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    Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    ...SPORT AUTO just tested the Ford GT on the Nordschleife and in Hockenheim. Was there any comparison between both in the US press? If yes, what were the results? Thanks.

    BTW:

    Ford GT, Nordschleife 7:52 and Hockenheim Kleiner Kurs 1:14,1 (worse than 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis).

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Here is this article but not with Porsche comparison wise.

    http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=2904&print_page=y

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    (997 Turbo/manual/PCCB/Rear diff lock) 7.39-7.42 at the Ring and 1.09,7-1.10,7 for Hockenheim.

    Let's see if I am right

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    RC said:
    ...SPORT AUTO just tested the Ford GT on the Nordschleife and in Hockenheim. Was there any comparison between both in the US press? If yes, what were the results? Thanks.

    BTW:

    Ford GT, Nordschleife 7:52 and Hockenheim Kleiner Kurs 1:14,1 (worse than 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis).



    The NBR time is not bad!

    BTW: The NBR time also confirms my reluctance to believe in the Z06 NBR times claimed by GM. The Ford GT is ca. 10% more powerful than the Z06. And still its lap time is about 10 seconds above the GM claimed NBR time of the Z06...

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    The Z06 will probably get a laptime of 7.57-7.59 on the Ring.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    CF said:
    (997 Turbo/manual/PCCB/Rear diff lock) 7.39-7.42 at the Ring and 1.09,7-1.10,7 for Hockenheim.

    Let's see if I am right



    i bet with you (for one beer) that you will be wrong.

    Hockenheim won't be under 1.12
    and Nuerburgring won't be under 7.45

    believe me


    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    I will buy you 10 beers if I'm right

    Given the direction of your posts I'm inclined to believe that you've got inside information!

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    CF said:
    I will buy you 10 beers if I'm right

    Given the direction of your posts I'm inclined to belive that you've got inside information!



    seems like i cannot loose this bet

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    guy2 said:
    Nuerburgring won't be under 7.45



    7.45 is still great

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    CF said:
    The Z06 will probably get a laptime of 7.57-7.59 on the Ring.



    The old C5 Zo6 got a 7.56 time. I believe the new C6 Zo6 got in the 7.41-7.43 range on run-flat tires. I remember reading about it a few months back.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    i think it is very easy:

    because of the 4wd system of the TT you will have around 4% power loss. so you will end up around 460hp. that is the same power as the 996GT2 MK1. this car did the nuerburgring in 7:46

    so 7:46 is the time to beat.
    BUT the GT2 is lighter and definately more of race car. so the new 997TT won't achieve its time. maybe with racing tires, but not with normal raod tires.

    this would mean the 997TT will be 20s faster than the 997C2S which sounds possible - for me.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    sshu930 said:
    Quote:
    CF said:
    The Z06 will probably get a laptime of 7.57-7.59 on the Ring.



    The old C5 Zo6 got a 7.56 time. I believe the new C6 Zo6 got in the 7.41-7.43 range on run-flat tires. I remember reading about it a few months back.



    It's been discussed over and over on these forums. There has been no proof whatsoever of the 7:43 run.

    guy2:
    Depends on what kind of AWD system it uses. Also, chassis refinement. Lighter weight than the 996TT (so it's only 60 kg heavier than the 996GT2). Wider powerband (from ~2000 rpm to ~7000 rpm). I don't think a time of 7:45 should sound that unlikely.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    ...SPORT AUTO just tested the Ford GT on the Nordschleife and in Hockenheim. Was there any comparison between both in the US press? If yes, what were the results? Thanks.

    BTW:

    Ford GT, Nordschleife 7:52 and Hockenheim Kleiner Kurs 1:14,1 (worse than 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis).



    The NBR time is not bad!

    BTW: The NBR time also confirms my reluctance to believe in the Z06 NBR times claimed by GM. The Ford GT is ca. 10% more powerful than the Z06. And still its lap time is about 10 seconds above the GM claimed NBR time of the Z06...


    First off, the Z06 is around 600lbs lighter than the Ford GT. Secondly, I was talking to a Corvette tuner yesterday (at the DC auto show) and he told me that he dynoed two new Z06s and got over 450hp at the wheels in both cars, so the 505hp rating is not accurate. He said it's closer to 540hp. So the Z06 is 600lbs lighter and only down 10hp. I think it's certainly possible that it's a lot faster than the GT around the NBR. However, with a track that is so long, it's really hard to get consistent/accurate lap times as there are so many factors that can affect the time of the car over such a great distance.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    C4S Co-Driver said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    ...SPORT AUTO just tested the Ford GT on the Nordschleife and in Hockenheim. Was there any comparison between both in the US press? If yes, what were the results? Thanks.

    BTW:

    Ford GT, Nordschleife 7:52 and Hockenheim Kleiner Kurs 1:14,1 (worse than 997 Carrera S with 20 mm chassis).



    The NBR time is not bad!

