Crown

Board: Motor Sports Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    https://newsroom.porsche.com/en/motorsports/porsche-motorsports-wec-management-hitzinger-enzinger-seidl-12344.html

    This is not good news at all! I find this very strange indeed and I'm very sorry to hear that Alex Hitzingeris leaving. He was brilliant and a real risk taker.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Agreed, that is a big loss!

    I wonder where he will turn up. Maybe in F1, teaching some of the non-Merc teams a few tricks of the trade for much more money than he could have ever made at Porsche in WEC?? Not unthinkable, given the very sophisticated hybrid engine tech in WEC.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    he will work outside of motorsport


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    I hope to see Adrian Newey in Porsche one day


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    kudryavchik:

    I hope to see Adrian Newey in Porsche one day

    Now that would really be something!Smiley


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    He is bound to be way beyond the normal compensation universe for frugal Stuttgart/Weissach.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    I don't know, WW was very well paid as CEO.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Sport Auto claims that Porsche will not have a new car for 2017. This could be behind Alex's departure.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Agreed, if confirmed this could be due to Dieselgate related cutbacks of 2017 Motorsport expenditure. I wonder to what extent the GT race car development will be affected as well.

    WW did so well comp-wise because his contract was drawn up when the company was almost bankrupt and nobody could imagine the kind of P&L numbers that years later would trigger his bonus entitlement.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    It may be related to Dieselgate, but  remember that the LMP1 rules change in 2018. There is really no point in developing a new car for just one year.

    I suspect Alex was not interested in sitting around for 2 years being uncompetitive, and so moved on. I also think he may have known something about the 2018 proposed rules that may have taken the shine off the challenge.

    I think we may get an inkling into the future by the person (especially his CV) that Porsche will choose to substitute him. It could be an indicator of Porsche commitment to the future of the LMP1 program.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Thanks, I did not know that there is a LMP1 rule change in the pipeline for 2018. Do you have any idea about the general thrust of these changes? And what about GT rule changes, following the 2016/17 revision and the onset of the Turbo Era?


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    No one knows any details (as those still have to be decided), but there has been talk about simplifying the cars (not a good sign) in order to keep costs low(er). Peugeot is especially interested in this , as there is  talk of them returning , but only if costs are controlled.

    The GT rules are set to remain as is but with constant updates.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    The more, the merrier...it would be great if BMW decided to join LMP1 as well, in addition to Peugeot.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    The problem is that they (the ACO) must keep the series technically interesting to the manufacturers such as Porsche . If they dumb it down , then only the manufacturers that are exclusively interested in using the series as a Marketing tool will remain.

    Furthermore , they must resist slowing down the cars. The WEC is beginning to be seen by many drivers and some fans as an alternative to F1. If they slow down the cars as F1 gets speeded up, then it will cease to be seen as an alternative, and it will loose popularity and we will start that dreaded downward spiral.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    A few observations:

    1. WEC will have to improve their own marketing by a mile or the major contenders will scale down their commitment anyway, which would be a real shame.

    2. FIA and ACO will have to strike a fine balance between affordability and attracting new entrants on one hand and maintaining the high tech profile of LMP1 on the other.

    3. With the new 2016/17 regs, LMP2 and GTE Pro will speed up quite a bit, so slowing down LMP1 would be an odd thing to do. It should be the F1 of long distance racing and be (almost) on a par with F1 speedwise, as it is currently depending on the track (only apprx. 5 sec slower per lap).


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Rebuttal:

    1. Agreed, but it's never going to be as commercial as F1. Sportscar racing has been a niche series for a long time. The real question is how big or small do want that niche to be. It is also important to remember that the WEC has Le Mans. It is one of the three most famous races on earth. The amount of marketing mileage that can be derived from that one event is mind boggling (see Audi)

    2. Agreed again. The problem is what is considered "balanced" by some may not be considered by others. I know that it is not very usual, but I'm convinced that the quest for the illusive "cost cutting" model is really a bit of a red herring. Manufacturers will spend what they can afford in order to win. If you limit testing (for example), they will simply spend the money that they " saved"  on very complex and expensive simulators. The same thing applies to aero development (wind tunnel testing). If you reduce that , they will spend their money on other areas that are not limited. Racing budgets are set. The money will be spent. The other problem is that the more you "control costs", the closer you will get to the F1 model...and look where that got them . (Also , constantly changing rules is very costly)

    3. Could not agree more! This is a pet peeve of mine. Actually, Porsche's pole time for Spa was only 0.5 seconds off Mercedes's F1 fastest race lap time. Slowing down the cars is a silly knee jerk reaction to certain incidents and reflect a zero tolerance for risk , but also serves as a "Pavalovian" like reaction that reflect the regulators mind-set that "something" must be done /changed at the end of each season. The fact that good management is also knowing when not mess with something completely escapes them.

