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    C2S versus C4S?

    I'm considering exchanging my Basalt '05 997.1 C2S (with 39,000 miles) for a 2nd generation PDK 997S.

    I've whittled it down to a choice between a 2010 Guards Red 997.2 with PDK (around 2,000 miles) and with a reasonable spec.... 

    See here.... http://www21.porsche.com/all/uk/?chester

    Or a Carrara white 2010 C4S, with PDK, under 5,000 miles and with an even better spec. ( to follow)

    I'm really undecided and would appreciate your advice.

    The alternative is to wait for the 991, but nobody seems very sure when that will arrive?

    I know you guys will help when heart starts to rule over head  Smiley....many thanks....Smiley

     

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

     Id go for the 4S, the sound is amazing !! and the wider stance really makes the car look more sporty and sexy.

    But then again waiting for a 991 does seem like a smarter choice . decisions, decisions...


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    S versions of the 997 are all has the wider stance, but the added traction is going to do wonders for the VERY WET UK weather. The extra safety margin is often over looked.

    I have driven both on a track, the 4S is so much more confident inspiring, it corners like it's on rails, keep begging me to go around faster and faster, the 2S is too twitchy and the rear threatens to step out big time with any speed like old 911s. If I remember correctly I was about 4 sec faster in the 4S than the 2S on a 1:30 track.

    Granted I am not a skilled driver so I can't extract max out of the 2S like the pros.

     


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    In the UK for a daily driver car I'd go for the 4S, especially if you do high speeds.

    Even on dry tarmac I've found that the 4WD is more stable especially on continuous curves at speeds near and above 180km/h.

    But the 2WD feels more nimble and it's good to know that it's less complicated with less things to go wrong.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    I have owened the 997.1 4S and the 997.2 S

    If you like the look of the new 4S ( red stripe) + wider hips  and you do not mind having a car that feels 'safer' ( more stable with a front more planted ) go for the 4S

    If you think the hips are too wide , that you do not like the red tripe,  and /or you realy want a car that feels the more sportier possible, go for the 2S.

    I have driven both all year long, meaning also through our snowy winter. The 4S is realy better in bad conditions ( snow, heavy rain ) no dought about it, but the 2S does it also, you just need to have a lighter right foot ( but you know all that as you have your 2S 997.1 )

    If both are at the same price, the 4S would be the better deal

    Make sure you get or uprade the steering wheel for the paddles. This is a MUST


    --
     

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Whoopsy:

    S versions of the 997 are all has the wider stance,  


    that is not the case actually. Only the C4 models have the wider boady...S is an engine specification only...


    --
    Off enjoying my car...

    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    John - I think you should try both on back-to-back extended test drives to see how they both feel  It's the only way to decide really ...

    Just curious, how come you decided to part with your current car? 


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Go for the white C4S on the site you provided.


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    C4S - love the stripe and PDK


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    If you are referring to the white C4S with anthracite rims that is displayed on your OPC´s website, then it certainly looks more special. I agree that the paddleshift steering wheel is mandatory to negotiate on both cars.

    If it is a financially reasonable step on the way to the 991 then do it...


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    The wheels are not factory painted, I think,  so make sure you bring this up in your negotiation.

    The car looks very nice and all the right  options are there. The white colour will brighten up the often dull Cheshire landscape.

    Sacrifice multi-function steering wheel and negotiate a paddle wheel.

    The red car doesn't have a LSD, a must in my opinion. I would drop it from my wish list if only for that reason.


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

     Don't wish to be negative, but if this car is likely to be a bridging car until 991 then i would not bother. Apart from the PDK and the updated PCM you will not find much more difference over what you currently have. Also be prepared for a BIG depreciation hit as they are still new cars (I have direct experience of this having getting out of my Gen2 C2S into the current GT3) Looking at the Red car you provide the link to, i can promise you that the OPC will have bought this car in for about £7k to £10k less.

    Without wishing to offend others on this forum, I can honestly say i never really gelled with my Gen2 Carrera. I found it to be a bit numb and without soul compared to the first Gen cars. Mine did not have PDK though, but it did have the Sports suspension. 

    If it was my money, i would either wait, or look at buying a slightly older turbo / GT3 (if it fits your lifestyle)? 

    If you do have a GEN2 PDK itch to scratch, then i would push the OPC for a 24 hour test drive, as you can't get a feel for a car in 20 minutes. 


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Good advice cdixon - I agree with every word 

    As a side issue, I wonder whether the 991 (that so many are waiting for) will feel even softer than the 997  I think it will be.

    Somehow, I think the next car for me to get may be a 991 GT3 

    --

    RT Moderator
    - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

     Personally I would definatelly wait for the 991 (no more that 2 years max), but then again one of the main reasons for the MK-II is the PDK and I'm  amanual guy so...


