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    OT - RC: A question of history

    Hi RC -

    What is the history of Rennteam.com? I remember back in 2000 and 2001, I used to frequent funcarsonline.com and see your name (I presume anyway) in posts all the time. I recall some kind of conflict and remember that that forum went down hill. Unless I am inventing history (which I may be) I recall that you always posted insightful information from Porsche and once you were gone... Anyway, a couple of years later, I came across rennteam.com and once again your name.

    So if it is something you can share, do you mind telling the story? If for any reason you don't feel comfortable - no problem at all.

    Thanks and kindest regards,

    PTM

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    i too am curious abt all these renn's (i.e. rennteam, rennlist, renntech, rennstock, etc.). why 'renn'? what is the word's significance with porsches?

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Renn= German word for race.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    got it.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    RC?

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    cazzi propri mai?

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Hehe - When I entered "cazzi propri mai?" into babelfish, it came back as "it never hauls own?" . . . hmmm . . . I think I am missing something here.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    RC will have all the whole story of course, but I remember Ron telling me that RC had issues with the fun cars online dudes and decided to go for a solo carreer.
    He then proposed Ron to tag along for the ride.
    I joined later around 2001 I think, having found Rennteam through a Google search (Lucky strike!).
    RC was super cool and so were the regulars at that time and provided me with all the knowledge I have today car wise.
    I remember names like Pierre, Ron, Zzoba, GM Austin, Carlos, Darius, CR, CF, Luigi and many more. Man, time flies!

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    PTM said:
    Hi RC -

    What is the history of Rennteam.com? I remember back in 2000 and 2001, I used to frequent funcarsonline.com and see your name (I presume anyway) in posts all the time. I recall some kind of conflict and remember that that forum went down hill. Unless I am inventing history (which I may be) I recall that you always posted insightful information from Porsche and once you were gone... Anyway, a couple of years later, I came across rennteam.com and once again your name.

    So if it is something you can share, do you mind telling the story? If for any reason you don't feel comfortable - no problem at all.

    Thanks and kindest regards,

    PTM



    Of course I don't mind but please understand that I don't want to wash dirty laundry here on the forum, so I try to be as honest as possible, even if I have to leave out some of the "delicate" things which happened back there.

    I was a member of the Funcarsonline discussion team (or better said: one of the "sheriffs" who had to take care of the discussions and their contents). Chris Kramer, the founder and owner of Funcarsonline was a friend by that time and we shared a lot of information and took advantage of various occasions to post REALLY NEW Porsche info. Chris was the FIRST EVER to post pictures of a non-camouflaged Boxster S...one year before this car was actually put on the market. Then, we were able to show the FIRST EVER pictures of the 996 Turbo, not only from the outside but also from the inside, some cars still being camouflaged. This was back in 1999, more than 8 months before the 996 Turbo was actually available for buying. The picture of me and Chris next to a 996 Turbo with "Erprobungsfahrzeug" lettering on the side and on the rear was sensational, it was re-posted on many other forums on the internet.
    So yes, Chris and me were the "Porsche" dudes, there were only three or four other people on the internet who were at the same or a similar knowledge/VIP level like Porsche Pete, Viken B. and one or two others.

    What happened? Well, very simple. A very dirty campaign started between the various groups. I think it was all about money, egos and again money but naive as I am and actually not interested in earning money with cars and car parts or track events, I didn't realize it by that time.
    Chris started to get a little bit kind of an ego-maniac, he started his Porsche parts shop and had a lot of trouble with the Porsche law department. I still didn't see the big picture and was naive enought to think that everybody was an enthusiast like me without any other motives.
    Then things started to go really bad, Chris and me were accused by other people to have deleted or modified posts, I never ever actually understood what this was all about but it started with Todd Serota, some funny lawyer from California who apparently was mad at us because we were making fun of his business (track events) and his car (a 996 Cab with various racing parts, wing, etc.). Things got out of control when Chris started to play "king", even starting to remove me as a moderator, then putting me back in, then removing me again and so on. We were talking on the phone all the time and I realized that we don't have anything in common anymore. Apparently the fact that he succeeded to sell a few used GT3 race cars to the US made him think that he is the Porsche god or whatever. He started to treat his users the same way and this is where another guy from Germany, CR, a former member of Funcarsonline jumped in and asked me: why don't we open our own forum, without any commercial background, no shop, no selling, no ads, nothing which would compromise our credibility. I found it to be a great idea but it took us several months until we were able to actually start the project.

    Why the name Rennteam? Because we didn't find anything better. We were afraid to use "Porsche" in our site name due to the risk to get trouble with the Porsche law department. By that time, the law department had started some serious threats against other websites using the name Porsche in their site name.

    Since Rennteam means "racing team" in German, we went for this name because we simply couldn't think of something better. The start was pretty difficult, me and CR didn't have a clue about forum software, SQL, PHP or whatever. Although it helped a lot that CR owned a communications company and offered to host Rennteam, we both were absolute beginners and didn't have any help. I was lucky that by that time, my daughter was still very young and I had a lot of time at nights (between feeding times ) to work on Rennteam.com.

