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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Bankrupt doesn’t mean the company goes away. Most if not all existing car manufacturers have gone bankrupt at some point or the other.

    That said, of course this does not resonate well with the costumers, but where is the competition anyway? Still 2-5 years behind... Plus the EV space should grow, right now it is only 2% of the market, that leaves a lot of room for all the brands to flourish. Just look at first hand experiences here, once you have tasted EV and if it fits in your transportation needs, there is no going back.

    In the downside scenario where the EV falls below the outstanding debt obligations, the ordinary equity is wiped out and debt holders are forced to take a write-down...

    So who would you expect to provide funding to keep the Tesla supercharger network running and pay suppliers for raw materials and services to maintain the business as a going concern?

    If you are just selling the brand and technology, that is not selling the business as a going concern. Going through a financial restructuring is also likely to put a dent (no pun intended) in the brand value.

    In that scenario, customer deposits may also be at risk in the waterfall of recoveries as unsecured creditors.

    Would the ownership experience for existing customers be impacted if there was no supercharger network, no software updates, no service centres, no app functionality, etc? Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    If they cannot get out of chapter 11, and that’s a big if because it would mean their car sales would have to collapse from the current levels, someone will scoop the whole thing way before it goes away. Google, Apple, Amazon, FCA, you name it... It is just too valuable.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Sometimes, not 100% sure if Tesla has much intrinsic value... Maybe the brand as a sub-brand of another OEM. But the rest?


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla trading wider in the secondary bond markets, with TSLA 5.3% notes due 2025 indicated below 83% of par to yield almost 9 per cent... Smiley

    1558385559240image.png

    ...debt investors may view this as flagging the potential risk of credit rating downgrade? Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Bankrupt doesn’t mean the company goes away. Most if not all existing car manufacturers have gone bankrupt at some point or the other.

    That said, of course this does not resonate well with the costumers, but where is the competition anyway? Still 2-5 years behind... Plus the EV space should grow, right now it is only 2% of the market, that leaves a lot of room for all the brands to flourish. Just look at first hand experiences here, once you have tasted EV and if it fits in your transportation needs, there is no going back.

    I'm well aware of that. However, when you consider that Musk invariably puffs his company as a shining star of the future, telling his employees that cutting cost to the point that even a penny expenditure must be approved by him, that has to raise concerns not only for prospective buyers but present owners. He doesn't have the cash to meet obligations including possibly warranty work or delay them.Smiley

    It's a serious problem. EV cars are not a necessity and buyers can wait for more established companies to market EV cars.


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    Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    This might be true, but he has done exactly the same in the recent past, just to spend more somewhere else. His management style is very disconcerting, Tesla should be private because it is run as such anyway.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla Gigafactory 3 building in Shanghai looks almost complete

    https://apple.news/AbhzJeiiLRZiDDSWtO-mphg

    More signs of a company going under soon and having a hard time finding capital to fund their car building operations angrywink

     

     

    Enron was sponsoring this and that and building this and that too just before they collapse.

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla cuts base price of new Model S and Model X vehicles

    https://apple.news/AIWeIsB64Tfu4QsaEIAXQVQ

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Personally, I have doubts if a 3% price reduction will change much.

    Just read that Morgan Stanley sees a downside stock price of US$ 10 Smiley


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    “Bear case” MS is calling for $10, down from $97 previously. But note their current price target is $230. As written here many times, this year is about demand. The theme of the quarter is Tesla has grown too fast relative to demand, hence the cost cuts, no one with a sane mind will deny that. They need to accelerate the Model Y release. I still maintain they made a mistake by releasing the Model 3 first. No one wants sedans anymore.

    Meanwhile some reports are flying around that Apple tried and failed to buy Tesla at $240 a share in 2013... I have never seen such a dichotomy of opinions on a stock.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    And Apple now can wait till Tesla go down even more and buy it out at $120.

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Or even lower. I can see the stock going down to $70 or so if Q2 demand does not rebound angel Around there the company will be worth $12bio or so, below that someone will scoop it for sure.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    I don't see Tesla going lower than $100 for an extended period of time, if it breach $100, it will go al the way to $0.

