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    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Well with 3 hours to go, we're just 3 seconds behind the leader of the GT Am class - not a bad showing and by far the most exciting race within the race!


    --


    Porsche Carrera GTS (2012); Porsche Cayenne Diesel (2012)


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Yes - we've taken the lead!


    --


    Porsche Carrera GTS (2012); Porsche Cayenne Diesel (2012)


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    It's been going back and forth. As long as IMSA don't allow Anthony Pons  back in the car, they should be able to hold off Lamy in the Corvette for the last stint.(in theory)133993153861535.gif


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    What on earth is IMSA thinking!? weeping.gif


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Driver choice putting it all at risk now...


    --


    Porsche Carrera GTS (2012); Porsche Cayenne Diesel (2012)


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Does anybody else think the RSRs are very unfairly regulated? When the Corvette was in the garage, it looked like the body came off in 3 pieces! And it many other racing series, the Porsches are penalized with weights and sand bags in the boot.

    The RSRs used to be so competitive, but not anymore. This reminds me of when the RS Spyder absolutley dominated both the LMP2 class, but also the LMP1 class, beating the diesel Audis in the 2008 ALMS 8 times out of 12. But then, the organizers severely regulated the RS Spyder, causing its demise. Also, the organizers suck at regulating the diesels. But at least in 2014, we'll have some new, interesting regulations. I heard an announcer on the broadcast say that the blind spots caused by the massive wheel arches won't be legal anymore, so we should have some pretty interesting looking cars! 

    And the RS Spyder reminds me, if there is one LMP car that can beat the diesels, it is a Porsche!


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Spyderidol:

    Perazzini_ not a professional

    Thank you very much sir. Smiley


    --
    FERRARI RULES!!!

    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Audi is the Le Mans legend. An accolade that enhances the brand even further.

    Porsche left the field open for them when Herr Wiedeking decided that Motorsport didn't matter so much for a sportscar company mail


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    What a thrilling race!

    Audi wins for the 7th time in 8 years. Utter dominance.

    After several crashes in quick succession, they still kept everyone else off the podium.

    So sad to see Pons taken so easily by Lamy in the GTE AM category.

    I really wish I had been there!


    --


    997.1 C2S
     GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen pickup, BMW Z4 2.5i Roadster Sterling Grey/Red


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Carrara:

    Does anybody else think the RSRs are very unfairly regulated? When the Corvette was in the garage, it looked like the body came off in 3 pieces! And it many other racing series, the Porsches are penalized with weights and sand bags in the boot.

    The RSRs used to be so competitive, but not anymore. This reminds me of when the RS Spyder absolutley dominated both the LMP2 class, but also the LMP1 class, beating the diesel Audis in the 2008 ALMS 8 times out of 12. But then, the organizers severely regulated the RS Spyder, causing its demise. Also, the organizers suck at regulating the diesels. But at least in 2014, we'll have some new, interesting regulations. I heard an announcer on the broadcast say that the blind spots caused by the massive wheel arches won't be legal anymore, so we should have some pretty interesting looking cars! 

    And the RS Spyder reminds me, if there is one LMP car that can beat the diesels, it is a Porsche!

    This is a long story, Lets go back to the start but I will just give a brief and concise explanation

    The Porsche has a 4.0L engine and was racing against the 4.5L in the 458. They were thus allowed to have .3mm bigger restrictors to balance the two engines out (see the table in the rules).

    The problems began to occur when the ACO decided that they wanted other manufacturers to also be competitive. They provided the BMW's with all sorts of waivers, and now they have done the same with Corvette (very large restricitors) and especially Aston (all sorts of breaks and giant restrictors).

    Porsche was so outclassed in the ALMS that they managed to get some breaks approved. (03mm increase in restricotr size and less weight), but these did not apply for Le Mans. (it is not a IMSA event)

    Obviously the BoP that the ACO is applying in the GTE class is more favorable to some than others.

    However, and having said all that, the 997 is out dated. It is simply not competitive against the 458, and because of its "small"engine it gets really affected by air restriction (torque).

    It is now up to Porsche to come up with a product that is competitive. Ferrari did it , So why not Porsche?


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    easy_rider911:


    So sad to see Pons taken so easily by Lamy in the GTE AM category.