    Look ; The series needs to grow. There is not just one magic bullet that will do this. It must improve its marketing (as you point out); it needs to have a good and stable set of rules that are both technically challenging, but will not cost the earth. It must expand the championship slowly to 10 races (at least). It must guarantee that it holds races in attractive venues, and that these venues are of interest to manufacturers as well as to the fans. It must guarantee that the cars look good and that they are fast. There are many, many things that need to be "managed" in order to guarantee success.  The search for the magic bullet will only lead to failure.

     

     


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    The resident expert has spoken... kiss


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    That is very kind of you, but you will be surprised to know that many people completely disagree with me.wink


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    It is lonely at the top...

    Any thoughts on Porsche's plans for the GTE Pro class, will the 2017 RSR (turbo-charged, engine moved forward, etc.) be enough to be on a level playing field again with the mid-engined competition after the transition season 2016, or will it be another BOP charade?


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    I'm really having a hard time with that one. I had it on good authority (from a trusted source) that Porsche were preparing a mid-engine car to compete with the Ford GT and the Ferrari's. However, since then we have had so many chops and changes that it looks to me that we may have a turbo charged rear engined 911 .

    If this is indeed the case, I think Porsche have made a mistake. for the following reasons:

    1. There are inherent advantages to be gained from a mid-engine layout. (fast corners)
    2. The  Ford GT is essentially a race car that has a road going version.
    3. The Ford GT uses a carbon and aluminum chassis.
    4. Porsche had a once-in-a- lifetime chance of  liberating itself from the "shackles" of the 911
    5. Porsche has a perfectly good mid- engine chassis (918) that could be developed into a very nice GTE.

    I don't know the reasons behind the change of heart (if there is one), but I suspect that BoP may be Porsche's best friend in the future.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    1. On GTE Pro, I think in a recent interview Walliser pretty much confirmed that the new car will be 911 based, like it or not. Still, I entirely agree with your points above.

    2. On LMP1, I have just read an article in SA on future rule changes and EoT:

     ° In essence, the 2018 rules are likely to move further towards emphasizing higher classes of hybrid power (up to 12 MJ versus up to 8 MJ now) and deemphasizing the role of the combustion engine through further fuel cutbacks.

    ° The next rules change after that in 2021 could include fuel cell technology for the first time, spawning a fuel cell EV racing car; that is what BMW seems to be aiming at for strategic reasons. (Where is Merc on that, given their longstanding research into fuel cell tech...??)   

    Given Porsche's Mission E project, the corporate strategy behind it and its timing in 2019/20, if VW Group/Porsche were to make progress on fuel cell tech as well, this could be exciting both on and off track...


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    I have heard many conflicting theories on the 2018 rules. If those in AS are correct, then we may be in for an interesting few years.!kiss


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    olli:

    1. On GTE Pro, I think in a recent interview Walliser pretty much confirmed that the new car will be 911 based, like it or not. Still, I entirely agree with your points above.

    2. On LMP1, I have just read an article in SA on future rule changes and EoT:

     ° In essence, the 2018 rules are likely to move further towards emphasizing higher classes of hybrid power (up to 12 MJ versus up to 8 MJ now) and deemphasizing the role of the combustion engine through further fuel cutbacks.

    ° The next rules change after that in 2021 could include fuel cell technology for the first time, spawning a fuel cell EV racing car; that is what BMW seems to be aiming at for strategic reasons. (Where is Merc on that, given their longstanding research into fuel cell tech...??)   

    Given Porsche's Mission E project, the corporate strategy behind it and its timing in 2019/20, if VW Group/Porsche were to make progress on fuel cell tech as well, this could be exciting both on and off track...