    --


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    easy_rider911:

    As a side issue, I wonder whether the 991 (that so many are waiting for) will feel even softer than the 997  I think it will be.


    I'n not that convinced yet, I remember that my 996-with the M30 sport suspensions was not as sporty as my current 997 with the P17 sport suspensions Smiley
     

    Somehow, I think the next car for me to get may be a 991 GT3 

     

     Now that would be my choice (for a daily driver car) regardless of how the 991 carrera turns out to beSmiley, if only it would have rear seats for kids, a must for me Smiley and now that it comes with a front lift mechanism for parkings, ramps, etc, and PSM for daily commuting and recreational street use, the rear seats is the only must have condition left for me on the GT3.

    though I understand the Porsche may not be too motivated to offer that option since most people won't use a GT3 for daily driving...


    --


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Many thanks guys for your inputs - your opinions and advice are much appreciated...

    @ Easy - I was offered a 24 hour test-drive in a C2S PDK and was blown away with the improvements over my 997.1, particularly PDK and the new PCM.  But it wasn't just that...the car felt so much more planted with genuinely much faster acceleration.  I had no interest in buying the 'demo' as it had over 13K miles on it and lacked some of my 'must have' options.  When I returned the car to the OPC I noticed the red and the white cars in the showroom.  I test drove the red one then and will be test driving the white one tomorrow.

    @ Joe - the white one is the one that is now featured on the same site.

    @ Gnil - I  intend to make retro-fitting of paddles a condition of the sale...if the deal goes through.

    @ Ferdie - that's how I saw it... an interim step to a 991.  It looks as though the UK won't be getting it until late next year at the earliest.

    @ Reginos - thanks for the observation, but what makes you think that the wheels on the white car are not factory painted?  Would definitely be a negotiating factor if true.

    @ cdixon - a turbo or GT3, as a daily driver, would almost certainly cost me my licence.  I've had three narrow escapes already which required the assistance of Nick Freeman to overcome.  On the price issue - I managed to get an offer of £8K off the asking price for the red one plus an increased trade-in price for mine....still negotiating on the white one.

    @ Carlos - I have also been a manual lover so far, but have sustained a left knee injury which makes PDK a very viable alternative.

    Once again... I'm very grateful to you all for taking the time to give me so much help and food for thought...


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    This is the 2010 Carrara White C4S I'll be testing tomorrow...

    • 19 inch SportDesign wheel
    • 7-speed double clutch transmission (Porsche Doppelkupplung - PDK)
    • BOSE Surround Sound System
    • Cruise control
    • Electric slide/tilt sunroof
    • Extended navigation module for PCM 3.0
    • Floor mats
    • Heated seats
    • Instrument dials in Carrara White
    • Outer door-sill guards in stainless steel, illuminated
    ;
    • ParkAssist (parking aid rear)
    • Porsche crest embossed on head restraints
    • Preparation for illuminated door sill guards
    • Sport Chrono Package Plus
    • Sports exhaust system
    • Sports seats
    • Telephone module
    • Three-spoke multi-function steering wheel
    • Universal audio interface
    • Windscreen with grey top tint

    WhiteC4S 1.jpg

    WhiteC4S 2.jpg

    WhiteC4S 3.jpg

    WhiteC4S 4.jpg

    WhiteC4S 5.jpg

    Wish me luck....

     


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    John H:

    @ Carlos - I have also been a manual lover so far, but have sustained a left knee injury which makes PDK a very viable alternative.

     

     In that case then the jump from the MK-I to the MK-II would be more worthwhile since  to me the PDK is its star feature vs the MK-I's Tip, and if you have a manual now and a knee injury, even more the reason  Smiley


    --


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    easy_rider911:



    As a side issue, I wonder whether the 991 (that so many are waiting for) will feel even softer than the 997  I think it will be.

    This is why 993s are still holding their value.Smiley

     


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    John H:

    WhiteC4S 3.jpg

     

    Its a very beautiful combo! especially in combination with the C4S' rear red strip which fits the white very nicely, very elegant and not the typical combo everybody is used to seeing  Smiley


    --


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    It is a beautiful car. Hope your test drive goes well !


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    John H:

    @ Reginos - thanks for the observation, but what makes you think that the wheels on the white car are not factory painted?  Would definitely be a negotiating factor if true.


    Factory painted wheels on the option list don't come in this colour. They are either black or body colour with the silver ring on the outer edge perimeter..

    So unless they are totally special order from the Exclusive department and outside normal options, they are painted after-market. 


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Carlos from Spain:
    easy_rider911:

    As a side issue, I wonder whether the 991 (that so many are waiting for) will feel even softer than the 997  I think it will be.