    We also tried to get official Porsche support for our site but without success, they didn't seem to take it too serious what we were planning to do. And the truth is: we never thought of having over 7000 registered members after more than three years only. Some private car forums, national and international, usually never had more than a couple of hundreds of members, some even closed down again. Only the forums supported with ads and press infos were actually successful and we are proud to say that Rennteam.com is the biggest non-commercial advertisement-free Porsche and Sportscars community in the world.

    To make a long story short: we are so proud of us and our users, you can't imagine. We were able to establish a peaceful international community of car enthusiasts without ANY hidden agenda or business in mind. Yes, it costs a lot of time and a lot of money, I think that me and CR already spent thousands of Euros for Rennteam, not to speak about our moderators who not only helped us to keep Rennteam.com up and running but also donated money (thanks Ron/Ron from Houston!!!) and the latest forum design (thanks Sönke/zzboba!!!) to keep this site up and running for you all.

    I'm sorry if I or any of the moderators sound a little bit harsh, sarcastic or even like a smarta.. sometimes, we're only here to help and to learn too.

    With this occasion, I want to thank you ALL for spending your precious time over here, posting infos and pictures and taking active part of this wonderful community.
    Without you guys, Rennteam.com would be nothing. THANKS!!!

    And a last word: don't underestimate the "power" of our community. Porsche and other sportscar manufacturers, including journalists from various car magazines worldwide, are monitoring Rennteam.com or are even members. We were succesful to create among them a certain credibility.
    We are a very powerful car community and believe it or not, we actually succeeded and still are succeeding to influence decisions regarding development and improvement of various cars, especially Porsche cars. Of course there are other forums and they are monitored too but I think we earned ourselves a lot of respect due to the fact that we're trying to keep the discussions at a pretty high quality level compared to other car forums. And our opinion has been always valued very high, unfortunately there seem to be elements in development/marketing/etc. who aren't always loving what we're doing here since our activity sometimes puts them under pressure.

    My biggest dream would be to meet you all during some sort of meeting or larger event. Maybe sometimes in the near future, who knowns?!

    Thanks again, guys...

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    i remember all..an i'm happy to be here

    i was on funcarsonline too,7/8 years ago..

    and RC was just my Porsche hero

    ciaoo

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Hi RC -

    Wow - Thanks for the great story. I appreciate that you took so much time to answer my question. In addition to being a great community, I am glad to hear that the forum actually makes a difference to car companies (especially Porsche)!

    The former success of funcarsonline and now rennteam seem to depend on a small group of people (not least among them you) to attract, build and maintain a great community.

    So thanks to you and all the moderators for the hard work!

    Best,

    PTM

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    I've a member of Rennteam for a long time now and I am proud to say that this is by far the best car forum in the world, packed with knowledgable ethusiasts from whom you can really learn a thing or two. Keep up the good work RC!

    Btw, a meeting is a great idea. Somewhere in Germany perhaps? Near an Autobahn... ...with no speed limit? *wink wink* *nudge nudge*

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Great Chris and others ,thanks for your work ......
    I think Rennteam is the Best Porsche Forum in the net .....and we can say thank to you !!


    I'd love the idea of a runnteam meeting and i also have the right location: it's Gmund, a small village in Carintia (austria) where, many years ago, a litlle man called Ferdinand created that faboulous car that keeps the all of us together in here!

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    RC said:
    My biggest dream would be to meet you all during some sort of meeting or larger event. Maybe sometimes in the near future, who knowns?!




    What better time to do it than around the time of the Geneva Auto show in March??? Except, maybe it's a little cold at RC's place for a big party at that time of the year.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    great story. am glad you shared that with us RC.
    of all the porsche forums out there, this is the one i like best.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Hey RC,

    Thank you for letting us in on the history of Rennteam, was very interesting indeed. I now understand why you want to keep it sponsor/add etc.-free very noble of you indeed!

    Never mind having 7000 members , how many of those members are Porsche/multiple-Porsche owners? Probably 45% of the members of the forum. Which is a huge ratio compared to other sites

    Thanks for spending many of your personnal hours on keeping this place running

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    sergini said:
    Great Chris and others ,thanks for your work ......
    I think Rennteam is the Best Porsche Forum in the net .....and we can say thank to you !!


    I'd love the idea of a runnteam meeting and i also have the right location: it's Gmund, a small village in Carintia (austria) where, many years ago, a litlle man called Ferdinand created that faboulous car that keeps the all of us together in here!




    Thanks a lot, RC, and all others who make this forum such a success!

    Yeah, Germany, Austria... when I pick my baby up in September- I'll be there!

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Wow, thanks for that detailed account RC. I must admit I did not know any of the history, being a relative newcomer to this site. I agree with everyone here, this is an excellent site. This one and Rennlist are the only two internet forums that I really try to keep up with.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    RC, after browsing through the many porsche forums out there, I like this one the best! Thanks!