     


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla's off take agreements for lithium by themselves are probably worth in the high tens of millions. There is a lot of break-up value, the stock would never get to zero. 


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    Past-President, Porsche Club of America - Upper Canada Region


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Reprint in local paper of a LA Times piece.

    These headlines in the newspapers will not encourage sales..

    code-red-elon-musk-and-tesla-in-survival-mode-as-dark-financial-clouds-circle-20190522-p51puh.html


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Just dropped my Lotus off for a pre track day service.

    Met the new Lotus workshop manager. He has come from the local Tesla service centre. He said he left as there was too much uncertainty re ongoing employment. 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Mithras:

    Tesla's off take agreements for lithium by themselves are probably worth in the high tens of millions. There is a lot of break-up value, the stock would never get to zero. 

    One question that remains is what assets of the Company are used for collateral?  Also, are the lithium agreements solely with Tesla or including Panasonic?  Most don’t realize that Panasonic has basically taken over Gigafactory 2 in Buffalo, New York.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Until they ramp up solar tiles production, yes. But that’s not a “secret”, there’s several article about it...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Until they ramp up solar tiles production, yes. But that’s not a “secret”, there’s several article about it...

    The solar tiles are DOA.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla making cars was DOA also. Look where they are now with a market cap close to the largest US auto manufacturers angry

    Would you care to elaborate why? Because I think you are completely wrong. It might stay a niche market, but DOA mail

    I would not put solar panels on my home because they are ugly, actually on one one my home they are not even allowed by the HOA for aesthetic reason angry But solar tiles? Totally even if they cost more. Just on resale having a solar roof tile would by a whoa factor smiley Hopefully next summer or the one after I will be able to pull the trigger.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Tesla's Navigate on Autopilot Requires Significant Driver Intervention

    https://apple.news/A3Oar-gcsQ9K2kI6vapmLLw

    Ultimately, automatic lane changes may be an interesting feature for Tesla enthusiasts, but the feature doesn’t provide any meaningful assistance to drivers... “This isn’t a convenience at all,” says CR’s Fisher. “Monitoring the system is much harder than just changing lanes yourself. Using the system is like monitoring a kid behind the wheel for the very first time. As any parent knows, it’s far more convenient and less stressful to simply drive yourself.”

    My first hand month long experience completely contradicts this statement. Not only changing lanes works 9 out of 10 times, but monitoring is much easier than doing everything yourself, who are they kidding? You need to pay attention regardless, this is not a level 4 system, and you can only go so long before squeezing the wheel (20 seconds at speed). They cannot see the forest behind the tree, yes auto lane change is not perfect, but on top of a pretty good level 2 system, it is great.

    More importantly, the whole system has significantly reduced the stress level of long daily commutes with some highway portion, beyond what the older best adaptative cruise controls could do, and being able to completely let go for a couple of minutes at a time in the heaviest stop and go traffic, where real danger is inexistant (<10mph) is a revelation.

     

     


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    Tesla making cars was DOA also. Look where they are now with a market cap close to the largest US auto manufacturers angry

    Would you care to elaborate why? Because I think you are completely wrong. It might stay a niche market, but DOA mail

    I would not put solar panels on my home because they are ugly, actually on one one my home they are not even allowed by the HOA for aesthetic reason angry But solar tiles? Totally even if they cost more. Just on resale having a solar roof tile would by a whoa factor smiley Hopefully next summer or the one after I will be able to pull the trigger.

    Let’s start with something very simple.  What is the installed customer base for Tesla solar roof tiles?  That answer is zero.  The company always states the product is just six months away and it has allowed for competitors to gain an early lead.  Without any product it is DOA. 


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    This is not even worth the time of writing an answer...


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    This is not even worth the time of writing an answer...

    Here.  Let me answer that for you since it seems to insult your intelligence. From an October 24, 2018 Ars Technica article: https://arstechnica.com/science/2018/10/five-solar-roof-shingles-that-arent-from-tesla/  

    Five solar roof shingles that aren’t from Tesla

    Two are still just prototypes, which means they're probably as far along as Tesla.