    The Porsche had a puncture soon after it had been overtaken. So perhaps it wasn't to be. Still, fighting  for just GTE AM honors is depressing for Porsche!

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    I think that they did not want to give Porsche the win as a way to pay them back for putting Pilet (who usually races for them) with the Lizards and not giving them a works driver. Surely this can be the only explanation. I have never seen anyone loose on purpose before.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Well said Spyderidol. The 997 has been racing for quite some time now, and most other cars either have a bunch of waivers, or are nice and fresh. I hope the 991 can bring the RSR back to the top.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Audi take great pride in their win, and justifiably so. This is how reputations are made.

    http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/100475


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Porsche will return soon and will show who is who;) 

    "To win Le Mans you must overtake Porsche" Martin Brundle.

    Congratulations to Audi, but most of their wins were taken without opposition.


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    kudryavchik:

    Porsche will return soon and will show who is who;) 

    "To win Le Mans you must overtake Porsche" Martin Brundle.

    Congratulations to Audi, but most of their wins were taken without opposition.

    That may have been true for this year, but Audi has done a great job battling other teams in previous years.

    It is getting kind of old though. I was rooting for Audi, but I wish the Toyotas would have stayed in it and gave Audi a major run for their money. This year was boring as it was almost a guarantee Audi was gonna win, while last year was an absolutely excellent race.

    It's a real shame the Audi vs. Peugeot battles seem to be finally over. Definetly the end of a very historic era of racing!


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Carrara:
    kudryavchik:

    Porsche will return soon and will show who is who;) 

    "To win Le Mans you must overtake Porsche" Martin Brundle.

    Congratulations to Audi, but most of their wins were taken without opposition.

    That may have been true for this year, but Audi has done a great job battling other teams in previous years.

    It is getting kind of old though. I was rooting for Audi, but I wish the Toyotas would have stayed in it and gave Audi a major run for their money. This year was boring as it was almost a guarantee Audi was gonna win, while last year was an absolutely excellent race.

    It's a real shame the Audi vs. Peugeot battles seem to be finally over. Definetly the end of a very historic era of racing!

    I don't mean to disparage Audi's accomplishments,but.....due to the ridiculously biased (in favor of diesels) rules, Audi have really had no opposition through the years except for the brief period with Peugeot. Even then, Peugeot was coming back into LMP1 racing and needed a couple of years to catch up.

    The non-diesel years were for Audi a breeze too because there was simply no other significant factory effort to challenge them. They came into the sport when Porsche and BMW were pulling out.

    Yes, they have built a strong reputation (fantastic marketing) and they have also gained valuable experience throughout their time. They are no doubt the team to beat, but they have only been pushed to their limits a few times(Peugeot).

    Hopefully Porsche will be able to give them a real challenge the first year, and beat their pants off the following.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Le Mans 24 H is not a race for the few who know, like for example the NBR 24 Hours. It is a high profile race for everybody. And what Audi have gained in the world market is a reputation for Motorsport success that adds to the image of their excellent products. Moreover, they have shown to the public that they can win with everything, turbo petrol, turbo diesel, hybrid, open top, closed top etc. Even if success came partly due to lack of serious competition, in most things the right timing makes the difference.

    My respect to Audi management and Herr Piech for their recognition that top level Motorsport in its various forms is vital for a premium brand and their uninterrupted adherence to this principle since the Audi Quattro in the 1980s kiss

    I hope that Porsche goes back to this ethic instead of spending their energies on "special" anniversary models, fancy paints and "deviating stitching".


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    100% in agreement.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    porsche will never do it in lmp1, the mom is already doing it, and in the best way possible.

    Sadly there will never be the old LeMans battles between Porsche and Ferrari anymore, ferrari only invest in F1 and porsche in their championships.

    but thanks for having all japanese brands supporting the 24h LeMans....


    --

    993 c2


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Carrara:
    kudryavchik:

    Porsche will return soon and will show who is who;) 

    "To win Le Mans you must overtake Porsche" Martin Brundle.

    Congratulations to Audi, but most of their wins were taken without opposition.

    That may have been true for this year, but Audi has done a great job battling other teams in previous years.

    It is getting kind of old though. I was rooting for Audi, but I wish the Toyotas would have stayed in it and gave Audi a major run for their money. This year was boring as it was almost a guarantee Audi was gonna win, while last year was an absolutely excellent race.