    BTW: The NBR time also confirms my reluctance to believe in the Z06 NBR times claimed by GM. The Ford GT is ca. 10% more powerful than the Z06. And still its lap time is about 10 seconds above the GM claimed NBR time of the Z06...


    First off, the Z06 is around 600lbs lighter than the Ford GT. Secondly, I was talking to a Corvette tuner yesterday (at the DC auto show) and he told me that he dynoed two new Z06s and got over 450hp at the wheels in both cars, so the 505hp rating is not accurate. He said it's closer to 540hp. So the Z06 is 600lbs lighter and only down 10hp. I think it's certainly possible that it's a lot faster than the GT around the NBR. However, with a track that is so long, it's really hard to get consistent/accurate lap times as there are so many factors that can affect the time of the car over such a great distance.



    You're right. Motor Trend has dynoed the Z06, too. But, surprise, surprise... the Ford GT dynoed at about 600hp!

    Sport Auto is birdcage lining!

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    common guys, let's wait and have some beer

    it would be great, if the car will be sub 7:45

    but that is near pagani zonda and porsche CGT territory.

    we will see and hope for the fastest possible time

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    C4Sdriver, 500 lbs lighter?? i believe its 300 if that..the ford comes in @ about 3400-3500 lbs if i remember right, compared to about 3200 for the chevy.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    sshu930 said:
    The old C5 Zo6 got a 7.56 time. I believe the new C6 Zo6 got in the 7.41-7.43 range on run-flat tires. I remember reading about it a few months back.



    Where do all these fantasy NBR times come from??? Sport Auto has never tested this car on the Nordschleife and I don't trust ANY other sportscar magazine.
    There is NO offifically confirmed time available for the C5/C6 Z versions, sorry.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    CF said:
    I will buy you 10 beers if I'm right

    Given the direction of your posts I'm inclined to believe that you've got inside information!



    Don't worry if Sarma is driving, the TT will be reported exceeding all competitor's time whether accurate or not.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    CF said:
    I will buy you 10 beers if I'm right

    Given the direction of your posts I'm inclined to believe that you've got inside information!



    Don't worry if Sarma is driving, the TT will be reported exceeding all competitor's time whether accurate or not.



    Nick, it appears that the recent disastrous test result of the F430 has upset you permanently

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Here is this article but not with Porsche comparison wise.

    http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=2904&print_page=y



    Interesting article. So the Z06 is slightly faster than the Viper ST-10. Not bad. But the Viper did a 8:13 time on the Nordschleife. I bet that the Corvette Z06 can't get below 7:52 on the Nordschleife, I'd even say 7:55 is more realistic. The Z06 has impressive engine figures, it has an impressive weight figure and it definetely has an impressive weight to power ratio.

    BUT I ask again: the Z06 is now available for a few months in the US. Is there ANY trustable TRACK test with that car, especially compared to the Ford GT (which would make sense) or even the C6 (non-Z) Vette?

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    RC said:

    BUT I ask again: the Z06 is now available for a few months in the US. Is there ANY trustable TRACK test with that car, especially compared to the Ford GT (which would make sense) or even the C6 (non-Z) Vette?



    Their strategy is to find enough idiots buying a Z06 based on rumours...

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Their strategy is to find enough idiots buying a Z06 based on rumours...



    I can't blame them, they did a great job. And to be honest: aren't we doing the same here? With one difference though: I think we can be trusted, we're not gaining any money or fame by telling people lies. And as soon as the 997 Turbo hits the streets, people will definetely judge us by what has been said here. I just hope that my sources and my experiences regarding the 997 Turbo weren't completely false. It would be a shame...for me and the others who invested so much time, nerves and convincing by gathering as much information about the 997 Turbo as possible.

    If the 997 Turbo is crap, you guys will be the first to know. I suppose you'll read the first OWNER review here on Rennteam.com.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    RC said:
    Quote:
    Ron (Houston) said:
    Here is this article but not with Porsche comparison wise.

    http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=31&article_id=2904&print_page=y



    Interesting article. So the Z06 is slightly faster than the Viper ST-10. Not bad. But the Viper did a 8:13 time on the Nordschleife. I bet that the Corvette Z06 can't get below 7:52 on the Nordschleife, I'd even say 7:55 is more realistic. The Z06 has impressive engine figures, it has an impressive weight figure and it definetely has an impressive weight to power ratio.

    BUT I ask again: the Z06 is now available for a few months in the US. Is there ANY trustable TRACK test with that car, especially compared to the Ford GT (which would make sense) or even the C6 (non-Z) Vette?



    Why are times reported by Sportauto accurate and reliable and all others not? Do not forget the old Z06 beat the 996TT with Ron Fellows driving the Z06 and Harley Haywood driving the TT. The new Z06 has 100 more hp and is lighter. The new 997TT has 60hp more and is heavier.

    Also why do you doubt the new Z06 time? Is Porsche the only car that is allowed to perform on the Ring?

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    ... Harley (sic) Haywood ...



    Hey Nick,

    "A" and "U" are nowhere near each other on the keyboard!

    Wazzup?

    Also, ever heard of integrating under the torque curve between shift point RPMs?