    Megan Geuss -  10/24/2018, 6:30 AM

    hang your shingle —

    view of solar shingles and a beach

    Enlarge

    CertainTeed

    In November 2016, Tesla CEO Elon Musk gathered a collection of investors, fans, and journalists at the Universal Studios backlot in Los Angeles, California, and revealed his vision of a "solar roof"—that is, tiles with solar cells integrated into them so that they look just like regular roofing tiles, except they produce power.

    At the time, SolarCity and Tesla officials said that solar roof installation would begin in summer 2017. Initially, Tesla employees were the only customers, until Tesla reportedly started installing solar roofs for reservation holders in January. Eventually, that seemed to stall, too. Reports indicated that, as of May 31, only 12 solar roof systems had been installed, all in Northern California. In an August shareholder call, Musk said that solar roof installations were finally ramping up, with "several hundred" solar roofs being installed. The company later contacted Ars to clarify that this number included homes that were scheduled for installation, not homes that were actively having a solar roof installed.

    Tesla has said that it's taking time to verify the safety of these solar roofs to make sure they'll work for decades rather than a dozen years. In the company's Q2 shareholder letter, Tesla wrote, "We are steadily ramping Solar Roof production in Buffalo and are also continuing to iterate on the product design and production process, learning from our early factory production and field installations. We have deployed Solar Roof on additional homes in Q2 and are gaining valuable feedback from each new installation." The letter added that Tesla plans to ramp up more toward the end of 2018, so if you're on the reservation list, you might get lucky soon.

    But if you're not on the reservation list, you might want to know how you can get a solar roof without waiting on Tesla. The car company didn't invent solar tiles—they existed as rare specialty products produced by a couple of lesser-known solar companies. In the years since, some of those companies have stopped producing or talking about solar tiles, while others have stepped into the game. So, as of October 2018, here are five solar shingle makers you might bet on to replace your old asphalt roof faster than Tesla can.

    Certainteed's Apollo II

    CertainTeed is an old company with a new name; it was originally (in 1904) General Roofing Manufacturing Company. Now, CertainTeed is a subsidiary of building product company Saint-Gobain, and it specializes not just in roofing but in "siding, fence, decking, railing, trim, insulation, gypsum, and ceilings," according to the company website.

    One advantage that CertainTeed has on its competitors is that its Apollo II solar shingles have been available for about five years now, and it's possible to buy said shingles through an installer. Each shingle or tile contains "14 high-efficiency monocrystalline silicon solar cells" that "provide a power rating of 60 watts per solar shingle," CertainTeed says.

    In an email to Ars, Chris Fisher, manager of Solar Product Development & Marketing for CertainTeed, said installation costs depend on the installer. (EnergySage says that, according to solar installation data, the cost is approximately $4.90/Watt, compared to $3.14/Watt for an average rack-mounted system and $6.40 for an estimated Tesla installation).

    Fisher said that his company's solar shingles are four- to seven-percent less efficient than traditional rack-mounted solar panels because without air circulation under the shingles, the solar cells have to be able to work at higher temperatures (this is common to most solar shingles).

    Luma Solar

    Luma Solar has also been installing solar roofs for years, and it has roofs in more than 20 US states as well as a few in Canada and the Caribbean, according to the company's chief advisor Marty Aquino.

    Aquino said that the price of Luma's solar roof varies by the complexity of the system. If a customer just wants a portion of their roof solarized, then it costs about $4.50 per Watt, although an "edge-to-edge" custom solar system can run up to $38 per square foot. Custom roofs take into account the customer's future energy use, their roof's sun exposure, and the customer's overall budget.

    Luma also advertises a higher efficiency rate for its solar shingles. The company says that because its patented shingle design allows for airflow underneath the shingle, its system has a 21-percent solar-to-electricity conversion efficiency, which is high even for rack-mounted panels. Aquino added that, "because of the smaller shingle profile, our Solar Shingles will generally 'turn on' earlier in the day (at about one-half to almost one-third the power needed as compared with conventional solar panels at an average of 18 to 24 volts per panel to 'turn on')."

    Luma generally seeks local installers to put in an installation, but it's capable of doing an installation itself, as well.

