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    GTS specs and some questions..

    Allright, gang.

    I have also decided to go for the GTS Coupe (sort of).

    It was possible for me to arrange a deal with my Porsche Dealer: i configure the GTS according to my own specs, the car is being ordered (Jan delivery) and if i dont take it, the dealership takes it as a demo car without any obligations from my side. The good thing is that i get to specify the car 100% to my wishes and  decide on the GTS once its here (maybe a bit earlier), but i dont HAVE to take it.

    Background info for this deal: i have some outstanding business deals, which should be on track by december-jan.

    I will post my Specs tomorrow, but in general is a lot like Johns

    The GTS should be speeced more sporty than my Cayman S (including colors, interior trim and technical features), without making it hard to live on a Day to day basis. I drive my Porsche as a DD, maybe 2 trackdays, but we do have fantastic country roads over here

    Main concern is the Sport PASM (incl. LSD, which i would take anyway). My Cayman S (pre FL) is equipped with normal PASM and i find it quite fine on the normal setting, but too hars on Sport (without providing any felt benefit other than stiffness).

    So my question is: how "bad" is the Sport PASM on normal setting? Is Sport PASM in normal setting same as/softer/harder as (normal) PASM in sport setting?

    Generally speaking i have the feeling that the 911 is a bit softer than the Cayman S. This observation is based on a test drive, where i switched from my car with PASM to a 911 (also with PASM) and it just felt softer in the same setting.

    All help is very very wellcome, and i hope to hear as much as possible on this...i have to decide by this wednesday on the final cofiguration.

    Looking forward to all Your input!

    thx

    Nick


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Nick - congrats on your choice of a GTS... I'm sure you won't regret it..

    As far as SPASM v PASM is concerned, It appears to be a matter of personal preference.  Several members here have suggested it, on the other thread, but I haven't experienced -20mm so cannot comment... except to say that I've been very happy with PASM on my current C2S.

    I may be 'missing out'... but rather than risk SPASM being too firm for me as a daily drive, I decided to go with what I know..

    BTW - there are some suspension adjustments to the GTS and those together with LSD will suit me just fine..

     

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    John, thanks for the reply.

    Im very sure that i will not regret the GTS, just love the looks and really looking forward to it!

    It would be great to hear from some members with Sport Pasm.

    What suspension adjustments do you mean, i searched the whole porsche sie but found no difference to the CS

    Nick


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Sport PASM besides differently rated active dampers, also includes shorter and harder coil springs and larger diameter stabilizer(anti roll) bars. So it is not only a matter of the differences between the respective damper settings (sport or normal). There are more elements to Sport PASM.

    These changes aid handling and steering mostly at high speeds and more so on smooth roads. The downside is that at low speeds and on less than perfect surfaces the car is comparatively harsher, noisier and also often interior trim tends to vibrate a little and cause uncomfortable noises and the steering is heavier although often you don't want it to be so.

    So if you drive on a track routinely, or at 200+km/h on motorways SPASM is good for you.If you use your car on a daily basis and inside cities IMO only get SPASM if your road network is absolutely perfect and you are willing to accept any consequent downside. Mind you, the normal suspension is quite  firm too. It is not as if the car handles or rides like a limousine without Sport PASM.

    Normal PASM plus LSD is very satisfactory for me for my daily routine and when I decide to go fast,  but not for others who prefer the Sport version. Therefore, try to test drive cars with the available suspension options on a variety of routes and then decide what you like depending on your driving needs.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    nick1:

    What suspension adjustments do you mean, i searched the whole porsche sie but found no difference to the CS

    Nick - I'm not 100% sure, but the Service Manager at the OPC, where I ordered my car, caught me as I was leaving and said something to the effect that, apart from the engine upgrades (air intake, power-kit etc.) there was an upgraded suspension feature in that the rear track has been widened by 32mm... even though it's not AWD.  This is confirmed when you compare the GTS standard technical data with that of a C2S.

    What difference this makes in practice is unclear to me, but he seemed pretty excited by the whole thing ??

     

     

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Maybe this description from the GTS overview gives us a clue..??

    "Compared with the 911 Carrera S, the body is 44 mm wider at the rear axle and the rear track has been widened by 32 mm for greater roll stability and improved turn-in."

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    What is the rear track on a 997.2 C4S? Is it the same 32mm increase compared to a 997.2 C2S? 


    --


    RT Moderator 
    - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    @John and Easy: im pretty sure that the rear track width is the same on a GTS as compared to a C4S. I dont think that there is any difference in the suspension set up in the GTS compared to the other PASM equipped cars.

    Had a chance to drive the -20mm Sport PASM car today for like 5 mins (was a customer car) at my dealer. Its definitly not as stiff as i was concerned, had the feeling that the car was more planted and stable even at slow speed. Other than that i cant say that much, because the drive was too short. But definitly looks better with the -10 mm compared to the PASM.

