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    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    ...but it is normal since MP12-4C was tested with Corsa tires.


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Sport auto Supertest tomorrow...can't wait!


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Tomorrow?! Great


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    According to tomorrow's Supertest for HvS is 991 Turbo S the best sportscar currently available.

    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    NBR - 7:34 (was expecting below 7:30 angry)
    HHR - 1:08.7

    Dunlop Sport Maxx Race Tires

    0 - 40: 1,0

    0 - 100: 3,0

    0 - 160: 6,5

    0 - 200: 10,0

    Power and Torque higher than factory claim ? Smiley

    The rest will be at the usual forum


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Thanks 

     

    I will contact him and see what he can do 


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    KresoF1:
    According to tomorrow's Supertest for HvS is 991 Turbo S the best sportscar currently available.

    Probably because it suits his strange one handed driving style ;)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Yep, Hockenheim laptime is the one of C.Gebhardt from 11/2013… Nordschleife (as the GT3 times) from HvS … Car had over 600 EWG-hp in the test, a bit much for my liking… Would have suspected a lower lap time indeed (on the Nordschleife)… And doesn't make sense to me that its quicker than the GT3 in Hockenheim and slower than it on the Nordschleife (as HHR is the technical course and NoS depends more on power/torque)… but hey, who am I to judge…

    What surprised me most were the camber settings, -0.6° f and almost  - 1.85°r … maybe the laptimes were set on different dates and Porsche adjusted the camber to smaller settings for the supertest (would at least explain the outcome) .. somehow can't see the lap time on the HHR with this kind of setup… 


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Mullh:

    Car had over 600 EWG-hp in the test, a bit much for my liking… Would have suspected a lower lap time indeed (on the Nordschleife)… 

    Are you saying the 991TTS tested had more than 600Hp Smiley

    J.Seven


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    boytronic:
    KresoF1:
    According to tomorrow's Supertest for HvS is 991 Turbo S the best sportscar currently available.

    Probably because it suits his strange one handed driving style ;)

    Smiley

    Very strange style indeed.


    --

    2014 981 Boxster S | Riviera Blue | PDK | Sport Suspension (-20mm) | PCCB | PTV | PSE
    2010 997.2 C2S | Carrara White | Manual | S-PASM (-20mm) | PSE | OZ Superforgiata
    2010 Audi S5 cabrio | Ibis White

    Previous
    2008 997.1 C4S | Guards Red | Manual | PSE | Bilstein PSS10 | H&R Roll Bars | Dension 500
    2007 997.1 Turbo | Meteor Gray | Manual | Bilstein PSS10 | Cargraphic Stage 2 | Dension 500
    2005 987.1 Boxster S | Arctic Silver | Manual | OZ Ultraleggera | H&R Cup Suspension | H&R Roll Bars | Sachs Racing Clutch | Recaro Shells
    2005 997.1 C2S | Atlas Gray | Manual | PSE | Sport Suspension (-20mm)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    J.Seven:
    Mullh:

    Car had over 600 EWG-hp in the test, a bit much for my liking… Would have suspected a lower lap time indeed (on the Nordschleife)… 

    Are you saying the 991TTS tested had more than 600Hp Smiley

    J.Seven

    It was to be excepted that the new (old) engine runs pretty well, the enthusiasm of the development team was way too high ("the whole package, it just runs so well, we don't know why but it does...") I always suspected that my car has more than 560 hp, the car is just too quick and the 0-160 kph and 100 to 200 kph acceleration figures (both below 7 seconds...6.4x and 6.5x seconds or something like that) were way too good for a 560 hp car.

    So I can assure you that if the tested 991 Turbo S had over 600 hp in the Supertest, customer cars shouldn't be behind. Smiley My car proves it.

    The legal situation is pretty simple: According to EU law, the engine can have up to 5% more or 5% less power. However and now you really need to understand this: The basis for this 5% more or less is the engine which has been tested for the certification. So if the certification engine had let's say 588 hp (which would be the nominal power of 560 hp plus the 5% tolerance), a production series engine can have up to 617 hp. Legally. Smiley

    So why didn't Porsche certify the engine with a higher power? Well, one can only speculate.

    Maybe the engine is at it's power peak (which I suspect) and there isn't much left for the facelift (real power, not power on paper). Maybe they didn't want to make the new Huracan and Audi R8 look bad (don't forget that Porsche is part of the big VW Group family).

    Another possibility: Since this is not a brand-new engine but a new engine based on the previous 997.2 Turbo DFi engine, it may just work pretty well and the whole "package" just runs very effectively (something I heard from development, apparently they were surprised themselves how well it runs).