    Suntegra

    SunTegra didn't return our request for comment, and the last press release it posted on its website is dated November 2017, so we worried that SunTegra may have gone out of business. However, a solar installation company called Sunrise Solar Solutions in New York has been installing SunTegra solar shingles since June 2018.

    In a phone conversation with Ars, Sunrise Solar COO Rand Manasse confirmed that his company just recently started installing SunTegra solar shingles. Manasse couldn't confirm a price per square foot, because he said it depended on the project. But the COO added that installing SunTegra's solar shingles generally makes economic sense for people who both need a new roof and want solar panels.

    In its recent press release, Sunrise Solar stated that it had already installed 55, 105-watt SunTegra shingles on a home in Connecticut one year ago, presumably as a pilot project.

    SunTegra's website says its solar shingles are lightweight and use 50-percent less wiring than rack-mounted solar panels.

    RGS' Powerhouse 3.0

    Powerhouse solar shingles were developed by The Dow Chemical Company, which installed early versions of the shingles on approximately 1,000 houses starting in 2011. RGS Energy came on the scene later, becoming the exclusive manufacturer of Powerhouse shingles as well as the warranty servicer for existing homes with the shingles.

    Currently, the company isn't offering any older shingles for purchase because it's ramping up to start selling Powerhouse 3.0 shingles to local roofers. (Ultimately, its customers will be homebuilders and roofers; homeowners will have to buy through one of these.) Justin Chinn, RGS' director of sales and marketing, wrote that as of the end of September, the company had secured $111 million in written reservations from local roofers. The company is still in the process of certifying its shingles for roof installation, and it expects reservations to increase after all necessary certifications have been acquired.

    Like the Apollo shingles, the Powerhouse shingles are literally the roof (they're not pasted flush against asphalt shingles below), and RGS expects that a Powerhouse-shingle-plus-asphalt-roof system will run $4.15 per square foot, including installation.

    Powerhouse says its 60-Watt shingles will have an energy conversion efficiency factor of 17.1 percent, which is on par with many rack-mounted solar panels today.

    Sunflare

    Sunflare's solar shingles are still in the concept stage. The company released images of its concept in September, looking for "feedback from roofers and residential solar installers," according to Elizabeth Sanderson, Sunflare's chief marketing officer.

    Sanderson told Ars that the company expects its solar shingles to be ready in 18 to 24 months, and no cost-per-square-foot had been determined yet. Like Tesla's system, Sunflare's shingles will be a mix of active and inactive tiles. Sanderson told Ars that it hopes to obtain certification in the US first, then in Europe and Australia.

    Efficiency testing has not yet been done, so Sunflare said it couldn't share any efficiency details at this time.

    Megan Geuss Megan is a staff editor at Ars Technica. She writes breaking news and has a background in fact-checking and research.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    These are all ugly and yield no advantage over solar panels, I would never install any of these on my house... but thank you for the informative post confirming that I should wait to evaluate what Tesla has to offer when they will have a product to sell.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    SciFrog:

    These are all ugly and yield no advantage over solar panels, I would never install any of these on my house... but thank you for the informative post confirming that I should wait to evaluate what Tesla has to offer when they will have a product to sell.

    You will have a very long wait.  


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    You know, those Tesla Solar Tiles? 

    They are the biggest vapour ware ever. 

    Tesla is having problem making them, not to mentioned they don't have the money to even make them viable.

    Elon is stuck, if they abandoned it, then the whole purchase of Sola City is a scam.

    https://seekingalpha.com/article/4265411-tesla-afford-abandon-solar-roof-fantasy


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    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Whoopsy:

    You know, those Tesla Solar Tiles? 

    They are the biggest vapour ware ever. 

    Tesla is having problem making them, not to mentioned they don't have the money to even make them viable.