    It's a real shame the Audi vs. Peugeot battles seem to be finally over. Definetly the end of a very historic era of racing!

    Le Mans can't be boring)))...maybe except 2000-2006. 

    The real battling years were in 2008-2011. 2010 and 2011 are pure gem races!

    Yes, it is really a great shame that Peugeot has finished their program, it could be the great Le Mans... 3 factories..ehh. But who knows, they have gained a great experience and there was a rumor that they can return in 2014...they had 2 ways, to continue the current program sacrificing the new car or to stop and develop a new car...only rumors...


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Spyderidol:
    Carrara:
    kudryavchik:

    Porsche will return soon and will show who is who;) 

    "To win Le Mans you must overtake Porsche" Martin Brundle.

    Congratulations to Audi, but most of their wins were taken without opposition.

    That may have been true for this year, but Audi has done a great job battling other teams in previous years.

    It is getting kind of old though. I was rooting for Audi, but I wish the Toyotas would have stayed in it and gave Audi a major run for their money. This year was boring as it was almost a guarantee Audi was gonna win, while last year was an absolutely excellent race.

    It's a real shame the Audi vs. Peugeot battles seem to be finally over. Definetly the end of a very historic era of racing!

    I don't mean to disparage Audi's accomplishments,but.....due to the ridiculously biased (in favor of diesels) rules, Audi have really had no opposition through the years except for the brief period with Peugeot. Even then, Peugeot was coming back into LMP1 racing and needed a couple of years to catch up.

    The non-diesel years were for Audi a breeze too because there was simply no other significant factory effort to challenge them. They came into the sport when Porsche and BMW were pulling out.

    Yes, they have built a strong reputation (fantastic marketing) and they have also gained valuable experience throughout their time. They are no doubt the team to beat, but they have only been pushed to their limits a few times(Peugeot).

    Hopefully Porsche will be able to give them a real challenge the first year, and beat their pants off the following.

    +100500


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    reginos:

    Le Mans 24 H is not a race for the few who know, like for example the NBR 24 Hours. It is a high profile race for everybody. And what Audi have gained in the world market is a reputation for Motorsport success that adds to the image of their excellent products. Moreover, they have shown to the public that they can win with everything, turbo petrol, turbo diesel, hybrid, open top, closed top etc. Even if success came partly due to lack of serious competition, in most things the right timing makes the difference.

    My respect to Audi management and Herr Piech for their recognition that top level Motorsport in its various forms is vital for a premium brand and their uninterrupted adherence to this principle since the Audi Quattro in the 1980s kiss

    I hope that Porsche goes back to this ethic instead of spending their energies on "special" anniversary models, fancy paints and "deviating stitching".


    --

    "Form follows function"

    There was a good phrase from Manfred von Brauhitsch: "No fight no win" I think this words greatly reflects the major amount of audi wins, that were happened before peugeot. I like Audi personally, but it is true. 


    --

    sportcars-history.com


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    xander71:

    porsche will never do it in lmp1, the mom is already doing it, and in the best way possible.

    Sadly there will never be the old LeMans battles between Porsche and Ferrari anymore, ferrari only invest in F1 and porsche in their championships.

    but thanks for having all japanese brands supporting the 24h LeMans....

    Maybe no battles with Ferrari, but I know Porsche will be extremely competitive in LMP1. Any time they've come to the top level of motorsports, they've dominated. Porsche DOES NOT play games when it comes to the top level.

    And there were a couple good Ferrari-Porsche battles in the GT class in the past few years at Le Mans.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Porker, I was at the qualifying session on Thursday, awesome atmosphere isn't it?Smiley

    I think Dr Piech will make it a personal issue to see Porsche at the top of endurance in 2014 again personally, with or without Audi, it will be extremely exciting and I am sure their LMP1 will be fabulous.

    By then, Toyota will be in full swing, strong rumours about Nissan in LMP1 in the paddocks this year too, and who knows, maybe more players, I heard a little bird mentionning the word Alpine.Smiley

    One thing's for sure, new regulations means the P1 will be petrol Hybrid, so the cars will sing and THAT is an awesome news. The Audi is impressive but you can almost hear the tyre roar you stand by the Dunlop Chicane.Smiley

    And until the Toyotas were both out, they were giving a good fight to the Audis.

