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    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    ClockEm:

    Porsche is one screwed up company. They send a note to the dealers in the US on Friday saying all customers will be called today Monday and the dealers were to get the "letter" first thing this morning. So far nothing. Germans…….

    Maybe you'd prefer they reacted as quickly (and as ethically) as GM?:

    http://time.com/46585/5-things-you-need-to-know-about-gms-recall-crisis/


    --

    fritz


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    What GM did was not only unethical but criminal. Someone must go to jail for this. 

    I have no problem with what Porsche is doing i.e. offering loaners, daily compensation and replacing engines. My criticism is the lack of transparency and failure to communicate timely. To this day, I do not know what the problem was with engines that necessitated replacing them. Fritz's explanation seems to be the most plausible. Also, from a communication standpoint we get bits of information every 30 days or so but yet to be told when we will get our cars.

    Porsche has made it clear that the GT3 problem is receiving attention from the highest levels. One would think the CEO instead of saying we found the problem would have said "We found the problem, decided on the solution and I have instructed that all GT3's will be back on the street before (pick a date)"  At least as a customer I will know the end game. It has been almost two months since the Stop Sale and as of today I know nothing other than my engine will be replaced which I learned two weeks ago.

    Porsche is too good of a company to allow communications with its affected customers to be glacial.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    To this day, I do not know what the problem was with engines that necessitated replacing them. 

    Seriously?! Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Christian, Porsche has not announced the reason for the engine replacements other than the risk of fire.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    Christian, Porsche has not announced the reason for the engine replacements other than the risk of fire.

    What was all the talk about conrod connecting bolts failing (either unfastening or braking) that allowed the conrods to penetrate the crankcase (with fire ensuing from oil dripping on the headers)?  Was that only a theory?


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Grant, that never came from Porsche. All we were told was that the engines needed to be replaced. As of today, we have not been told when or how. Its been two months since they issued the stop sale. 

    Right now I know nothing other than my car is sitting on some dock near PDI. Porsche is too good of a company to do this to their customers. We were to get updated information yesterday but now the rumor is maybe this week.mail


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    Grant, that never came from Porsche. All we were told was that the engines needed to be replaced. As of today, we have not been told when or how. Its been two months since they issued the stop sale. 

    Right now I know nothing other than my car is sitting on some dock near PDI. Porsche is too good of a company to do this to their customers. We were to get updated information yesterday but now the rumor is maybe this week.mail

    Are you saying that the letter from Tim Quinn of PCNA (copied into a post of 17 March above by forum member Hesperus) was not genuine?  From its content and tone it certainly looks genuine.
    Have you confronted your dealer with this, as Porsche may be relying on the dealers to keep those customers informed whose initial delivery had  to be delayed?


    --

    fritz


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    fritz:
    nberry:

    Grant, that never came from Porsche. All we were told was that the engines needed to be replaced. As of today, we have not been told when or how. Its been two months since they issued the stop sale. 

    Right now I know nothing other than my car is sitting on some dock near PDI. Porsche is too good of a company to do this to their customers. We were to get updated information yesterday but now the rumor is maybe this week.mail

    Are you saying that the letter from Tim Quinn of PCNA (copied into a post of 17 March above by forum member Hesperus) was not genuine?  From its content and tone it certainly looks genuine.
    Have you confronted your dealer with this, as Porsche may be relying on the dealers to keep those customers informed whose initial delivery had  to be delayed?

    I recieved a Swedish version of that letter so I'd say it's legit.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Fritz, it was genuine but nothing indicates a final solution other than they believe the loosening bolts are the problem. 

    Something Porsche really needs to understand and learn. Dealers rarely provide up to date information. More often than not, the internet is the place to get information and we pass that on to the dealer. I recall one dealer lamenting that often he is the last to know what is going on. It's a vicious circle. Dealer tells you to check with PCNA and PCNA tells you to check with the dealer.

    The dealer is the last place I would go to get information.

    Last night I was prepared to end this saga but just tell my dealer to return my deposit. But today I read an article from Pistonheads which had interviewed the CEO of McLaren. In it he states that the GT3 to a tour de force and a technological marvel. His high praise is worth noting since he acknowledges his models are designed to compete against Porsche's and not artistic cars like Ferrari. As a result, I am waiting to hear if I will see my car anytime soon.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Taken from Rennlist:

    Hi guys,
     
    I have just had an email from my dealership in East London. 
     
    "Just to say Porsche are just finishing there tests on the new engines and have stated that the first batch of replacements should hopefully start to arrive at UK dealership after Easter.
     