    Elon is stuck, if they abandoned it, then the whole purchase of Sola City is a scam.

    https://seekingalpha.com/article/4265411-tesla-afford-abandon-solar-roof-fantasy

    Don't tell SciFrog that!  He has installer waiting to install the Tesla Solar Tiles to his home.  There are several relevant Tesla stories today that are conveniently being neglected by the Tesla faithful.  First, Consumer Reports issued a report that Autopilot "raises serious safety concerns."  https://www.cnbc.com/2019/05/22/consumer-reports-says-teslas-autopilot-raises-serious-safety-concerns.html  

    This news is followed by several analysts downgrading the equity price range based on serious company deficiencies including a weak board.  This is virtually the same board that approved the Solar City deal that saved Musk's family's investment as well as saddled Tesla with unnecessary debt.  Nothing has worked with the Solar City acquisition.  

    One month ago TSLA was trading in the $264 range versus the current price of $196.00.  Over the past fifty-two weeks, the company traded at nearly $390 per share and has declined almost 50%.  Most CEOs would have lost their job by this time but Musk as consolidated control over the same time period. 

    Apple is not this company's savior.


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    From Consumer Reports today.

     

    Tesla's Navigate on Autopilot Requires Significant Driver Intervention

    CR finds that latest version of Tesla's automatic lane-changing feature is far less competent than a human driver

    Tesla Model 3 with Navigate on Autopilot

    Tesla recently updated its Autopilot software to allow certain cars to automatically change lanes. The automaker says it’s an attempt to make driving “more seamless.” But Consumer Reports observed the opposite in its own tests of the feature, finding that it doesn’t work very well and could create potential safety risks for drivers.

    Tesla added the update to its Navigate on Autopilot feature last month as part of a promised upgrade to its package of driver assist features. To use it, a driver must first turn it on, essentially giving the car permission to make its own lane changes. A driver can cancel an automated lane change that’s in progress at any time by using the turn-signal stalk, braking, or holding the steering wheel in place.

    In practice, we found that Navigate on Autopilot lagged far behind a human driver’s skill set: The feature cut off cars without leaving enough space and even passed other cars in ways that violate state laws, according to several law enforcement representatives CR interviewed for this report. As a result, the driver often had to prevent the system from making poor decisions.

    “The system’s role should be to help the driver, but the way this technology is deployed, it’s the other way around,” says Jake Fisher, Consumer Reports’ senior director of auto testing. “It’s incredibly nearsighted. It doesn’t appear to react to brake lights or turn signals, it can’t anticipate what other drivers will do, and as a result, you constantly have to be one step ahead of it.”

    Despite Tesla’s promises that it will have full self-driving technology by the end of next year, our experience with Navigate on Autopilot suggests it will take longer. In addition, experts tell CR that the automatic lane-change feature demonstrates the technological limits of Tesla’s current hardware.

    Choosing It, Insuring It, Driving It

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    What Tesla Claims

    Tesla released the original version of the Navigate on Autopilot feature late last year. It added functions to the Autopilot partially automated driving system, which keeps the car centered in a lane and controls its speed, maintaining a set distance from vehicles in front. CR has previously expressed safety concerns about Autopilot.

    Autopilot has been engaged during at least three fatal crashes in the U.S., according to the National Transportation Safety Board. The latest fatal crash occurred in March, when the driver of a Tesla Model 3 was killed after the vehicle struck the side of a semitrailer in Florida. The driver turned Autopilot on 10 seconds before the collision, according to the NTSB’s preliminary findings released last week.

    More on Semi-Autonomous Technology

    In the first version of Navigate on Autopilot, Tesla said the software could guide a car through highway interchanges and exits and that it could make a lane change if the driver confirmed it by using the turn signal or accepting an onscreen prompt. When CR first tested this version of the Navigate feature in November, we found that it lagged behind a human driver’s abilities in more complex driving scenarios despite Tesla’s claim that it would make driving “more relaxing, enjoyable and fun.”

    On April 3, Tesla announced an updated version of Navigate on Autopilot that, according to the automaker, could automatically make lane changes on certain roads. This latest version gives drivers the option to hand over control for lane changes to the car’s computers. It’s available as a software update for Tesla owners who purchased Enhanced Autopilot or Full Self-Driving Capability, which, despite the name, does not make the vehicle a self-driving car.