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Keep up the good deeds , RC. I haven't been around funcarsonline for years , as everyone there pretty much ended up here . Yours is that rare island of civilized ,mostly mature discussion. It ceases to amaze me how much hate is on most car sites around the world . When I look around my area , most folks own a Bimmer and a MBZ and an Audi and a Porsche for the variety and spice . They must think it bizzare that some people develop such strong neg feelings over such a life embellishing thing . What a weird ying/yang bit of karma to carry around.
    CAR ( not marque ) enthusiasm is why we are here and not at "scrapbookfanaticsonline.com " .

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Nice thread, I was also asking myself why all this forums, rennteam, rennlist etc etc....

    Good to know the history RC, and of course a big thank you to you and CR and the superb moderators we have here!!!!

    I also got to rennteam by a very strange and lucky way in google.com

    I LOVE RENNTEAM!!

    We should organise a big meeting somewhere in Europe or USA , may be nurburgring or a special circuit who knows......

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    RC said:

    Chris and me were accused by other people to have deleted or modified posts, I never ever actually understood what this was all about but it started with Todd Serota, some funny lawyer from California who apparently was mad at us because we were making fun of his business (track events) and his car (a 996 Cab with various racing parts, wing, etc.).



    I had completely forgotten about Todd. He sure caused a lot of problems. I quit visiting Funcarsonline about that time because the atmosphere had become so hostile.

    I was there when Chris began selling parts and bought clear side markers and clear headlights for my 1999 996 from him.

    In the early days it was a great forum. As you stated, you could get information there that was unavailable elsewhere. I had a 1995 993 coupe and was planning on buying the first of the 996 cabs. I learned more about the upcoming cars from the forum than any car magazine.

    That tradition continues at rennteam. I always seem to know more about upcoming products by visiting this forum than I would from magazines or even from the salesman at my Porsche dealership (they sometimes seem to be the last to know anything).

    I used to tell my wife about the horrible fights that would go on and on at Funcarsonline. She couldn't believe that things could get so out of hand.

    Rennteam has been more about learing and exchanging information and less about large egos.

    Keep up the excellent work.

    Phil

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    <I had completely forgotten about Todd. He sure caused a lot of problems. I quit visiting Funcarsonline about that time because the atmosphere had become so hostile>
    there is a bit of revisionist history here. the jist of the problem was Todd Serota's statements /opinions on tire pressure was contrary to the Porsche company line,he advocated much lower that factory recommendations
    from there it got very,very ugly. so much so that the use of the words "tire presure" in a post was enough to get posts deleted by the then moderators.
    a mass migration took place from cfg's to rennlist
    Rc has mellowed a lot since those days

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    RC said:
    My biggest dream would be to meet you all during some sort of meeting or larger event. Maybe sometimes in the near future, who knowns?!



    How about in Sunny Florida next summer?

    What does everyone think?

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    The funny thing is: I was accused of writing things or deleting/editing posts and I never actually did that. Now who could use a user's name to do that? Right...the system admin. Another reason why I quit, too many hidden agendas, too many hidden stuff I never understood and never was involved to. I'm just a Porsche enthusiast like the other moderators and editors and I would lie to you if I wouldn't admit that I would love to earn money with Rennteam.com and/or Porsche cars. This is my hobby and what is more wonderful than to be able to earn money with something you really love. But I'm not clever enough for the car business, I have my own business (selling drugs, legally of course) and there is an old saying over here: stick with the things you learned to do best.

    And if I forgot to tell you guys: THANKS again for your support and your friendship and sorry if i sometimes sound a little bit harsh or too smarta..-alike. This happens if my mouth (fingers) works faster than my brain, I apologize.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    <I was accused of writing things or deleting/editing posts and I never actually did that>
    that explains a lot.

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Thanks RC and thanks for putting up with my funny BS humor..

    Your tolerance is very much appreciated ..

    throt..

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    peecarfan said:
    <I had completely forgotten about Todd. He sure caused a lot of problems. I quit visiting Funcarsonline about that time because the atmosphere had become so hostile>
    there is a bit of revisionist history here. the jist of the problem was Todd Serota's statements /opinions on tire pressure was contrary to the Porsche company line,he advocated much lower that factory recommendations
    from there it got very,very ugly. so much so that the use of the words "tire presure" in a post was enough to get posts deleted by the then moderators.
    a mass migration took place from cfg's to rennlist
    Rc has mellowed a lot since those days



    I don't think that my statement was "a bit of revisionist history". I didn't say anything about Todd other than he caused a lot of problems. That is certainly a true statement. Were there other people who contributed to/magnified the problems? Absolutely yes! A whole lot of nastiness went on for quite a while. As I stated I left Funcarsonline because of the overall hostile atmosphere, not because of Todd.

    Phil

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    < I don't think that my statement was "a bit of revisionist history>
    sorry, but that was not directed at you, but in general.
    it did get ugly, and people left in droves, but Todd was not to blame.
    i'll bet cfg still gets shivers when he hears a tire pressure question <g>

    Re: OT - RC: A question of history

    Quote:
    RC said:
    But I'm not clever enough for the car business, I have my own business (selling drugs, legally of course) and there is an old saying over here: stick with the things you learned to do best.


    RC ....ARE U AN APOTEKER ?????????????

    IF SO ....WE ARE COLLEGUE !

     
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