    They haven’t told us what customers engine will arrive or when so I know hopefully by month end we will know where we stand.
     
    If all does go to plan then you could have your GT3 by the end of May."
     
    I saw mine in mid Feb just before the recall as it's currently in the show room. Thought I'd share with you guys
     
    Adam

    --

    RS60 Spyder, 991 GT3 RS pending... :(


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    Fritz, it was genuine but nothing indicates a final solution other than they believe the loosening bolts are the problem. 

    Something Porsche really needs to understand and learn. Dealers rarely provide up to date information. More often than not, the internet is the place to get information and we pass that on to the dealer. I recall one dealer lamenting that often he is the last to know what is going on. It's a vicious circle. Dealer tells you to check with PCNA and PCNA tells you to check with the dealer.

    The dealer is the last place I would go to get information.

    Last night I was prepared to end this saga but just tell my dealer to return my deposit. But today I read an article from Pistonheads which had interviewed the CEO of McLaren. In it he states that the GT3 to a tour de force and a technological marvel. His high praise is worth noting since he acknowledges his models are designed to compete against Porsche's and not artistic cars like Ferrari. As a result, I am waiting to hear if I will see my car anytime soon.

    Car manufacturers normally try to operate a "one face to the customer" policy, rather than open up several lines of communication which could only result in contradictions and misunderstandings. That face should normally be that of the dealer, as that is effectively what he is paid for. 
    Unfortunately, some dealers are not up to the job. 


    --

    fritz


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    If this is true then it means Porsche hasn't started to produce the replacement engines. It would also mean those of us in the US will not see our cars until late June or probably July just when the 2015 models will be produced. Can cars built initially as 2014's be re-designated as 2015's if they have not been delivered and the 2015's are identical?

    Otherwise I will have a 2014 car which I have not driven when the 2015 models are built. Oh the pain.Smiley

    Fritz, I failed to mention one other point regarding the engine issue. Do we know whether it was defective con rods tolerances or wrong torque settings?

     


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Vote with your feet - else it is all noise.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Leawood911:

    Vote with your feet - else it is all noise.

    Agree.  


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    Fritz, it was genuine but nothing indicates a final solution other than they believe the loosening bolts are the problem. 

    What would you want more? Smiley

    Something Porsche really needs to understand and learn. Dealers rarely provide up to date information. More often than not, the internet is the place to get information and we pass that on to the dealer. I recall one dealer lamenting that often he is the last to know what is going on. It's a vicious circle. Dealer tells you to check with PCNA and PCNA tells you to check with the dealer.

    The first point of communication is...the dealer. Dealers seem to get annoyed when they have to "fix" Porsche's own wrong doing (technical issues from the factory), so they try to "unload" the customer "problem" on Porsche again. Not really the best solution but as long as Porsche doesn't step up and communicates with customers directly, it won't change. 

    The dealer is the last place I would go to get information.

    Well, the dealers know quite a lot but this doesn't mean they want (or can) share it with the customer.

    Last night I was prepared to end this saga but just tell my dealer to return my deposit. But today I read an article from Pistonheads which had interviewed the CEO of McLaren. In it he states that the GT3 to a tour de force and a technological marvel. His high praise is worth noting since he acknowledges his models are designed to compete against Porsche's and not artistic cars like Ferrari. As a result, I am waiting to hear if I will see my car anytime soon.

    I get your frustration but you are thinking like a lawyer now, not like a car enthusiast. Just relax and enjoy the car when it arrives. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

     

    Fritz, I failed to mention one other point regarding the engine issue. Do we know whether it was defective con rods tolerances or wrong torque settings?

     

     

    At Weissach, I had verbal confirmation of "out of spec" bolts. Also, they have added a 3rd shift at the engine plant to ram up production :) but no word on how it of out of spec.

    I also think they pulled some workers from the 918 engine line to help out at the regular engine line, as when we arrived at the factory floor then engine area is empty of workers and all benches and stations are covered, but there was 4 completed engines waiting.


    --

     


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Christian, there is a huge difference between resetting a torque tool and redoing spec on bolts which involve suppliers.

    Whoopsy (I wish you would give us at least your first nameindecision) thanks for the information. 

    FWIW, British owners and buyers have been told GT3 engine production will begin after Easter. 


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

     

    Whoopsy (I wish you would give us at least your first nameindecision) thanks for the information. 

     

     

    We have the same first name haha.


    --

     


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    nberry:

    Christian, there is a huge difference between resetting a torque tool and redoing spec on bolts which involve suppliers.