    BTW - Do you remember where that Walliser interview was published? I need it for another discussion I am having on another site.Smiley


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Please don't worry; I found it!wink


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    And, did he say what I seem to remember?yes


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    He does, but he does not seem to rule out the engine being moved to the center.

    I really don't understand that: Surely if you are going to move the engine forward, you would do that with a platform that has been specifically designed for that purpose.

    Any way, lets see what they can come up with.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    So basically, the 2017 RSR (and maybe its potential road sibling GT2 RS) could turn out be a rear/mid-engine car under the 911 silhouette, to keep up the pretense.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    According to AMS, rumour has it that Axel Hitzinger will re-surface in the Red Bull universe where he used to work previously from 2006-2011 as head of technology.

    Tied to that is the speculation that Hitzinger could help RB develop a new F1 hybrid engine of its own, under the Aston Martin marketing banner.


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Yes, I read this on another forum. Quite sad really. Porsche now needs to make sure they hire a top guy or promote from within , but whatever they do they must try and make sure that this new person is really going to "wear the team jersey" (so to speak).


    Re: WEC: Porsche Team management restructuring

    Here we go.


     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA 2/22/18 3:22 AM
    Pilot
    264425 1706
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3 (2017) 2/19/18 7:18 PM
    Carlos from SpainM
    262478 4155
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: 911 GT2 RS (2017) 2/20/18 6:02 PM
    Targa Tim
    91307 1518
    Porsche Sticky 992 (Next 911 generation 2019/2020) 2/23/18 12:26 PM
    RCA
    70065 929
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: 991.2 GT3 RS (2018) 2/23/18 12:30 PM
    DaveGordon
    0 318
    Porsche 918 latest news Thread Closed 11/6/17 10:43 AM
    RCA
    549318 5574
    Porsche 991 GT3 RS 1/9/18 1:43 PM
    Kimi
    457406 5816
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S 2/9/18 9:50 PM
    MKSGRM
    447062 4251
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 2016 Porsche Carrera 911 [991.2] Facelift 3/24/17 12:49 PM
    RCA
    255527 1382
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 1/4/18 9:14 PM
    wurlie
    247866 2558
    Porsche 997 GT3 RS 4.0 3/15/17 10:40 PM
    noone1
     
     
     
     
     
    231488 737
    Porsche Cayman GT4 12/30/17 11:07 AM
    Boxster Coupe GTS
    213924 2482
    Porsche 991 GT2 RS (2017) - Rumors, speculations and gossip Thread Closed 7/3/17 2:04 PM
    RCA
    175715 1699
    Porsche The moment I've been waiting for... 2/22/18 8:37 AM
    RCA
     
     
     
     
     
    165804 938
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Turbo and Turbo S 1/23/18 12:27 AM
    RCA
    165055 1074
    Ferrari 488 GTB/GTS 2/22/18 7:01 AM
    pmarkow
    142925 1400
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 2/8/18 2:35 AM
    rhino
    139945 2901
    Porsche 991.2 GT3 Thread Closed 3/7/17 11:47 AM
    RCA
    125291 1651
    Porsche Boxster Spyder (981) 12/29/17 8:31 AM
    dreamcar
    111398 692
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016) 1/6/18 10:41 PM
    Wonderbar
    108185 1284
    Others Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016 model) - Review (updated Feb 13th 2017) 2/11/18 12:00 AM
    Topspeed
    105758 1870
    Ferrari Ferrari F12 Berlinetta / 599 GTO Successor 12/5/17 3:29 PM
    RCA
    87776 765
    Others VW caught cheating emissions tests 7/10/17 2:36 PM
    RCA
    81989 861
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 718 Boxster (2016) 10/20/17 11:17 AM
    DaveGordon
    81862 732
    Porsche 991 GTS 4/3/17 4:27 PM
    bluelines
    68923 247
    Porsche OFFICIAL: Cayenne (958) Facelift 2014 3/2/17 4:22 PM
    RCA
    67725 163
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 (facelift) Carrera 4 and Carrera 4S 3/30/17 7:33 PM
    Carlos from SpainM
    60729 131
    McLaren F1 8/23/17 11:10 AM
    Carlos from SpainM
    49752 202
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 12/27/17 10:34 PM
    rhino
    46698 638
    Porsche UPDATES: 2018 Porsche Cayenne 2/6/18 2:13 PM
    RCA
    42162 423
    360 items found, displaying 1 to 30.