    IMSA saved Porsche's honour with a podium, they had to put Anthony Pons in the car at the end in order for him to complete the minimum time a driver has to do during the 24 hours (4 hours).

    The GTE pros were rather unlucky but that's the race.

    Awesome win for AF Corse who started at the back of the grid.

     


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    A real shame that IMSA did not manage their driver time allocation at the wheel better. It lsost them 1st place..


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Reginos

    I hope that Porsche goes back to this ethic instead of spending their energies on "special" anniversary models, fancy paints and "deviating stitching". 

    Smiley


    --


    Porsche Carrera GTS (2012); Porsche Cayenne Diesel (2012)


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Futch:

    Porker, I was at the qualifying session on Thursday, awesome atmosphere isn't it?Smiley

    I think Dr Piech will make it a personal issue to see Porsche at the top of endurance in 2014 again personally, with or without Audi, it will be extremely exciting and I am sure their LMP1 will be fabulous.

    By then, Toyota will be in full swing, strong rumours about Nissan in LMP1 in the paddocks this year too, and who knows, maybe more players, I heard a little bird mentionning the word Alpine.Smiley

    One thing's for sure, new regulations means the P1 will be petrol Hybrid, so the cars will sing and THAT is an awesome news. The Audi is impressive but you can almost hear the tyre roar you stand by the Dunlop Chicane.Smiley

    And until the Toyotas were both out, they were giving a good fight to the Audis.

    IMSA saved Porsche's honour with a podium, they had to put Anthony Pons in the car at the end in order for him to complete the minimum time a driver has to do during the 24 hours (4 hours).

    The GTE pros were rather unlucky but that's the race.

    Awesome win for AF Corse who started at the back of the grid.

    Hi Futch!

    Indeed the atmosphere is intoxicating. I only just made it in time for the night qualifying session on Thursday since I had to manage my speed on the autoroutes with the gendarmes lurking.

    The atmosphere on Friday was completely crazy, I now understand why it's called "Mad Friday", the crowd on the streets goes completely wild when you're passing by.

    Regarding the Audi's, I found their cornering speed gobsmacking, especially through the Porsche curves you could easily notice the speed difference with 'lesser' contenders. Smiley

    In short, it was a fantastic experience, I enjoyed the atmosphere around the LM24H as much as I did the race itself.


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Futch:

    Porker, I was at the qualifying session on Thursday, awesome atmosphere isn't it?Smiley

    I think Dr Piech will make it a personal issue to see Porsche at the top of endurance in 2014 again personally, with or without Audi, it will be extremely exciting and I am sure their LMP1 will be fabulous.

    By then, Toyota will be in full swing, strong rumours about Nissan in LMP1 in the paddocks this year too, and who knows, maybe more players, I heard a little bird mentionning the word Alpine.Smiley

    One thing's for sure, new regulations means the P1 will be petrol Hybrid, so the cars will sing and THAT is an awesome news. The Audi is impressive but you can almost hear the tyre roar you stand by the Dunlop Chicane.Smiley

    And until the Toyotas were both out, they were giving a good fight to the Audis.

    IMSA saved Porsche's honour with a podium, they had to put Anthony Pons in the car at the end in order for him to complete the minimum time a driver has to do during the 24 hours (4 hours).

    The GTE pros were rather unlucky but that's the race.

    Awesome win for AF Corse who started at the back of the grid.

     

    Awesome news! Great news about all of the petrol cars coming up too. The diesels sound so boring, and the petrol powered cars have so much spirit and whine!

    Don't the 2014 regulations also allow for diesels though? I'm pretty sure I saw that in the regulation, even though they are very restricted compared to the petrol cars to even it out some more.

    And do you know anything about these "open engine regulations", in which there are pretty much no restrictions regarding capacity, amount of turbos, or cylinders?


    Re: 24Heures Du Mans (16 - 17 June 2012)

    Sorry, I don't know much about the open engine regulations. I think Diesel will be open to LMP2 next year or in 2014, but I know for sure the Porsche P1 will be a petrol hybrid closed car.

    I've read on a couple of occasion that people expect something like 918 RSR. The 918 is a GT, not a prototype.

     

     


     
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