:

    If they confiscate the car and sell it who gets the proceeds? What is the purpose of selling the car?

    The purpose of selling the car is only the fact that you want use the same car to do this once again. it's actually the same proceedure as with a gun. if you did shot someone, they will get the gun that shot the guy but the ten others that you have.
    the persons getting the proceeds is the state. one part of the sell is for the fine and the rest goes to the state.

    --

    Audi TT, Cayenne S, Go kart Birrel, John Deer


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Leawood911:

    That's crazy - charging fines based on how much you are worth, the car you drive or how much you earn!  I love the US - I can drive my Turbo like its on fire 90% of the time and no body cares - No speed cameras, no excessive fines, just equal treatment without greed or 'social-justice'!  I must say that here in Kansas I enjoy free use of my car far more than anyone in Europe - Germany included!  I would trade the unrestricted autobahn and german speed cameras elsewhere for Kansas and Missouri roads ) except the scenery anytime. 

    I feel bad for you Cram - hang in there.  I would buy a 50cc scooter in der Schweiz

    well, what can i say, yes it's crazy. today killing someone right away, will almost cost you less then driving to fast or having pushed on the thruttle and speed. SmileySmileySmiley

    thanks i've a good power ahead, so doing ok. but my days are not the same. but i'm still alive and positiv attitude.Smiley

     

     


    --

    Audi TT, Cayenne S, Go kart Birrel, John Deer


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    noone1:

    What happens if you're speeding in a car that isn't yours? Can they confinscate a car that doens't belong to you and sell it? Would the confinscate a rental car?

    in any situation with this new law, they will get on the owner of the car. let's imagine you get flashed, you ask to see the picture, on the picture we can't see if it's you or not. you tell the police, it wasn't me but a friend from bagodville in Canada. You as the owner get the fine and all the trouble. This is due to the fact that there's been to many things like this in our country.

    Now, you open a company, you are the director of it, you drive a car under the company name, the car will be sequester as well. Happen to a guy in the swiss german part. The guy got his company car taken plus the 2 cars at home and his bike. This is really wird. i guess he'll have to get a really  good lower but even with a good one, it'll be difficult to get the cars back.


    --

    Audi TT, Cayenne S, Go kart Birrel, John Deer


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    this new law is so rude that even the state prosecutor don't have always the right solution to how they should punish you. But anyway they will always find the right solution for you.


    --

    Audi TT, Cayenne S, Go kart Birrel, John Deer


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    A few clarifications :

    We are talking about huge excessive  speeding , not the regular small speeding . To state it again  :

    You have to be driving at ( or over )  200 km/h in a 120 km/h zone,   140km/h in a 80 km/h zone,  100 km/h in  at  50 km/h zone ( city  ) , 80 km/h in a 30 km/h zone .   + you have about 10 km/h ' margin ' between your speedo + the radar 

    I don't say those speeds are not easily reachable , but they are very serious speeding .

    If you speed a little bit in Switzerland , you just get a normal fine  , like 10 / 15 km/h over the limit ( + 10 km/h margin ) will get you a fine of Euro 100  , on the highway  . So actually up to 150 km/h things are not bad .

    I have more fines when  I drive in France then in Switzerland !!!!!  And I believe UK is also covered with speed cameras, and I would also not want to speed in Germany on the restricted parts ( which must be around 90 % of the roads )

    Same goes to many parts of the US . Try driving at 130 MPH in the US and see what happens !!!!!

    It is a bit strange that so many non Swiss residents  ( on this forum ) get so extreme towards their view about driving in Switzerland, and that for most people living  and driving in Switzerland , it does not seem to be a big issue .

    Do you guys speed permanently or do you respect the limitations ?   I drive most of the time 10 km/h over speed limit and had one  30 Euro fine in Switezrland  in the last  14 years . Maybe I have been lucky .

    Mind you I am completely against this new law and find it way over the top and unfair .

     

    About the sequestration of the car :

    If you reach these speeds , it is not considered as an offense anymore but as a CRIME . That is the whole difference . The car becomes a crime tool and is considered as such, so it is taken away if used in a '' criminal'' manner . Just like a gun or knife would be if used to attack .

    They consider that we have been warned  and that If we still choose to drive at speeds that they have decided are '' criminal'' we have deliberately decided to become '' killing machines '', put other peoples lives at a high danger . ...... and so the consequences .