    If drivers turn it on, the car will automatically execute lane changes when Navigate on Autopilot is active, and it will continue to do so until drivers change the setting or turn off Autopilot. It works as long as Tesla’s Autopilot partial automation system is active and drivers have set a navigation destination. To turn it off, a driver will have to go into a menu on the vehicle’s touch screen and re-enable lane-change confirmation.

    The first time a driver disables lane-change confirmation, a warning message pops up that reads, in part, “This does not make your vehicle autonomous.” However, this pop-up does not appear again when the system is in use.

    A Tesla spokesperson told CR, “Navigate on Autopilot is based on map data, fleet data, and data from the vehicle’s sensors. However, it is the driver’s responsibility to remain in control of the car at all times, including safely executing lane changes.” 

    What We Saw

    In early May, our Model 3 received a software update that allowed Navigate on Autopilot to make automatic lane changes without requiring driver confirmation. We enabled the feature and drove on several highways across Connecticut. In the process, multiple testers reported that the Tesla often changed lanes in ways that a safe human driver would not—cutting too closely in front of other cars, and passing on the right.

    Tesla Model 3 Navigate with Autopilot

    Navigate on Autopilot ready to pass on the left. 

    One area of particular concern is Tesla’s claims that the vehicle’s three rearward-facing cameras can detect fast-approaching objects from the rear better than the average driver can. Our testers found the opposite to be true in practice.

    “The system has trouble responding to vehicles that approach quickly from behind,” Fisher says. “Because of this, the system will often cut off a vehicle that is going a much faster speed since it doesn’t seem to sense the oncoming car until it’s relatively close.”

    Fisher says merging into traffic is another problem. “It is reluctant to merge in heavy traffic, but when it does, it often immediately applies the brakes to create space behind the follow car—this can be a rude surprise to the vehicle you cut off.”

    Our testers often canceled a pass that had been initiated by Autopilot—usually by applying steering force to move the car back into the travel lane—when they felt that the maneuver would be unsafe.

    Ultimately, even in light traffic, our testers found that the system’s lack of situational awareness made driving less pleasant.

    “In essence, the system does the easy stuff, but the human needs to intervene when things get more complicated,” Fisher says.

    When asked about the system’s performance, a Tesla spokesperson pointed us to a company blog post from April 3. “Through our internal testing and Early Access Program, more than half a million miles have already been driven with the lane change confirmation turned off,” the post said. “Our team consistently reviews data from instances when drivers took over while the feature has been in use, and has found that when used properly both versions of Navigate on Autopilot offer comparable levels of safety. We’ve also heard overwhelmingly from drivers in our Early Access Program that they like using the feature for road trips and during their daily commutes, and we’re excited to release the option to the rest of the Tesla family.”

    Tech and Legal Concerns

    Several CR testers observed Navigate on Autopilot initiate a pass on the right on a two-lane divided highway. We checked with a law enforcement official who confirmed this is considered an “improper pass” in Connecticut and could result in a ticket.

    Navigate on Autopilot also failed to return to the right-hand travel lane after making a pass, which also could result in a driving infraction, the official confirmed. A Tesla spokesperson told CR that “it is the driver’s responsibility to remain in control of the car at all times, including safely executing lane changes.”

    Tesla Model 3 with Navigate on Autopilot ready to pass on the right.

    A Tesla Model 3 with Navigate on Autopilot ready to pass on the right. 

    Dorothy Glancy, a law professor at Santa Clara University School of Law in California who focuses on transportation and automation, told CR that making sure that automation is programmed to obey traffic laws is one of the many legal concerns that will crop up as vehicle automation increases.

    “One of the issues we lawyers are looking at is the obligation of autonomous vehicles to obey all traffic laws where the vehicle is being used,” she said. “That can get tricky when there are variations from area to area, even within a state—for example, municipal speed limits.”

    Glancy said that Navigate on Autopilot is unique because it allows drivers to change one setting a single time to enable automatic lane changes for every trip thereafter.

    “There are a whole bunch of these lane keeping assistance-derived features, but this one is different because you commit to it when you start either the car or Autopilot,” she said.