    @Reginos: thanks for the input, while i think i can live with the stiffness, now kinda concerned about the trim rattles...

    i can change the specs another 7 days: this is going to be tough...

    thanks for the input.

     


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Here are the specs:

    Carrera White exterior

    Black leather with Alcantara interior (wanted to keep the special feel of GTS)

    Dynamic cornering lights (really terriffic)

    Parking Sensors

    Upper part of front screen tinted

    mats

    Full leather with Alcantara

    Garage opener

    Self dimming mirrors

    90L Fuel tank

    Rear console in Leather

    Navigation

    PDK

    Sport Chrono Plus

    Sport PASM incl LSD (still undecided)

    Red belts

    Rear Seats

    Heated Seats

    Rear shells of seats painted in exterior color

    RS Spyder central locking wheels

    (still contemplating Adaptive seats. I have them in the Cayman but unsure this time).

     

    Generally speaking i wanted to keep the car down to 3 colors: red (brake calipers, needles and belts), White (exterior and seat backs) and black (wheels and interior). Was thinking about getting some carbon but with red, black, silver and grey (alcantara isnt really black) inside carbn would have looked to fussy.

    ideas wellcome!

    nick

     


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    It's good idea keeping colors down to two or three (Max)!


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Love white backseat's looks stunning ! 

    white.jpg


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    reginos:

    Sport PASM besides differently rated active dampers, also includes shorter and harder coil springs and larger diameter stabilizer(anti roll) bars. So it is not only a matter of the differences between the respective damper settings (sport or normal). There are more elements to Sport PASM.

    These changes aid handling and steering mostly at high speeds and more so on smooth roads. The downside is that at low speeds and on less than perfect surfaces the car is comparatively harsher, noisier and also often interior trim tends to vibrate a little and cause uncomfortable noises and the steering is heavier although often you don't want it to be so.

    So if you drive on a track routinely, or at 200+km/h on motorways SPASM is good for you.If you use your car on a daily basis and inside cities IMO only get SPASM if your road network is absolutely perfect and you are willing to accept any consequent downside. Mind you, the normal suspension is quite  firm too. It is not as if the car handles or rides like a limousine without Sport PASM.

    Normal PASM plus LSD is very satisfactory for me for my daily routine and when I decide to go fast,  but not for others who prefer the Sport version. Therefore, try to test drive cars with the available suspension options on a variety of routes and then decide what you like depending on your driving needs.

    Thanks Reginos - That summarises things perfectly and reflects my feelings precisely..Smiley

    There are two things I love most about my current car.  The sound of the 'always-on' PSE and the fact that it has no rattles or interior noises whatsoever.

    I can't stand rattles or squeaks and if a car has them and they can't be resolved... then the car has to go!

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Nick, why the 90L fuel tank - are you planning some very long journeys...

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    John H:

    Nick, why the 90L fuel tank - are you planning some very long journeys...

     
    Apart from the widebody spec, the optional 90 litre fuel tank is one of the exclusive features on the GTS. As it it a no-cost option, I would seriously consider it. Smiley


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Is the larger tank at the expense of luggage space?


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    John H:

    Nick, why the 90L fuel tank - are you planning some very long journeys...

     


    Well i sometimes drive to Munich and i dont always make it with 1 tank. Other than that, as already stated, its a NCO and exclusive to GTS which is nice. Plus i find it more comfortable to go to the gas station less frequently. Also: maybe less understeerSmiley


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    reginos:

    Is the larger tank at the expense of luggage space?


    As i was told the luggage space on the GTS is the same as on the AWD cars, even though its RWD. Apparently in the front section (where the front drive is supposed to be) there are some beams that reduce the space to the same as AWD. I found no clue that the 90L Gas tank reduces luggage space further.

     


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Is there a possibility to have the FL Sports Exhaust modificated to Always on?


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Ferdie:
    John H:

    Nick, why the 90L fuel tank - are you planning some very long journeys...

     
    Apart from the widebody spec, the optional 90 litre fuel tank is one of the exclusive features on the GTS. As it it a no-cost option, I would seriously consider it. Smiley

    Not shown in the UK configurator.. Forehead slap.gif

    What effect, if any, would a bigger fuel tank have on performance/handling..?

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    John, i would really like to believe that it would reduce understeer, but highly doubt it...

    As said, i regard this more a comfort feature.


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    I would assume buyers would usually want a 90 litre fuel tank more for track use since one goes through fuel much faster on track. It's easy to finish over half a 67 litre tank in one track session. Plus, fuel filling stations are not always near the track and having to leave the track to fill up is not always convenient given the track day timetable/schedule etc.  So a bigger tank certainly helps in that context.