    Let's just be glad we have more and not less power. Smiley

    As to the lap time on the Nordschleife: The time is indeed not very impressive and doesn't add up with the time in Hockenheim, especially considering the fact that the time has been achieved with UHP tires. I haven't read the Supertest yet, so I will comment on it as soon as I read the whole Supertest. Maybe the asphalt temperature wasn't ideal for the UHP tires, this would be a possibility. Everything below 20°C isn't really that good for UHP tires, even if they build up heat during driving and thus more grip. Not sure what the ideal temp specs are for the Dunlop though.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Yep, though in my opinion semislicks even work best (or at least as good) with a bit colder temperatures but the engine does have more power… at least if its above 10°C... thats why the best drivers set the fastest lap times in 24h racing during the night et cetera (ok slicks but same reasoning at the end)… Doesn't add up with the claim of Porsche as well, as even Porsche said that the TTS is faster than the GT3 on the Nordschleife when fitted with the Dunlops… but well, as for the GT3 test, I think he maybe runs that times now for real, but never on this planet was he able to drive the Carrera GT in 7:33 or the RS 4.0 in 7:30 xD .. just doesn't add up (especially as there was said to be over 30°C when the 4.0 was tested)

    Temps were 12°C air and 13° asphalt… so nearly identical to the one in Hockenheim (12/15) … still think it has maybe to do with the camber… 

    And well, could be that some got more power and some don't?! Would at least explain the big differences between the tests (i.e. the italian mags /CH MP4 vs german mags etc) … So be happy that you have one that seems to be from the stronger fraction ^^

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    I just heard that the tested power figure is not correct, Sport Auto apparently made a mistake by using the correction factor for N/A engines. The power is lower than 607 hp but slightly above stock power. Not sure if Sport Auto will mention it in the next issue.

    Still, pretty impressive performance for a 560 hp car. indecision


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    RC:
    J.Seven:
    Mullh:

    Car had over 600 EWG-hp in the test, a bit much for my liking… Would have suspected a lower lap time indeed (on the Nordschleife)… 

    Are you saying the 991TTS tested had more than 600Hp Smiley

    J.Seven

    It was to be excepted that the new (old) engine runs pretty well, the enthusiasm of the development team was way too high ("the whole package, it just runs so well, we don't know why but it does...") I always suspected that my car has more than 560 hp, the car is just too quick and the 0-160 kph and 100 to 200 kph acceleration figures (both below 7 seconds...6.4x and 6.5x seconds or something like that) were way too good for a 560 hp car.

    So I can assure you that if the tested 991 Turbo S had over 600 hp in the Supertest, customer cars shouldn't be behind. Smiley My car proves it.

    The legal situation is pretty simple: According to EU law, the engine can have up to 5% more or 5% less power. However and now you really need to understand this: The basis for this 5% more or less is the engine which has been tested for the certification. So if the certification engine had let's say 588 hp (which would be the nominal power of 560 hp plus the 5% tolerance), a production series engine can have up to 617 hp. Legally. Smiley

    So why didn't Porsche certify the engine with a higher power? Well, one can only speculate.

    Maybe the engine is at it's power peak (which I suspect) and there isn't much left for the facelift (real power, not power on paper). Maybe they didn't want to make the new Huracan and Audi R8 look bad (don't forget that Porsche is part of the big VW Group family).

    Another possibility: Since this is not a brand-new engine but a new engine based on the previous 997.2 Turbo DFi engine, it may just work pretty well and the whole "package" just runs very effectively (something I heard from development, apparently they were surprised themselves how well it runs).

    Let's just be glad we have more and not less power. Smiley

    As to the lap time on the Nordschleife: The time is indeed not very impressive and doesn't add up with the time in Hockenheim, especially considering the fact that the time has been achieved with UHP tires. I haven't read the Supertest yet, so I will comment on it as soon as I read the whole Supertest. Maybe the asphalt temperature wasn't ideal for the UHP tires, this would be a possibility. Everything below 20°C isn't really that good for UHP tires, even if they build up heat during driving and thus more grip. Not sure what the ideal temp specs are for the Dunlop though.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)

    It´s official, I´ll contract you for my new precious and very persuasive lawyer  Smiley Smiley Smiley