    Tesla Road Tests

    That puts Navigate on Autopilot one step closer to the functionality of self-driving car prototypes being tested on public roads. The difference, Glancy said, is that self-driving car testing sometimes is regulated at the state level, while the safety of the Navigate on Autopilot system is not.

    Shiv Patel, an automotive analyst at market research firm ABI Research, told CR that although he believes Tesla is ahead of other automakers when it comes to automated driving, the automaker’s current hardware may be working at capacity.

    “I would say that Navigate on Autopilot would be pushing the upper limits of what could be achieved with the current computer hardware in the vehicle,” he said.

    Additional features—which Tesla CEO Elon Musk has said would be available by 2020—would require new hardware, such as the new self-driving chip that Musk announced in April.

    “The current hardware does not have the computing power required to support full self-driving features,” Patel said.

    Musk said that owners who purchased the Full Self-Driving Capability option would get the new chip as part of a no-cost hardware upgrade.

    The Verdict

    David Friedman, vice president of advocacy at Consumer Reports, says that as it currently exists, the automatic lane-change function raises serious safety concerns.

    “Tesla is showing what not to do on the path toward self-driving cars: release increasingly automated driving systems that aren’t vetted properly,” he says. “Before selling these systems, automakers should be required to give the public validated evidence of that system’s safety—backed by rigorous simulations, track testing, and the use of safety drivers in real-world conditions.” 

    Ultimately, automatic lane changes may be an interesting feature for Tesla enthusiasts, but the feature doesn’t provide any meaningful assistance to drivers—and it certainly doesn’t make Tesla vehicles “self-driving” by any means.

    “This isn’t a convenience at all,” says CR’s Fisher. “Monitoring the system is much harder than just changing lanes yourself. Using the system is like monitoring a kid behind the wheel for the very first time. As any parent knows, it’s far more convenient and less stressful to simply drive yourself.”

    Tesla Model 3 on highway, from rear


    Re: Tesla Roadster

    Indeed the solar business is pretty disappointing. The economics just do not work to install panels and I would not consider installing them, they are ugly on top of dubious savings, but the tiles are different because at least they look good, they are a luxury item and as most luxury items, price is not as relevant. Where is the business going? I have no idea but California just mandated solar systems on new constructions...

    This autopilot article is BS, they want to blame the system for something it is not (yet). But it sells a lot of ads, so they go for it. For example, if you use the autopilot on secondary roads you will get killed at some point. It is not ready to be used as a level 4, even on the highway. But as a level 2 (ie supervised) it works very well overall.

    Tesla stock could trade $100 or $500, it is irrelevant to me as long as they can attract new cash if they need to. The lower the price, the most likely they will attract investors. The company is going nowhere, it is just too valuable, but Musk role is a different story.

    About the author of this “non biased” article:

    Disclosure: I am/we are short TSLA. I wrote this article myself, and it expresses my own opinions. I am not receiving compensation for it (other than from Seeking Alpha). I have no business relationship with any company whose stock is mentioned in this article.

    Disclosure about me: if you think I am biased you are wrong. I will tell you ALL the GOOD things and ALL the BAD things as an owner and daily user. I have written about panel gaps, rattles, autopilot failures, handling short comings in very hard turns, range anxiety and real range numbers (ie my 220 10-90 real range vs the EPA 295 miles). If I wanted I could have not disclosed any of it and you would not know about it. If I was convinced TSLA stock was a sure bet I would find a way to profit from it (even if I am not allowed to own it directly). But I am actually writing I would not be surprised if the stock goes much lower in the short-medium term.

    The fact that you cannot comprehend that the Model X has vastly exceeded my expectations as an owner and for my daily uses, as many here has also reported, is just showing YOUR bias. To put it simply, today on the market there is not a better vehicle for my personal use. It is not for everyone, far from there, but the fact that a start up company with a crazy CEO and shaky financial grounds can produce cars that has long standing established manufacturers changing what they have been doing for decades says a lot of what they will not tell you.

    Getting bashed by people here that we don’t even know what car they actually own or use just because they hate a CEO or a company is getting long in the tooth. I am just trying to give real first hand feedback on a car that shows what the future of transportation will be for the masses Smiley


     
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