    Whoopsy (I wish you would give us at least your first nameindecision) thanks for the information. 

    FWIW, British owners and buyers have been told GT3 engine production will begin after Easter. 

    I think the "out of spec" says a lot, also you have my many posts related to this matter. If you expect something official, you won't get it. Like I said before...they do not want to p.ss anyone off. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Turbo S, Porsche Boxster S (981), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014), BMW X3 35d (2013)


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Whoopsy:
    nberry:

     

    Whoopsy (I wish you would give us at least your first nameindecision) thanks for the information. 

     

     

    We have the same first name haha.


    Haha, I remember I was once calling you by your first name and nobody seemed to understand. Smiley


    --

    The secret of life is to admire without desiring.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    There we have it - good Nick and bad Nick.  (at work, anytime there was a new Mike I would compete for the 'Bad Mike' title - none have outlasted me.)

    Good Nick - I am looking forward to more of your impressions!


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Leawood911:

    There we have it - good Nick and bad Nick.  (at work, anytime there was a new Mike I would compete for the 'Bad Mike' title - none have outlasted me.)

    Good Nick - I am looking forward to more of your impressions!

    Smiley


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Whoopsy:
    nberry:

     

    Fritz, I failed to mention one other point regarding the engine issue. Do we know whether it was defective con rods tolerances or wrong torque settings?

     

     

    At Weissach, I had verbal confirmation of "out of spec" bolts. Also, they have added a 3rd shift at the engine plant to ram up production :) but no word on how it of out of spec.

    I also think they pulled some workers from the 918 engine line to help out at the regular engine line, as when we arrived at the factory floor then engine area is empty of workers and all benches and stations are covered, but there was 4 completed engines waiting.

    Given the current situation, why would anyone want an engine produced on the night shift...


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Why not? If they pull engine builders from the 918 line to help out, those are the cream of the crop picks.

     

    @leawood911, I will take the seat as the bad Nick 

    Nick has been known as Nick for so long now on this board, I am quite happy to stay as Whoopsy to avoid confusions. 


    --

     


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    I doubt that the 918 master engine builders would be placed on the night shift.  Additionally, even an attentive employee late at night are more prone to make errors.


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    There is a thread over at Rennlist that calls for a global owners campaign to present to PAG. Suggest those who are affected read it. A secure forum has been set up to discuss strategy and ensure all affected parties across boarders are respresented fairly with regards to compensation and clear communications. There are now 10 million USD of owners subscribed to this closed forum and I encourage any of you affected no matter where you live to read the thread then PM me the details of your transaction (the RL thread lists the information required) if you would like to be part of this Owners Action Group (note this is not a legal challenge to PAG)......


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Fellow 991 GT3 Stakeholders,

    We have today, filed our GT3 Worldwide Action Group Letter of complaint, to Porsche AG senior management. A separate communication has also concurrently been sent to Porsche sales offices and regional distributors across the globe.

    This letter was the culmination of an intense collaborative/consultative approach between 100+ x 991 GT3 stakeholders from across the globe via a private forum that was created for this purpose - http://tinyurl.com/GT3-Worldwide-Action-Group 

    The letter seeks to take PAG to task on the issues of communication and fair treatment across regions, in relation to the 991 GT3 "engine rod bolt recall" and the customers it affects. To the best of our knowledge Porsche AG have not at this time consulted the stakeholders directly with regards to these matters!

    We hope you will take some time out of your busy schedules to click on the link below and read what has been submitted to dealers and PAG.

    We also urge you, as a 991 GT3 "stakeholder", regardless on whether or not you have been a direct part of the GT3 Worldwide Action Group Forum to press upon your supplying dealer the contents of this communication. Your dealer should be aware of the letter and it may in fact help achieve a satisfactory remedy for you....

    Sierra Mike & Macca




    A full copy of the communication to both dealers and PAG appears here: 
    http://tinyurl.com/991GT3-PAGletter

     

    1398221120320Sample.JPG


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Hi, for info my engine was produced this week and next week will be delivered in Milano

     


    Re: ATTENTION 991 GT3 Owners: DO NOT use your car anymore!!! (Recall)

    Last week-end in Magny-Cours, the first french engine swaped 991 GT3 hit the track during the Porsche Club Motorsport event...

    The owner showed us a letter from Porsche saying that they will reimburse all the costs linked to the club events he missed and that he will get some cash to compensate the immobilization of the car.


    --

    I remember when sex was safe and motor racing was dangerous...


     
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