    991TTS has indeed an amazing performance, no doubt about that, but do you really believe in all you´ve just wroteSmiley You´ve been complaining ever since you got your car that Porsche should have put 991TTS with 600Hp from standard on the market for the well known reasons, and now you just think it´s perfectly normal this tested car to have MORE than 600Hp Smiley Ferrari 458 have similar performance to 991TTS, so we can assume Ferrari is on the 600Hp region too Smiley Mclaren is way faster than 991TTS from 100Kph up, so we can assume is has also way more than 625Hp Smiley I can only imagine what you would say if Sport Auto would test a 458 with + 600Hp on Dyno Smiley Smiley

    I wont say 991TTS may have few more ponies than the stated 560Hp, but 40Hp more from standard cars without any mod, is hard to believe!!!! If true, good Job from Porsche Smiley Smiley Smiley

    J.Seven

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    J.Seven:
    RC:
    J.Seven:
    Mullh:

    Car had over 600 EWG-hp in the test, a bit much for my liking… Would have suspected a lower lap time indeed (on the Nordschleife)… 

    Are you saying the 991TTS tested had more than 600Hp Smiley

    J.Seven

    It was to be excepted that the new (old) engine runs pretty well, the enthusiasm of the development team was way too high ("the whole package, it just runs so well, we don't know why but it does...") I always suspected that my car has more than 560 hp, the car is just too quick and the 0-160 kph and 100 to 200 kph acceleration figures (both below 7 seconds...6.4x and 6.5x seconds or something like that) were way too good for a 560 hp car.

    So I can assure you that if the tested 991 Turbo S had over 600 hp in the Supertest, customer cars shouldn't be behind. Smiley My car proves it.

    The legal situation is pretty simple: According to EU law, the engine can have up to 5% more or 5% less power. However and now you really need to understand this: The basis for this 5% more or less is the engine which has been tested for the certification. So if the certification engine had let's say 588 hp (which would be the nominal power of 560 hp plus the 5% tolerance), a production series engine can have up to 617 hp. Legally. Smiley

    So why didn't Porsche certify the engine with a higher power? Well, one can only speculate.

    Maybe the engine is at it's power peak (which I suspect) and there isn't much left for the facelift (real power, not power on paper). Maybe they didn't want to make the new Huracan and Audi R8 look bad (don't forget that Porsche is part of the big VW Group family).

    Another possibility: Since this is not a brand-new engine but a new engine based on the previous 997.2 Turbo DFi engine, it may just work pretty well and the whole "package" just runs very effectively (something I heard from development, apparently they were surprised themselves how well it runs).

    Let's just be glad we have more and not less power. Smiley

    As to the lap time on the Nordschleife: The time is indeed not very impressive and doesn't add up with the time in Hockenheim, especially considering the fact that the time has been achieved with UHP tires. I haven't read the Supertest yet, so I will comment on it as soon as I read the whole Supertest. Maybe the asphalt temperature wasn't ideal for the UHP tires, this would be a possibility. Everything below 20°C isn't really that good for UHP tires, even if they build up heat during driving and thus more grip. Not sure what the ideal temp specs are for the Dunlop though.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)

    It´s official, I´ll contract you for my new precious and very persuasive lawyer  Smiley Smiley Smiley

    991TTS has indeed an amazing performance, no doubt about that, but do you really believe in all you´ve just wroteSmiley You´ve been complaining ever since you got your car that Porsche should have put 991TTS with 600Hp from standard on the market for the well known reasons, and now you just think it´s perfectly normal this tested car to have MORE than 600Hp Smiley Ferrari 458 have similar performance to 991TTS, so we can assume Ferrari is on the 600Hp region too Smiley Mclaren is way faster than 991TTS from 100Kph up, so we can assume is has also way more than 625Hp Smiley I can only imagine what you would say if Sport Auto would test a 458 with + 600Hp on Dyno Smiley Smiley

    I wont say 991TTS my have few more ponies than the stated 560Hp, but 40Hp more from standard cars without any mod, is hard to believe!!!! If true, good Job from Porsche Smiley Smiley Smiley

    J.Seven

     

    According to Sport-Auto Supertest  607ps & 784Nm (8.4% more)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    But why 0-200 is only 10 secs???? if it is 607 hp!!!


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    BiTurbo:
    According to Sport-Auto Supertest  607ps & 784Nm (8.4% more)

    Do you guys actually read what I wrote? The published power figure is not correct, Sport Auto (or the company which did the measurements) made an error by using the correction factor for N/A cars. The tested car has way below 600 hp but slightly more than stock power. Period. I guess Sport Auto will mention this in their next issue (not sure though but it would make sense, otherwise Porsche could be accused of "cheating").