    Now, in many canton ( regions ) judges have not yet keeped the cars . They have always given them back after a few month . In a few cantons ( Aarau, Bern ) they are much more severe and there they have sold the cars .

    So , it is still the the judge appreciation to see what he will deceide about the cars .  They have a very hard time to apply this law , as it is too extreme and often does not make sense , but they have very little margin .  The jail sentence has always been a '' probation '' sentence . So you foo not go to jail, unless you repeat the fault in  a certain time frame .

        

     

     


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    I still don't get the complaints of some people here. Like Gnill already clarified, this is excessive speeding and in my opinion, it should be punished with excessive fines/penalties.  Sequestration if the car is one if those penalties. I wouldn't even mind if they made these fines even higher.

    The fact that the fines are ralated to your annual income is a perfect system. A fine should hurt, so that you think twice the next time you want to drive that fast. Someone with a monthly income of 20k will only be hurt if a fine is 5000 or more, while someone with a monthly income of 2k will be equally hurt with a fine of 500k. To be clear... This system is only for excessive speeding, not for driving 5 or 10km/h to fast.

    One is expected to know the traffic rules, so it is your own responsibillity if you brake the rules. If you want to drive that fast, you know in advance what the consequenses will be. If you don't want to go to jail or have your car confisticated, then make sure you don't drive that fast. it's as simple as that.


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic    [SOLD]
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    SuzyF:

    I still don't get the complaints of some people here. Like Gnill already clarified, this is excessive speeding and in my opinion, it should be punished with excessive fines/penalties.  Sequestration if the car is one if those penalties. I wouldn't even mind if they made these fines even higher.

    The fact that the fines are ralated to your annual income is a perfect system. A fine should hurt, so that you think twice the next time you want to drive that quickly. Someone with a monthly income of 20k will only be hurt if a fine is 5000 or more, while someone with a monthly income of 2k will be equally hurt with a fine of 500k. To be clear... This system is only for excessive speeding, not for driving 5 or 10km/h to fast.

    One is expected to know the traffic rules, so it is your own responsibillity if you brake the rules. If you want to drive that fast, you know in advance what the consequenses will be. If you don't want to go to jail or have your car confisticated, then make sure you don't drive that fast. it's as simple as that.

    +1 SmileySmiley


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    +2 kiss

     


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    TEE:

    I have seen speed traps even on the nice swiss mountain twisties... mail

    I had an unmarked BMW 5 series following me in one of these roads in Switzerland and it was a police car. I spotted them in time but actually wouldn't have been able to speed anyway because of the dangers (incl. dense traffic) but I really felt annoyed when they stopped me anyway (they never gave me a reason) and one of the police officers (they younger one) gave me a lecture on the dangers of these roads. C'mon...really?! Smiley Funny: A motorcycle passed me in a 60 kph area but they were still following me. I know the Swiss police reputation, so I didn't mention it because I didn't want to start an argument and end up with serious problems with them but it was pretty obvious that they wanted to nail me. Somehow.

    This is why I hate driving to Switzerland. Also had an encounter at the border, where they kept me for one hour(!) in my car (I wasn't allowed to even step outside and they warned me not to start the engine). I was there with a 997 Turbo S, didn't have any luggage with me, just wanted to visit a friend in St. Gallen, so no reason for that. Weird.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Next time try to put on your innocent face RC indecision 

    I've never experienced things like that in Switzerland to be honest. Not even at the border. 

    Actually... I think the Netherlands is a lot worse than Switzerland. I did have at least one fine a month, when  i was living there (mostly parking tickets though...)


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic    [SOLD]
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    SuzyF:

    Next time try to put on your innocent face RC indecision 

    I've never experienced things like that in Switzerland to be honest. Not even at the border. 

    Actually... I think the Netherlands is a lot worse than Switzerland. I did have at least one fine a month, when  i was living there (mostly parking tickets though...)

    You're a (pretty?...haven't seen you yet Smiley) woman. Smiley

     


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    SuzyF:

    Next time try to put on your innocent face RC indecision 

    I've never experienced things like that in Switzerland to be honest. Not even at the border. 

     

     

    RC,  you have mentioned those incidents a few times, but I, like Suzy, did not have any of these kind of problems in the 29 years I have been driving in Switzerland as well as crossing the border . Either you have bad luck or you attract them for I don't know what reason ??  Or you don't know how to talk to them ?? 