    I'n not that convinced yet, I remember that my 996-with the M30 sport suspensions was not as sporty as my current 997 with the P17 sport suspensions Smiley
     

    Somehow, I think the next car for me to get may be a 991 GT3 

     

     Now that would be my choice (for a daily driver car) regardless of how the 991 carrera turns out to beSmiley, if only it would have rear seats for kids, a must for me Smiley and now that it comes with a front lift mechanism for parkings, ramps, etc, and PSM for daily commuting and recreational street use, the rear seats is the only must have condition left for me on the GT3.

    though I understand the Porsche may not be too motivated to offer that option since most people won't use a GT3 for daily driving...


    --


    It will be very hard for me to deceide between the 991 CS and the 991 GT3..........


    --

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Carlos from Spain:
    John H:

    @ Carlos - I have also been a manual lover so far, but have sustained a left knee injury which makes PDK a very viable alternative.

     

     In that case then the jump from the MK-I to the MK-II would be more worthwhile since  to me the PDK is its star feature vs the MK-I's Tip, and if you have a manual now and a knee injury, even more the reason  Smiley


    People are most of the time referring to the PDK as the thing to consider between the 997.1 and 997.2.

    To me the engine improvement and the better front aesthetics are 50% of the pleasure in the 997.2 . The car is MUCH faster then the 997.1 ( at least with the PDK ) and that is a real joy and I can appreciate everyday....


    --
     

     997.2 C2S, PDK, -20mm


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

     The white with the red stripe looks amazing, also the wheels plaz on the sporty stance and appearence of the C4S, Its not a typical combo but its all the more special for it. good luck on the drive.


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Gnil:
    Carlos from Spain:
    John H:

    @ Carlos - I have also been a manual lover so far, but have sustained a left knee injury which makes PDK a very viable alternative.

     

     In that case then the jump from the MK-I to the MK-II would be more worthwhile since  to me the PDK is its star feature vs the MK-I's Tip, and if you have a manual now and a knee injury, even more the reason  Smiley


    People are most of the time referring to the PDK as the thing to consider between the 997.1 and 997.2.

    To me the engine improvement and the better front aesthetics are 50% of the pleasure in the 997.2 . The car is MUCH faster then the 997.1 ( at least with the PDK ) and that is a real joy and I can appreciate everyday....

     

    Also the front is more controlled on 997.2 with much reduced vertical movement compared to 997.1. I am referring to RWD cars.

     

     


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    That C4s looks absolutely stunning John! As others mentioned, paddles sound like a must. Also, but this is a very personal issue; I hate the red stripe. If possible, I would order an engine lid of a C2s and have it replaced, keeping the original lid just for when the car will be sold.

    Another issue; even if the 991 will be there in augest 2011, will you be buying the very first series? I'd always wait for at least half a year to a year, or maybe even for the mk2, as they always solve little issues on the early models. For example, I find the aesthetics on the 997.2 way better than those on the 997.1 (except for the stripe then ;-) )


    --

    Porsche, seperates LeMans from LeBoys

    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    Well... this is a bit of a let down..!!

    I was due to test the car today at 2pm.  Early this morning I received a call from the OPC telling me that a salesman had sold the car late last evening.

    I hadn't been able to test the car earlier this week as I spent Monday to Thursday in Devon and Cornwall attending a family funeral...

    I think I would have gone for this one, but what the heck... it's not the end of the world, there will more in the pipeline.

    The upside is that following my car's recent service, which included new spark plugs, it is now driving like a dream...much more lively and responsive..

    The sat-nav upgrade is also a major improvement and saved me from a lengthy delay on the M5 at Bridgewater where, due to a massive accident, traffic was static for over 2 hours!  It took me off the motorway, by-passed the problem junctions, and reduced any delay to a minimum.

    I am a bit disappointed - I just hope the buyer didn't see this thread and beat me to it....  


    --

    "Things turn out best for people who make the best of the way things turn out."


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    We say:  "every obstacle is for the good".

    The next one will be even better!


    --

    "Form follows function"


    Re: C2S versus C4S?

    @John H: that's a pity - it seemed like you were really keen on that one  Certainly, the Carrara White one was lovely.

    OPCs nowadays behave little better than estate agents where the practice of 'gazumping' has been coming back  OPCs care little about the relationship they have with customers - they just want to get the money in now - even if that means disappointing a customer who has already scheduled a test drive 

    Sorry to hear about your knee - if it's a temporary issue, I personally wouldn't let it affect my decision on manual vs PDK. However, if it could be permanent (and I sincerely hope it isn't) then PDK could be the right solution for you.

    I wouldn't worry about used car stock. If you aren't in a great hurry and you just keep checking the search engine regularly, something even better should turn up 

    --

    RT Moderator
    - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection

    Rennteam signature photo 2.jpg


     
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