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    artur777:

    But why 0-200 is only 10 secs???? if it is 607 hp!!!

    Sport Auto tests the acceleration with a full tank and two passengers. Other car magazines with one passenger only and sometimes they don't care about the content of the fuel tank. Also, Sport Auto tests the car on a normal street tarmac, while other car magazines use drag strips or special tracks with a stickier tarmac for that purpose.

    However, the tested car didn't have 607 hp anyway.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Sport Auto has two options for acceleration tests: first is the Hockenheimrings dragstraight and Parabolika, second is the Airfield of Lahr, Germany which has a grippy concrete surface. This Turbo S was tested on the airfield, because -what a surprise- HHR has not enough room for a 0-300 kph test.

    Other magazines are faster only because of the -1 person advantage.

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    The 0-300 of 29.Xs tells us the power, it is around the 560PS mark as advertised.


    --



     

    3.9  GT2 2011 make over


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    TB993tt:

    The 0-300 of 29.Xs tells us the power, it is around the 560PS mark as advertised.

    It is actually 31 seconds (HvS claim in Sport Auto). Some cars may be a bit faster but I guess Porsche provided a car with pretty much stock power, so Sport Auto doesn't complaint about any cheating attempts (Sport Auto has busted BMW GmbH and Mercedes AMG in the past). This is also why they were quite surprised when they read about the 607 hp claim. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    acrobat:

    Sport Auto has two options for acceleration tests: first is the Hockenheimrings dragstraight and Parabolika, second is the Airfield of Lahr, Germany which has a grippy concrete surface. This Turbo S was tested on the airfield, because -what a surprise- HHR has not enough room for a 0-300 kph test.

    Other magazines are faster only because of the -1 person advantage.

     

    How do you know the 0-300 kph has been done of the same (grippy or non-grippy) surface as the 0-100 or 0-200 kph tests? Smiley I wouldn't put too much importance into 0.4, 0.2 or less seconds difference from 0-200 kph though. The cars have different power levels, one car runs better, the other less better and of course the weight plays a role too, indeed. Overall however, it seems that the tested cars do better than the factory claim and this is what counts. All cars delivery AT LEAST the factory claim.

    Regarding the Nordschleife Test: I would love to see a test with all assist systems (ESP) turned off and one in the sportiest ESP mode (Sport Plus in the case of the Turbo S). Judging from my experience with Sport Plus and the associated ESP setup (which is very good), I have a feeling that some less professional drivers could achieve a better time on the Nordschleife in comparison with turning ESP off completely. I'm curious.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Because these are exactly the same numbers (acceleration up to 200 kph, flexibility and braking) what they measured with the exact same testcar last year. And in that particular comparison they posted the 0-250 and 0-300 kph times as well.


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    acrobat:

    Because these are exactly the same numbers (acceleration up to 200 kph, flexibility and braking) what they measured with the exact same testcar last year. And in that particular comparison they posted the 0-250 and 0-300 kph times as well.

    Didn't they do 10.1 seconds in that blue test car last year? Smiley

    Also the 0-300 kph time was slightly worse (31.4 or so?). Now it is 31 seconds flat.

    Too many numbers for me to process and I'm in the office right now and don't have access to the magazine(s).


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    No, the times are identical: 0-40 in 1 sec, 0-100 in 3 sec, 0-200 in 10, 0-250 in 16,7 and 0-300 in 31,0 s.

    They skipped the acceleration-test for the Supertest this time.

    http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2810/10569395406_c525861e79_h.jpg


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    Thank you. It seems I confused the SA times with the AMS times.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    RC:

    Thank you. It seems I confused the SA times with the AMS times.

    You're welcome. Yes, AMS did 2,9 and 10,2 s with this testcar (S-GO 517) as well. Smiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    acrobat:
    RC:

    Thank you. It seems I confused the SA times with the AMS times.

    You're welcome. Yes, AMS did 2,9 and 10,2 s with this testcar (S-GO 517) as well. Smiley

    Aahh...10.2 seconds, yes...same car. So as you can see, a couple of hundreds of milliseconds really don't matter.

     


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    So which car is faster around the Ring (like I care)? The GT3 or the TTS?

    I find it very odd that so many test have substantially different results.


    Re: OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S

    nberry:

    So which car is faster around the Ring (like I care)? The GT3 or the TTS?

    I find it very odd that so many test have substantially different results.

    If the test results show a delta of 2 seconds around the 'Ring, I would conclude that they are fundamentally the same (with respect to laptime).  I would focus more on how the cars feel differently while lapping at about the same pace.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


     
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