    As for speed traps in the mountains......... please all look at  RC's Bike threat  .  That is exactly why they trap in the mountains ! Too many people killed on motorbike while speeding . ( and again, I don't defend that , but that's why they put them ) .  So, on one hand the same people complain about bikes driving like nut cases in twistees and on the other hand are offended when cops try to put a stop to that by trapping .......

    Actually my worst time spend with ' cops ' or similar was at the German border, coming from Holland . What a nightmare I had to go trough and the Germans were dreadful !! Now I will not generalize ..... as it probably could happen in any country .


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Gnil:
    SuzyF:

    Next time try to put on your innocent face RC indecision 

    I've never experienced things like that in Switzerland to be honest. Not even at the border. 

    RC,  you have mentioned those incidents a few times, but I, like Suzy, did not have any of these kind of problems in the 29 years I have been driving in Switzerland as well as crossing the border . Either you have bad luck or you attract them for I don't know what reason ??  Or you don't know how to talk to them ?? 

    As for speed traps in the mountains......... please all look at  RC's Bike threat  .  That is exactly why they trap in the mountains ! Too many people killed on motorbike while speeding . ( and again, I don't defend that , but that's why they put them ) .  So, on one hand the same people complain about bikes driving like nut cases in twistees and on the other hand are offended when cops try to put a stop to that by trapping .......

    Actually my worst time spend with ' cops ' or similar was at the German border, coming from Holland . What a nightmare I had to go trough and the Germans were dreadful !! Now I will not generalize ..... as it probably could happen in any country .

    +1

    I never experienced such issues in Switzerland either.

    I had very positive experience from the German police when my rear licence plate detached itself at 230km/h passing Lübeck en route to Sweden. Next exit, first police station, they sent out a car to search for the licence plate and meanwhile we were treated with coffee and cake Smiley


    --

    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE

    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    I don't think any of us think it's OK to speed excessively, but I think most of us find the fines grossly unreasonable. It's not about what someone can afford, it's about what's reasonable. Just because you can eliminate a problem with excessive force doesn't make it a good solution or less absurd.

    If it's OK to fine rich people so much for speeding, why not everything else? Most fines have zero effect on the rich. Are they going to start writing $10K parking tickets when rich people start parking wherever it is convenient to them?

    The penalty of the crime should be proportionate to the crime, not the person's income.

    And funny enough, such a fine doesn't even hurt proportionally because costs of living aren't proportional to income. There is no way to make the fine's effect on people equal. A 2M fine for someone earning 20M per year doesn't have even remotely the same effect as a 5K for someone earning 50K per year. Costs of livings have ceilings and floors. One guy could be way closer to the floor and one guy way above the ceiling. Cars, homes, food, travel, clothes etc only get so expensive. Even the richest people still live way below their means and why they accumulate so much wealth. And likewise, some very rich people live very, very modestly. Why fine them so disproportionately to their lifestyles?

    So really, what's the point of it other than a bullshit tax grab? It's not only unreasonable for obvious reason, it's not even logical. If you want them to stop speeding, just ban them from driving for 5 years unless it's an emergency. They're rich, let them get a driver.


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    BTW, if I was potentially faced with such a massive fine, I wouldn't even stop. I'd just keep my foot on the floor and have a good chance of getting away. Try and catch up to a 250kpm car from a standstill before he gets to an exit of some sort.

    What really is the extra risk at that point? I'd rather make them catch me or prove it then willingly accept such punishment. How much worse could it get by saying you didn't see the cop motion you to stop? You were already braking the law. Keep breaking it.


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Sorry, I really disagree with some of the false distinctions being drawn here ...

    An "offence" means exactly the same thing as a "crime" since an offence means a "criminal offence".

    "Excessive speed" means any speed 'in excess of' (i.e. greater than) the limit. So if the limit is 50 km/h, then both 55 km/h and 155 km/h are "excessive".

    Sure, the punishments can vary depending on the degree of how excessive the speed is but all speeds above the limit are excessive.

    As for the degree of punishment fitting the degree of excessive speeding, IMO that is fine provided that everyone is treated equally before the law.

    I find it shocking and frightening that the State could punish different people for the same criminal offence differently. So a richer person pays a much bigger fine than a poorer person? All in the name of making the punishment actually hurt the offender.