    Didn't think so

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    W8MM said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    ... Harley (sic) Haywood ...



    Hey Nick,

    "A" and "U" are nowhere near each other on the keyboard!

    Wazzup?

    Also, ever heard of integrating under the torque curve between shift point RPMs?

    Didn't think so



    Mike the worst thing you can do is get like Fritz.

    Regarding your inquiry, I believe I know of what you speak but have not seen it described in that fashion. My question to you is would that make a difference in a 7 mile run?

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    nberry said:

    Why are times reported by Sportauto accurate and reliable and all others not? Do not forget the old Z06 beat the 996TT with Ron Fellows driving the Z06 and Harley Haywood driving the TT. The new Z06 has 100 more hp and is lighter. The new 997TT has 60hp more and is heavier.




    I'm unclear here... Definitely the 997TT is heavier than the Z06, but the 997TT is 90 lbs lighter than the 996TT...

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    amjf088 said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:

    Why are times reported by Sportauto accurate and reliable and all others not? Do not forget the old Z06 beat the 996TT with Ron Fellows driving the Z06 and Harley Haywood driving the TT. The new Z06 has 100 more hp and is lighter. The new 997TT has 60hp more and is heavier.




    I'm unclear here... Definitely the 997TT is heavier than the Z06, but the 997TT is 90 lbs lighter than the 996TT...



    Don't base your findings(weight) on Car and Driver's preliminary numbers. They are usually not creditable.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...


    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Why are times reported by Sportauto accurate and reliable and all others not? Do not forget the old Z06 beat the 996TT with Ron Fellows driving the Z06 and Harley Haywood driving the TT. The new Z06 has 100 more hp and is lighter. The new 997TT has 60hp more and is heavier.

    Also why do you doubt the new Z06 time? Is Porsche the only car that is allowed to perform on the Ring?






    Well Sport Auto figures are very acqurate because they have been doing tests on the ring for a long time. Drivers know their way. They use real timing gear and they test with the course closed. Many magazines just get in there, drive with a stopwatch and traffic and then compensate the time because the straight is closed.

    For instance Walter Rohl might be some seconds faster with the car than Sport Auto. Sport Auto database is a good reference point because they usually use the same driver.

    The C6 got a 8:15 (404 HP and 1492Kg as tested) time with Sport Auto and the 996 Carrera 2 (2002) did and 8:17 (320 HP and 1467 kg as tested)

    So standard manual C6 about the same time as the old 996 with 80 Hp less

    The Z06 weights 20 Kg less and has 100 Hp more. If it breakes 8 min it will not be by much. It should be slower than the 996 TT let alone the 997TT

    After this you can belive what you want about the 7:43 time but 32 seconds less than the standard manual C6 without major improvements in suspension design (leaf springs) is not reachable.

    Of course if they fit slicks anything is possible but we are always talking about all weather tyres times.

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Why are times reported by Sportauto accurate and reliable and all others not? Do not forget the old Z06 beat the 996TT with Ron Fellows driving the Z06 and Harley Haywood driving the TT. The new Z06 has 100 more hp and is lighter. The new 997TT has 60hp more and is heavier.

    Also why do you doubt the new Z06 time? Is Porsche the only car that is allowed to perform on the Ring?



    The answer is pretty simple, Nick:

    1. you can't compare performance of two different cars with two different drivers sitting in each of them, this is pure BS.
    2. I didn't see ANY trustable Nordschleife test figure yet for the Z06, sorry. There is the possibility to get an "official" time taken, apparently no Z06 driver had this done yet.
    3. SPORT AUTO is the most trusted sportscar magazine among enthusiasts over here and for a reason. They are actually the only car magazine who are doing the Supertest, a well defined track test with ONE single driver, Horst v. Saurma. He is a very respected driver, he is very talented because he can adapt to different cars and what is best: he isn't focused on one single brand only. Of course there are enough people who don't trust his tests, especially Ferrari drivers.
    4. if the old and new Vettes are that good, I wonder why no german car magazine gets them for testing on the track.

    Nick, you don't want to understand: our co-editor CR owns a Ferrari F430 Spider too as you know very well. But ask him what he drives on the track or when he needs ultimate performance. Right...996 Turbo. Of course there is another reason for that but in the end, he agrees that the Ferrari is for the heart and soul, the Porsche for performance (although I don't agree here, I think he gets goose bumps too when driving his Turbo).

    Re: Talking of the Corvette Z06 and the 997 Turbo...

    From what I have been reading on the corvette forums about the new Z06 is that its very fast around the track. Its very fast period. I also dont think comparing it to the standard C6 does any good. Although it looks similar, everything about the car is completely different. Also, you can install headers for only 2k to get an additional 30 lb/tq. Talked to someone at my local corvette shop who just installed headers, added coilover suspension, and has slicks and he beat everyone at the track including Vipers and heavily modded GT2's. I strongly belive that unless this new 997 turbo is very fast, the new Z06 will leave it and almost any other production car under 200k bloodied at the track.

     
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