    For road use, a bigger fuel tank is mostly unncessary IMO. I don't think any of the normally aspirated cars actually need it - since they all have a good range. I can easily manage 400 gentle motorway cruising miles on one (normal sized) tank. As we know, petrol stations are pretty easy to find on public roads. For usage on public roads, the only cars where I would consider a bigger tank are the turbo charged ones e.g. TT, TTS, GT2 etc. Those cars can eat fuel very fast if one has a heavy right foot.

    Anyway, I don't like driving around with a full fuel tank - sure, it gives better turn in (due to the increased weight) but at what cost - with a 90 litre tank filled with fuel, you are driving around with around 70 litres of unnecessary weight. It affects performance and agility making the nose feel heavier. Plus it costs you more driving around with so much unnecessary weight.

    I would get a 90 litre tank but not fill it all for most of the time. I would get it for those few occasions (e.g. track use, long road trips) when you actually need a lot of fuel.

    --

    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    UK configurator and overview offers only a standard 67 litre tank....

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    From what I remember from same option on the GT3,  the larger tank cannot be accommodated on RHD cars due to the position of the steering column.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    easy_rider911:

    For road use, a bigger fuel tank is mostly unncessary IMO. I don't think any of the normally aspirated cars actually need it - since they all have a good range. I can easily manage 400 gentle motorway cruising miles on one (normal sized) tank. As we know, petrol stations are pretty easy to find on public roads. For usage on public roads, the only cars where I would consider a bigger tank are the turbo charged ones e.g. TT, TTS, GT2 etc. Those cars can eat fuel very fast if one has a heavy right foot.

    Anyway, I don't like driving around with a full fuel tank - sure, it gives better turn in (due to the increased weight) but at what cost - with a 90 litre tank filled with fuel, you are driving around with around 70 litres of unnecessary weight. It affects performance and agility making the nose feel heavier. Plus it costs you more driving around with so much unnecessary weight.

     
    Sorry Easy,

    but I do not share that opinion. Driving on the Autobahn, you won´t last longer than 300 miles and those are done pretty quickly. On top of that, we are speaking about a difference of 23 litres, resulting in a difference of 16 kg. Smiley

    Interesting to hear that it might not be available on the RHD models, from my understanding it fills up the remaining space up front that the differential occupies on the AWD models.


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    I kinda consider this as a battery in my iphone: if it last longer but weighs more (in this case roughly 1% or even less) then the positive effect outperform the negative impact.

    still undecided on the sports Pasm though...


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    Ferdie, sure, if you are driving at very high speed on the Autobahn then, of course, I agree with you - fuel gets used up much faster so you might well need a bigger fuel tank. I was talking about the kind of motorway miles that we have to do in the UK where our max speed limit is only 70mph. I can do 400 miles if I keep to 70 mph

    Regarding your calculation, I realise that 90 less 67 = 23 litres but I wouldn't advocate driving around with a full standard tank of fuel either. So comparing a full standard tank vs a full bigger tank is not relevent to my situation. I usually keep it less than half full - the car just feels different then. Less turn in but more agile. So 90 less about 33 litres is about 58 litres of fuel. And you can tell the difference when you carry an extra 60 litres. My favourite is when the fuel is close to empty - the car feels really nimble then. I also like to top up fuel more regularly too - rather than letting the fuel just sit there in the tank for some weeks.

    --

    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    nick1:
    reginos:

    Is the larger tank at the expense of luggage space?


    As i was told the luggage space on the GTS is the same as on the AWD cars, even though its RWD. Apparently in the front section (where the front drive is supposed to be) there are some beams that reduce the space to the same as AWD. I found no clue that the 90L Gas tank reduces luggage space further.

     

     90 l fuel tanks do not reduce luggage space. At least in the GT3 it is like that.


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    reginos:

    From what I remember from same option on the GT3,  the larger tank cannot be accommodated on RHD cars due to the position of the steering column.

    Maybe that's why it's not offered in the UK configurator or overview....Smiley

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    nick1:

    still undecided on the sports Pasm though...

     
    Nick,

    I can only refer to the 997.1 sport suspension which, as stated here, has its benefits in terms of handling. The ride quality is certainly stiffer and, in my opinion, at the limit of tolerability for a daily driver. From my understanding, the 997.2 sport suspension seems to be similiar in terms of ride quality.

    AMS tested both suspensions next to each other with the verdict that the harsher ride does not translate in significantly improved performance. If one should trust them? Sport Auto however has not found any complaints on that account:

    456446-AMS3i.jpg


    Re: GTS specs and some questions..

    easy_rider911:

    I usually keep it less than half full - the car just feels different then. Less turn in but more agile. So 90 less about 33 litres is about 58 litres of fuel. And you can tell the difference when you carry an extra 60 litres. My favourite is when the fuel is close to empty - the car feels really nimble then.

     
    I agree, it does make a difference. As in Nick´s case, the bigger fuel tank makes a difference during longer trips as you most certainly carry a suitcase with you. I actually never understood why Porsche did offer the bigger fuel tank only on the GT2/GT3 models.


     
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