    But the point of punishment is not just to deter future offences but it is, more importantly, to punish the current offence (which is a crime against society and its laws). Now the danger that a speeding driver creates at 250 km/h is the same no matter what the size of the wallet of that driver. So why should a richer person be punished more severely than a poorer person?

    Personal circumstances such as old age preventing incarceration or a person's prior criminal record affecting sentencing are fine but not the size of a person's assets.

    Again, individual freedom should not IMO be trumped by the crushing power of the State. The laws in our countries are not just pieces of legislation made by our Parliaments but they are also reflective of the different jurisprudential philosophies that our legal systems are based upon. Thank goodness I live in a Common Law legal jurisdiction.

    (Just a side comment, people seldom mention this but countries like the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc have legal systems that are derived from the Anglo Saxon Common Law legal tradition created in England. English law is one of our biggest exports. Approximately, 50% of commercial contracts are governed by, and construed in accordance with, English law for a very good reason, namely that people trust our legal system will treat them fairly ... so all those disputes are heard before courts and/or arbitrators in England, which makes for an important source of revenue for the UK (for lawyers etc Smiley). NY law is the other major legal system that is used worldwide by parties globally for similar reasons).

    --

    997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    noone1:

    BTW, if I was potentially faced with such a massive fine, I wouldn't even stop. I'd just keep my foot on the floor and have a good chance of getting away. Try and catch up to a 250kpm car from a standstill before he gets to an exit of some sort.

    What really is the extra risk at that point? I'd rather make them catch me or prove it then willingly accept such punishment. How much worse could it get by saying you didn't see the cop motion you to stop? You were already braking the law. Keep breaking it.

     

    People like you should not be allowed to have a driver's license, let alone a car. You are talking clear bullshit.  What an ***hole!


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic    [SOLD]
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Not really. If you're already willingly do it, why stop until you have to or it becomes unsafe? People pull the same stuff every day. They pass a cop speeding, brake hard, hope he doesn't pull out after them, then say they didn't notice they were speeding when he pulls them over. They park somewhere illegally then run out to move it when they see a parking maid coming so they don't get a ticket. If I'm smoking a joint and a cop drives by, I'm definitely going move my hand behind my back or toss it in the bushed, unless I'm in Colorado wooooo :)

    People break the laws willingly all the time and don't stop until they get caught and asked/told to stop. In most cases, even speeding, it's not the end of the world.

    It's not like you got caught speeding and decided it was worth the risk to kill the cop, bury the body, and fly to South America.


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    SuzyF:

    What an ***hole!

    You are welcome to disagree with other's opinions (and you can demolish opinions you disagree with) but, a polite request, please don't make personal insults. Thanks Smiley

    --

    997.1 C2S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    As this law is pretty new for us, of course some adjustment from the citizen has to be done. Every driver will quickly learn and take real conscience about the new rules.

    in the meantime, some licences will flow and some cars or bikes will be taken and after a time everything will be clear in each swiss citizen.

     


    --

    Audi TT, Cayenne S, Go kart Birrel, John Deer


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    I admire the clear words. Not polite, but 100% correct. Congrats!


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    easy_rider911:
    SuzyF:

    What an ***hole!

    You are welcome to disagree with other's opinions (and you can demolish opinions you disagree with) but, a polite request, please don't make personal insults. Thanks Smiley

     

    OK, i'll take back the personal insult. Sorry for that noone1. But it's because people think like that, that laws like this are necessary, otherwise they never learn to behave.


    --

    Suzy

    2013 Porsche Boxster S (MT) | Basalt black metallic    [SOLD]
    2014 Audi A6 Avant 3.0 BiTDI Quattro | Moonshine blue metallic
     


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    easy_rider911:

    Sorry, I really disagree with some of the false distinctions being drawn here ...

    An "offence" means exactly the same thing as a "crime" since an offence means a "criminal offence".

    "Excessive speed" means any speed 'in excess of' (i.e. greater than) the limit. So if the limit is 50 km/h, then both 55 km/h and 155 km/h are "excessive".

    Sure, the punishments can vary depending on the degree of how excessive the speed is but all speeds above the limit are excessive.

    As for the degree of punishment fitting the degree of excessive speeding, IMO that is fine provided that everyone is treated equally before the law.

