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    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    I fully expect  a more elaborate " Sound Symposer Plus " gimmick in these models and the PR/marketing angle will be basically " who cares how it sounds from the outside  ...just enjoy the music inside ( via Wizard of Oz auditory bells, diaphragms , tubes and whistles ) 

    its funny how we deride BMW for running synthtic engine sound via the entertainment speakers, but think about it, the Porsche sound symposer is basically a speaker too ( vibrating diaphragm pushing a column of air tuned by the hidden output tube's length and diameter ... a device many , many sporty cars have incorporated and will become an industry in itself once we are running more and more silent full electric autos , with all sorts of ECU-synchronized selectable engine sounds overlayed into the audio system 

    wanna commute this morning  in your smart e-car using a "  zingy F1 motor " push button B and later push button D to drive home with a " roaring  V12 " !


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    gusmlt:
    pjd:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbLrfNV3Kc4

    Not bad sounding at all and this is without sports exhaust. 

    This car has two sound symposers, do I need to say more? Smiley

    If the sound from the inside is the most important thing to you, yes, it will be satisfying.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    RC:
    gusmlt:
    pjd:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbLrfNV3Kc4

    Not bad sounding at all and this is without sports exhaust. 

    This car has two sound symposers, do I need to say more? Smiley

    If the sound from the inside is the most important thing to you, yes, it will be satisfying.

    Thats a big shame wasn't aware about the symposers. It's starting to sound very much like an M4 situation here. 


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    The M4 actually uses amplified sound from the engine bay through the speakers.

    The sound symposer works differently and in a more elegant way in my opinion but it is basically the same system, "cheating" the sound perception inside the car.

    It is also interesting to note that the new bi-turbo charged engines are not using VTG chargers like in the 991 Turbo/Turbo S. Different engines, different turbo chargers.


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    RC:
    gusmlt:
    pjd:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbLrfNV3Kc4

    Not bad sounding at all and this is without sports exhaust. 

    This car has two sound symposers, do I need to say more? Smiley

    If the sound from the inside is the most important thing to you, yes, it will be satisfying.

    Inside is most important definitely. What should I care about how others can hear me? Smiley 

    The 991.2 sounds excellent on shifts - much better than (at least my) 991.1


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Lars997:
    RC:
    gusmlt:
    pjd:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbLrfNV3Kc4

    Not bad sounding at all and this is without sports exhaust. 

    This car has two sound symposers, do I need to say more? Smiley

    If the sound from the inside is the most important thing to you, yes, it will be satisfying.

    Inside is most important definitely. What should I care about how others can hear me? Smiley 

    The 991.2 sounds excellent on shifts - much better than (at least my) 991.1

    Agree. And from outside it doesn`t sound bad at all (for a turbo)....

    BTW my guess: In 10/15 years only 1% (or less) of new cars will have real sound exaust.... we better get used to this.... Smiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    The outside is what the car actually sounds like, that is why it's the most important. Also the symposers don't actually create the best sound, sportier than without yes but it's still a muffled sound designed to add to the real sound,it does not substitute the actual real sound coming from the outside. And then there is the principle of it that ruins the enjoyment of the sound, the fact that most of it is an artificial sound now,not just a little.
    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Carlos from Spain:
    The outside is what the car actually sounds like, that is why it's the most important. Also the symposers don't actually create the best sound, sportier than without yes but it's still a muffled sound designed to add to the real sound,it does not substitute the actual real sound coming from the outside. And then there is the principle of it that ruins the enjoyment of the sound, the fact that most of it is an artificial sound now,not just a little.

    Exactly. It is no fun if you enjoy an amazing sound inside and when you open the window, the sound actually comes from the inside and not from the outside, this is even worse in a cabriolet or when driving through a tunnel or some narrow roads with buildings surrounding them.

    Also, I remember what my son always says when my wife drives away in the Macan Turbo (and trust me, the Macan Turbo with PSE is not quiet from the outside but it is that typical low tone Turbo sound the new 911 has as well) or when he watches a new M3/M4 driving by or accelerating, you can tell his disappointment from the look on his face.

    With the cars I'm driving, I'm a cool dad anyway. 99% of the parents are driving Minivans and hatchbacks or some Diesel SUVs. Smiley Can't say I have much friends in the parents community but their kids love me (and this benefits my own kids, which is amazing). Smiley A bit less attention would actually be better but the kids are positively affected, so why not? In the past, we were worried it would be different.

    Last time I picked my daughter up at school, a bunch of boys came over and asked me to accelerate a little bit more. There is a speed limit, so I didn't exactly accelerate much but my exhaust is really loud and they were applauding. The next day, my daughter got comments like "cool car, cool dad", you should have seen here, she was glowing out of pride. Smiley

    These are every day experiences you will barely have with a muted exhaust sound. You should see how people react to my Mustang, it is just amazing. Yes, sometimes people feel annoyed but they seem to be a minority (yet).


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Question: The symposer on 991.1 was just a duct at the back of the cabin letting engine (induction) noise in the cabin. Is the 991.2's the same concept or a totally artificial one like BMW for example?


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    reginos:

    Question: The symposer on 991.1 was just a duct at the back of the cabin letting engine (induction) noise in the cabin. Is the 991.2's the same concept or a totally artificial one like BMW for example?

    The 991.1 symposer had the resonance chamber with the diaphragm too, the change seems to come in that it now has two of them because of the lack of real sound coming from the outside into the cabin, and I don't know if the design has been tweeked as well or not, but the concept is still the same I believe, very different than BMW which is sound recreated through the speakers though.

    991.1 version

     


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Fascinating discussion here.  i guess I conclude that Porsche has done a good job, considering most customers' (probably urban)  preferences.  And I keep reminding myself that even external sound is not the real engine sound, but muffled as well.  


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Carlos from Spain:
    reginos:

    Question: The symposer on 991.1 was just a duct at the back of the cabin letting engine (induction) noise in the cabin. Is the 991.2's the same concept or a totally artificial one like BMW for example?

    The 991.1 symposer had the resonance chamber with the diaphragm too, the change seems to come in that it now has two of them because of the lack of real sound coming from the outside into the cabin, and I don't know if the design has been tweeked as well or not, but the concept is still the same I believe, very different than BMW which is sound recreated through the speakers though.

    991.1 version

     

    Thank you Smiley


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Wonderbar:

    Fascinating discussion here.  i guess I conclude that Porsche has done a good job, considering most customers' (probably urban)  preferences.  And I keep reminding myself that even external sound is not the real engine sound, but muffled as well.  

    I can take muffled real sound, and I can just about take a car interior being targeted to receive selectively filtered real sound, but being targeted with totally synthetic engine sounds in my own car would make me feel infantile. Smiley


    --

    fritz


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    fritz:
    Wonderbar:

    Fascinating discussion here.  i guess I conclude that Porsche has done a good job, considering most customers' (probably urban)  preferences.  And I keep reminding myself that even external sound is not the real engine sound, but muffled as well.  

    I can take muffled real sound, and I can just about take a car interior being targeted to receive selectively filtered real sound, but being targeted with totally synthetic engine sounds in my own car would make me feel infantile. Smiley

    +1

    As long as the sound remains analogue and not digital I have no issue.


    --

    2015 981 Cayman GT4 | White | Full Bucket Seats | Sport Chrono
    2014 991 Carrera 4S | Dark Blue Metallic | PDK | Sport Chrono | SPASM


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Btw, 991.2 C4 and C4S should be introduced very, very soon. 


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Wake up Guys!

    We have a new Carrera 4 and Targa 4

    http://www.netcarshow.com/porsche/2016-911_carrera_4/

    http://www.netcarshow.com/porsche/2016-911_targa_4/

     

    Netcarshow was faster then official Porsche web site Smiley

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Looks great!
    --


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Very nice indeed!



    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    I see that as a member of VW Porsche, maybe don't have any problems with emissions (at this moment), but an update of its website, unfortunately YES. So far I do not see any updates on the official website of Porsche.

    Whatever...we have a new Carrera 4 and Targa 4. Porsche showed fairly quickly, these models.


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Looks very good!

    Has the WLS kit been revealed as well?


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Finally we have a offical web site arrera 4 and Targa 4 Porsche update

    http://www.porsche.com/microsite/911/germany.aspx#overview


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    911 Turbo and Turbo S models should also be announced before end of the year.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    This is the best looking 911, no silly rear spoiler, just a simply clean line. Love the new tail lights too.


    --

    J.Seven

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    Looks very nice indeed! 


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    J.Seven:

    This is the best looking 911, no silly rear spoiler, just a simply clean line. Love the new tail lights too.

    i'd like to see alcantara interior and rear seats delete!!!!

    peter


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    reginos:
    Carlos from Spain:
    reginos:

    Question: The symposer on 991.1 was just a duct at the back of the cabin letting engine (induction) noise in the cabin. Is the 991.2's the same concept or a totally artificial one like BMW for example?

    The 991.1 symposer had the resonance chamber with the diaphragm too, the change seems to come in that it now has two of them because of the lack of real sound coming from the outside into the cabin, and I don't know if the design has been tweeked as well or not, but the concept is still the same I believe, very different than BMW which is sound recreated through the speakers though.

    991.1 version

     

    Thank you Smiley

    The 991.2 system will not work like the sound symposer of the 991.1 because there are two turbochargers in front of the intake manifold that muddles the sound.  This is a significant reason why turbocharged cars sound flat, as the sound typically originates in the intake track and not the exhaust system as many would assume.  


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    According to my information, Porsche still uses a similar sound symposer and not an artificial sound generator or the speakers (BMW) but in the case of the new facelift, they are using two sound symposers.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    I've always thought of the symposer technology as a bit like this: 

    dual-head-stethoscopes-78888-163895.jpg

     

    In fact, maybe that is where it could go.... driver decides where the engine' heartbeat should be measured, put the ear inserts in your ears, and rev away!  

     

     


    --

    2011 Range Rover Sport S/C,  2009 Porsche 911S


    Re: OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche 911 [991.2]

    In my opinion, sound symposers should only be used in cars which sound great from the outside but not so great from the inside because of a too good noise insulation. So the driver should be able to decide if he wants the whole sound inside the car or only a little bit. The Macan Turbo with PSE sounds OK from the outside but you can't hear a bit of that sound inside the car and since it doesn't have a sound symposer... surprise


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Ford Mustang GT500 Shelby SVT (2014), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


     
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