    I find it shocking and frightening that the State could punish different people for the same criminal offence differently. So a richer person pays a much bigger fine than a poorer person? All in the name of making the punishment actually hurt the offender.

    But the point of punishment is not just to deter future offences but it is, more importantly, to punish the current offence (which is a crime against society and its laws). Now the danger that a speeding driver creates at 250 km/h is the same no matter what the size of the wallet of that driver. So why should a richer person be punished more severely than a poorer person?

    Personal circumstances such as old age preventing incarceration or a person's prior criminal record affecting sentencing are fine but not the size of a person's assets.

    Again, individual freedom should not IMO be trumped by the crushing power of the State. The laws in our countries are not just pieces of legislation made by our Parliaments but they are also reflective of the different jurisprudential philosophies that our legal systems are based upon. Thank goodness I live in a Common Law legal jurisdiction.

    (Just a side comment, people seldom mention this but countries like the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc have legal systems that are derived from the Anglo Saxon Common Law legal tradition created in England. English law is one of our biggest exports. Approximately, 50% of commercial contracts are governed by, and construed in accordance with, English law for a very good reason, namely that people trust our legal system will treat them fairly ... so all those disputes are heard before courts and/or arbitrators in England, which makes for an important source of revenue for the UK (for lawyers etc Smiley). NY law is the other major legal system that is used worldwide by parties globally for similar reasons).

    I dont like the concept either. We dont use it in other cases like for example murder. Nobody then cares how rich you are - all treated the same infront of the law. So why with speeding fines, but not parking fines Smiley It is a simple way to raise cash for the state who needs it badly. The concept of the fine should "hurt" whether you are rich or poor is a weak argument too. The same as 10km/h is not deemed excessive but 50km/h. All arbitrary at the end...Sad that the law is now increasingly being written that judges have little room to use their judgement.

     

     


    --
    Off enjoying my car...

    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    The problem is not the fine . . The fine is actually the softer part of the law .  The part that is hard is the 2 years without licence + the 1 year jail sentence ( that is completely crazy ) even if it is not really applied .  

    Easy  :Making our country look like it is the worst place to live on this planet because of some ' details ' of our law  is very exaggerated and not fair at all.  Our place is certainly one of the best ones where you want to face justice .  This law was introduced because our people asked for it !!!  We have a direct democracy and the people could of opposed it , but they did not . The people wanted it .  (  but not me  )

    noone1 : Even if you run away, you have been caught . Our speed traps take photos . It is mandatory . So no escape there .

     

    And BTW , I just opened my post ......... and received  a speeding fine from the French police !!!!!!  Again . As I said, each time I travel to france I get caught !!! mail  That place is much worse then Switzerland indecision


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    Right: why not parking fees?

    I live in in the middle of Munich/Germany. Many cars, not enough parking lots. Last year in my neighborhood a successful business man very often parked his big sedan or SUV on the sidewalk in front of his office. That was much easier for him than to walk 200m from his underground car park. A young mother always had problems to get to the entrance of her building with her stroller for the twins. She talked to him, he said he didn’t care, his secretary would pay the fine once a month. I don’t know the laws, but even the police was not able to do more than to give him a ticket.

    Same problem: Enough money and the fines don’t work. Yes, all men are equal. But should the punishment be equal or how the punishment acts? Why don’t we use a system based on daily rates depending on your income? (I think in Germany this is already used when we talk about criminal law, but I am no lawyer) Probably more people would pay attention to the rules. And please don’t call it Socialism.

    Funny side note: many people support tougher punishment for criminals (zero tolerance). But nobody wants a tougher punishment if he/she could be affected (tax, driving …)

    Back to the original topic: if you are driving that much too fast you know what you are doing. I learned that Switzerland is a working democracy. The laws are made by the majority of the people, so follow the rules and nothing will happen. If not you are responsible for the fines. And if you don’t like the rules/laws start an initiative to change them. That is how it works.
     


    Re: Who would love to have his Turbo S under sequester?

    I've been living in CH for over twelve years and I've never been stopped by the police. I never had a speeding ticket for more than CHF100. I maybe get 3-4 per year. The speeding cameras are relatively easy to spot. So to be honest it's not that bad unless you do something really stupid.


    --

    2012 Cayenne S White/Espresso 

    Ex: 993 Targa, 986S, 986 and 964 C2


     
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